PLEASE DON'T RUN AWAY

Edip_Yuksel

Dear Ayman

Do you mean that

Salli Ala
and
Aqim el Salah

mean the same thing?

I understand the first to mean "support, encourage" and the second as "observe the contact prayer".

Peace,
Edip

Natu

Woopeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!

D D D

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Natu,

Thanks again for the reminder! Many people need to realize that the VERY FIRST response of those in "hell" is "we were not of those aho maintained the process(salaat)! Salaat is the process of enlightenment.

Looks like you were successful in drawing out Edip to this thread! WOW!
This is good, maybe we can clear this matter up now.

Nural_Amin

Peace,

Congratulations people! Edip came!

Edip, I understand that you are in support of a physical salat, I would like to kindly ask for your time to share your understanding of the verses in the Quran with those who support non-physical method.

I understand you are a busy man but I think many people have been waiting to hear from you about this topic.

Also I read you article about 'arab conspiricies...' article, I went through some of Mr Safar's work and I am impressed, I would like to hear your views on his ideas because you seemed to reject some of the concepts quite harshly at start. Mr Safar seems to have written in detail about the words and language of the Quran, just want to know whether you have seen this and would also like to see your analysis, maybe you can contribute to our understanding of 'Salat/solaa'

Peace
Nural

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Edip,

Let me get the ball rolling again,

I understand the first to mean "support, encourage" and the second as "observe the contact prayer".

Lets deal with the basic verses first, that way we have a foundation to use when weighing the evidence of teh other verses in question. My first question to you is, How can "salaat" be "contact PRAYER" when the word "Du'a" is used all throughout this reading(quran) to mean Prayer/calling God?

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Edip,

I guess you have chosen not to discuss this.

unknownuser

Salaamun alaikum,

It is apparent that EDIP's post was directed to AYMAN and he is waiting for Ayman's answer. I think that when Ayman answers his question he will jump back in !! wink

Peace,

Tanveer

Natu

Fair enough actually, we'll have to be patient.

unknownuser

Peace be upon you,

So if Ayman never responds we cannot have a meaningful discussion?

O well, peace to all anyway.

Natu

AYMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

cry cry cry cry cry cry cry cry cry cry cry
! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

ayman

Peace Edip,

Do you mean that

Salli Ala
and
Aqim el Salah

mean the same thing?

No they don't mean exactly the same thing. One is a verb, "salli", the other is a common noun "salah". However, they do describe the same process.

I understand the first to mean "support, encourage" and the second as "observe the contact prayer".

What do you base such understanding on? "Support, encourage" is certainly not the meaning given by Classical Arabic dictionaries. Also, this meaning cannot be construed from all other locations where derivatives of the root "sly/slw" are used.

You seem to be doing exactly like Aidid who you criticized for making up meanings that have no basis in Arabic or the great reading.

Moreover, logically your understanding doesn't add up because "yusalun" in 3356 is in the continuous present tense. We know for a fact that The God's support and encouragement (whatever that means) of the prophet was not continuous (for example see Chapter 80).

PS. Thanks Natu for the reminder. )

Peace,

Ayman

Natu

Thanks Ayman - now for the next phase of patience... roll

unknownuser

Peace be upon you all,

Looks like I found a good time to get back to the debating (hajja) proceedures whereby we put all Opinions to the test to extract the Truth.

Good response Ayman, looking foward to Edip's response.

ayman

Peace brother Kyle,

It is good to see you back on the forum.

Peace and all best wishes,

Ayman

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Brother Ayman,

Thank you, its good to be back. Finally got a good , FAST connection at home. It was always I was at work , or at home with a slow connection, now I am home with a fast connection. I am very excited D

Ive been doing a lot of homework. I'm ready to start uncovering a lot of truths.

Natu

I look forward to it idolfree D

unknownuser

Peace be upon you,

This sure is a slow thread.

Natu

We need someone who does traditional salat, who shall we invite? Any ideas?

rahenijaat1

Salam and Peace, everyone!

1)---Salaat means "the ritual Salaat."
2)---Salaat also means "commitment to Al-Quran." (The meaning of Salaat becomes clear with reference to context. Sometimes it is only ritual, and sometimes it is commitment)

After all these dabates, we have not yet reached a final method of offering "the ritual Salaat."
Why?---Perhaps, there is something missing. And that something, that is missing is,---that we must go to our Allah and request Him to guide us, because there is no one except Allah to guide His slaves.

