Ezwaaj are not wives
-
Sure, I can try to explain how I see it, it should be easy one.
First, this is about guarding one's furooj (plural of ferj), which is understood as "private parts", but its meaning is "private things" or just "privacy" in every meaning. It can include private parts also, but it's not just about that. For example, if I'm talking about what I do with my wife it should not be guarding my furooj, or if I'm talking about anything which shouldn't leave my house and be exposed in public. Romans used "vulgare" for exposing to public, which we now use mostly for bad talk; similarly, words ferj and furooj loose something of their broader meaning.
In this meaning, guarding one's furooj cannot be about one's woman, because our relation with woman is a part of our furooj. Also you can notice that our grown-up daughter is not mentioned or some other women as an exception of guarding. Only two exceptions were made ezwaaj and "maa meleket eymaanukum".
As I said at the start of this topic, word ezwaaj is a plural of a potential noun, which means that it talks about something which can be "zewj" (pair, couple). In this context, as well as in many more, I think that meaning here is "fiancées" or women which one's try to pair with (girlfriends, dates, etc.). Men can talk to them their private things.
-
Sure, I can try to explain how I see it, it should be easy one.
First, this is about guarding one's furooj (plural of ferj), which is understood as "private parts", but its meaning is "private things" or just "privacy" in every meaning. It can include private parts also, but it's not just about that. For example, if I'm talking about what I do with my wife it should not be guarding my furooj, or if I'm talking about anything which shouldn't leave my house and be exposed in public. Romans used "vulgare" for exposing to public, which we now use mostly for bad talk; similarly, words ferj and furooj loose something of their broader meaning.
In this meaning, guarding one's furooj cannot be about one's woman, because our relation with woman is a part of our furooj. Also you can notice that our grown-up daughter is not mentioned or some other women as an exception of guarding. Only two exceptions were made ezwaaj and "maa meleket eymaanukum".
As I said at the start of this topic, word ezwaaj is a plural of a potential noun, which means that it talks about something which can be "zewj" (pair, couple). In this context, as well as in many more, I think that meaning here is "fiancées" or women which one's try to pair with (girlfriends, dates, etc.). Men can talk to them their private things.
Salam...
Thank you for your input... I prefer my understanding... Not yours..
God bless you... If in future any other subject in sha Allah I involve. Not in this topic.. I got what your knowledge and understanding is by what you have explained.. Thank you.. -
peace, in context means spouses (wives) clear from inheritance
2240 والذىن and the ones ىتوفون taketh being (dying) منكم among you (pl.) وىذرون and leaving ازوجا spouses of وصىه instruction (behest) لازوجهم li-azwajihim/for spouses theirs ...
412 ولكم walakum/and for you (masculine pl.) نصف half ما ma/what ترك left ازوجكم azwajukum/spouses yours (pl.) ان if لم not ىكن beeth لهن for them (feminine pl.) ولد offspring
ولهن walahunna/and for them (feminine pl.) الربع the fourth مما mimma/from what تركتم left you (pl.)
ان if لم not ىكن beeth لكم for you (pl.) ولد offspringnote difference to husband ما ma/what and to wife مما mimma/from what
otherwise it would be contradiction and would not know who to payoff first
mother 1/3 (fixed), husband (2/3 * 1/2 = 1/3), father 1/3 (variable)
wife 1/4 (fixed), mother 1/3 (fixed), father 5/12 (variable)
-
peace, in context means spouses (wives) clear from inheritance
2240 والذىن and the ones ىتوفون taketh being (dying) منكم among you (pl.) وىذرون and leaving ازوجا spouses of وصىه instruction (behest) لازوجهم li-azwajihim/for spouses theirs ...
412 ولكم walakum/and for you (masculine pl.) نصف half ما ma/what ترك left ازوجكم azwajukum/spouses yours (pl.) ان if لم not ىكن beeth لهن for them (feminine pl.) ولد offspring
Noon waalqalami, note that in 2240 situation is that men died, and in 412 is situation that women died, so they're not "zewj" (pair, couple) anymore, but they became "ezwaaj", potentional pairs... it's not used nisaa' either because they died (men and women, as listed) and they're not their wives anymore... this word "ezwaaj" is perfectly selected, because they were zewj and the word kept its root, as they can be zewj again
jkhan, sure, your understanding should be more valid to you then mine
-
Noon waalqalami, note that in 2240 situation is that men died, and in 412 is situation that women died, so they're not "zewj" (pair, couple) anymore, but they became "ezwaaj", potentional pairs... it's not used nisaa' either because they died (men and women, as listed) and they're not their wives anymore... this word "ezwaaj" is perfectly selected, because they were zewj and the word kept its root, as they can be zewj again
Aladin, 412 pertains to men dying leaving spouses and women dying leaving spouses.
