Are we enjoined to do sabbath ?
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Peace brother,
just when i was thinking of having a day of rest everyweek )
But thanks to Br.ayman - wonderful logic.You can rest on any day you want but don't claim that it was decreed by The God. If it was up to me, I would work on Saturday and Sunday and take any other two days of the week off. This way I can avoid the rush-hour traffic jams for two of my work days. Similarly when I was in Egypt I liked to work on Sunday, Saturday and Firday when traffic was light during the day. I also like to work on Christmas and take other days off instead, especially if I am travelling on vacation. This allows me to get cheap airline tickets and avoid the Christmas airport congestions. ;D
Peace and all best wishes,
Ayman
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peace
You can rest on any day you want but don't claim that it was decreed by The God.
I agree. If you follow al quran, that cannot be argued.
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Peace All
Did Abraham observe Sabbath?
When was it decreed?
Was it only for the People of the book or for the Children of the Israel or for All?
Was it decreed on the day when the mount was raised and God took a covenant from the Children of Israel?
Since the command ( on the day the covenant was taken) was not to transgress the Sabbath was Sabbath decreed before the covenant was taken?
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Peace,
The Bible doesn't mention that Abraham took Sabbath. This only appears in The Book Exodus; 208, 3113, Deutonorium 512-15Leviticus 252, 426,34, Jesua 564, Hebrews 49 Ezekiel 2012,228, Mathew 128, 2420 Mark 227 and Kol 216.
The story of Abraham is contained in the Book Genesis and doesn't account of any special day of rest. As for the story of Moses, we cannot attain certainty about what Laws were truly given to him and which laws were put into the story by the later people as to make them divine laws. The five Books were called the Books of Moses, but this title cannot be taken seriously. As we have edited versions of manuscripts which are labeled as being from Moses.
The Thora(books of Moses) is constructed around 500BC by what we call the editors. In those days every synagogue had their own collection of manuscripts about the laws and the history. Because of the Diaspora after Babylonia conquered Judea, the need was created to collect all these manuscripts to make one universaly used collection. So they gathered all the manuscripts and started editing them. Some manuscripts had information other maunscripts didn't had, and so they completed the others information. Also they started to mix the history with the laws so people would understand where it was formed.
So like Deutonorium and Numeri which contains the laws of Moses, are constructed out of at least 9 different manuscripts. Genesis almost the same amount. The Psalms are constructed out of several collections of songs, as psalms refers to layments. Propably only half of the Psalms are really connected with David. So all of these manuscripts are not in their original form as we have them now in the Bible. We have the edited versions from which it is hard to understand which laws and stories are real and which ones are not. Also the order is wrong in the Bible as the story of Job happened before Abraham if i'm correct.
The 'editors' as we call them, decided which piece of information was taken up in the new edited version and which pieces were not. As they constructed and formed the story in such a way around the laws of their choice, it is hard to find which were real and which were taken in. We don't know which part can be traced to Moses and which one is not. It is like Quran is mixed up together with Hadith and Tafseer and myths and then all mixed so you don't know really which is which and also parts of the Quran left out. We don't what is missing and what is real.
This also applies to the Gospels as we know they are build up from several manuscripts. Mathew,Luke had as bases Mark and on or two other sources that are lost now. Mark is based also on those sources and other ones, again lost. John is a mish-mash of Mithra legends, Gnosis and two other lost sources of Jesus-sayings as these are not found in the other three. If we look at the Gospel of Thomas, which only contains sayings of Jesus, we can see that this was the only important part of the teachings of Jesus for the first Christians, or rather Nazarene. Most Gospels are mixed sayings and history and are again chosen information by their compilers, and again we don't know what is real and what is their view.
Interresting note that Jesus even neglected the Sabbath by 'working' on them. And showed the priests ignorance and dumbness about Sabbath by asking them if they would save their donkey on Sabbath if it would fall into a ditch.
