The salat Ritual..Where does it come from..
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I was asked this question in a local forum which reminded me of an article in an Indonesian Magazine..The salat ritual was actually from a Syrian Othodox Christian which they are still practising till now...90% of their ritual are the same as the ritual being practise by the sunni or syiah out there...The only major different is...they pray 7 times a day instead of 5 times..I will scan the photostated copy of the magazine(but its in Indonesian,which I myself don't really understand) which got the pictures of the ritual soon..Hope it won't be so blur..
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Salaams Sangkancil,
The salat ritual was actually from a Syrian Othodox Christian which they are still practising till now...90% of their ritual are the same as the ritual being practise by the sunni or syiah out there
I know that the Syrian Orthodox Christians are the closest to Easa?s (PBUH) teachings. If you see them you can really see how different they are than many people, in their discipline and great manners. But anyway, do you think that we should completely reject the teachings in the Bible and Torah? Do you think that they are false books and that they have nothing to do with Al Injeel and Al Tawrat mentioned in Al Quran?
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I think we should reject them because we have a better book which is Al-Quran..
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PEACE, SANGKANCIL,
I think we should reject them because we have a better book which is Al-Quran..
We have the...best book.
3923 Allah has revealed the best hadith, a book conformable in its various parts, repeating, whereat do shudder the skins of those who fear their Lord, then their skins and their hearts become pliant to the remembrance of Allah; this is Allah's guidance, He guides with it whom He pleases; and (as for) him whom Allah makes err, there is no guide for him.
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Peace,
Rejection is something disbelievers do, I would rather assess the books and accept what is from God. I would say the quran is one scripture from God not the ONLY one, there are revelationS from God. But that is just my personal opinion.
Nural
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Peace,
thanks for correcting me PRIEST_BOKMEI DAnd for Nural, its not that I don't believe in In Other Kitabs, the problem is..I don't think the real Kitab such as Injeel still exist...and if you ask me to accept bible..I would definitely reject it..
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Peace,
Peace,
would rather assess the books and accept what is from God.
Nural
Why should you waste your time doing that when you have something which is already complete?
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Peace,
Peace,
would rather assess the books and accept what is from God.
Nural
Why should you waste your time doing that when you have something which is already complete?
Why would it be waste of time?
If you see only your book is correct and others not then you owe it yourself to read them or else your stance is like the man with its head in the sand.
Knowledge leads to understanding and understanding leads to insight and insight leads to an enlightenment that makes us grow out of our childish way of thinking. We stop believing in Santa Clauses, Fairy Godmothers and Tooth Fairies; we leave behind our arrogant self; we leave behind our hatred and see the world differently and see others differently. Instead of seeing others as unbelievers we see them as our fellow traveller in the journey we call Life. This is the True nature of Wisdom; this is the True nature of Self-Knowledge.
Regards,
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Salaams Sangkancil,
Peace,
And for Nural, its not that I don't believe in In Other Kitabs, the problem is..I don't think the real Kitab such as Injeel still exist...and if you ask me to accept bible..I would definitely reject it..Sangkancil, you wroteI don't think the real Kitab such as Injeel still exist, so can I ask you What would you consider the Ayat in the Quran that speak about Al Injeel ? Would those Ayat now be useless to you since they are speaking about something that does not exist anymore? Then how about the Ayat that speak about the Pharaoh? Since there are no more pharaohs now! Do you consider the Ayat that speak about Al Injeel, Al Tawrat and the Pharoah outdated? What then is the point of mentioning them time and again in the Quran, in your opinion? Do you not believe that the WHOLE Quran, meaning the WHOLE 114 Suras, belong to all times and places? And since you believe that Al Injeel no longer exists, when do you think Al Injeel had "disappeared"? Isn't there any possibility that it could be hidden somewhere?