No need to use Nisa/womenfolk (3+) and what is the point of this thread — to confuse? -
My point is in following
- to check if my understanding stands when opposed by serious students of the Qur'an
- to point that a pair can be exactly 2
- pair is not same as marriage
- grammar of the Qur'an should be personally learnt from the Qur'an not from the books somebody wrote on his own understanding while we have no way to discuss with them
- Allah is always using best possible words with best meaning in the context
- there're so called "broken plurals", these words are from the same root with slightly different meaning then the (real) plural would be... for example, šehr شَهْر has its plural in šuhoor الشُّهُور used in 936, not in ešhur أَشْهُرٌ which is a different word from the same root; plural of a verbal noun in a form Fa'L should be Fu'ooL as is... or, nefs has its plural in nufoos not in enfus... or 'ibaad is not a plural of 'abd, but a verbal noun in form III (one to multiple) acting as a collective noun which describes many being 'abd to one
in this case ezwaaj is in a form as ebwaab being a plural of potential noun baab; singular of ezwaaj should be zaaj, but it's not possible because everything that can be paired their potential pair is always plural, for example each man can potentially be pared with billions of women
but I'd like to discuss here only about ezwaaj not being a plural of zewj, and that zewj cannot take plural, and ezwaaj cannot be wives, since it's a potential not a verbal noun
back to our discussion... Can you agree that ezwaaj in these 2 aayaat is not "wives" since their husbands died in one case, and in the other they died, so women cannot be wives to dead men and dead women cannot be wives anymore? Will one say "I have a wife" if she died or "I had a wife"?
-
back to our discussion... Can you agree that ezwaaj in these 2 aayaat is not "wives" since their husbands died in one case, and in the other they died, so women cannot be wives to dead men and dead women cannot be wives anymore? Will one say "I have a wife" if she died or "I had a wife"?
No absolutely not since it’s clear 412 pertains to inheritance to husbands and to wives likewise kalala case
If you want then translate 412 and give exactly to wife and parents? Then exactly to husband and parents? -
It's not possible for me to translate every word "1 to 1", even in my own language, so I'll try to explain some of them and will leave them in transliterated original, and I'll also explain some other words and concepts. I'll also try to cover other aayet about kelaala, since they're connected.
-
weled/waalid - We should see that dual noun ebewaan أَبَوَان was used 7 times for "two parents", 6 times for "mother and father", so waalidey وَٰلِدَي cannot mean the same. I understand that Nooh could not know what somebody will beget in 7127 and that this doesn't mean "to give a birth", but rather "to rise", "to bring up", "to breed", etc. Weled can be somebody's child, but also a foster child or spouse's child; same is for waalid which is not only a father, but stepfather or foster dad. 411 covers ewlaad (pl. of weled) and ebnaa' (not same as ewlaad).
-
Who are inheritors and who they inherit? From 47 we can conclude that grown-up men (er-rijaal) and grown-up women (en-nisaa' are inheritors and they inherit waalidey and el-aqreboon. This word is a maculine superlative and its meaning is "the closest ones", which we can understand as spouses, ewlaad and ikhwet - siblings. Siblings are only ones with at least one same parent. In 48 feminine superlative el-qurbaa which means "kinship", and we can see that they should get something, as well as el-yetaamaa (orphans) and el-mesaakeen (disabled). Notice that in 411 waalidey are not inheritors, but father and mother.
-
le-kum in 412 is masculine only plural from the context
-
nisfu and maa are جار ومجرور, so it means "half of what"
-
We should see the difference in "len yekun le-hunne weledun" and "kaane le-hunne weledun". First is a jussive mood and not perfect (which would be "maa kaane le-hunne weledun" same as next phrase but negated by "maa". Is Allah complicating this or trying to point something? Jussive mood is not perfect nor imperfect nor a future tense. It's timeless (can be about any tense) and serves as an explanation of something brought up. Imagine that a women had a foster kid or she was married to some man who had kids, but she was not fostering kid after some time or she divorced from that man or had any kid that died. We already saw that waalidey are inherited no matter when they were waalidey, and this includes not just their biological kids, but also foster kids and kids from their spouses. So, if "maa kaane le-hunne weledun" that would mean that they had no weled ever. Jussive mood explaines what previously was said and it's about leaving some property to inherit, and this should mean that they have no weled to inherit them, not that they didn't have weled ever. Now it's clear that "kaane le-hunne weledun", which comes after, is just about time when they left (a property to inherit, and this life), no need to use a jussive mood again to explain.
