Who is the Messenger in 81:19 ?
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Peace Ahmed
you state
and for Allah Mohammad is the greatest of'm all
Wow, isn't that some heavy sunni influence roll
And u know who was the greatest in gods eyes shock
how i wish i would be that certain!
now, don't get me wrong, i never question about the god, i only question my understandings...lk
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Peace Ahmed
Peace Elke
you state
and for Allah Mohammad is the greatest of'm all
Wow, isn't that some heavy sunni influence roll
lol , come on Elke, don't give me this typical accusation by the Quran alone followers, if you read again you will see that I'm going against the Sunni in these verses, please read Ibn Kathir and see for yourself what he says about sura 81, now, how I based my understanding in why Mohammad is the greatest prophet from Allah presepective?, is a big reasearch and is not for the faint hearted really, and it is not Quran alone, rather Quran first, then the recofnised 4 Gospels, Barnabas Gospel, the Hindu Veda, the Dead Sea Scrolls and Hadith, and it is personal research not to promote it, I was only responding to the question directed at me and i responded logically not emotionally to be honest but I'm happy to share this research with you when both of us have some time
And u know who was the greatest in gods eyes shock
don't be shocked please, I didn't say I know, what I said is the verses are clear, Allah praised all prophets in the Quran and Mohammad was the most to be praised by Allah as one of His prophets and the last one as well, Allah also told us in the Quran that He gave favours to prophets more than others because He put some higher than others, therefore I'm talking based on what Allah said in the Quran that was delivered by Mohammad first then all the other sources of evidences I mentioned above confirmed it conclusivly, now from my prespective, mohammad is the same as moses as jesus as noah as the rest of prophets, I don't praise one more than another really so you have no point indeed to accuse me as being a sunni influneced muslim wink
how i wish i would be that certain!
now, don't get me wrong, i never question about the god, i only question my understandings...lk
sure but when both of us have plenty of time we can start this discussion one on one on a new thread and I will let you know sister when i do have time, it should be interesting topic
peace be with you
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salam.
could the messenger be Muhammad or is it necessarily Gabriel ?8119
It is the saying of an honourable messenger.8120
With power and influence from the One of the throne.8121
Obeyed, and trustworthy.8122
And your friend is not crazy.8123
And he saw him by the clear horizon.8124
And he has no knowledge of the future.8125
And it is not the saying of an outcast devil.thanks .
salam.Greetings Saladin,
81.19 in no way, shape, or form refers to Islam?s prophet.
It specifically refers to Jesus.
A complete exegesis can be found here.
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=58961#58961
Hope this helps...
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Greetings Saladin,
81.19 in no way, shape, or form refers to Islam?s prophet.
It specifically refers to Jesus.
peace Apple Pie .
jesus himself was a muslim . i.e 'islam's prophet' .i will checkout that thread .
According to sura 81, Jesus is more than a prophet....He is God Himself...
Check it out...
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According to sura 81, Jesus is more than a prophet....He is God Himself...
can u quote please.
peace.Greetings Saladin,
As you probably have already observed, sura 81 (albeit in convoluted style), completely follows the material present in the Biblical Book of Revelation.
Here are the contextual summaries that (that beyond any reasonable doubt) confirm to us that 81.19 is describing Jesus Christ.
Further, 81.20 & 81.21 elaborate on Jesus? deity by confirming that He occupies the Throne of God and is obeyed there as one entity?
Summary of 81.19
Innahu laqawlu rasoolin kareemin
81.19 Certainly His Word is a Holy message.
? Revelation tells us that the ?logos?, or Word, of God, is Jesus
? 81.19 begins by informing us of something that is ?inna?, or certain
? This thing that is certain is applied to ?qawlu?, or Word, via the personal pronoun ?hu?, or His, and possessive affirmative particle ?la? ? thus giving the Word as an inherent attribute of Him
? ?laqawlu? occurs three times in the Koran, and in each occurrence it is beyond any reasonable doubt that it directly refers to Jesus
? 81.19 also informs us that His Word is a ?kareemin?, or holy, ?rasoolin?, or message
? Sura 81 acknowledges Jesus as the Word of GodSummary of 81.20
Thee quwwatin AAinda thee alAAarshi makeenin
81.20 Lord of power in the presence and possession of the throne, the established one.
? Revelation tells us that the Jesus occupies the Throne of God
? 81.20 builds upon 81.19 by informing us that His Word (i.e. Jesus) with the Holy Message, is ?thee? (genitive case) in possession of ?quwwatin? (singular), or the one (and only) power
? Amazingly, in addition to ?quwwatin? referring to power or strength, it also has the meaning ?and separately twisted portion of two or more which, being twisted together, compose the whole of a rope, and of a string, or thread?
