Is Swine Hallal
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LOL Rant, rave, bluff, then duck, cut and run. This your m.o.; you're finished, Savage. I let you get away with not answering those 15 questions, but not this time. Your refusal to answer just establishes that you cannot defend your assertion and, rather than simply admit that, you prefer to change the subject, bluff, stall, deflect, sashay around, duck, run, rant, rave, etc. etc. etc. You can't learn anything behaving like that. Get honest and answer post haste.
Same guy who has the audacity to say that he asked other people to calm down roll My answers have been what they've always been...have the courtesy and integrity to answer other people's points first before expecting answers perpetually, but that's not on the cards for this user.
Stop groussing. Listen, we all accept that you are the paragon of integrity, courtesy, and wonderfulness, o.k.? Now, with that said and honors bestowed on you, please direct your attention to the following posts and answer them Quranically. Prove me wrong that you are NOT about...changing the subject, bluffing, stalling, deflecting, sashaying around the principle issue, ducking , running, ranting, raving, etc. etc. etc
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Posted Sat Sep 03, 2005 550 pm
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Posted Sat Sep 03, 2005 928 pm
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Salaam all,
I have no understanding that this is fun, you think it's fun to make people upset!?
And I think also this is only a mess,playing with verses of Quran like you are doing,WHAT A SHAME!!!!!
No one is learning something good here it's only your already from the beginning understanding of this issue that's seems to count.
It's better you move on to something else because you don't gain anything from continue this thread with your attitude of looking down on us who don't believe in you.
Man you aren't a winner so wipe away your silly smile on your lips, smiles of pride isn't real smiles.
Peace
Sis MajidahHmmm...you don't seem to mind when others post smilies at me...very selective morally goin' on thar, Swede. Listen, you're changing the subject and making things personal. Let's just stay on topic, shall we? Now, do you have a clear and coherent argument to state? If so, then state it for all to examine, if not, don't post personal stuff, cool? But keep this mind...If the claw don't fit...you must acquit. And that is the bottomline. wink
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mz357,
my issue has merely been people bringing crap to the table and then insisting it doesn't stink ...
incidentally speaking of which ... here is a lil quote i caught at the following website ... http//www.gnmagazine.org/booklets/CU/matterofhealth.htm
Following is the opening to the article you posted
Clean and Unclean Meats A Matter of Health?
Why did God, in the Scriptures, distinguish between clean and unclean meats-the animals humans may or may not eat? Is there more to the story? Can we find a health connection?
The specific reason God gave the Israelites for forbidding them to eat any unclean animals or even touching their carcasses was to "be holy, for I am holy" (Leviticus 1144-45). Here God does not distinguish between clean and unclean animals specifically for health's sake.
And there you have it. The article is nothing but conjecture/extrapolation. Allah says
5328 But they have no knowledge therein. They follow nothing but conjecture; and conjecture avails nothing against Truth.
733 Say the things that my Lord has indeed forbidden/made haram are shameful deeds, whether open or secret...and saying things about Allah of which yoy have no knowledge.
1736 And pursue not that of which thou have no knowledge; for every act of hearing, or of seeing or of (feeling in) the heart will be enquired into (on the Day of Reckoning).
Allah, relative to food, specifically, in regard to the Jews says
6146 And to those who were Jews We made unlawful every animal having claws, and of oxen and sheep We made unlawful to them the fat of both, except such as was on their backs or the entrails or what was mixed with bones this was a punishment We gave them on account of their rebellion, and We are surely Truth.
Now, what is the realtionship between ayat 6146 and 55? I've explained this in depth
55 This day are (all) things good and pure made lawful unto you. The food of the People of the Book is lawful unto you and yours is lawful unto them....
At the time these ayats were being revealed, what animals for food were not haram for the People of the Book/The Jews to eat? That's right ALL the animals which were...CLAWLESS. Well, the pig is a clawless animal/qaudruped, hence, at the time these ayats were being revealed, the pig would have had to have been halal for both the Jews and the Muslims, because it was never made haram by Allah in first place. With that said, lahma khinzerin cannot mean pig in the literal sense, because that would then contradict ayats 55 and 6146.
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SaLaM PB
I just have to say. This is better than Jerry Springer Show Looooooooooollllllllll.
Well, the pig is a clawless animal/qaudruped, hence, at the time these ayats were being revealed, the pig would have had to have been halal for both the Jews and the Muslims, because it was never made haram by Allah in first place.
4 Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that part the hoof the camel, because he cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you.
5 And the coney, because he cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you.
6 And the hare, because she cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, she is unclean unto you.
7 And the swine, because he parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, but cheweth not the cud, he is unclean unto you.With that said, lahma khinzerin cannot mean pig in the literal sense, because that would then contradict ayats 55 and 6146.