-
weSiyyet - this word is understood as "a testament, will", but since Allah's using it for Himself we should rethink. We can see its verbs in form I (basic), II (causing of basic), IV (transitive) and VI (reciprocal). Word weSiyyet is "an instruction" in a sense of "order", which we can today understand as "a testament, will" in some cases. But is this the meaning in the Qur'an, or even in some aayaat? So, we understand it as somebody left his will. But then we see that it stands weSiyyet OR deyn (debt), which leads to that they are similar, not opposite. Otherwise, "will AND debt" should be used, telling us that we have to fulfill both. In case of OR if we do one a condition is met. In case of "do this OR that" if we do any it's true, but in case of "do this AND that" both should be done to be true. We should also ask ourselves can somebody leave 100% of a property to some person(s)? If so, then why all these rulings? WeSiyyet is an instruction transfered from a person to person in continuing doing good (khayr) one was doing. For example, if I am feeding some poor people or I'm paying a scholarship to somebody or I'm giving to some family some amount periodically, etc., and I want my inheritors to continue with that after me, I can make weSiyyet to them to continue. This is an obligation as deyn (debt) is. This is why imperfect is used with a verb, because if deceased woman left some instructions (weSiyyet) by which she's instructing it's not just one-time, but something she was doing continuously. We also can understand that inheritors are not obliged to pay any debt. They can if they want. Also they're not obliged by all of weSiyyet, one will make a condition true. It would be unjust for inheritors to pay debts, and this could be a nice topic to discuss.
-
Haleem - One who's making long term plans, who thinks in advance, who thinks for the future, maturity in thinking, etc.
-
kelala and muDaarr - will be explained.
So, translation could be as follows
"And for you (m. pl.) is a half of what your ezwaaj left, if no weled for them (to inherit them). So, if there was a weled for them then for you is the fourth of what they left after weSiyyet (an instruction for doing good continuously on a person's behalf) they are instructing by or debt.
And for them (f. pl.) is the fourth of what you left, if no weled for you (to inherit you). So, if there was a weled for you, for them is the eight of what you left after weSiyyet (an instruction for doing good continuously on a person's behalf) they are instructing by or debt.
If a man, being inhereted, was kelaalEN, or a woman, and has a brother or a sister, then for each one of them two is the sixth. So, if they happen more then that (more then one each) then they (all) are partners in the third, after weSiyyet (an instruction for doing good continuously on a person's behalf) they are instructing by or debt without muDaarr.
WeSiyyet (an instruction) from Allah, and Allah is 'Aleem Haleem."
We can see 3 situations here a woman died and left a man, a man died and left a woman, and a third situation, which can be only that dead person left no spouse. So, this third part is about single dead persons.
Verbal noun Diraar ضِرَار means making a contract with several parties about some deal. In relation to a marriage it's bigamy and polygamy, but here's about debt, a situation mentioned near to the end of a long aayet 2282 about debts. I understand it as giving some loan as a debt and adding some guarantors. I understand that a spouse can be the only guarantor, and this is why mentioning of "debt" with muDaarr is just in case of kelaala. Terms on kelaala in 412 are in case a person had weled, and if no weled what is in 4176 is valid on kelaala.
We can see that in most of the cases not all of property of dead person is to be inhereted, and we should ask what will be with the rest? We should go back and remember that kinship, orphans and disabled ones should get from it.
Now, let's go back to my question. Is dead woman still wife to a man she left, and is a woman still wife to her dead man? If your answer is YES then you can keep taking ezwaaj as "wives", I don't mind, but my answer is NO.
-
-
It's not possible for me to translate every word "1 to 1", even in my own language.
if not possible for you to translate why state spouses does not mean wives/husbands?
- Who are inheritors and who they inherit? From 47 we can conclude that grown-up men (er-rijaal) and grown-up women (en-nisaa' are inheritors and they inherit waalidey and el-aqreboon.
men or women died their kids get nothing? what age is grown up?