? Thus, ?quwwatin? conveys the idea of two (or more) things intertwined to become one thing
? Revelation informs us that the Lamb is in the ?mesos?, or midst of the ?thronos?, or throne
? Likewise, 81.20 tells us that He is ?inda? (A particle used as a preposition to denote time and place), or in the presence of ?alAAarshi?, or the throne
? There are numerous Koranic examples where allah is ?Lord of the throne?; thus, when the Word (i.e. Jesus) is referred to as Lord of the Throne ? there can be no doubt that Jesus is God
? 81.20 specifically utilizes ?thee? twice in this one ayah; the first is to signify possession of the singular power of the Word, and the second is used to signify the possession of the throne by the Word
? Revelation tells us that the one sitting on the throne is of the appearance of ?sardinos?, or a reddish brown variety of chalcedony
? Interestingly, 81.20 describes the ?arshi?, or throne as ?a red sapphire, which glistens with the light of the supreme?
? 81.20 closes by mentioning ?makeenin?, or the established one, from the root ?makuna? (meaning he made Him to have dominion) which clearly indicates that the Word (from 81.19), is God Almighty
? The authors of the Koran copied the Book of Revelation, and, more importantly, they understood who the Biblical Jesus is. Revelation clearly shows us the deity interchangeability between God and Jesus, as they are one in the same. Ironically, this ayah also demonstrates the same exact thing by showing that the two are, in fact, one in the sameSummary of 81.21
MutaAAin thamma ameenin
81.21 Obeyed one there, Amen.
? Revelation tells us that Jesus not only occupies the Throne of God, but that He is ?lat reuo?, or served, as well as ?aineo?, or praised, and ?proskuneo?, or worshiped , and ?phobeo?, or feared as God, as well
? 81.21 continues with 81.20 by informing us that His Word (i.e. Jesus) not only occupies the Throne of God, but that He is ?mutaAAin? (singular), or the ?obeyed one? ? that He is entitled to be obeyed
? A survey of the Koran yields 37 ayahs that mention that both allah and his messenger (i.e. Jesus) are to be obeyed
? Hence, the proclamation in 81.21 of a singular obeying at the throne is to be expected
? Revelation describes the worshiping of God on the Throne with the added suffix of ?Amen?
? Interestingly, 81.21 also follows suit by adding its own ?ameenin?, or Amen
? Revelation also describes the worshiping of God on the Throne with the added suffix of ?allelouia?, or praise ye Lord
? ?Ameenin?, in 81.21, can also mean ?O?Lord?, as it is one of the names of God ? thus adding additional support to Jesus being God AlmightyTake care?
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you translated " " as "Amen"????
brickwall
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you translated " " as "Amen"????
brickwall
lol
that was funny bro, he is a smart boy isn't he?
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you translated " " as "Amen"????
brickwall
lol
that was funny bro, he is a smart boy isn't he?
Had you bothered to study classic Arabic, then you would have discovered that this is how it is rendered?
= ?ameenin?
?ameenin? definition
Trusted; trusted in; confided in; trustworthy; faithful; steadfast. A person in whom one trusts or confides; a confidant; a person entrusted with, or to whom is confided, power, authority, control or a charge, over a thing; a person entrusted with an affair, or with affairs, i.e. with the management, or disposal, thereof; a confidential agent, a trustee; a depositary; a guardian; an aid or assistant; the strong. It is a word used immediately after a prayer, or supplication (it is best expressed when in occurring in a translation by the familiar Hebrew equivalent ?Amen?). Answer thou me; answer thou my prayer; O? God answer thou; or so be it; so do thou; O? Lord. It is one of the names of God. It comes from the root ?amina?, which means he was, or became, or felt, secure, safe, or in a state of security or safety; originally he was, or became quiet, or tranquil, in heart, or mind; he was, or became, secure, or free from fear; he was, or became, or felt, free from expectation of evil, or of an object of dislike or hatred, in the coming time; originally, he was, or became, easy in mind, and free from fear; to trust, be secure, be in safety, confine in. he was, or became trusted in, or confided in; or he was, or became, trusty, trustworthy, trustful, confidential, faithful; said of a man.
References
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume one, pp. 100 ? 103
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur?an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar, pp. 33 - 34Thus?now you understand?
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Peace
Apple Pie, The Quran specifically states that Jesus was the son of Maryam and that he commanded his people to follow GOD ALONE. That's a really big jump you made to believe that because the Book of Revelations spoke of the Word as being God then the Quran would mean the same thing too. As mentioned in 4171, Jesus is mentioned as the word of God, but that doesn't make him God. You're coming from a standpoint where the Bible IS the anchor to which all other books must fit their meanings into, which is fine, if that's what you believe. But that's not gonna work with the Quran, specifically if you're trying to prove Jesus is God. There is no Muslim on the face of this earth that believes that Jesus was more than just a servent of the One True God. That's built into our shahada and if you don't believe in the shahada - La Ilaha Illa Allah Wahdaho LA SHAREEKA LAHO - then Islam is not your faith, period.