Read Al-Quran, and we will find that Allah is advising Ibraheem to offer Salaat the way He taught him to do.
It means that Allah taught Ibraheem the full method of ritual Salaat. And this full method must be in The Revelations that Ibraheem received from Allah.

And because once the full method of the ritual Salaat was given to Ibraheem, and this is valid until Al-Qiyamah, so may be in the next Revelations Allah didn't mention the method of Salaat, only commanded to offer Salaat (the method of which was already given to Ibraheem).

It means the method of ritual Salaat that we follow today,---is the same method of ritual Salaat that is coming down from generation to generation since Ibraheem.

It might have been so, that at different times people added to the real Salaat, some shirk things.
And whenever Allah's Messenger came, they did away with the shirk part that misguided people had added to Salaat, purified it, and gave it to the people.

The same Salaat was being offered at the time of Muhammad in Makkah. People had added shirk things again to the Salaat, and the real method was not easy to find out.
When Muhammad was declared as Messenger of Allah, he must have taken away shirk form the Salaat, purified it and gave it to ummah.

Allah declares in His Exalted Quran, that His Quran is in His Protection. It means that everything in Al-Quran is in Allah's Protection. Nothing from Al-Quran will be changed or lost.
So, Salaat is one of Allah's Commandments, so Salaat is also in Allah's Protection.

The way Al-Quran is coming down from generation to generation in Allah's Protection,-----the same way Salaat is also coming down from generation to generation in Allah's Protection.
Having Iman in it, we must believe that today we have the same method of ritual Salaat that was first given to Ibraheem.

Al-Quran is The Light. And The Light shows people what is right and what is wrong, what is Tauheed and what is shirk.

This will be our own fault, if in spite of having Allah's Quran (Allah's Guidance), we are unable to find out the real method of Salaat.

Now, look at the method of the Salaat, we presently have,-----examine it, in The Light of The Quran,-----and whatever shirk things we find in it, we must do away with that.
Rest is absolutely okay.
Reciting from Al-Quran, standing, ruku, sajdah, everything is alright.

Al-Quran, The Light,-----is Allah's Guidance,-----that will take us to the real method of the ritual Salaat.

Look at all the rituals different nations have. Our method of ritual Salaat is the best.
First you stand like an obedient slave before your Allah. Then you do ruku. Then you do sajdah.
No method, as such, is so obedient and humble as ours.

=================================================================================

If there had been no Sahih Al-Bukhari, etc,---still we would have the same method of ritual Salaat that was given to Ibrheem (AS).
This is the "Millata Ibraheema (Salaat, Hujj, Umrah)" that Allah commanded the last Messenger to follow

-----"Then, We inspired you (O Messenger, saying) ?Follow the religion of Abraham, exclusively devoted. And he was not of those who associated (others with Allah)." (Al-Nahl-123)

If "Millata Ibraheema (Salaat, Hujj, Umrah)" had not been in Allah's Protection and if it had been disappeared,-----why would have Allah ordered the Messenger (and the ummah) to follow it, without mentioning their methods in datail in Al-Quran?

So, the methods of "Millata Ibraheema (Salaat, Hujj, Umrah)" was already there and being practiced, so Allah didn't mention their methods in Al-Quran.
The last Messenger only purified these rituals from shirk, and ordered his ummah to follow.

Salaat is not in Imam Bukhari's Protection.---Don't put the crown on his head.

Salaat is in Allah's Protection, and He knows how to protect it for His obedient slaves who do not commit shirk with Him.

As a matter of fact, I learned Salaat from my parents.---Never read Sahih Al-Bukhari.
My parents learned from their parents.---They never read Sahih Al-Bukhari.
Their parents learned from their parents.---They never read Sahih Al-Bukhari.
-----and this goes, until we reach the Prophet.
This is in Allah's Protection.

Where do we find Imam Bukhari?

Peace again!
A lot of Peace!

High_Imam_Ismaili_Sniper

We need someone who does traditional salat, who shall we invite? Any ideas?

I participate in "physical salat". hail I also like chicken eat You summon me? jedi

PLEASE DON'T RUN AWAY

1)---Salaat means "the ritual Salaat." 2)---Salaat also means "commitment to Al-Quran." (The meaning of Salaat becomes clear with reference to context. Sometimes it is only ritual, and sometimes it is commitment)

1)---Salaat means "the ritual Salaat."
2)---Salaat also means "commitment to Al-Quran." (The meaning of Salaat becomes clear with reference to context. Sometimes it is only ritual, and sometimes it is commitment)