46 وابتلوا and test ye of الىتمى the orphans حتى until اذا when of بلغوا reach they of النكح the marriage (age) فان so if انستم perceives you منهم of them رشدا rational of فادفعوا so deliver ye of الىهم towards them امولهم wealth theirs ...
نسا nisa/womenfolk (3+ any age; need to use context of course)
اخوه ikhwatun (3+ at least 1 male e.g., brother and 9 sisters any age)
رجلا rijalan (3+ at least one male; e.g., male and 99 females any age)4176 ties nisa to females (any age); distribute shares if underage given at age of marriage/maturity.
4176 ونسا wanisaan/and womenfolk (3+) فللذكر so to the male مثل similitude حظ apportion الانثىىن the females two
We should also ask ourselves can somebody leave 100% of a property to some person(s)? If so, then why all these rulings?
rulings if there is no will to prevent quarrels etc., and yes 100%
So, translation could be as follows
not a translation with words untranslated
Terms on kelaala in 412 are in case a person had weled, and if no weled what is in 4176 is valid on kelaala.
no, you'll run into contradictions cannot solve (try daughters and sisters or all permutations)
kalala pertains to sibling heirs who only inherit with parents (case if no spouse, no offspring)
We can see that in most of the cases not all of property of dead person is to be inhereted, and we should ask what will be with the rest? We should go back and remember that kinship, orphans and disabled ones should get from it.
no, always 100% (no more and no less) likewise says when they inherit give "from it" the poor, etc. 48
Now, let's go back to my question. Is dead woman still wife to a man she left, and is a woman still wife to her dead man? If your answer is YES then you can keep taking ezwaaj as "wives", I don't mind, but my answer is NO.
the most bizarre question on this forum; we're talking about inheritance, right?
when you die “your” spouse/wife, parents, children or siblings inherit! 411, 412, 4176
see inheritance paper https//www.academia.edu/39919602/Quran_Inheritance
peace!
-
if not possible for you to translate why state spouses does not mean wives/husbands?
men or women died their kids get nothing? what age is grown up?
No, not grown-up ewlaad are el-yetaamaa, check 411, and check 45 (when kids are not getting inheritance in their hands) and 46 when somebody is grown-up. El-yetaamaa will have their part as grown-up do, but somebody else will take care about them until they are grown-up or forever in case of 45.
For translation with not translating all the words, you could try to read philosophy and you'll see that "gnosis", "ego", "kelaam" and many other words are mostly not translated, because there's no "1 to 1" word in English or they wouldn't suit well if translated, can be misguidance. Forcing translation is not always good. But I think you know all this. You asked me to translate, I did my best at that moment.
If not 100% always inherited what will happen if a single man with no weled dies and had only 1 sister? And pls rethink about ewlaad are not an offspring, otherwise you claim that forster kids and spouse's kids are not inheritors. I'd like you, if you want, to comment here or on the other topics about usage of OR, especially do you think that all debts should be payed off by inheritors. Maybe I miss something in these rulings.
No quarrels when Allah gave us ruling, only in case people are looking for somebody else to judge, which is ok, but they're kaafiroon. No will is allowed by the Qur'an, there's full kitaab on this subject, all situations are covered. Just think if there's any situation left. Is it just that somebody leave his property to a dog, or to the country, or to one of 3 sons, or to sons and nothing to daughters? If Allah and His resool decided something we cannot make our own rules and do as we wish to.
Out of my question all other we talk about is off-topic. So, again Is dead woman still wife to a man she left, and is a woman still wife to her dead man? If your answer is YES then you can keep taking ezwaaj as "wives", I don't mind, but my answer is NO.
If Allah used "wife" or "spouse" then it's not Haqq, and Qur'an is Haqq 100% accurate. I'd like you to see that 412 is starting with plural (you and ezwaaj) then it goes singular (rejul and imre'et), because the singular of ezwaaj cannot be applied on humans. Notice also that it wasn't said "zewj" but imre'et. I'd like you to see how these words are perfectly used to avoid any mistake.
(academia is a toponym, not sulTaan)
-
Resolution of Heritage Verses
https//www.answering-christianity.com/blog/index.php?topic=3800.0
-
No, not grown-up
did you not write this earlier Aladin?