No you got that wrong. It actually effects the rotation of Jupiter.
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Salaams SC,
I believe the quranic Dictionery explained this"lahma khinzerin" = Flash you see is Bad
and "see" is not just with the eyes ,it can be see,smell taste -literally using any of your senses.
I am into foods and believe me meat you buy today ,unless you keep it in a fridge will be off tomorow ,and more then likely cause food poisoning - and you can usualy tell from its smell if its off.
Just imagine meat in the hot countries.
But having answered your quistion i think each of us is capable of making a good enough judgment from the above posts to realise what is falshood and the Truth.
Salaams All.
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Salaam all,
I wonder what the arabic word for pig is?
Peace
Sis Majidah -
Salaam Sweet Br Jaxal,
But why are all keep saying that it means unclean?
Peace
Sis Majidah -
Peace all,
All food was lawful to the children of Israel except that which Israel had forbidden to himself before the Taurat was revealed. Say Bring then the Taurat and read it, if you are truthful.
Has anyone who says swine has been sanctioned by God taken this advice? I have, I?ve asked those who say they have the torah and no it?s not in the law. It?s Talmud. That was easy!
Have you at least checked historical references? I have, they are unable to find how this prohibition originated other than to speculate. That was easy!
Have any of the scientific minds declared swine unfit for human consumption? No.
I will provide historical references to anyone interested.
I say let's take God's advice. It's easy.
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SaLaM PB
I just have to say. This is better than Jerry Springer Show Looooooooooollllllllll.
Well, the pig is a clawless animal/qaudruped, hence, at the time these ayats were being revealed, the pig would have had to have been halal for both the Jews and the Muslims, because it was never made haram by Allah in first place.
4 Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that part the hoof the camel, because he cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you.
5 And the coney, because he cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you.
6 And the hare, because she cheweth the cud but parteth not the hoof, she is unclean unto you.
7 And the swine, because he parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, but cheweth not the cud, he is unclean unto you.With that said, lahma khinzerin cannot mean pig in the literal sense, because that would then contradict ayats 55 and 6146.
No you got that wrong. It actually effects the rotation of Jupiter.
Hmmm...I see. You prefer to take the word of scriptures which are known to have been tampered with, hence, doubtful, rather than, the word of a scripture--Al-Quran, which is untampered and without doubt. is this your position? You know, Jax, you should just stop posting, because you sound like a braying ass
3119 ...surely the most hateful of voices is braying of the asses.
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PEACE, GROURSELF,
Peace all,
All food was lawful to the children of Israel except that which Israel had forbidden to himself before the Taurat was revealed. Say Bring then the Taurat and read it, if you are truthful.
Has anyone who says swine has been sanctioned by God taken this advice? I have, I?ve asked those who say they have the torah and no it?s not in the law. It?s Talmud. That was easy!
Have you at least checked historical references? I have, they are unable to find how this prohibition originated other than to speculate. That was easy!
Have any of the scientific minds declared swine unfit for human consumption? No.
I will provide historical references to anyone interested.
I say let's take God's advice. It's easy.
Thanks much for your input. Perhaps they will believe you! I think, as you some times say, "it's a slam dunk", that khinzerin cannot mean a literal pig. Don't disappear on us now. Peace.
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PEACE, MZ357,
Salaams SC,
I believe the quranic Dictionery explained this"lahma khinzerin" = Flash you see is Bad
and "see" is not just with the eyes ,it can be see,smell taste -literally using any of your senses.
I am into foods and believe me meat you buy today ,unless you keep it in a fridge will be off tomorow ,and more then likely cause food poisoning - and you can usualy tell from its smell if its off.
Just imagine meat in the hot countries.
Salaams All.
Good point. A blind person, for example, would have to rely on smell in determining the quality of food. Al-Quran was meant for the blind as well.
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SaLaM PB
because you sound like a braying ass
Brother you were sounding like that a long time ago. I just caught it from you. Its terrible. I know
As for the Torah, i can see you still have not made any efforts to increase ur knowledge about it. So while u rant about how Khanzeer means ill-seeming and bad and rotten lollllll, i will sit back and just watch you humiliate urself. I enjoy it lol . At times, i will join in and contribute to this hilarious thread.
But why are all keep saying that it means unclean?
Well Priest thinks he has the truth while we are all blinded by the EVIL CORRUPTION of the Quran Lollllllllllllllll. Khanzeer means pig. To say anything would be down to the lack in knowledge about the Quran and its language http//www.geocities.com/bigjaxal/s1.gif
Have any of the scientific minds declared swine unfit for human consumption? No.
Thats is incorrect. Dont post false and ridiculous information like Priest does.
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Salaam Sweet Br Jaxal,
But why are all keep saying that it means unclean?