Thanks,
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Peace,
Sangkancil, you wroteI don't think the real Kitab such as Injeel still exist, so can I ask you What would you consider the Ayat in the Quran that speak about Al Injeel ? Would those Ayat now be useless to you since they are speaking about something that does not exist anymore? Then how about the Ayat that speak about the Pharaoh? Since there are no more pharaohs now! Do you consider the Ayat that speak about Al Injeel, Al Tawrat and the Pharoah outdated? What then is the point of mentioning them time and again in the Quran, in your opinion? Do you not believe that the WHOLE Quran, meaning the WHOLE 114 Suras, belong to all times and places? And since you believe that Al Injeel no longer exists, when do you think Al Injeel had "disappeared"? Isn't there any possibility that it could be hidden somewhere?
Simple, God ask us to believe in Injeel, yes I believe in Injeel, but can you show me now where is the Injeel Kitab? I mean the one that is not modiified such as bible? If you can bring me the true unmodified Injeel then I would have no problem accepting it!
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Peace,
Peace,
Peace,
would rather assess the books and accept what is from God.
Nural
Why should you waste your time doing that when you have something which is already complete?
Why would it be waste of time?
If you see only your book is correct and others not then you owe it yourself to read them or else your stance is like the man with its head in the sand.
Knowledge leads to understanding and understanding leads to insight and insight leads to an enlightenment that makes us grow out of our childish way of thinking. We stop believing in Santa Clauses, Fairy Godmothers and Tooth Fairies; we leave behind our arrogant self; we leave behind our hatred and see the world differently and see others differently. Instead of seeing others as unbelievers we see them as our fellow traveller in the journey we call Life. This is the True nature of Wisdom; this is the True nature of Self-Knowledge.
Regards,
I agree if you say read for understanding/knowledge, but not as a book of guidance, Coz I think I have a better book of guidance. Ask yourself, would you take a book full of doubts and errors as a guide for you when you have a better book that can guide you to the right path? Its not that I say that I rejected bible because Its old and outdated, but its simply because it has a lot of errors that can get us misguided...Its the same thing as Hadith..Not all hadith make no sense..I still read hadith as a matter of knowledge and understanding of others but never as a guidance...
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Peace Sangkancil,
Peace,
Sangkancil, you wroteI don't think the real Kitab such as Injeel still exist, so can I ask you What would you consider the Ayat in the Quran that speak about Al Injeel ? Would those Ayat now be useless to you since they are speaking about something that does not exist anymore? Then how about the Ayat that speak about the Pharaoh? Since there are no more pharaohs now! Do you consider the Ayat that speak about Al Injeel, Al Tawrat and the Pharoah outdated? What then is the point of mentioning them time and again in the Quran, in your opinion? Do you not believe that the WHOLE Quran, meaning the WHOLE 114 Suras, belong to all times and places? And since you believe that Al Injeel no longer exists, when do you think Al Injeel had "disappeared"? Isn't there any possibility that it could be hidden somewhere?
Simple, God ask us to believe in Injeel, yes I believe in Injeel, but can you show me now where is the Injeel Kitab? I mean the one that is not modiified such as bible? If you can bring me the true unmodified Injeel then I would have no problem accepting it!
That is not at all what I asked you about. I clearly understand that you don't believe that the bible of today is the true Injeel.
I asked you about the Ayat in the Quran, the many Ayat in Quran that speak about Al Injeel, what would you think of them? What is the point of so many Ayat that speak about things that to you no longer exist, that they belong to a period of time that is long over. What would you do of those Ayat now? Are they useless? Who are those Ayat speaking to? Not to you? Then to who? To Prophet Muhammad only? Do you think that only part of Al Quran belongs to this modern time, and not the WHOLE Quran? Can the Whole Quran, my guidance, contain things that I don't need? Things that are now extra!?
And do I understand from your quote above that the unmodified bible equals Al Injeel? What is the definition of MODIFIED to you? Do you think there is any true parts, any true words of Allah, in the bible? Or is all the bible, completely, ba6il = conjecture?Peace,
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Peace,
well, my bad..I shouldn't use the word "reject"..actually isn't that I don't believe that Bible also have the words from Allah and its totally wrong...What I was trying to say is...I think It is much better to take Quran alone (thats what I believe) as a guide for me to avoid myself from being misguided...But I do read bible (not only bible, but also hadith and even the book called "the teaching of Buddha") to learn and understand about other religions or other people's belief...Its the same reason why I don't take "Hadith" as a book of guide for me..it contains a a lot of things that can get us misguided to take it as a guide for us..I need to admit that my knowledge of Quran isn't yet that good that I can accept some other books as a guidance for me..So, for that reason I believe its much safer for me to only take Quran as a book of guidance for me...