"From 47 we can conclude that grown-up men (er-rijaal) and grown-up women (en-nisaa' are inheritors"For translation with not translating all the words, you could try to read philosophy and you'll see that "gnosis", "ego", "kelaam" and many other words are mostly not translated, because there's no "1 to 1" word in English or they wouldn't suit well if translated, can be misguidance. Forcing translation is not always good. But I think you know all this. You asked me to translate, I did my best at that moment.
you can make an effort to give an idea otherwise it's ok to say I don't know!
likewise, it's clear you opened topic yet don’t know meaning of below words2232 واذا and when of طلقتم divorce you النسا the womenfolk …
ازوجهن azwajahunna/spouses (husbands) theirs (feminine pl.)2240 … وىذرون and leaving ازوجا azwajan/spouses (wives) of
وصىه instruction (behest) لازوجهم li-azwajihim/for spouses (wives) theirs (masculine pl.)411 ىوصىكم instructed you (pl.) الله the God فى in اولدكم awladikum/offspring yours (pl.)
412/924/1672/334 ازوجكم azwajukum/spouses (wives) yours (pl.)
412 كلله kalala/sibling heir
2190 واصلحنا and cures we of له for him زوجه zawjahu/spouse (wife) his
246 والذىن and the ones ىرمون accusing ازوجهم azwajahum/spouses (wives) theirs (masculine pl.)
3359 ىاىها O you النبى the prophet قل say لازوجك li-azwajika/to spouses (wives) your (sing.) وبناتك and daughters your (sing.) ونسا wanisai/and womenfolk المومنىن the believersIf not spouses (wives/husbands) where are instructions for inheritance to wives/husbands?
If not 100% always inherited what will happen if a single man with no weled dies and had only 1 sister? And pls rethink about ewlaad are not an offspring, otherwise you claim that forster kids and spouse's kids are not inheritors. I'd like you, if you want, to comment here or on the other topics about usage of OR, especially do you think that all debts should be payed off by inheritors. Maybe I miss something in these rulings.
sole inheritor sibling, parent, spouse, son, daughter get 100% and no need for rulings
if person died with dept e.g., borrowed/owed $100,000 and leaves total $150,000 value
inheritors get remaining $50,000 – if dept is more than total value inheritors get nothingspouses’ kids get nothing (unless stated in a will) read 412 and rest of Qur'an carefully
No quarrels when Allah gave us ruling, only in case people are looking for somebody else to judge, which is ok, but they're kaafiroon. No will is allowed by the Qur'an, there's full kitaab on this subject, all situations are covered. Just think if there's any situation left. Is it just that somebody leave his property to a dog, or to the country, or to one of 3 sons, or to sons and nothing to daughters? If Allah and His resool decided something we cannot make our own rules and do as we wish to.
Out of my question all other we talk about is off-topic. So, again Is dead woman still wife to a man she left, and is a woman still wife to her dead man? If your answer is YES then you can keep taking ezwaaj as "wives", I don't mind, but my answer is NO.
If Allah used "wife" or "spouse" then it's not Haqq, and Qur'an is Haqq 100% accurate. I'd like you to see that 412 is starting with plural (you and ezwaaj) then it goes singular (rejul and imre'et), because the singular of ezwaaj cannot be applied on humans. Notice also that it wasn't said "zewj" but imre'et. I'd like you to see how these words are perfectly used to avoid any mistake.
(academia is a toponym, not sulTaan)
The language used is clear only pointed you to my paper on academia which you clearly have not studied especially inheritance which the vast majority 99.999% is clueless parroting errors otherwise you would not ask such questions – when you die (in context of inheritance) your spouse/wife is your wife as are your children, parents, and siblings, etc.
no worry like my differential equations (advanced calculus) professor once said
“if you never ask dumb questions, you’ll never get over being dumb!”
peace!
-
No, not grown-up ewlaad are el-yetaamaa
You haven't quote the rest. Only grown-up inherits by getting the property, not grown-up are not getting property and they're explained before on 1st page of this surah, before rijaal and nisaa' are mentioned. I'm not sure about English word, is it heir? If so, heir is getting the property for el-yetaamaa for the conditions specified. Note that 4176 is about rijaal and nisaa', not about kids before nikaaH, otherwise dheker and unthaa (male and female) would be used.
I really don't know which English word would suit in this case, but I tried to explain my understanding of a concept. In general it is "what can be pair", and in this case it reflects the fact that these women were paired with men and they can be paired again in Afterlife. Similarly, for a dead woman somebody should say "she WAS my wife", rather then "she IS my wife".
I really haven't found that ezwaaj was used for live couples, if you know some example that could be a proof for what you're telling all the time. So, if you know any bring it and we could finish this discussion and I'll also be happy to see/know something new for me. I also think that zewj is a different then nisaa' (or imre'et) when used for "wife", since the concept of marriage, as I understand, is different than what we have in "civilized world" today.
