Has Anyone Seen This Explanation of Obey the Messenger?

Idris

peace, I am getting really sick of this arguement but since Zed never fails to bring it up I decided to post this and hopefully under this thread we can settle it out once in for all here

a new understanding of obey the messenger I found here- http//www.genuine-islam.com/messengership.htm tell me your thoughts on it and if you believe it is better then our present understanding on the topic

WARNING-Zed before you start saying "the HADITH REJECTING KAFIR ARE NOW SAYING SO AND SO" let me tell you that nobody I know of on this site, in fact nobody I know, advocates this view on obey the messenger as of yet from reading their already present views, now with that said, here you go

Muhammad is NOT the father of any man among you, but he IS the messenger of God and the seal of the prophets. And God is fully aware of all things.

Mumahammad is GOD'S messenger...not your messenger or my messenger...so please pay good attention to what GOD has to says about HIS messenger.

Keep in mind that people have the tandency to have all kinds of silly questions and silly assumption as to what a messenger be like.

Why was the Quan not revealed to him all at once?

Why is he sent without an angle?

Why is he not from a higher social ranking?

Why is sent without a treasure?

Why is he not like this ...why is he not like that etc etc etc...instead of sincerely examining the message he is conveying to them.

They will do many things to deceive themself and prevent themself from believing in a messenger that LEADS THEM TO THE TRUTH AND SALVATION!!

And those before them have schemed, but to God is all scheming. He knows what every soul earns and the rejecters will come to know to whom is the better abode.

And those who reject say ?You are not a messenger.? Say ?God is sufficient as a witness between me and you, the One who has the knowledge of the Scripture.?

When it comes to messengeeship and prophet-hood, the book of GOD indicates 3 categories.

Talking to and about previous messengers and prophets such as Noah, Ibrahim, Moses, Jesus, etc etc etc.
Talks about and to a specific and generally un-named messenger...the one that had the book or the meaning of the book revealed to him and about specific events that happened in his time...that messenger most likely being "Ahmad"...the one who came 1400+ years ago...the one who was mentioned by name by Jesus.

And when Jesus, son of Mary, said ?O children of Israel, I am God's messenger to you, authenticating what is present with me of the Torah and bringing good news of a messenger to come after me whose name is Ahmad.? But when he showed them the clear proofs, they said ?This is profound magic.?

The third part APPLY to the a present messenger who is the SEAL of prophets in his present time...and actual living events and process...the part that applies to Muhammad as he comes to seal the prophets before him.

I believe a messenger starts as a messenger and can progress to prophet-hood ( A higher level of insperations and wisdom that enables him to foresee and predict a more accurate future results), all depends on his effort and GOD'S will.

AHMAD V.S MUHAMMAD

The on-going progressive revelations coming from the MOTHER BOOK to confirm the message in the book between our hands continues as Humans continue to develop and EVOLVE.

There is no indication that that process has ended...on the contrary...many verses indicate the opposite.

People are responsible of their own times, not that of their ancestors.

REALITY CHECK # 1

GOD says that "Muhammad" is Not the FATHER of any of our men...what does that mean!?

Muhammad is not the father of any man among you. He is a messenger of GOD and the SEAL of prophet. GOD is fully aware of all things.

Note; GOD did not say "he is not any of your men"...HE says "he is NOT the Father of any of your men" !!??

So it means Muhammad could be one of our men and he is NOT LIMITED to as "WAS the father of one of our men"!!??

GOD also says "Muhammad" is a Messenger, and the SEAL of prophets...HE NEVER said he was the last (akher) messenger AND HE NEVER SAID he was the last prophet...instead HE used the word SEAL!!!

Another aspect to consider is what the word SEAL actually means...does it mean Finish there will be no more Muhammad and no more SEALS?...could the SEAL be a continuous SEAL...and on-going SEAL..why not???

Normally the SEALING process could happen more than once if not often.

REALITY CHECK # 2

Muhammad is no more than a messenger like the messengers before him. Should he die or get killed, would you turn back on your heels? Anyone who turns back on his heels, does not hurt GOD in the least. GOD rewards those who are appreciative.

Note GOD is talking about Muhammad in general again using the word "Afa-in" which indicates an on-going possibility (should he die or get killed).

REALITY CHECK # 3

Those who believe and work righteousness, and believe in what is being sent down to Muhammad - which is the truth from their Lord - He remits their sins, and blesses them with contentment.

Note the word "nuzilla" not "unnzilla" !!??...Sounds like a recent past continuous sentence...which means this verse can apply as the revelation is coming down at any given time!!

