evolution!
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Peace,
Yes, i will give an example on verse 2432-33 i translated together with another brother.
First we look at Nikaa meaning marriage/combining/mixing/contract/covenant/joining
BaGhA'a (as also in 1920 Bagyyaa) meaning
Sought for or after, desired, endeavored to find and take and get (good or evil)
Loving or affecting a thing
Acting wrongfully, injuriously or tyrannically
Seeking or endeavoring to act corruptingly, wrongly and/or unjustly, insolent/disobedient
Exceeding due bounds or just limits in any way
Not right, proper or fit
Prostitute or adulteress, unchasteTahasanun
HaSadNun
To be well fortified
to strengthen
to immunize
to secure
to strengthen one's position
to be secure
be protected
And TaHaSadNun
securing
safeguarding
protection
protectedness
See
Hans Wehr - A Dictionary of Modern Written Arabic - Edited by J. Milton Cowan (Third Edition)(183)
Furthermore, Abu Fazl and Lanes hold similar ideas on the issue of Hasuna (Ha,Sad,Nun) Giving
to fortify
to secure
to structure (a palace)Malakat
coming from the word MaLaK
kingdom or realmAyManukum
oath/pledgeMa malakat aymanukum what is under your guardianship/oath
We can translate the verse from marriage point of view
"And combine/marry/bring together off those among you who are single/solitary, and from the virtious/good/righteous among your male and female servants/subordinates/workers. If they are poor/in need, then God will grant them from His grace. And God is Encompassing, Knowledgeable.
And let those who are not able to find a combination(match)/not able to marry, continue to be chaste until God enriches them of His Bounty. And if those (women) under your oath/authorization/guardianship seek marriage/rights, then marry them off/give them their rights if you find they are ready/deserve it, and give them from the wealth of God which he has bestowed on you. and don't compel/drive/force your daughters/your women/young women into something that goes beyond their just rights/them feeling injustice, if they wish/desire to structure their own 'palace'(life)/protect their own 'palace'(life).
Or
and don't compel your daughters/your young women into something beyond their just rights/them feeling injustice, when they seek their own ways of strengthening their position.
Or
And don't compel your daughters/young women (in regards to their personal goals) beyond their just rights/them feeling injustice, when they seek their own independent ways of strengthening their personal position (in regards to their personal goals in life).In order that you make a gain in the goods/In order that you seek the gains of the immediate enjoyments (hayatud Dunya). God is the One who protects and provides (from the consequences of such mischievous plans).(2432-33)
"Hayatud Dunya" has been presented to be so by Abu Fazl in his Urdu Dictionary in Urdu words as follows "Fawri Aaish", I have translated above the meaning given by Abu Fazl in Urdu to English to be "Immediate enjoyments".
God is the one who "covers them from the consequences of the plans" and "provides them", Ghafuur=
God is the one who "protects" and "provides" .Ghafuur even means "the one who protects" (Refer Gharibul Quran - Abu Fazl)(page.292). Raheem even means "the one who provides" (Refer Lughatul Quran and Gharibul Quran notes on "Rahma"In the first version it is to combine the single people, so they can find a partner in love, and don't just pick out the rich. Combine the rich and poor to get a balanced society, where equality rules. And God will help them all grow then. And if they can't find a good combination yet, let them wait, and don't fall into illicit acts. And if you are a trustee/responsible over people under your care, that can mean from daughters to anyone under your authority/guardianship, then if they are ready, let them get married if they want, and help them get started. And don't force the daughters/women into situations were they feel they are being treated with unjust, things that go beyond their wishes, their permission, let them fill in their own lives. Let them decide on their own, how they want to develope. So this can apply to choice of education, husband, work, and so on. Just to please your or a family, or to uphold a tradition, or to gratify your wishes and plans you had with them, let those expectations go. Let them be individuals is what this verse tells us. Because God will protect them against the consequences of your plans.
Or if you see Nikaa in a social 'help' contract.