Sorry, if you didn't understand, kelaalet is a state of somebody who died as a single person, had no zewj in time of his/her death, I thought it was clear from what I wrote.
Can you tell me wherefrom you got that info about sister as a sole inheritor gets 100%?
Have you partially quoted aayaat to discuss ezwaaj in these?
(Academia was a joke, cause people use this word as something sacred for the knowledge, even it's just a toponym, as Devil's Hill is.)
-
Note that 4176 is about rijaal and nisaa', not about kids before nikaaH, otherwise dheker and unthaa (male and female) would be used.
yes it is used, read! (you need to study I cannot spoon-feed you everything)
4176 وان and if كانوا be they of اخوه ikhwatan/siblings (3+ at least 1 male)
رجلا rijalan/menfolk of ونسا wanisaan/and womenfolk (3+)
فللذكر falildhakari/so to the male مثل similitude حظ apportion الانثىىن l-unthayayni/the females twothey can be baby brother/s and sister/s or baby children (411)
they inherit at that time wealth held until marriage/maturity46 وابتلوا and test ye of الىتمى the orphans حتى until اذا when of (time adverb future) بلغوا reach they of النكح the marriage (age) فان so if انستم perceives you منهم of them رشدا rational of فادفعوا so deliver ye of الىهم towards them امولهم wealth theirs ...
I really don't know which English word would suit in this case, but I tried to explain my understanding of a concept. In general it is "what can be pair", and in this case it reflects the fact that these women were paired with men and they can be paired again in Afterlife. Similarly, for a dead woman somebody should say "she WAS my wife", rather then "she IS my wife".
I really haven't found that ezwaaj was used for live couples, if you know some example that could be a proof for what you're telling all the time. So, if you know any bring it and we could finish this discussion and I'll also be happy to see/know something new for me. I also think that zewj is a different then nisaa' (or imre'et) when used for "wife", since the concept of marriage, as I understand, is different than what we have in "civilized world" today.
Sorry, if you didn't understand, kelaalet is a state of somebody who died as a single person, had no zewj in time of his/her death, I thought it was clear from what I wrote.
I've posted numerous verses prior? https//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=zwj#
2230 فان so if طلقها divorce her فلا so not تحل lawful له to him من from بعد after حتى until تنكح she marry زوجا zawjan/spouse (husband) of غىره other than him
2232 واذا and when of طلقتم divorce you (m/p) النسا the womenfolk فبلغن so reach they (f/p) اجلهن term theirs (f/p) فلا so not تعضلوهن thou hinder ye them (f/p) ان that ىنكحن yankihna/married they (f/p) ازوجهن azwajahunna/spouses (husbands) theirs (f/p)
kalala pertains to sibling heirs (brother/s and/or sister/s)
hence no spouse, no offspring (only inherit with parent/s)
you can read all about confusion in my paper and belowhttps//www.amazon.com/The-Quranic-Term-Kalala-Monograph/dp/074861916X
http//rorotoko.com/interview/20090904_powers_david_muhammad_not_father_any_your_men_making_last_prophet/?page=2
“Book 011, Number 3937 , Abu Talha reported 'Umar b. al-Khattab (Allah be please…Abu Talha reported 'Umar b. al-Khattab (Allah be pleased with him) delivered a sermon on Friday and made a mention of Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) and he also made a mention of Abu Bakr (Allah be pleased with him) and then said I do not leave behind me any problem more difficult than that of Kalala. I did not refer to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) more repeatedly than in case of the problem of Kalala, and he (the Holy Prophet) never showed more annoyance to me than in regard to this problem, so much so that he struck my chest with his fingers and said 'Umar, does the verse revealed in summer season, at the end of Sura al-Nisa' not suffice you? Hadrat 'Umar (then) said If I live I would give such verdict about (Kalala) that everyone would be able to decide whether he reads the Qur'an or he does not.”
Can you tell me wherefrom you got that info about sister as a sole inheritor gets 100%?
simple none to challenge or share with -- why do you need ruling on sole heir?
if only son/s or daughter/s 100%
if only spouse (wife/husband) 100%
if only a mother or a father 100%
if only brother/s or sister/s 100%peace!
