Do people before the advent of Islam go to heaven?
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Peace all,
I agree there is no such thing as "before islam". All the messengers brought the same message of al-islaam from the one Creator. Al-islaam was COMPLETED with the revelation of al-qur'aan, not initiated.
53 today I completed for you your deen, and I completed on you My blessing , and I accepted/approved for you the islam (as) a deen
This is what Abraham said according to al-qur'aan
2131 When his Lord said to him "Surrender (aslim)," he said "I surrender (aslamtu) to the Lord of the worlds."
This is what Joseph said according to al-qur'aan
12101 "My Lord, you have given me sovereignty and taught me the interpretations of what is supposed. Initiator of the heavens and Earth, you are my protector in this world and the Hereafter. Take me as one who has surrendered (musliman), and join me with the good doers."
Allah named the submitters "muslim" from before, and called the deen creed/religion of Abraham
2278 And strive in the cause of God its truly deserved striving. He is the One who has chosen you, and He has made no hardship for you in the deen, the creed (millata) of your father Abraham; He is the One who named you 'those who have surrendered' (almuslimeena) from before as well as in this.
Prophet Muhammad was asked by Allah to follow the religion of Abraham who was a muslim (submitter) according to 2131
16123 Then We inspired to you "You shall follow the creed/religion (millata) of Abraham, monotheism, and he was not of those who set up partners."
Some of those in the heavens and the earth who are "muslims" have been present even before mankind (like the angels), so islam has been around even before mankind existed
383 Is it other than God's system (deen) that they desire, when those in the heavens and the earth have surrendered (aslama) to Him voluntarily or by force? And to Him they will be returned.
2218 Did you not see that to God submit what is in the heavens and what is in the Earth, and the sun and the moon and the stars and the mountains and the trees and what moves, and many of mankind, and many who have deserved the retribution. And whoever God disgraces, then none can honour him. God does what He pleases.
Allah promises that WHOEVER surrenders to Him and does good will be rewarded
2112 No, whosoever surrenders (aslama) himself to God, while doing good, he will have his reward with his Lord. There will be no fear over them, nor will they grieve.
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peace KGB,
doesn't the quran tells us to follow all the messengers? how did the previous scriptures become abrogated?
also, didn't the previous scriptures and prophets teach us the same message?
and i think the quran also talks about following previous scriptures. I don't know for sure.
but please answer my above questions.i agree with Kyle, if that wasn't obvious already.
Peace mate
The quraan never told us to follow the previous scriptures, it only told us to believe that Allah sent them
we are only ordered to follow the Quran
Salam
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Peace
I did see that but it is waste of time try to explain something to someone who do not believe that Qur'an is the divine revelations of Allah (SWT).
Mate
I advice that you convey the message then messure the ego and intelligence scale of the replys of your opponent, A Quran submitter should easily identify the hopeless cases through those two scales, and sure I donlt waste my time with hopeless cases
cheers
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Thank you Ahmed Bahgat. InshaAllah keep this in mind in future.
I really don't like this Australian slang Mate. ;D
Ok bro here is a list and you tell me what you like
- Mate
- Khai
- Sadiqi
- Friend
- Mister
LOL
you choose
cheers
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Thank you Ahmed Bahgat. InshaAllah keep this in mind in future.
I really don't like this Australian slang Mate. ;D
Ok bro here is a list and you tell me what you like
- Mate
- Khai
- Sadiqi
- Friend
- Mister
LOL
you choose
cheers
- Sadiqi real nice. ;D
Ok Sadiqi
Your wish is granted, Profiler 2006 has been updated
Salm Sadiqi
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Thank you Ahmed Bahgat. InshaAllah keep this in mind in future.
I really don't like this Australian slang Mate. ;D
Ok bro here is a list and you tell me what you like
- Mate
- Khai
- Sadiqi
- Friend
- Mister
LOL
you choose
cheers
- Sadiqi real nice. ;D
Ok Sadiqi
Your wish is granted, Profiler 2006 has been updated
Salm Sadiqi
Thank you Brother. )
BTW
Sadiqi means "my friend" in arabic
I know that much of Arabic now.