This is what you can see if you approach Nikaa in a social waya) Life in a Quranic system is more social where none would be left solitary. This verse urges the Social programmers to work on providing a strong family structure for these solitaries this may be through marriage or without it. Such is because such solitaries may be a child, a lady, a woman, or even elderly citizens residing in the city.b) Quran wants various classes of the society to come forward and show their enthusiasm in helping these solitaries find their a better life.c) Quran even emphasizes that those with limited means aren't ignored in this call. This is because, there are chances that they may have something to give to some which others may not. So, let this call be generally for all, whosoever feels that he/she is well in a position to fulfill it.
2432
So get the solitaries, the solitaries of society together, combine with them/form social contracts with them, wether you are rich or poor, the virtious, and God will grant them from His Bounty. God is Encompassing, Knowledgable.a) To continue, after going through the responsibilities of the contract (case to case) if one feels that he may not be able to do it, then let him refrain from proceeding with it. One shouldn't be demotivated for being in such a state; it is hope that takes one to the top, if one has the will to learn and strive in getting what he aims at in ways better and productive.
b) I believe that one is more a kind of Trustee when it comes for handling "Ma Malakat Aymanukum". Thus, giving back the trust to the right owners is quite important. So, of those who have responsibilities pertaining "Ma malakat Aymanukum" based on some stipulated contract, should spend of what they own of theirs if requested when it comes for establishing them in their desirable objectives. However, in case, the trustee is more worthy of defining the limits of spending then be it so.
c) Last but not the least, having had given such right to the trustees it doesn't mean that they poke nose and press things to a level that individuals tend to have nothing of their personal identity or say a opinion or even an objective regarding their future. One should understand that it is they who have to decide what they would have to do and that the job of the trustee is to guide them. So, if those under the shade of the trustee particularly the young women wish to strengthen their life in their own independent ways (this may or may not be about marriage) then they should be given all the more utilities to work on it. Let not the gliterring present deceive you in giving them their due rights.2433
And let those who can't find a good combination (to give social help or to find social help), then refrain from it till God helps you, enriches you. And if those who are under your guardianship (Ma Malakat Aymanukum) seek their own rights (Kitaab) then give them once you believe that they deserve it and provide them with the means that God had provided you with.And don't compel/drive/force the people under your guardianship(contract) on you into something (in regards to their personal goals) beyond their just rights/doing them injustice, when they seek their own independent ways of strengthening their personal position (in regards to their personal goals in life).
In order that you make a gain in the goods/In order that you seek the gains of the immediate enjoyments (hayatud Dunya). God is the One who protects and provides (from the consequences of such mischievous plans).So in these interpretations, that both fit perfectly, you get two most important ideas/laws/directions. One protecting women/youths/people under guardianship, and the other to drive people to help social solitary people to get back on their feet.
When you approach the Quran, you must do that from a logical, non-mythology, non-time related thinking.
This is the best key, that gives the most logical explantions.Peace
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Peace arnoldyasin. Absolutely superb analysis. I think you have solved the riddle of the meaning of ;'those whom your right hand posesses',and maybe how many wives you (or the prophet.) can marry... Very,very good work.
Now these verses can bear some relevence to reality and reason,and for the possible betterment of society.
Peace all. -
Peace,
Thank you enquirer, this is only the beginning. The thing is, this we did in 2 days, as long as you have good dictionaries and old arabic literature, this you pick up immediatly if you use a clear, logic and wise mind. The same applies for other things like heaven and hell, jinn, even the so-called virgin birth, which the Quran doesn't mention. There is no mythology, no contradiction and no unlogical things in the Quran, it truly can shake a mountian of will......
Peace
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peace arnoldyasin, enquirer and phoenix1,
could this be the beginning of a new islam?
arnoldyasin, how did you arrive with such perfect conclusions within a very short time span? i admire your work and wisdom. simply, the blueprints and research you have presented could surely be applied for the quran as a whole... maybe if we agree on something, maybe this website wouldn't be so diverse...
keep up the excellence...
peace, rifat
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But life didn't emerge through what we call is evolution, but what we can rather call, intelligent design. Since all the factors that must be present to create these possibilities are so precise, it is impossible that mere chance was involved.
peace arnoldyasin,
great analysis. Thank you.