So there is no proof at all that it was a law given to Moses by God. No one can really prove or disprove that it was taking in by the editors in 500BC. The Quran and Ayman's approach do prove it was edited into the Laws by the editors. There is also no history directly to be found that it taken from another culture. But an 'observence day' was common with priesthood religions.
Hope this helps....
Peace
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peace arnold
The Bible doesn't mention that Abraham took Sabbath. This only appears in The Book Exodus; 208, 3113, Deutonorium 512-15Leviticus 252, 426,34, Jesua 564, Hebrews 49 Ezekiel 2012,228, Mathew 128, 2420 Mark 227 and Kol 216.
Those are not part of the bible? ( i dont know too much about it) I would like info, if you don't mind.
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Peace,
Bible comes from the latin biblia, which means collection of manuscripts. The Bible contains 75 different manuscripts each chosen. All these manuscripts talk about a specific prophet or history. Like the Book Genesis is the first book of the Bible, which tells the story of Adam, Abraham, Joseph and so on. The Book Exodus, Deutonorium, Leviticus tells about Moses and how he and his people were guided to Israel. Every book has it's own subject. So you wanted to know if Abraham was aquinted with the Sabbath, then it should have been mentioned in Genesis, but it is not in there, and Genesis is the only Book in the Bible telling about Abraham. The Books i gave above do contain the concept of Sabbath, and the first Book that talks about Sabbath is the book, where the story of Moses is told. Exodus, Deutonorium and Leviticus. But like i told above, we don't know for certain if that was part of the original text as they edited and included text in 500BC.
I hope this helps a bit....
Peace
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peace arnold
I hope this helps a bit....
Yes it does, thanks
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Peace All
Peace AY
Thank you so much for the explanation.
Quote Arnold Yasin
?It is like Quran is mixed up together with Hadith and Tafseer and myths and then all mixed so you don't know really which is which and also parts of the Quran left out. We don't what is missing and what is real.?
Do you think part of the Quraan is left out ?Also I wanted to know the answers to my questions on Sabbath from the Quraan.
I guess if we try to find answers to these questions through all verses (also verses preceding and after these 5 verses) related to Sabbath it is gravitating towards Aymans theory . I was wondering why, Ayman did not try to use all these verses to support his theory but instead concentrated onlyon 7163 in isolation.Referring to AYasins' information in which Jesus not only by not adhering to Sabbath but in fact scoffing at it made me think can Sabbath be possible in real life. Does that mean all utilities, electricity water transport all distribution emergency law enforcement, medical and health services have to rest as well? Or this will be transgressing the limits of the rest?
I thought this might be connected and like to quote 2 verses from the Quraan which instructs after the gathering on Jumua to go about and do our work or businesses.
62 9 O ye who believe! when the call is proclaimed to prayer on Friday (the Day of Assembly) hasten earnestly to the Remembrance of Allah and leave off business (and traffic) that is best for you if ye but knew!
62 10 And when the Prayer is finished then may ye disperse through the land and seek of the Bounty of Allah and celebrate the Praises of Allah often (and without stint) that ye may prosper.God has not prescribed a Sabbath for the believers. But today in most Muslim countries Friday is a holiday and the people go to the masjid as early as possible (there are hadith to say there is merit in going very early to mosque on Friday) and also there are Jumua Eve programs in the mosque, basically it?s a Holy Holiday.
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peace arnold and all
Not to go off-topic, but on a related note. Did Jesus drink wine?
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Peace,
Quote Warner
Do you think part of the Quraan is left out ?No, it just to get an idea how the previous scriptures ended up. All previous scripture resembled the message of the Quran, but were not protected as the Quran. So they were edited and mixed up with later myth and theology. And things are also lost, so we cannot know what is part and what is not. I use the Quran as criterion, so i can get an idea what could have been part of the original message of those scriptures. The best result and clear idea of the message i got with the Veda's and Bhagada-vita.
And Imran, i don't believe he did drink wine as there are Gospels and references of the students that he condemned it. Also he was part of the Nazarenes/Essenes that didn't used wine in their rituals. But i 'll check further to be sure.