Peace
Sis MajidahMain Entry KHANIZA compound word comprised of khinz-bad and ara- I see it bad; to stink; to be evil; to be bad; dirty; piggy; pig/swine/hog; proud; greedy; stubborn, obstinate, stupidly perverse. The Dictionary of the Holy Quran, by Abdul Mannan Omar, pg. 166
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JAXAL As for the Torah, i can see you still have not made any efforts to increase ur knowledge about it. So while u rant about how Khanzeer means ill-seeming and bad and rotten lollllll, i will sit back and just watch you humiliate urself. I enjoy it . At times, i will join in and contribute to this hilarious thread.
Jaxal, what is the Book of Guidance to all of mankind...the Torah or Al-Quran? Here's a clue for ya 2185. Yeah, by all means, keep watching me humilate myself. LOL!!
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SaLaM PB
Another word which is a compund. NONSENSICAL. This word is comprised of NON - SENSE - ICAL. It means Lacking intelligible meaning a nonsensical jumble of words.. Something like what comes out of PRIEST. Especially when one does not does his research and blindly beleives what someone else thinks.
by all means, keep watching me humilate myself
Tho misguided, you are a brother to me PB. And i WILL watch u humiliate urself. Funnily God tells us at one point that if we are in doubt, we consult the previous scripture. Amazing isnt it?
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Peace mz357,
health of people is of prime importance to health authorities world wide and for that countries have taken measures to penalise people for using /selling bad meats AND/BUT not selling PIGS MEAT AS SUCH AND THIS I THINK YOU WILL AGREE was with the help of those with knowledge in this field, health experts and such.
These are the same health authorities who are not banning cigarettes and are allowing people to continue using the most toxic substance ever for the human body. Cigarette smoking has been scientifically proven to cause cancer and at least 10 different diseases and is killing or making ill millions, yet the health authorities have turned a blind eye to that. Cigarette smoking causes more mortality and morbidity than all the other drugs combined, yet it is not banned, because billions of dollars are being made in the cigarette smoking industry, and the authorities care more about making money rather than the health of the people.
And to me this applies to Bad meat ? what the health authorities are banning now using the strong hand of the law . Bad meat causes food poisoning and other things ? and is a killer as well.
Bad meat can kill in a few days, yet Allah in his infinite mercy allows bad meat to be eaten when forced out of need even though it will kill ? Do you mean to say that Allah says when you are starving and cannot find good food, then go ahead and eat bad meat even though it will kill you in a more agonizing way ?
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Peace Grourself,
Have any of the scientific minds declared swine unfit for human consumption? No.
I did not expect a person like you who seems educated and learned to make an irresponsible statement like that. You tell others to do research before making any statements, yet you yourself do not even bother to do the scientific research and make a statement like this.
Please read the following, if you have not already done so, and verify all the information given by reading the referenced articles in the scientific journals quoted.
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=53218#53218
What surprises me is how come everyone keeps ignoring the grammatical rules while translating "lahma alkhinzeerin". Grammatically, there is NO WAY anyone can translate "lahma alkhinzeerin" into "ill seeming or bad/dirty meat". Making "alkhinzeerin" an adjective of "lahma", will violate the Arabic grammar rules. Grammatically, the ONLY translation of "lahma alkhinzeerin" can be "meat of pig". The relevant rules of Arabic grammar have been posted multiple times by Someone, and I have quoted them at the following link
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=53173#53173
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SaLaM Tanveer
I was working as a butcher for a year. This is how meat is works. Once the meat is cut fresh its quality is excellent for 1 day unless you freeze it in which case its good for a longer than that. But not all of us do that. Then after one day, you can see it turning brown. ITS STILL GOOD. It stays like that for another day. This is when it becomes really soft. People think its bad and they throw it away. ITS NOT BAD and it will cook better and it tastes better. The meat is matured. After 3 days, it begins to give off smell. Thats when the meat is regarded as being bad.
With pork, its different. I used to work on the counters of a super market. I handled meat, chicken and pork. What i found supprising was that pork was the worst. As a test, i took 2 freshly cut pieces of meat and pork and put them in the chillers. The temprature in the chillers is 5 degrees centegrate. after JUST a week, the meat was being matured where as the PORK HAD FUNGUS ON IT. I did this test with several different types of meat and pork and the result was the same. Never once did i found fungus on meat. ONLY ON PORK. When i showed it to my christian collegues, they were supprised as well.
So, where meat just goes bad, pork goes bad and grows fungus. Its absolutely ridiculous to say pork has no bad health effects.
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Salaam all,
one thing I have notice is that PB don't give some people salaam, why!?
So maybe he is not here for peace, just arguing and to belittle us.
peace
Sis Majidah