-
yes it is used, read! (you need to study I cannot spoon-feed you everything)
4176 وان and if كانوا be they of اخوه ikhwatan/siblings (3+ at least 1 male)
رجلا rijalan/menfolk of ونسا wanisaan/and womenfolk (3+)
فللذكر falildhakari/so to the male مثل similitude حظ apportion الانثىىن l-unthayayni/the females twothey can be baby brother/s and sister/s or baby children (411)
they inherit at that time wealth held until marriage/maturityAs mater of fact they can't be children, because inheritors are rijaal and nisaa', but for males is similar to two females. Inheritors are not males and females, it's just inheritors' gender. As you can say "... And if they're mixed, actors and actresses, then males have like double salary as females".
In 2230 there's no ezwaaj, but zewj, which I agree that has meaning of "couple, pair" in many instances.
In 2232 subjunctive mood is used, which is a potential (have clause EN, meaning "if" itself that reflects future, not present. That's why ezwaaj is used cause they're their potential pairs, not PRESENT pairs. I hope you can see what I'm trying to show you no ezwaaj for present coupled person(s) to another, as I know. Ezwaaj are always who can be coupled, are not at the present.
I care not about what Perso-jewish fairy tales say on kelaala, but thx for sharing, maybe somebody will find it interesting.
I can be wrong about kelaala and on everything else, but as far as I understand 4th surah kelaala is 3rd option, as I said.I don't need any ruling on sister as a single inheritor cause I know that there's none (and I can be wrong), but maybe you'll need it to recheck your opinion. If you find it, please share.
If you want we can also see some other aayaat...
(I wanted to write an article on "selaam" today, but I spent a day listening Rage against the machine ) Peace to you 2)
-
As mater of fact they can't be children, because inheritors are rijaal and nisaa'
totally clueless! making absurd statements! do grownups breastfeed?
2233 والولدت and the mothers ىرضعن breastfeed they اولدهن awlādahunna/offspring theirs (f/p) ...
وان and if اردتم intends you ان that تسترضعوا another breastfeed they of اولدكم awlādakum/offspring yours42 واتوا and gives ye of الىتمى the orphans امولهم wealth (inheritance) theirs ...
411 ىوصىكم instructed you (pl.) الله the God فى in/concerning اولدكم awlādikum/offspring yours
للذكر lildhakari/to the male مثل similitude حظ apportion الانثىىن l-unthayayni/the females tworijaal (3+) can be a baby boy accompanied by 99 women
nisaa (3+) can be baby girls or any age, old women etc.
children i.e., orphans (fatherless) don't inherit is absurd!... then males have like double salary as females".
no, not double exactly case IF 1 male (any age) and 2 females (any age)
you cannot apply it e.g., 1 male 1 female (2 females have to be present)
1 female daughter/sister gets 1/2 regardless # of males (sons/brothers)In 2230 there's no ezwaaj, but zewj, which I agree that has meaning of "couple, pair" in many instances.
again 2230 is about divorce! who divorces? married couples, wives and husbands!
زوجا zawjan/spouse of (a spouse; use context wife/husband)
2230 فان so if طلقها tallaqahā/divorce her فلا so not تحل awful له to him من from بعد after حتى until تنكح tankiha/she marry زوجا zawjan/spouse of (a husband) غىره other than him
In 2232 subjunctive mood is used
blah blah blah read without ranting!
again, about divorce/marriage (spouses; wives and husbands)2232 واذا and when of طلقتم divorce you (masculine pl.) النسا the womenfolk فبلغن so reach they (f/p) اجلهن term theirs (f/p) فلا so not تعضلوهن thou hinder ye them (f/p) ان that ىنكحن yankihna/married they (f/p) ازوجهن azwajahunna/spouses (husbands) theirs (feminine pl.) ...
I care not about what Perso-jewish fairy tales say on kelaala, but thx for sharing, maybe somebody will find it interesting.
I can be wrong about kelaala and on everything else, but as far as I understand 4th surah kelaala is 3rd option, as I said.again, clueless you don't know which verse to apply e.g., to mother and sister/s 412 or 4176
I don't need any ruling on sister as a single inheritor cause I know that there's none (and I can be wrong), but maybe you'll need it to recheck your opinion. If you find it, please share.
of course, no need for a ruling for an only brother, an only daughter, an only son, an only parent or spouse
simply use the brain in hard head! brickwall
no more comments! peace
-
If you wanna discuss with me you have to be polite and show a respect towards the Qur'an, cause we wouldn't discuss unless Allah's Word connected us. If you think you know all, you got all right, you sorted all then you're high above me and don't go down to my level. I'm just a humble student of the Qur'an and I plan to be as long as I live.