Peace
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peace
i don't believe he did drink wine as there are Gospels and references of the students that he condemned it.
Hmmm very interesting. I really find the conversation between Jesus and God really fascinating (on the day of judgement) 5116-118
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Peace,
That is one of the reasons i study Theology, to get the best idea on the history of the prophets and Deen, and then write books about the what the Quran tells us, and how it coincides with history. The Quran shows the correct history, it amazes me everytime.
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peace
The Quran shows the correct history, it amazes me everytime.
Not surprised.... Like what specifically
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Peace,
The believe in one God has always been present, this can be seen in almost all traditions around the world. The story of Moses, Joseph. Jesus and his true followers. The concept of how cultures rise and fall. But especialy the theology of monotheism and how it resonates through history. It is so much to explain and i hope in time to write articles and books about it.
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Peace All
I thought this might be connected and like to quote 2 verses from the Quraan which instructs after the gathering on Jumua to go about and do our work or businesses.
62 9 O ye who believe! when the call is proclaimed to prayer on Friday (the Day of Assembly) hasten earnestly to the Remembrance of Allah and leave off business (and traffic) that is best for you if ye but knew!
62 10 And when the Prayer is finished then may ye disperse through the land and seek of the Bounty of Allah and celebrate the Praises of Allah often (and without stint) that ye may prosper.God has not prescribed a Sabbath for the believers. But today in most Muslim countries Friday is a holiday and the people go to the masjid as early as possible (there are hadith to say there is merit in going very early to mosque on Friday) and also there are Jumua Eve programs in the mosque, basically it?s a Holy Holiday.
Salaam all
That's what I was thinking about when I read the comments of Ayman.
Sabath means, other than rest, gathering. It is related to the first exudos when all the israelites were "gathered" in the red sea. That's why it is first mentioned in "Exudos".
Maybe they transgressed the "sbt" because they were asked not to rest, but to leave business, gather and "pray". Instead, they just stopped working the whole day and rested from doing even good deeds, just as we treat "friday".
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The Roman Catholic Emperor had made change sabbath to sunday, to change history and Allah's will.
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Salaam,
On alternative explanation over the punishment/trial concern impose to Ashab Sabt (The Sabt Observant), it might also meant that God had tested them with the abundant of fish, on their self made "God" decreed rest day, compared to so called their working day.
Since God never commanded them to observe so called sabbath day, the trial (abundant of fish) had definitely exposing them to their own self made absurdity (bid'ah) and true greed.
It was itself a transgression in the name of God, by decreeing the Sabbath.
IMHO, Peace.
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Here is an excellent article about the Sabbath in the Quran
http//www.ccg.org/english/s/p274.html
and also about Juma'ah, preparing for the Sabbath
http//www.ccg.org/english/s/p285.html
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Sabt , soubat, yousbitoun , sabat is a word can be used as a verd
sabt , means puse or stop, soubat means sleep etc..sabbat = "day off" , it can be anyday , and saturday was named sabt is a fabrication, for religon purposes, to give a rituel and create a mystic day
sabt or day offf can be sunday until saturday , it is observed in every country in the world, some people take 2 days sabat, some takes one only, and jobless people are living a sabatt until they find a job -
I would have to disagree that the Sabbath day is fabricated sinc ethere are to say synergy in the commandment with God Almight creating his creation in 6 days and "logically" stopping on the 7th day on. Thus the COmmandment to enjoin the Sabbath day.
Also there are other commandments in the Torah that are also, to say, synergetic with this commandment such as the 6 years working/planting the land, and the 7th a rest year for the land (unlawful to plant, reep etc), also there is the 50th year jubilee (7x7+1)....
All these commanments would not thus likely to be fabricated, why would people not do anything and even have a punishment for death if one violates this, and even leave a 7th year not farming their land for?Moreover, the word SABT is used in the Quran, an instance where it state something like, "we made your sleep SIBATA" (Resting/stoping/dormant etc).
The Hebrew Word for Sabath is a direct cognate of the Arabic, and i think it's also used as a verb meaning stop