Translation of `Jinn`
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Peace Nabster,
Kindly address who it is you're posting to so we can avoid any confusion. Anyway, I think this was for me
No it is a debris from the issue of believing in Jinns as real beings as opposed to fantasies.
If jinns are not real...First, no one is saying jinn isn't real.
why would Allah have bothered to refer to them several times in the Quran and in detail?
Since when does something have to be an invisible creature in order to be mentioned in the Qur'an in detail?
It is the logic of the argument I am questioning that rules out the existence of Jinns as real beings.
OK.
Because similar arguments could then be used to invalidate the existence of Allah as a Real Being.
Baloney (bologna)!
There can only be one omnipresent source of creation. This cannot be written off. But I'm not sure what you mean by "being".What I said was even belief in Allah requires a leap in faith, similar to belief in what we cannot see, inclusive of Jinns.
Why does Allah ask us again and again to witness nature, to witness the universe, the heavens, the mountains, the rain? Why would you say these queries are posed? My opinion Because the deeper you dig, the more similarity you will find, and the closer you will get to the only possible solution - that something far greater than we can imagine created something so infinitely complex via such a simple, beautiful recipe. This requires no leap of faith. It simply requires unadulterated perception.
Maybe we will have instruments one day that will allow us to measure Jinn activities, and maybe even capture one, but for now it all has to do with faith.
Of course you're free to go down that path. I'm of the opinion that the Qur'an delivers guidance for this life, not clues of a creature that no one has seen for 1400 years, and may not see for another 14,000 years. I don't fault you or anyone for believing as you do. Why is it, that you fault those who do not believe as you do?
Please please let us stop this argument, this is not about who has the last word...
Agree to disagree, and call it quits. But getting the last word and saying it's not about the last word seems ironic, no?
By the way, neither you nor Ahmed have explained what it means that God is closer to us than our jugular vein.
Peace,
Tay -
By the way, neither you nor Ahmed have explained what it means that God is closer to us than our jugular vein.
Peace,
TayBrother Tay
do you really think I need to explain that?
well, it means Allah is very close to us, it has nothing to do with the Jugular Vein, nor Allah is inside us
Peace
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peace
Why does Allah ask us again and again to witness nature, to witness the universe, the heavens, the mountains, the rain? Why would you say these queries are posed?
because when you do, you'll realize that these things don't just 'exist.' Which will lead you to the path of the Creator
By the way, neither you nor Ahmed have explained what it means that God is closer to us than our jugular vein.
Read the verses before this verse and after
5015 Did We have any difficulty in making the first creation? No, they are in confusion about the next creation.
5016 And We have created man and We know what his soul whispers to him, and We are closer to him than his jugular vein.
5017 When the two receivers meet on the right and on the left.
5018 He does not utter a word except with having a constant recorder.
5019 And the moment of death came in truth "This is what you have been trying to avoid!"This is an allegory
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Peace be upon you Ahmed,
Now it is your turn to inform us how every human verified that Jinn are our egos
As soon as you show me where I ever said jinn = ego.
Please pay closer attention.
Nabster, you would fare better using the idea of MENTAL creation. Did a piece of Shakespeare die when one of his characters died?
Lastly, to all, how can the God be EVERYWHERE if It is not within the human being? Didn't the God blow into the human from ITS OWN Divine Energy(Ruh Ul Qudus)?
If the God is not in teh human being, then the human stands apart from the ONE, making another(partner).
All is ONE.
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Peace be upon you Ahmed,
Now it is your turn to inform us how every human verified that Jinn are our egos
As soon as you show me where I ever said jinn = ego.
Bro idolfree
forgive my ignorace
I can rephrase the question
can you please inform me how you verfired that the Jinns are exactly as how you understand it?
cheers
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peace tay
Peace Imran,
What is the truth behind this allegory, as you understand?