REALITY CHECK # 4

Muhammad - the messenger of GOD - and those with him stand firm against the disbelievers, but kind and compassionate amongst themselves. YOU SEE THEM bowing and prostrating, as they seek GOD's blessings and approval. Their expressions on their faces is an indication of their prostration. This is the same example as in the Torah. Their example in the Enjeel is like plants that grow taller and stronger, and please the farmers. He thus enrages the disbelievers. GOD promises those among them who believe, and lead a righteous life, forgiveness and a great recompense.

Note GOD is saying YOU SEE THEM and able to recognise their expressions!!??

SO ASK YOURSELF

The description Muhammad means The one whom people Thank GOD for.

What is the REAL different between "Ahmad" and "Muhammad"!??

What is the REAL difference between a prophet and a Messenger??.

Is VERY possible that the messenger mentioned by "JESUS" called "AHMAD" was the actual name of the messenger who received the QURAN, or received revelation from the BOOK 1400+ years ago and "MUHAMMAD" could be a description/titel of him, and or a description/titel of a messenger after him...a Muhammad descriptive title of human messenger conveying, and un-covering/clarifying GOD'S message in the book...A message that announces the completion of GOD'S "Method of duty", the fulfillment of HIS blessings upon us, and the declaration of HIS acceptance of ISLAM as a "Method of duty", hence a SEAL of the prophets before him !!

Is GOD REALLY commanding us to OBEY A DEAD messenger, and to have him judge between us!?...is the word To JUDGE and OBEY normally used for a dead person or a living one??

All the above Serious, Important, Questions are healthy, legitimate, and valid Questions...but Traditionalists are blinded by worshiping their ancestors to the point that they feel paranoid that their already corrupted religion will be corrupted!!

People might be ignoring, and abusing live messengers in the name of following, obeying, glodifying and worshiping dead messengers!!

GOD ALONE choose and sends messengers according to HIS Timing and according to HIS will and wisdom to CONVEY AND CLARIFY HIS message to people....AND NO ONE CAN PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING.

Muhammad is GOD'S FALLIBLE Human messenger...he is the "SEAL" of prophets before him...he is a warner, give good news, conveys and Clarifies GOD'S message, guides people, leads the believers, and roles in consultation by GOD'S BOOK.

As believers of the BOOK advance in guidance and knowledge they WILL RECOGNIZE the messenger and that will help them recognize the message more and speed up their guidance KNOWLEDGE, WISDOM and ACHIEVEMENTS.

Let me share with you a secret...it is NOT a simple thing for anyone to claim to be a messenger of GOD...especially among the TRADITIONAL So-called Muslims...so you would think that FACT would make any sincere humble seeker of the truth who have real respect to GOD...would make him HUMBLE AND SERIOUS in his examination of such claim...not rushing in ARROGANCE, CROOKEDNESS, AND REJECTION instead!

It is VERY CLEAR, or anyone with minimum commonsnse that the info being presented in this site is NO NONSENSE.

Let me share with you one more VERY IMPORTANT Information...anyone who claims that Muhammad means exactly the the same as Ahmad without showing a CLEAR PROOF is a plain LIAR!

And anyone who claims that Muhammad is a one single dead messenger without showing a CLEAR PROOF is a plain LIAR!

There is NOT a single proof to that...and on the contrary there are many proofs to the opposite for the sincere humble seeker of GOD'S Guidance.

One last point...why do many people feel negative about the prospect of a messenger instead of total happiness...it does not hurt them in anyway, there are many crazy people who do and can claim that they are GOD himself...hey, it is a free world...A GOD GIVEN FREEDOM.

When you think about it, believing in the messenger comes after believing in the book NOT BEFOR, people might respect him and take him seriously and presume he is a messenger but, they will REALIZED and BELIEVE he is a messenger BASED ON THEIR BELIEVE AND REALIZATION OF THE RELEVANT VERSES OF THE BOOK.

The Claim/announcement of himself is not for people to believe in him blindly...it is just to examine him and his believe honestly, fairly, humbly, sincerely, and seriously.

Muhammad is NOT the father of any man among you, but the messenger of GOD and the seal of the prophets. And GOD is fully aware of all things.

I advice YOU to sincerely and humbly SEEK GOD'S Guidance because that is the "ONLY" way to understand HIS message hence the "ONLY" way to
RECOGNIZE HIS MESSENGER!

http//www.genuine-islam.com/index.htm
here is their main site, if Zed or anyone has any refutations post them under this thread and I'll email them to the site and post their refutation they send me if they have one

peace