You Have Been Warned
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Peace "phoenix1",
peace
I don't think that's what that verse means. But anyway...this is the problem I have with a physical hell (regardless of what the quran says)
- If this world is an illusion, our bodies are illusions, the word "physical" itself is an illusion. Nothing physical matters. It is the immaterial that we should concern ourselves with. What is inside our souls.
The physical "reality" is an illusion. We can play and distract ourselves with physical things, but what matters is how we feel inside. A rich drug dealer can womanize all he wants, buy all the cars he wants...but it won't change the condition of his heart. He will still be in hell in the true reality which is immaterial.
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Pain, physical pain, is caused by our nervous system inside our bodies. If someone's nervous system doesn't function, he/she cannot feel pain. In fact, people can eliminate pain through meditation.
Our state of mind determines how much pain we feel. A soldier getting shot might not feel that much pain because he will get to go home. Child birth in some cultures is more painful than in others because of how child birth and motherhood is viewed.
So Pain, like every other physical thing, is an illusion. -
If God does send us to a physical place after our deaths, that doesn't make God very forgiving.
If Hell is what we put ourselves into by our actions here on earth, and hell is temporary, we can get ourselves out of it and that does make God very forgiving and merciful.
So a physical hell also contradicts what the Quran says about God.
There is no spoon because a spoon is a physical object. There are no physical objects.
Everything is ONE, part of GOD.JK- "Physical" is just a term which humans have given to something which they can touch feel or sense so far with their bodies or other availabke devices. If your in a dream then using the definition from this world it applies well to what you can sense there in the dream. This is the problem of terminology which quite often gets in the way of a debate/argument and renders it a nuisance. Sometimes it's unavoidable though. What is said is that Hell would be sensed visually, with the sense of sound , touch , taste and smell i.e. all the senses plus maybe additional ones. In other words it is a world with features we'd experience and it is real in the sense that we would feel it. Consider yourself in a dream. Whilst your in it that very dream becomes your reality until you wake up again. If you wont wake up for long there will come a time when youll want to and have to get along with the features available in your dream. I hope you got my point. GOD Bless!
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Peace jonny_k
Yes thank you, you talked very well. And it has nothing to do with whether I agree with you or not. Matter of fact I do. It actually clarifies my own thoughts...
And OpenMind, you need some Peace of Mind too...
It is not the amount of posts that matter, dude... -
Peace "noble",
Peace jonny_k
Yes thank you, you talked very well. And it has nothing to do with whether I agree with you or not. Matter of fact I do. It actually clarifies my own thoughts...
And OpenMind, you need some Peace of Mind too...
It is not the amount of posts that matter, dude...JK- Thankyou ) GOD Bless!
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JK- "Physical" is just a term which humans have given to something which they can touch feel or sense so far with their bodies or other availabke devices. If your in a dream then using the definition from this world it applies well to what you can sense there in the dream. This is the problem of terminology which quite often gets in the way of a debate/argument and renders it a nuisance. Sometimes it's unavoidable though. What is said is that Hell would be sensed visually, with the sense of sound , touch , taste and smell i.e. all the senses plus maybe additional ones. In other words it is a world with features we'd experience and it is real in the sense that we would feel it. Consider yourself in a dream. Whilst your in it that very dream becomes your reality until you wake up again. If you wont wake up for long there will come a time when youll want to and have to get along with the features available in your dream. I hope you got my point. GOD Bless!
peace
so we will feel hell through our senses?
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Peace jonny_k
Yes thank you, you talked very well. And it has nothing to do with whether I agree with you or not. Matter of fact I do. It actually clarifies my own thoughts...
And OpenMind, you need some Peace of Mind too...
It is not the amount of posts that matter, dude...No, it's the amount of respect, and you have none.
Peace.
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Lol OpenMind, if I would not laugh at many things, I will die of boredom and despair.
Stop taking yourself so seriously, I dont take myself seriously.
Discussing the Quran however is very serious, as there is a barbecue issue at the end.
Got my drift, dude?
Peace -
Lol OpenMind, if I would not laugh at many things, I will die of boredom and despair.
Stop taking yourself so seriously, I dont take myself seriously.
Discussing the Quran however is very serious, as there is a barbecue issue at the end.
Got my drift, dude?
PeaceWhat does this have to do with me? All I was saying is you need to respect people here. I'm assuming you don't fully understand the environment here, so I was just trying to help you out. You come in here making immature comments and disrespecting members. No need for that. No need to get hyped up. Just respect the forum.
Peace.
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Bro OpenMind
You just passed one of the criteria of Belief.