Peace,
TayGod is omniscient/omnipresent... that man thinks he wont be held accountable that no-one is watching him
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Peace,
AB, you take the Quran literally you always say. Ok. When you look at 2115 He says He is everywhere. When we would cut you open (only as an example ), the inside of your body would also fall under the 'everywhere'. When i would zoom in on a molecule with an electroscoop, that would also be included with 'everywhere'. Even when i look at the void of space, this is also included in 'everywhere'. When you or me look at our bodycells, when we look at every molecule and energy ray in the creation, they all include under 'everywhere'. I think 'everywhere' is pretty clear.
You always emphasise you take the Quraan literally, but now you back down on that approach and let your own opinion and assumption take over. You said this
well, it means Allah is very close to us, it has nothing to do with the Jugular Vein, nor Allah is inside us
Do you question Allah's word of using everywhere? So the 'everywhere' stops with our body? Where does this 'everywhere' stop for you? So this is the only verse you will not take literally?
To me God is everywhere, but i have no choice except to believe this as God says it Himself in the Quran, and we are made by Him and our excistence comes from Him. You think, by saying God is everywhere, and that we, our souls and body are part of Him, you think we make ourselves gods. This is nonsense. It only shows His All-pervading, never to be escaped power. We only have the power God gives us. Knowing we are part of Him, only makes me even more humble. I cannot escape Him, as everything i'm made off is part of Him. Knowing this doesn't make us gods or whatever, it even makes us more creation then before, as we now truly know, no power is from ourselves. Even the smallest energy particle is from Him, and He only gives what He wants to. I cannot take away any power from Him, i cannot force anything.
Peace
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Peace,
Peace bro
AB, you take the Quran literally you always say.
Sure, but hold on I hope you get what I mean so let me be more clearer
Yes I take everything literal UNLESS there Allah is telling us that this is a metaphor OR it is clearly a metaphor without saying to us first that it is a metaphor, however you will see that Allah in almost all cases told us, here is a metaphor in advance
And by me doing as such I?m still taking it literal 100% because to treat a clear cut metaphor as a metaphor, you treated it 100% literally, do you get it bro?
Ok. When you look at 2115 He says He is everywhere.
This is one of the most silliest argument I have ever met in my life, I told you bro, I agree that Allah is every where, but He is not carried or part of Him is carried in our bodies with one of us, this is non sense
When we would cut you open (only as an example D), the inside of your body would also fall under the 'everywhere'.
Sorry, this is stupid bro, so Allah is part of my car then, far out man this is blasphemy
When i would zoom in on a molecule with an electroscoop, that would also be included with 'everywhere'.
Well, 2115 is not actually saying Allah every where, this is a clear cut manipulatio0n by you, it only say where ever you face you Allah will be there, so it can be understood that he is everywhere AROUND us and AROUND His creatures not bloody INSIDE us and INSIDE His creatures, this is blasphemy
IN FACT THIS IS EXACTLY AS ALLAH TOLD US THAT HE IS EVERYWHERE AROUND US
Unto Allah belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and whatsoever is in the earth. Allah ever surroundeth all things.
(126)
-> Now here I got you cornered bro, do you know what the word , ?Muhita?, let me explain
-> The word ?Muhit? means ?Surronds?, now we read above , ? Allah ever surroundeth all things.? , i.e. Allah is surrounding all things, now do you consider me ?A thing?, I do, therefore Allah is surrounding me, therefore according to 2115 wherever I face I will face Him
Do 4126 or 2115 suggest the slightest that Allah is part of every thing?, NO IT IS NOT, but it is Iblis suggesting that to you
Even when i look at the void of space, this is also included in 'everywhere'.
Wow, I applaud how hard you try, but I don?t applaud how silly your arguments are
Let me even make it harder for you then
- can you prove to me that void of space is really void?
- According to 4126 if we consider the void to be ?thing?, then Allah will be surrounding the void as well, however I don?t think, void is void because it has something called dark matter, and if consider darl matter ?a thing? then according to 4126 Allah is surrounding the dark matter
When you or me look at our bodycells,when we look at every molecule and energy ray in the creation,
Sounds good to me
they all include under 'everywhere'. I think 'everywhere' is pretty clear.
