Rahmadan- guide to fasting in Rahmadan
-
Salaam Anthonywallace,
Its Ramadan NOT Rahmadan
peaceThanks,
peace
-
Soof,
Do you understand that you are committing the grestest Sin when you speak about God what He did not say. My advice to you is as followBefore pormoting for The Submitter of Northern Hemisphere and The Submitter of South Hemisphere, you need to have Quranic Proof. A Quranic proof that supports the existing of two Qudar nights and two Rammadan Months and to divide Submitter By Location.
Now while finding answers, what would you say to a person who lives 6 month in Northern Hemisphere and 6 month in south Hemisphere when he asks you if He should Fast the Two Rammadan or not?
Peace
Understand this If you observe shahru ramadhan then you begin your fast. So anywhere on earth you observe it you fast. This differs from North to South obviously. The Qur'anic proof is
The month of Ramadhan therein was sent down the Qur'an is a guidance unto mankind, and with evidences one of the Books of guidance and the distinction. So whosoever of you witnesseth the month, he shall fast it, and whosoever sick or journeying, for him the like number of other days.
2185This is obviously a translation. What we differ about is whether it is Month or Full Moon.
Whoever witnesses the full moon should fast it therefore if he observes it once then he shall fast it. If he observes it again he shall fast it.
-
Salaam Soof,
Well!! ask your guru Ayman who says
Many, many cultures the world over perform solstice ceremonies. At their root an ancient fear that the failing light would never return unless humans intervened with anxious vigil or antic celebration.And perhaps, our impulse to hold onto certain traditions today -- candles, evergreens, feasting and generosity -- are echoes of a past that extends many thousands of years further than we ever before imagined.
"Shall we liken Christmas to the web in a loom? There are many weavers, who work into the pattern the experience of their lives. When one generation goes, another comes to take up the weft where it has been dropped. The pattern changes as the mind changes, yet never begins quite anew. At first, we are not sure that we discern the pattern, but at last we see that, unknown to the weavers themselves, something has taken shape before our eyes, and that they have made something very beautiful, something which compels our understanding."
--Earl W. Count, 4,000 Years of Christmas
http//www.candlegrove.com/solstice.html#turta
peace
Sorry I should have been clearer I meant the Night of Measure i.e. when the Qur'an was sent down is an event that has already passed.
We have indeed revealed this (Message) in the Night of Power
971I'm not sure I agree that the Night of measure occurs several times every year. I think that there are things we can observe that may have happened on the Night of Measure but the actual Sura 97 describes a singular event. If you have a different understanding please share it.
Note this isn't sun worship or season worship. The sun and the moon are both indicators for Man, this is in the Qur'an. We use the moon in this case to begin our prescribed fast. That is it.
Peace.
-
Sorry I should have been clearer I meant the Night of Measure i.e. when the Qur'an was sent down is an event that has already passed.
We have indeed revealed this (Message) in the Night of Power
971I'm not sure I agree that the Night of measure occurs several times every year. I think that there are things we can observe that may have happened on the Night of Measure but the actual Sura 97 describes a singular event. If you have a different understanding please share it.
Note this isn't sun worship or season worship. The sun and the moon are both indicators for Man, this is in the Qur'an. We use the moon in this case to begin our prescribed fast. That is it.
Peace.
Salaam soof
No You are in fact using solistic event for the moon. In other words chasing the sun god for fasting in different countries.Starting from summer hail and next country summer hail and next hail, first I beleive in the NORTHERN Hemisphere and finishing in the summer of the Southern Hemisphere hail
peace
-
Regarding two Night of Measure's...because the Qur'an was revealed in the NORTHERN hemisphere, the Night of Measure (an event which has come and gone and does not reoccur - revealing of the Qur'an) occured only once in the respective summer solstice of the Northern Hemisphere. The fasting is dependant on when and where you observe the Moon so this DOES vary and there should be two periods of fasting logically. But There is only ONE EVENT called the night of Measure because the Qur'an was revealed to a Man in the Northern Hemisphere. If this was not the case God would have said There are TWO or SEVERAL night of Measure's.
-
Salaam soof
No You are in fact using solistic event for the moon. In other words chasing the sun god for fasting in different countries.Starting from summer hail and next country summer hail and next hail, first I beleive in the NORTHERN Hemisphere and finishing in the summer of the Southern Hemisphere hail
peace
Please stop referring to a Sun God. I already said what I use the Sun and Moon for. If you persist to say I worship idols when I am only using what God ALONE created as indicators for Man, I will cease to speak with you.
Peace
-
Summer solstice refers to a period where the Earth is at an angle where one side gets signifcantly greater amount of sunlight. There is no Sun God involved. So when you wake up in the morning when the sun rises do you say you are chasing the Sun God starting from every dawn? foolishness..
-
Understand this If you observe shahru ramadhan then you begin your fast. So anywhere on earth you observe it you fast. This differs from North to South obviously.
If you use the Quran as Guidence you will never get confused, but if you don't you will be lost and confused.
Shaher = Month according to Quran guidence
Rammadan= the name of the month that we should fast, according to quran guidence.The Qur'anic proof is
The month of Ramadhan therein was sent down the Qur'an is a guidance unto mankind, and with evidences one of the Books of guidance and the distinction. So whosoever of you witnesseth the month, he shall fast it, and whosoever sick or journeying, for him the like number of other days.
2185This is obviously a translation. What we differ about is whether it is Month or Full Moon.
Then if we differ, we should do what
Whatever it be wherein ye differ, the decision thereof is with Allah Such is Allah my Lord in Him I trust, and to Him I turn. (42-10)
Let us do that, please, so we can end this.