On your translation of 2233... el-waalidaat are not mothers, mothers are ummehaat أُمَّهَات, also ewlaad is not an offspring, I wrote about this when I gave a translation of kelaala aayet. Yes, ewlaad are male and female, rijaal and nisaa' are male and female, but inheritors are not males and females, they're rijaal and nisaa'. Pls check again 47 and 48. Also check 49 to see that ewlaad are not an offspring, it's dhurriyyet.
I know that it's confusing, as for those from so-called hadeeth you quoted, but the reason for confusion is that people haven't understood words and put some random meaning.
For "double" you quoted an example from life I gave (As you can say...).
I already said that in 2230 ezwaaj is not used, but zewj, and I agree that it can mean "a couple, pair", but it's totally different word from the same root, as, for example, naar and noor are not same.
I beg you to think again on 2232. Notice that negation of imperative (as you translated) is not used, but negation of a jussive mood. This mood indicates some explanation on what is previously said, not just an imperative as qul! (say!) or igre'! (study!, take a lesson!). It's an explanation of the set of 2229-232 and the case of 3rd "divorce". If I "divorced my wife" 3rd time I'll knew that she had to remarry somebody else before I can marry her again, and I can prevent her of getting married out of regret for my stupidity of "divorcing her". We could discuss Talaaq ("divorce" here, but there's no need, since ezwaaj are not YET their couples, pairs, husbands, they're only potential zewj. Just think about your translation
so not تعضلوهن thou hinder ye them (f/p) ان that ىنكحن yankihna/married they (f/p) ازوجهن azwajahunna/spouses (husbands) theirs
So, not ye hinder them that they married their spouses (husbands)
They're not their spouses/husbands yet, that's why ezwaaj is used, they're wanna-be husbands/couples.
Sorry, I maybe missed you asked about mother and sister as only inheritors? First, if you define mother as waalidet then there's no ruling on this, but if you think that mother is umm then 411 is for her, and for sister two of kelaala verses, which is when a dead person died as a single. Note again, waalid and waalida are not inheritors, but ebewey.
-
I wanna discuss that ezwaaj أَزْوَاج is not a plural of zewj زَوْج. The reason is that the meaning of this root as "pair(-ed, -ing)" cannot be used for 3 or more, thus zewj cannot take a plural, only singular and dual, as it is used. Theoretically, its plural would be zooj, or zuyooj if waw turns to yay (as, for example, buyoot is a plural of beyt).
Ezwaaj is not a verbal noun, which zewj and its dual are, but it's a plural of a potential noun, as qalem and its plural aqlaam, same weight.
There're many occurrences of ezwaaj and if anybody wants we can discuss them one-by-one, instead of making a very long text which people mostly won't read.
Enough dude... It is very clear you are not responding which has concrete support .
Have you honestly read all Zawj Zawjain and aswaj verses.. Coz you think Zawj is only pair.. It is not merely pair..
Zawj has meaning of sort/class/category/kind etc as well...So Zawjain becomes pair
And aswaj is three or more..Read all verses.. Then come and explain..
For example
567 And you become THREE Aswaj...
Go read pls comprehensively.. -
jkhan, there's no need for me to read them if you have any reference from the Qur'an, you're talking about. So, please, provide aayaat you think that zewj means "sort/class/category/kind etc" and we can discuss. Or provide any of "etc" meanings you think zewj has and the same plural meaning which ezwaaj took.
I fully agree that zewj and ezwaaj share the root, thus their root meanings are the same, but these are different words, not singular (or dual) and plural. It would be the same as if you say that naar and noor are the same words, different in number or anything related to the nouns.
I fully agree that in 567 ezwaaj means "sort/class/category/kind" but it's not zewj, it's a different word. 567 is one of instances that is not possible to take as "wives/husbands" as people understand ezwaaj in most of the cases.
-
You can also think about, for example, words en-nehaar النَّهَار and el-enhaar الْأَنْهَار (same weight as ezwaaj), which are from the same root, but due to their different form their meanings are very different, even they share root meanings.
The root meanings are many and not all the words from the root have all the root meanings. Every single Harf (letter) has multiple meanings and when they collectively make a root, by 2 3 4 or 5 Huroof, number of the root meanings can be in hundreds. Even though, not all of those meanings are in every word from the root, otherwise there would be no need to have a multiple words from the same root, one word will provide all the root meanings.