Fine but the Quran says Allah is surrounding everywhere, i.e. He is indirectly everywhere and this is proven by 2115 that wherever we face we will face Allah
You always emphasise you take the Quraan literally,
And I still do
but now you back down on that approach and let your own opinion and assumption take over. You said this
I never back off unless proven wrong, can you prove it?, if you do, I will even thank you
well, it means Allah is very close to us, it has nothing to do with the Jugular Vein, nor Allah is inside us
my statement above is very accurate, because according to 4126, He is surrounding EVERTHING and that indirectly means He is everywhere and again this indirectly means that He is very close to EVERYTHING, like me and you
Do you question Allah's word of using everywhere?
No I don?t because He clearly said that He is surrounding EVERYWHERE, in 2115 He never said that He is everywhere, it only says that He has the east and the west ?DIRECTIONS? then it adds that wherevery we look we will face Allah, again we look in a direction in front of our faces?, 2115 never said Allah is inside everything, this is the lie you are trying to inject with deception and that is what I?m questioning, I?m one of those belivers who never question Allah even if it looks unjust or non sensible to me
So the 'everywhere' stops with our body?
Of course because it is used by our bodies, or used by any object, unless you want to bloody tell me that Allah is inside the fridge, insode the car, inside the toilet ?Astaghfar Allah?, this is blasphemy, but I know according to 4126 that Allah is surrounding all these objects
Where does this 'everywhere' stop for you?
When there is no object using it, mate you are getting very silly indeed, and I?m wasting my time to be honest
So this is the only verse you will not take literally?
Which verse, 2115?
It seems you are totally confused regarding 2115
To me God is everywhere,
Fine but not inside everywhere, as you are trying hard to inject into our minds
but i have no choice except to believe this as God says it Himself in the Quran,
He never said that He is inside everything, THIS IS A LIE AND BLASPHMEY BY YOU, ITAQI ALLAH BROTHER,
and we are made by Him and our excistence comes from Him.
sounds good to me
You think, by saying God is everywhere, and that we, our souls and body are part of Him, you think we make ourselves gods.
The above is utter BS by you and a case of desperation
I guess you should start the damage control phase
This is nonsense.
That?s right it is your non sense, because I never said that
It only shows His All-pervading, never to be escaped power.
What the hell was that?
We only have the power God gives us.
Sounds good to me
Knowing we are part of Him, only makes me even more humble.
Sounds blasphemy to me
I cannot escape Him,
Sounds good to me
as everything i'm made off is part of Him.
Sounds blasphemy to me
Knowing this doesn't make us gods or whatever, it even makes us more creation then before,
Yeh, yeh, the same old philosophical BS, no wonder all philosophers were Kafiroon
as we now truly know, no power is from ourselves. Even the smallest energy particle is from Him,
Sounds good to me
and He only gives what He wants to. I cannot take away any power from Him, i cannot force anything.
Peace
Sounds good to me
But sorry bro this will be the end of it with you, I have given you enough time and enough logic and you have given me enough non sense and crap,
I hope Allah guides you to His path
Salam
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By the way, neither you nor Ahmed have explained what it means that God is closer to us than our jugular vein.
Peace,
TayBrother Tay
do you really think I need to explain that?
well, it means Allah is very close to us, it has nothing to do with the Jugular Vein, nor Allah is inside us
Peace
The contradictory Ahmed once again. He believes that a stick turned to a snake physically, but believes that this line is metaphorical.
Picking and choosing, whatever suits your argument. Predictable and hypocritical.
Peace.
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Peace truth
when Allah wants to point to a parable, he does it using the sunna of his creation.
when he gives examples involving humans, jinns or angels these are facts and not metaphors, however you learn from both...
now how about opening your eyes
Nabster outIn which world is a jugular vein non-factual? Is it not part of a human?
If the jugular vein is metaphorical, then what about our hearts, chests, and other parts mentioned - are they metaphorical also?
Acting as Ahmed's lapdog and failing to spot your own nonsense is not very encouraging in relation to the openness of your own eyes.