But about evolution, instead of calling it chance, can we call it fate? maybe God planned this. -
Peace mr humble....I hope so...This 'new' islam(peace.) in reality has always existed...just sometimes 'hidden' under different names,titles,people and places. We should try to unite on the universal practical verified morals,and practical,logical verified laws..Theoretical'Beliefs' are not always that important(we sometimes use different words/concepts to say the same things,or understand a concept such as god in a different though similiar ways.),the behaviour,and following the verified universal laws/morals are the most important things....
Peace all. -
peace enquirer,
Peace mr humble....I hope so...This 'new' islam(peace.) in reality has always existed...just sometimes 'hidden' under different names,titles,people and places. We should try to unite on the universal practical verified morals,and practical,logical verified laws..Theoretical'Beliefs' are not always that that important(we sometimes use different words to say the same things,or understand a concept such as god in a different though similiar way.),the behaviour,and following the verified universal laws/morals are the most important things....
Peace all.basically, you are saying that 'muslim ideology' could be applied without the input of any of what we call "muslims"... does that mean when scientists are researching and discovering 'nature' are they necessarily 'muslims'?(for example, people who work not only to saitsfy personal curiosity but also for the betterment of society)
peace, rifat
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Peace phoenix. But the thing is,this 'new' 'islam'(peace.) can be propogated by behaving and reacting rationally/peacefully to situations and people,not just with discussions or theories...many people in the world(especially non-religious people in the west or liberal democracies.) automatically follow this islam(peaceful/logical behaviour.) without giving it the label of 'islam'...Have some optimism my friend. )
peace all. -
Peace mr humble. 100% those scientists can be muslims...Just by instinctively following universal law willingly. Whats better than trying to work for the betterment of yourself and others?...I feel this is what god really requires from everyone...Not illogical,unverified,controlling,dogmatic use of rituals...
I also wouldnt say that 'traditional' muslims or 'quran only' muslims are not good muslims,...you have to 'quantify' each person on their general merits...Any person of any religion or background can contribute to society positively,as long as they are peaceful(muslim.) and follow universal,verified laws willingly,and to the best of their god-given individual abilities. -
Peace,
Phoenix, why call it fate? Just like Professor Paul Davies said
? This can be no trivial detail, no minor byproduct of mindless, purposeless forces. We are truly meant to be here?It is more then fate, understand you, yes you, are meant to exist. You as a person, is not just here because God's liked to create you, He created you, to be you! It goes beyond fate...........
Thank you guys for your kind comments,it motivates me to do more, the truth motivates me enough, but these are icings on the cake But keep in minds guys, i'm only a 24 year old youngster, if i can understand, so can you.
It is a whole package that makes somebody a submitter to Reality. So it is a requirment to believe in God, in having a purpose for our existence, to live good and work hard to make society better.
Most of my analysis comes through philosophy of reason, science and my theology study. Most people on this site have opinions(which of course is their right to express and have, don't get me wrong on this) but without researching all the history and answers surrounding a topic. You waste some many time on just discussing things without knowing the background, instead of using that time to study Arabic which is so important. I hear so many people judge the Quran as a 'wise' book from history, and 'i don't know if it is from God', while if people studied the science in the Quran, you would be amazed by it, and know for certain this is not a simple book from the past written by men, no person in the 7th century could have known these things! Come on, reality check please! Instead of complaining the laws can't be applied no more, first check if you have the right understanding, because most people on this site don't have it. I don't say i have all the answers, but at least i try to do a bit more to understand it all....Like heaven and hell are easy to be found, first you investigate how psychology of understanding words work, then you will see that every words defeinition depends on its culture and were it cultures gets its definition from. So then you will see that meanings change and are created around words sometimes. So i traced back the concept of heaven and hell, and saw it was all mythology. Then i checked what the Quran says itself, and voila.......