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BTW
Sadiqi means "my friend" in arabic
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Peace mate
The quraan never told us to follow the previous scriptures, it only told us to believe that Allah sent them
we are only ordered to follow the Quran
Salam
peace Ahmed, thank you for the explanation. But one more question. If God told us to follow what He sent us, then aren't the previous scriptures part of what God sent us?
I think what it all comes down to is verification. we must verify and understand everything before we follow it. -
Peace mate
The quraan never told us to follow the previous scriptures, it only told us to believe that Allah sent them
we are only ordered to follow the Quran
Salam
peace Ahmed, thank you for the explanation. But one more question. If God told us to follow what He sent us, then aren't the previous scriptures part of what God sent us?
I think what it all comes down to is verification. we must verify and understand everything before we follow it.Allah (SWT) has replaced the previous scriptures with Qur'an. If you read Qur'an with a faith it is divine revelation than there are more changes you will be able to understand the message.
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Peace mate
The quraan never told us to follow the previous scriptures, it only told us to believe that Allah sent them
we are only ordered to follow the Quran
Salam
peace Ahmed, thank you for the explanation. But one more question. If God told us to follow what He sent us, then aren't the previous scriptures part of what God sent us?
I think what it all comes down to is verification. we must verify and understand everything before we follow it.Mate
I see it this way
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The first scriptures were full of wisdom and guidance
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Allah gave the human the role of guarding it but they failed
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Allah sent the last guidance that have the same guidance revealed previously in addition to that new laws, and even new laws that overwrote laws in these old scriptures, like the laws of punishing the homos or the laws regarding adultry, Allah was clear that the Quran is "Muhaimen" on all other scriptures, i.e. it is far superior to all the previous scriptures, it is enough that Allah said He is in charge in guarding to make far superior to others scriptures which were gurded by the flawed humans who can't be trusted
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The Quran also stressed that those previous scriptures have been corrupted by sick humans, hence there is no obligation on humans to follow it as it is going to be hatrd to know which part is corrupt and which is not, no wonder He sent another message "The Quran" and no wonder that He is guarding it Himself because it is the last one He sent to us as the Quran told us "Khatim Al Anbiaa", i.e. there will be no more prophets to tell us Anbaa "News"
Regarding verification, well it is so easy to prove that Allah was 100% right when He told us in the Quran that humans corrupted the previous messages, therefore it is verified
now what else you are seeking to verfy, please don't tell me that you have to verify the existance of Allah
can you please give me a few examples fropm the Quran on things that we must verify?
cheers
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peace KGB,
what leads you to the conclusion that the previous scriptures have been replaced?
46 And We sent after them in their footsteps Isa, son of Marium, verifying what was before him of the Taurat and We gave him the Injeel in which was guidance and light, and verifying what was before it of Taurat and a guidance and an admonition for those who guard (against evil).
47 And the followers of the Injeel should have judged by what Allah revealed in it; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the transgressors.
48 And We have revealed to you the Book with the truth, verifying what is before it of the Book and a guardian over it, therefore judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their low desires (to turn away) from the truth that has come to you; for every one of you did We appoint a law and a way, and if Allah had pleased He would have made you (all) a single people, but that He might try you in what He gave you, therefore strive with one another to hasten to virtuous deeds; to Allah is your return, of all (of you), so He will let you know that in which you differed;
49 And that you should judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their low desires, and be cautious of them, lest they seduce you from part of what Allah has revealed to you; but if they turn back, then know that Allah desires to afflict them on account of some of their faults; and most surely many of the people are transgressors.