Peace.
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Bros
you are wasting my time, but here you are the metaphor is about the fact that- The heart is the seat of our beingness (unlike what they think in the west)
A metaphor about a fact - nice little twist there.
So people who have heart transplants become different persons, or their 'beingness' switches does it?
So much for "Western thinking" (they're not legitimate humans after all) - bring on the Arab transformation. Bring on the beards, and bring on the pick and choose mullah mentality.
Salaaaaaaam.
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The contradictory Ahmed once again.
LOL mate, I'm glad that even with your silly allegations, many found what I say makes great sense, those many not only here bro, but in mnay other places including real life, not your world of a keyboard and a monitor
He believes that a stick turned to a snake physically,
yes it was turned into that by Allah, Allah can do anything
but believes that this line is metaphorical.
are you comapring apples with mangos again?, come on bro, what is your IQ exactly?
Picking and choosing, whatever suits your argument. Predictable and hypocritical.
Peace.
LOL, it seems you don't know what you are talking about and truley I have to dismiss you
Salam
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Peace
these are facts and not metaphors
Can't a metaphor be a fact?
How are you differentiating between an example and a metaphor ?
How is the example of truth and falsehood different from a metaphor? Is this picture not a fact or constituting al-haqq?
Joe
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truth, I refer you to the book by Dr Paul Pearsall "The Heart's Code" who is a heart surgeon.
Yes indeed, people who have heart transplants have been witnessed to exhibit changes in personality which reflect those of the donors.
PeaceNabster, you are ignorant beyond words.
Please see the website of this "heart surgeon" http//www.paulpearsall.com/ and discover for yourself that he is actually a psychologist (a non-medical profession) and a self styled "self-help guru" who writes books on various topics for profit. The book you mention is rated 3 out of 5 on Amazon and talks about baseless ideas and quasi-science.
What was it that you were saying about Western thought by the way?
Later.
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Ok. When you look at 2115 He says He is everywhere.
This is one of the most silliest argument I have ever met in my life, I told you bro, I agree that Allah is every where, but He is not carried or part of Him is carried in our bodies with one of us, this is non sense
If i cut up molecules, is what i see not part of everywhere? If i go as far as to the pure energy level, isn't that part of everywhere? How then can't He be EVERYWHERE like the Quraan says? This is not nonsense, this is you not having the conciousness to grasp it yet.
When we would cut you open (only as an example D), the inside of your body would also fall under the 'everywhere'.
Sorry, this is stupid bro, so Allah is part of my car then, far out man this is blasphemy.
To where do you limit 'everywhere'?
When i would zoom in on a molecule with an electroscoop, that would also be included with 'everywhere'.
Well, 2115 is not actually saying Allah every where, this is a clear cut manipulatio0n by you, it only say where ever you face you Allah will be there,so it can be understood that he is everywhere AROUND us and AROUND His creatures not bloody INSIDE us and INSIDE His creatures, this is blasphemy.
2115 And to God the sunrise/east and the sunset/west, so wherever you turn, so there (is) God's face/presence, that God is rich/extended , knowledgeable.
wherever i turn...to where do you limit everywhere AB? I can turn to a microscope to look at cells or molecules. It clearly says that wherever i turn, God's 'face', which clearly shows i'm looking at Him, altough that creation is representing Him, He is there.
IN FACT THIS IS EXACTLY AS ALLAH TOLD US THAT HE IS EVERYWHERE AROUND US
Unto Allah belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and whatsoever is in the earth. Allah ever surroundeth all things.
-> Now here I got you cornered bro, do you know what the word , ?Muhita?, let me explain
-> The word ?Muhit? means ?Surronds?, now we read above , ? Allah ever surroundeth all things.? , i.e. Allah is surrounding all things, now do you consider me ?A thing?, I do, therefore Allah is surrounding me, therefore according to 2115 wherever I face I will face Him
You have cornered yourself. Allah SURROUNDS ALL THINGS. So also molecules, energy ,whatever. He surrounds it at every level, as He clearly says ALL things. So also your body cells, the molecules that make up your car and you. Eveywhere you look, He is there, as He surrounds ALL things.