Here are some answers i gave a person on heaven and hell, these are just some loose scraps of my thoughts, i still have to work it all out in an article
Standing in front of God is meant symbolicaly. On that day,we will be confronted with the truth, and will understand the truths about our lives and God. So it is a day of self-confrontation, you will be confronted with the illusions you lived, your personally made hell. God is everywhere and everything, so seeing is symbolic for seeing His attributes, seeing the truth. Heaven and Hell are methaphors for living in truth or lies. We create or own hells, by creating illusions of how to live and think. God will not punish,you will do that yourself by living in lies. In that way you will never grasp the reality of potentials in this life. That is why God says, that all your deeds on earth,how good they even were,will have no value as you haven't understood life and your true potentials. The hell we create is one of not grasping reality. It is like denying you have two arms,and by thus always ignoring them,never using them,and thus taking away your true potentials of what you could have achieved in your life. And this denial will go on in the next life,even though you have been confronted with the truth,you will remain in illusions as long God wants to, you will know your illusions are wrong, but you cannot grasp the truth, and will continue your own made hell. So commiting a 'sin' comes out of choosing a lie, if i commit adultry now,i must lie to myself to accept this deed,make a fake-truth to make an excuse to perform a deed. This is hell. These lies burns away your potentials and your reason, it will burn away all the blessings God wants you to experience. That is why believe in one God is so important,because it is the truth,it is not because God wants you to believe in it,you need it to escape fake-truths,hells. God doesn't need or want anything. If you believe in no God or believe there are multiple gods,is again like believing you have no arms or believe you have ten arms,you will never make good use of the two you really have. So all the things God says in the quran is not about that He wants you to believe it otherwise He punishes you, it is otherwise you end up putting yourself in living illusions,lies,hells. God does this to help our selfs,not because He wants thanx. Listening to the quran and thanking God is acknowledging the truth and by thus giving yourself heaven. Djenna=is the garden we can't see,because it is in our thinking. The rivers and other allegories in the quran about heaven are methaphors for the fruits of heavenly-thinking, the results, the things we will experience because of our thinking and living the truth, heaven for individuals, that will create heavenfor societies. That is also why the quran is mostly talking in symbolic language, because it is a book for all times. Literal meanings would limit it to only certain period in time. Trough symbolic language the quran is approachable for all people and ages.The Quran talks a lot in symbolic language. The punsihment for theft is a good example, do you believe we have to chop of their hands literaly? Or maybe take it symbolic and cut of their means of stealing by prisontime and 'marking' them like with the women with Yousouf, through photoindication? Gehenna, whatwe translate into the Greek-Roman English word Hell, is a valley near Jerusalem where they used to sacrifice humans to their made up idols. Do you realy believe that people go to this valley in the next life literaly? Of course not, you take this symbolicaly for a place of punishment. Now you have to question yourself; how did your interpretation of 'hell' come from? You were probably brought up in an Islamic or Christian enviroment. The thing is, meanings and filling in of words, is done by our education, the image of what that word means, is not always the real image of the definition of the word, but a filled in explanation. Like in the Islamic world, Salat meaning only prayer, while its meaning is far wider then that alone. In the Jewish-Zoroasterian-Christian-Islamic world, the vision of heaven and hell comes from the Greeks and Egyptians. Their vision of heaven and hell comes from their polytheistic mythology.
Djenna, what we translate into the Greek-Roman heaven, literaly means; the garden we can't see. Again symbolic language used. Gehenna was taken as a symbol for people following lies, that destroys humanity and individuals, by referring to the lies that burn away reason, peace, thruth, progress and our potential of attaining higher levels, in this life and the next. Djenna, the garden we cannot see, refers to our higher thinking, that will produce unbelievable things by following the truth, things that God resembles with rivers of milk and honey. The houris of the next life, is not that created them specificaly so, but they are a result of the higher thinking, of the higher behaviour in the next life. God also says there are different levels in the heavenly thinking, which will produce different levels of 'fruits'=results, results that will be unimaginable, unbelievable.
The question here is, do you need a place of punishment to be threathened with to persuade you not to follow lies? Do you need to be scared with punishment to persuade you to follow the truth? Do you need a reward to persuade you to follow the truth? Isn?t following the truth, heaven by itself? Isn?t following lies, hell by itself? Isn?t the truth enough for you to follow it? Why do you need a push, why should anyone need to be threathened to follow the truth? Isn?t it then blackmail? Ask yourself these questions when you choose your symbolic fill in of heaven and hell.