Peace indeed
Noble
PS I can be humble a lot of the times, but not when I hear the Signs of Allah insulted and mocked, sorry... (I do not mean you so dont feel pointed at like others do, who seem to have a guilt complex, why are they so touchy then?, its just the Ego/Nafs talking, and the value of a Believer is proportional to how he/she can tame her ego) -
Hello all
Let?s get this thread on track, I will have a break from exposing the word ?Mathal? or ?Mithl? in the Quran ?The slam dunk party? and will concentrate on a related subject which is ?FEAR? for now, the reason I?m doing so is simply another comment that was deleted by someone that I posted on page one in this thread, my comment was about one line regarding these two comments
Peace be upon you,
I remember when I was motivated by fear. Thank God that is no longer the case.
peace i second that.
What I said and was deleted anonymously was as follow
I?m proud to be horrified of Allah
Now let?s have a closer look at Idolfree comment and we will see clearly that it can?t be coming out of a Quran believer as he claims, well, he will not be able to fool me, he can fool a few indeed but not me
He claims that he verifies everything before he believes in it, now I may ask, how did he verify that you should not fear God?, and we may need to first confirm the God he thanked in his comment ? Thank God that is no longer the case? is it the God of the Quran ?Mentioned in the Quran?, or is it a man made god he made for himself?, this is very important guys because my fear from Allah is verified in the Quran, ?The words of Allah?, here it is
Such as unite that which Allah hath commandeth should be joined, and fear their Lord, and dread a woeful reckoning;
(21)
-> Allah is describing the believers in Him and His Quran ? and fear their Lord, and dread a woeful reckoning;? see
Those who fear their Lord in secret and who dread the Hour (of doom).
(49)
-> Again describing the believers ? Those who fear their Lord in secret and who dread the Hour?
Those who deliver the messages of Allah and fear Him, and do not fear any one but Allah; and Allah is sufficient to take account.
(39)
-> Now here is something interesting, people hate me because I talk a lot about hell and death, however I fear no one but Allah ? Those who deliver the messages of Allah and fear Him, and do not fear any one but Allah?, why I do that and don?t give a fluke about the unbelievers because ? Allah is sufficient to take account.?
And a burdened soul cannot bear the burden of another and if one weighed down by burden should cry for (another to carry) its burden, not aught of it shall be carried, even though he be near of kin. You warn only those who fear their Lord in secret and keep up prayer; and whoever purifies himself, he purifies himself only for (the good of) his own soul; and to Allah is the eventual coming.
(1
-> And again ? those who fear their Lord in secret?
Allah has revealed the best hadith, a book conformable in its various parts, repeating, whereat do shudder the skins of those who fear their Lord, then their skins and their hearts become pliant to the remembrance of Allah; this is Allah's guidance, He guides with it whom He pleases; and (as for) him whom Allah makes err, there is no guide for him.
(23)
-> Another interesting verse, those true believers who FEAR Allah, when they read the Quran it will shudder the skins, see how fear was associated with hearing Hadith Allah ? Allah has revealed the best hadith, a book conformable in its various parts, repeating, whereat do shudder the skins of those who fear their Lord?
10- And they shall say Had we but listened or pondered, we should not have been among the inmates of the burning fire.
11- So they shall acknowledge their sins, but far will be (forgiveness) from the inmates of the burning fire.
12- (As for) those who fear their Lord in secret, they shall surely have forgiveness and a great reward.
(10)
(11)
(12)-> Now we read that the fear of Allah is rewarded with forgiveness and a great reward ? - (As for) those who fear their Lord in secret, they shall surely have forgiveness and a great?, on the other hand we also read what those who didn?t fear Allah and His punishment was really doomed ? And they shall say Had we but listened or pondered, we should not have been among the inmates of the burning fire.?, then they convicted themselves ? they shall acknowledge their sins, but far will be (forgiveness) from the inmates of the burning fire.?
Now, the fear of Allah and not fearing the people mentioned above was a description of the true believers, in the following verse we read it as an ORDER from Allah
Surely We revealed the Taurat in which was guidance and light; with it the prophets who submitted themselves (to Allah) judged (matters) for those who were Jews, and the masters of Divine knowledge and the doctors, because they were required to guard (part) of the Book of Allah, and they were witnesses thereof; therefore fear not the people and fear Me, and do not take a small price for My communications; and whoever did not judge by what Allah revealed, those are they that are the unbelievers.
(44)
-> See, ? ?,? therefore fear not the people and fear Me?
This order to fear Allah was repeated in 53 and 2150
See how I verified that a true believer must be horrified of Allah, the true God exactly as He ordered us and exactly as He described the true believers
Now I may ask you Idolfree
Why you don?t fear Allah as He ordered you to do?