To where do you limit ALL things and EVERYWHERE?
Do 4126 or 2115 suggest the slightest that Allah is part of every thing?, NO IT IS NOT
God surrounds ALL things and is EVERYWHERE. So to what quantum level does the ALL things and EVERYWHERE stop?
Even when i look at the void of space, this is also included in 'everywhere'.
Wow, I applaud how hard you try, but I don?t applaud how silly your arguments are
Let me even make it harder for you then
- can you prove to me that void of space is really void?
- According to 4126 if we consider the void to be ?thing?, then Allah will be surrounding the void as well, however I don?t think, void is void because it has something called dark matter, and if consider darl matter ?a thing? then according to 4126 Allah is surrounding the dark matter
And God is surrounding ALL things, dark matter, the quantum field, so also the molecules in your body and everybody. He surrounds every level of every little particle o ray in the creation, it doesn't matter on which level you look, He surrounds it. So also your body cells, your organs..He is All.
When you or me look at our bodycells,when we look at every molecule and energy ray in the creation,
Sounds good to me
All things remember? You just explained to me above what the verse says...
they all include under 'everywhere'. I think 'everywhere' is pretty clear.
Fine but the Quran says Allah is surrounding everywhere, i.e. He is indirectly everywhere and this is proven by 2115 that wherever we face we will face Allah
indirectly? God doesn't say that, AB does. Surrounds ALL things, includes molecules and every quanta level of the molecules.
You always emphasise you take the Quraan literally,
And I still do
Not this time....
but now you back down on that approach and let your own opinion and assumption take over. You said this
I never back off unless proven wrong, can you prove it?, if you do, I will even thank you
Surrounds ALL things and is EVERYWHERE. To where do you limit these definitions?
well, it means Allah is very close to us, it has nothing to do with the Jugular Vein, nor Allah is inside us
my statement above is very accurate, because according to 4126, He is surrounding EVERTHING and that indirectly means He is everywhere and again this indirectly means that He is very close to EVERYTHING, like me and you
Yes, ALL things. So also your body cells, the molecules, the quarks. He is not very close, He is Everything...This 'indirectly' is your assumption. To how far do you accept 'surrounds ALL things' and 'is everywhere'?
Do you question Allah's word of using everywhere?
No I don?t because He clearly said that He is surrounding EVERYWHERE, in 2115 He never said that He is everywhere, it only says that He has the east and the west ?DIRECTIONS? then it adds that wherevery we look we will face Allah, again we look in a direction in front of our faces?, 2115 never said Allah is inside everything, this is the lie you are trying to inject with deception and that is what I?m questioning, I?m one of those belivers who never question Allah even if it looks unjust or non sensible to me
Surrounds ALL things. Molecules of your car and your body also fall under 'ALL things' doesn't it? And you do question God many times, but you can't see it. And till now it is you how is twisting the answers.
So the 'everywhere' stops with our body?
Of course because it is used by our bodies, or used by any object, unless you want to bloody tell me that Allah is inside the fridge, insode the car, inside the toilet ?Astaghfar Allah?, this is blasphemy, but I know according to 4126 that Allah is surrounding all these objects .
Why is that blasphemy AB? haha, toilet is only dirty for us. You make a human out of God, like He thinks the toilet stinks to. But here is a contradiction, first you say it is blasphemy, but then you have to acknowledge He surrounds all of these objects. He surrounds ALL things AB, this means every little part of this creation, which means He is everything.
Where does this 'everywhere' stop for you?
When there is no object using it, mate you are getting very silly indeed, and I?m wasting my time to be honest
Me too, but i'll still answer. No object using it? Where did you got this definition from? Not the Quraan AB, this comes out of your head.
To me God is everywhere,
Fine but not inside everywhere, as you are trying hard to inject into our minds
You can accept or don't accept, but i'm not injecting anything. I'm just reading the clearcut arabic literal Quraan....
Peace