You say you want to meet God, but God says He is everywhere and everything we see and don?t see. So which do you want to meet or see? You are already part of Him, you ?use? Him to live. You are already ?meeting? Him. So know which part of you is not meeting Him? Isn?t that your thinking? Our eyes cannot penetrate Him, but He can penetrate ours. So it is our understanding that will meet Him, our understanding will meet the truth.enquirer and the rest, i can really recommend you to buy Ahmed Ali translation, and dr.Shabbir's transaltion, which are not 100% perfect, but at least approach the Quran with wisdom and an as much clear head as they could. I believe myself that in just a few more years there will be more consensus on understanding Quran. So i recommend also that just like me, study arabic. What do you have to loose??? Read as much history you can, science books and so on, don't be depended on the internet, let the net be depended on you.....
And i can really recommend you guys, to approach the Quran more seriously as a real revelation. Your doubts you guys have, are not un-founded, they're based on logic and demand for reason, which some people just don't need apparently. So your reluctancy are correct, but are formed because of wrong translations and understandings, and especialy on wrong defenitions of certain terms as hajj, jinn, heaven, hell, angels and so on.Living in heaven, is living in the truth. That takes more then just your concience. Your concience is your steering wheel, but you still need a car to steer....
On this site you can obtain the translations
http//www.studyquran.co.uk/ Here you can download the Ahmed Ali translation and the QXP from dr.Shabbir
peace -
Peace,
Thank you enquirer, this is only the beginning. The thing is, this we did in 2 days, as long as you have good dictionaries and old arabic literature, this you pick up immediatly if you use a clear, logic and wise mind. The same applies for other things like heaven and hell, jinn, even the so-called virgin birth, which the Quran doesn't mention. There is no mythology, no contradiction and no unlogical things in the Quran, it truly can shake a mountian of will......
Peace
"Hayat-u-dunya" Means "the life of this world".....Both separately also, are very commonly used words in Urdu. Hayat means life, and Dunia is this world.
Anyway just for your info.
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But life didn't emerge through what we call is evolution, but what we can rather call, intelligent design. Since all the factors that must be present to create these possibilities are so precise, it is impossible that mere chance was involved.
peace arnoldyasin,
great analysis. Thank you.
But about evolution, instead of calling it chance, can we call it fate? maybe God planned this.Evolution, if properly understood, is chance (mutations) plus fate (selection). And I believe that there's no such thing as 'chance' to God, who knows all possible outcomes. I believe if we humans see chance, for God it's just hidden certainty.
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Peace,
Virtual eye, how you use words today, can't be used as examples for how it was used 1400 years, as the modern arabic and even the view on old arabic is mostly distorted by the Persian language. So thank you for your comment, but it is the same as saying when i translated a old english book from 1200, and you wanna correct me with american english. But if you speak Urdu, i know some good dictionaries in Urdu, my friends use. Abu Fazl disagrees with you, as the root refers to it being the temporaly enjoyments. Translating it as wordly life is partly false, as there is nothing wrong with this life. This is one of the main mistakes people make with reading and translating the Quran, by thinking this life is 'bad', as this thought contradicts the Quran. It is about that the temporaly enjoyments are wrong to pursuit....
Peace
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Peace,
Virtual eye, how you use words today, can't be used as examples for how it was used 1400 years, as the modern arabic and even the view on old arabic is mostly distorted by the Persian language. So thank you for your comment, but it is the same as saying when i translated a old english book from 1200, and you wanna correct me with american english. But if you speak Urdu, i know some good dictionaries in Urdu, my friends use. Abu Fazl disagrees with you, as the root refers to it being the temporaly enjoyments. Translating it as wordly life is partly false, as there is nothing wrong with this life. This is one of the main mistakes people make with reading and translating the Quran, by thinking this life is 'bad', as this thought contradicts the Quran. It is about that the temporaly enjoyments are wrong to pursuit....
Peace
Well, who said this life in the world is bad....its just bad to be lost in the pleasures of it instaed of preparing for the real life after death....This is our examination hall for the real life after the answer sheet is marked.
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Peace,
Quote
its just bad to be lost in the pleasures of it instaed of preparing for the real life after death....This is our examination hall for the real life after the answer sheet is markedYour thinking and deeds has as much effect on tommorow as on the next life. So it is not just a test, it is learning what is the best way to live, to get the most out of life. In this life and the next....
Peace
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Did i ever say it wasn't?