And I have to repeat my question that I asked earlier, is the god you thanked in your comment, the God of the Quran ?Allah?, or another god you just think that is a god?
No wonder a total Quran rejector like Magi and someone who hardly understand the Quran like phonix seconded Idol comment
I hope my comment don?t get deleted, however who will dare to delete the Quran verses?, well, the sunni bastards did it before on WhyIslam
Salam
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Peace ahmed
you wrote
Now let?s have a closer look at Idolfree comment and we will see clearly that it can?t be coming out of a Quran believer as he claims, well, he will not be able to fool me, he can fool a few indeed but not meWhy do you believe that idolfree wants to fool you ?
elke
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Peace ahmed
you wrote
Now let?s have a closer look at Idolfree comment and we will see clearly that it can?t be coming out of a Quran believer as he claims, well, he will not be able to fool me, he can fool a few indeed but not meWhy do you believe that idolfree wants to fool you ?
elke
Peace Elke
For some reason that I don't know I expected you to be the first to reply to my comment, I swear, man
Anyway, that was a sarcastic comment due to the fact, his comment indirectly meant that I'm a coward because I fear Allah hence I have to be motivated and of course, the clear cut deception he insists on promoting on a public forum that Mohammad was never a real person, and to be honest sister and without any offence for you to claim to be a Muslim and support anyone who says this will sure make your Islam questionable, however I respect both of you as humans
cheers
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Peace AhmedBahgat
that hell of the movie is the same hell some Christian priests and nuns portrayed, the red colour, the flames, the bones, the ugly faces, ...
The Hell topic is what made me feel interested in Islam. Before a muslim told me about it, I thought nobody really believed in that. I knew it was a common topic in Christianity but not in my environement where religious hell and heaven are just tales.
I am grateful to that muslim, for me they are still tales, but I ended reading and discussing online and offline the best things and I could know about Metu Neter and other great books.
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Peace ahmed
you said
For some reason that I don't know I expected you to be the first to reply to my comment, I swear, manthat proves that you have a great deal of sensibility that - really, no offence intended, i would not have expected.
I congratulate you for that and propose that you try, from time to time, to look at yourself from far away, as if you saw a stranger. I do it often for myself and it teaches me a lot about myself and my numerous flaws. if you felt my reaction, i'm sure you'll be able to do this !
I can live with the fact that you'll not consider me a muslim and shall not anymore take this as an offence - as i did previously when it came from mquran. It is clear that i do not fit in your definition and i can only hope that God will think differently.salaams, lk
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Peace Ahmed, all,
I'm sure Kyle can speak for himself, but I just thought I'd point out that there is a difference between "fearing Allah" and "being motivated by the fear of Allah". In my understanding, al-qur'an speaks to both avenues. Some people are motivated by fear, some by love, most need both. At any rate, one can surely be motivated by love while still fearing the Almighty.
Peace,
Tay -
Peace,
If you do a good deed because you fear you get punished by God if you don't do it, then you are not good by nature. If you do a good deed because of the reward, then again you are not good by nature. Your motivations for the deed are not doing good for the sake of good itself, but out of fear of being punished or missing the reward. So without the punishment you would have not done good, and without the reward you would not have done good. And by thus you are not good by nature.
If a person doesn't do an evil deed because he fears the punishment, then again he is not good by nature, as without the punishment he would have done the evil deed. If a person doesn't do an evil deed because he fears of missing the reward for not doing it, again he is not motivated by being good, but by missing the reward. So without the punishment he would have done evil, and without the reward he would have done evil. These people are no better then dogs, without a treat or punishment they will not listen. They are motivated by fear or greed. Does this make good muslims? No, as the core of such a persons soul is not based on a good nature.
I do good because i understand the nature of doing good. I do good without fear or greed, without need for a reward or fear of punishment. That in the end God will reward for me it, is again showing God is the most Mercifull, the Provider, but because my motivation is for the sake of good itself, my soul is pure, as i'm the same with a reward or punishment as i'm without them. That every deed has a certain result is God's law, His yaumwedeen, the Era of Judgement and Order which is at work all the time.
You have to question yourself, by what are you motivated? And more especially If there were no reward or punishment, would you have still done good, would you have still obeyed God? Answer this question and you will understand the core of your being, the motivator of all your deeds.....
Peace
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Salam,
My answer is i follow God's advice.The quran details a beautiful road map to life,and I just follow God's advice there how best to live and do good,the reward are a welcome consequential benefit,but the joy comes from obeying my creator,trusting his advice and following it.
Peace