(46)
(47)
(4
(49)
Salam
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I see it this way
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The first scriptures were full of wisdom and guidance
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Allah gave the human the role of guarding it but they failed
peace
I understand the above, but what I don't understand is why it took God several tries to understand that the humans cannot be trusted? why couldn't be the first scripture perfect like the Quran?
now what else you are seeking to verfy, please don't tell me that you have to verify the existance of Allah
can you please give me a few examples fropm the Quran on things that we must verify?
I don't think belief in God has anything to do with the Quran.
I think we have to verify every law. I don't believe we should read the Quran with complete and blind faith in it's "perfectness." We need to follow what the Quran says and find out if it works or not. We need to put every law, every lesson side by side with natural law to make sure that what it says is true. That is the ONLY way to know. Otherwise, the Quran might not be what it claims to be. I hope you understand what I'm saying. -
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I understand the above, but what I don't understand is why it took God several tries to understand that the humans cannot be trusted? why couldn't be the first scripture perfect like the Quran?
It didn?t take Allah several tries neither the previous books were not perfect, it was part of His plan to expose the human corruption, I also see it that humans are the ones who are taking too many tries to understand what Allah is and what He is doing with us they even corrupted the messeeges Allah sent to them,
now what else you are seeking to verfy, please don't tell me that you have to verify the existance of Allah
can you please give me a few examples fropm the Quran on things that we must verify?
I don't think belief in God has anything to do with the Quran.
Well I?m talking about the God of the Quran not any other gods if there is any, now to believe in God you have to believe what he says, you can?t separate the two
I think we have to verify every law.
Give me examples of some laws and how it can be verified please
I don't believe we should read the Quran with complete and blind faith in it's "perfectness.
I think that you are missing an important point regarding the Quran, part of the Quran is not perfect and is called Mutashabih, 37 and the Quran told us that no human will even know the meaning of those mutashabihat verses, hence you can?t really verify all the verses in the Quran
" We need to follow what the Quran says and find out if it works or not.
it has to work because Allah knows and we don?t know as the Quran told us, hence even if it does not work then the problem is with the humans not with the divine laws
We need to put every law, every lesson side by side with natural law to make sure that what it says is true.
Great, let?s start with verse 11 and go through the whole Quran and show me how you can do that and how long it will take you to do that
That is the ONLY way to know.
I have a much either way, I believe what Allah told me in the Quran blindly
Otherwise, the Quran might not be what it claims to be. I hope you understand what I'm saying.
No I don?t understand that bit and would like you to elaborate please
Salam
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This verse clearly point that Qur'an has replaced the previous scriptures.
2106 None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar Knowest thou not that Allah Hath power over all things?
Ma nansakh min ayatin aw nunsiha nati bikhayrin minha aw mithliha alam taAAlam anna Allaha AAala kulli shayin qadeerun
I did say that Allah (SWT) has abrogated the previous scriptures which is not correct. I will try not to make not such statements in the future.
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peace Ahmed,
I don't think we need to take God and Quran together. What if you were locked up in a room and were only given to read what your captives allowed, and they never give you the Quran. Would you not believe in God then? would it be impossible for you to have a sense of morality?
It is easy for people like me and you to follow the quran blindly. We've been brought up believing that. It was ingrained in our brains at an early age that the quran is from God. What if a christian reads the quran? how can he/she blindly believe in it right away?
We don't need to verify every single verse. But all the major points in the quran. For example killing is wrong, or stealing is wrong. We can see for ourselves that those things are bad. The rules for governments, distibuting wealth, all of those laws.
How can we just assume, without ever reading it, that the quran is from God? and if we have to read it, and understand it to believe that, then you agree with me that we have to verify.and is 37 telling us that NO ONE will be able to understand those verses or only the ones with knowledge?
and if it is saying what you think it does, then doesn't that sound a bit suspicious.
I mean, I could write a book and say all sorts of things in it, and then claim that this book is from God. And it's not perfect because God included in it non-sense on purpose, to test us. -
37 telling us that NO ONE will be able to understand those verses or only the ones with knowledge?
No, the verse clearly states, only God knows AND the people with knowledge...