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Salaams Sangkancil, All
well, my bad..I shouldn't use the word "reject"..actually isn't that I don't believe that Bible also have the words from Allah and its totally wrong...What I was trying to say is...I think It is much better to take Quran alone (thats what I believe) as a guide for me to avoid myself from being misguided...But I do read bible (not only bible, but also hadith and even the book called "the teaching of Buddha") to learn and understand about other religions or other people's belief...Its the same reason why I don't take "Hadith" as a book of guide for me..it contains a a lot of things that can get us misguided to take it as a guide for us..I need to admit that my knowledge of Quran isn't yet that good that I can accept some other books as a guidance for me..So, for that reason I believe its much safer for me to only take Quran as a book of guidance for me...
I used to believe in Hadeeths that were supposed to be Muhammad's (PBUH) but now I don't.
I am talking about the position of the "Quran alone" believers. The Quran "alone" talks about Al Injeel, Al Tawrat, Musa, Bani Isra'eal, etc.. and many other things that I, personally, cannot relate to! Well ok, I can?t reject Al Injeel or should I? Since parts of it are clearly not God's words. So what am I to do with it or with the Ayat that speak about it? Why is Allah telling me something about something I have nothing to do with? What is my responsibility here? Can I assume that only parts of the Quran is necessary for me now, for my life, while the rest is just history?
I can go on but this maybe too much for now so ... later.
Peace,
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Peace,
thanks for correcting me PRIEST_BOKMEIGood deal.
It is my understanding that, Allah, has referred us to the prior sciprtures, not so that we can follow them for guidance, as we do with Al-Quran, but to find a particular piece of information them. What is your understanding?
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The salat ritual was actually from a Syrian Othodox Christian
The salat / contact prayer are always commanded by God to previous ummah. Read about karaites jew, they still do the 'full prostration'.
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karaite_JudaismIn the Quran the prescribed shalat is 3 times a day, just like the jews doing their daily "Daven".
they pray 7 times a day instead of 5 times
Prophet Dawd / David (pbuh) praise and pray to Allah 7 times a day... u can read about this in one section of Psalm....
Prophet Daniel (pbuh) praise and pray to Allah 3 times a day facing Jerusalem, u can read about this in Daniel book....Allah knows best..
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Peace,
salamun alaikum all
The real fact is that, The creator of this universe has given us only one book which is "Al-Quran" which is the operating manual of the most complicated machine on this earth human created by The God, having proper operating procedures, truoble shootings and remedial. This book is for all time and ages. it can't be confined to a particular time period. It is not a book of history as has been mentioned at least 8 times in quran that it is not "asateer-ul-awwaleen", and 2110 tells us us that it is for us present continious time, the preriod we are living in.
The word
kitab
means written one, weatehr a line, a sentence, a para or a booklet or a detailed complied binding. so "books" plural refers to each ayat of quran and does not mean any previous scriptures by the name of Injeel,torat,zaboor. These are atributed names of Allah's book like
furqan", burhan, sultan, haq, rehmat, hikmat,zikr etc, re tese also some separates books, whereas Allah has said that his words his ls never changes, so why deos he needs to reveal different Books?All those ordered ayats are calld as torat and their sermon is injeel and zaboor is pieces of differnt instructions or part of Book.
Nowhere in Quran it is stated that Moosa was given Taurat, instead Moosa was given the Book. The book is present all the time and all the messengers gets understanding from the book by Allah and presched to masses according gto the situation which is the main assignment of a messenger, and messenger will continue , there will be no end..Saleem
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Peace be upon you,
All those ordered ayats are calld as torat and their sermon is injeel and zaboor is pieces of differnt instructions or part of Book.
WOW!!! Let me ponder on this!!! Good post.
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SaLaM Taj
do you think that we should completely reject the teachings in the Bible and Torah?
No. Those are the books of God. They have been changed or altered just like the Quran has been changed or altered. God asks us to follow the truth where ever we find it. This includes Injeel and Torah.