RK : BELIEVE IN ME OR ROT IN HELL!!!
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So, it is possible that if you don't believe in messenger, God will punish you or no?
The message or the messenger? God or the messenger? Don't you see the pattern? Christians got lost somewhere along the line and took jesus to be god. So-called "muslims" got lost and followed conjectures and traditions. It seems some of us are falling/have fallen into the SAME trap we thought we escaped from.
All messengers pointed to GOD, not themselves. idea
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Greetings with peace,
Usually some people get it right while most of the people go after the human being.
Anwar Azim
So, it is possible that if you don't believe in messenger, God will punish you or no?
The message or the messenger? God or the messenger? Don't you see the pattern? Christians got lost somewhere along the line and took jesus to be god. So-called "muslims" got lost and followed conjectures and traditions. It seems some of us are falling/have fallen into the SAME trap we thought we escaped from.
All messengers pointed to GOD, not themselves. idea
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It is not for a human that God would give him the Scripture and the authority and the prophethood, then he would say to the people ?Be servants to me rather than God!?, rather ?Be devotees for what you have been taught of the Scripture, and for what you studied.?
oh and 79 less 3 is 19x4.... lol (sorry, I couldn't resist)
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peace
I have heard this nonsense before. "If you dont belivein jeeeebush, youre going tohell"
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I thought even if we are true believers we will still go to hell (as a complimentary present for any sin however small we've committed)?
Really, most people find it very hard to believe that nobody will escape punishment. Myself, I just try to resign to the inevitability of hell.
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I thought even if we are true believers we will still go to hell (as a complimentary present for any sin however small we've committed)?
Really, most people find it very hard to believe that nobody will escape punishment. Myself, I just try to resign to the inevitability of hell.
what i have read in the koran , if our good works outweigh our sins , God will erase our sins and we go to heaven/paradise/garden . if sins outweigh the good works , we go to hell . its not like the disbelievers will also go to heaven as a complimentary present for any good works they had done ,right ?. what do u think .
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I thought even if we are true believers we will still go to hell (as a complimentary present for any sin however small we've committed)?
Really, most people find it very hard to believe that nobody will escape punishment. Myself, I just try to resign to the inevitability of hell.
what i have read in the koran , if our good works outweigh our sins , God will erase our sins and we go to heaven/paradise/garden . if sins outweigh the good works , we go to hell . its not like the disbelievers will also go to heaven as a complimentary present for any good works they had done ,right ?. what do u think .
Peace Saladin,
After reading your post and re-reading the verses I thought supported my view (which I carry from my traditionalist background), 997-10, I think I need to reconsider it now.
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About a year before I found this Progressive Muslims site, I stumbled across RK's site. I liked some of what he had to say. But his insistence that he be seen as a messenger of God kept interfering with any actual messages he delivered. It very much reminded me of Christian evangelists like Jim Bakker and Oral Roberts...even if RK wasn't asking for money they way they did.
After some soul-searching, I decided not to visit the site any more. Within a couple of months, God led me to the free-minds site. Then I felt at peace with what I was reading, because this site was focused on God and not on self-promotion. I almost felt as if RK's site was a test. Even though, for the first time, I'd found someone who had ideas closer to my own, I had to be willing to give it up (lay it on the altar, so to speak) in order to find my way to a place that focused only on God.
I say "test," because I chose long ago to follow the God Alone path and use the Quran as my source of guidance...not long after giving up the Chistian church community/fellowship I'd known all my life. I could no longer be part of that community but I wasn't part of a Muslim community either because of my views. It was a rather lonely journey.
My questions are...why does RK need to push the idea that he's a messenger of God? Isn't it enough that he has a message to share with people? Why does he need the recognition so badly?
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My questions are...why does RK need to push the idea that he's a messenger of God? Isn't it enough that he has a message to share with people? Why does he need the recognition so badly?
how can he have a message in the first place when he wasnt a messenger ?
salam. -
My questions are...why does RK need to push the idea that he's a messenger of God? Isn't it enough that he has a message to share with people? Why does he need the recognition so badly?
how can he have a message in the first place when he wasnt a messenger ?
salam.Salam Saladin.
I'm sorry. I don't understand.Are you saying he must prove he's a messenger before he can deliver the message? If so, why? I ask this with genuine interest, because I don't think I see a need for doing more.
I guess I don't see the need for someone who brings me information to make a big deal about being the person who is delivering the information...without getting in the way. Isn't it the message and not the messenger that should receive the most attention?
If the information is used to serve God, promote better understanding and is consistent with The Quran, what more is needed?
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Salam to readers
When I've read this forum, I don't really think that necessary we need to proof him as the messager because if we believe that message came from god. We don?t have to worry but for now we have to find the truth in those words. I don?t want to upset anybody, but for my opinion, we should all remember that Allah the most intelligent, knower of all creatures, he listen to whom he wish to and help to whom he wants to. But still he is a most forgiver we ever have. Just we shouldn?t make the same mistake. For my point of view, RK was proud to stand up for what is right for him. Not to pled people to say his is the messanger but wants us to understand his stanza with Allah hopes? Allah still love us, he gave us lots of chances, if he don?t he can easily took our soul like what had happen to Moses era. To think back about this, in every prophet era has their own reason for Allah has to take men?s life. I hope in our era, we are still in balance??. And I was totally graceful to Allah! Forever and ever!! wink
I write with peace to whom who read this. Thank you
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Salam to readers o
When I've read this forum, I don't really think that necessary we need to proof him as the messager because if we believe that message came from god. We don?t have to worry but for now we have to find the truth in those words. I don?t want to upset anybody, but for my opinion, we should all remember that Allah the most intelligent, knower of all creatures, he listen to whom he wish to and help to whom he wants to. But still he is a most forgiver we ever have. Just we shouldn?t make the same mistake. For my point of view, RK was proud to stand up for what is right for him. Not to pled people to say his is the messanger but wants us to understand his stanza with Allah hopes? Allah still love us, he gave us lots of chances, if he don?t he can easily took our soul like what had happen to Moses era. To think back about this, in every prophet era has their own reason for Allah has to take men?s life. I hope in our era, we are still in balance??. And I was totally graceful to Allah! Forever and ever!! wink
I write with peace to whom who read this. Thank you o
Peace maiden,
Welcome to the forum.
I don't know if the first pamphlet is authentic, but it does show a common mentality in humans, which is appealing to personality/authority.
To me, RK is just another human that happens to claim to have found code 19 in the Qur'an (which I myself consider irrelevant). So he is not a messenger. How can he be a messenger if the message has already been delivered by someone else earlier (Muhammad)?
But you are right, what's more important is the message.
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My questions are...why does RK need to push the idea that he's a messenger of God? Isn't it enough that he has a message to share with people? Why does he need the recognition so badly?
how can he have a message in the first place when he wasnt a messenger ?
salam.Salam Saladin.
I'm sorry. I don't understand.i was just saying that RK didnt have any message to deliver . just by saying "worship God alone" doesnt mean he had message or he was a messenger . the message for all mankind , the koran , had already been delivered .
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Andya Primanda peace to you, and to everyone.
you are right, muhammad got that first. Still, RK just wanted to remind us, right? But why this has changed everything about sunnah and islam? What is the total different here? About his as the messanger is not our piority right? the main thing is we must now find the truth behind god's words, right?
i just kept wondering, what will god say about what we have done after the last prophet life. do we do what he has told us?
just asking for oppinion, peace towards everybody.
may god bless everyone.