Regarding two Night of Measure's...because the Qur'an was revealed in the NORTHERN hemisphere, the Night of Measure (an event which has come and gone and does not reoccur - revealing of the Qur'an) occured only once in the respective summer solstice of the Northern Hemisphere. The fasting is dependant on when and where you observe the Moon so this DOES vary and there should be two periods of fasting logically. But There is only ONE EVENT called the night of Measure because the Qur'an was revealed to a Man in the Northern Hemisphere. If this was not the case God would have said There are TWO or SEVERAL night of Measure's.
confused confused confused
Please stick to Quran so you do not get lost and look like you are
Fasting FOR THE SUN -
Please stop referring to a Sun God. I already said what I use the Sun and Moon for. If you persist to say I worship idols when I am only using what God ALONE created as indicators for Man, I will cease to speak with you.
Peace
Salaam
But Summer Solstice is directly related to the scorching moon Ayman refers to.This date has had spiritual significance for thousands of years as humans have been amazed by the great power of the sun. The Celts celebrated with bonfires that would add to the sun's energy, Christians placed the feast of St John the Baptist towards the end of June and it is also the festival of Li, the Chinese Goddess of light
And Ayman relates it to his version of sacred month
This is a time to celebrate growth and life but for Pagans, who see balance in the world and are deeply aware of the ongoing shifting of the seasons it is also time to acknowledge that the sun will now begin to decline once more towards winter
This is a time to celebrate growth and life but for Pagans, who see balance in the world and are deeply aware of the ongoing shifting of the seasons it is also time to acknowledge that the sun will now begin to decline once more towards winter
http//www.new-age.co.uk/
You can do your own search to0. -
If you use the Quran as Guidence you will never get confused, but if you don't you will be lost and confused.
Shaher = Month according to Quran guidence
Rammadan= the name of the month that we should fast, according to quran guidence.Then if we differ, we should do what
Whatever it be wherein ye differ, the decision thereof is with Allah Such is Allah my Lord in Him I trust, and to Him I turn. (42-10)
Let us do that, please, so we can end this.
confused confused confused
Please stick to Quran so you do not get lost and look like you are
Fasting FOR THE SUNI'm not confused. God says there is one Night Of Measure, therefore there is. Simple as that.
Peace
-
Summer solstice refers to a period where the Earth is at an angle where one side gets signifcantly greater amount of sunlight. There is no Sun God involved. So when you wake up in the morning when the sun rises do you say you are chasing the Sun God starting from every dawn? foolishness..
No the sun and the moon are the creation of Allah and are there to help us survive, so wake up in the morining and be thankful for the blessing emitting from the sun for us with the leave of Allah
Subhan Allah.
For details of sun worshipper do a Google search for "Summer Solstice"
peace -
Salaam
But Summer Solstice is directly related to the scorching moon Ayman refers to.This date has had spiritual significance for thousands of years as humans have been amazed by the great power of the sun. The Celts celebrated with bonfires that would add to the sun's energy, Christians placed the feast of St John the Baptist towards the end of June and it is also the festival of Li, the Chinese Goddess of light
And Ayman relates it to his version of sacred month
This is a time to celebrate growth and life but for Pagans, who see balance in the world and are deeply aware of the ongoing shifting of the seasons it is also time to acknowledge that the sun will now begin to decline once more towards winter
This is a time to celebrate growth and life but for Pagans, who see balance in the world and are deeply aware of the ongoing shifting of the seasons it is also time to acknowledge that the sun will now begin to decline once more towards winter
http//www.new-age.co.uk/
You can do your own search to0.Ok thanks. But you must realise just because Pagans worshipped the sun, moon and many other things does not mean that we cannot use these great signs from our lord. Do you think that praying in the direction of the Kaa'ba is worshipping the Kaa'ba or simply a prayer direction? It is the intention behind the act that is important. My sole intention of fasting is an act of devotion to the one God, to help me strengthen my resolve and discipline and to be mindful of those who have less food than me, whilst gaining health benefits and cleansing my body. The mere fact that this fast is based on our observations of the moon and the sun - which man has used to deduce 365 days, 12 months, 52 weeks, 24 hours and many other measurements does not mean that we follow a Sun God or we worship a God of summer.
It seems on this forum your purpose is to make an "Ayman" sect when all that was made was a simple article that people found truth in using the Qur'an alone. Whereas the Ramadhan that Sunni's practice is explained in the HADITH, hmmm. At the end of the day, we can't take anyone's word for anything, we have to verify it for ourselves as God commands us to do. If we blindly follow something we simply agree with, we are not using our brains, and more research is needed. Please desist with referring to people as sheep/followers/sectarians. What does God say about backbiters, "would you like to eat the flesh of your dead brother?"
Peace
-
No the sun and the moon are the creation of Allah and are there to help us survive, so wake up in the morining and be thankful for the blessing emitting from the sun for us with the leave of Allah
Exactly. But there are people who would say because you wake up and and are happy because the Sun is up, you are worshipping the Sun. But your intention is purely acknowledging that the Sun is a creation from God that it is a sign from Him and we are thankful. The same applies, accept you are trying to fabricate a label for people who use the Sun, Moon and stars for indicators. If people use the stars to find their way when they are lost in the mountains, are they Star worshippers? Where is your logic?
He has made subject to you the Night and the Day; the sun and the moon; and the stars are in subjection by His Command verily in this are Signs for men who are wise.
1612And marks and sign-posts; and by the stars (men) guide themselves.
1616Peace
-
I'm not confused. God says there is one Night Of Measure, therefore there is. Simple as that.
Peace
Agree, one night of Measure yay
My sole intention of fasting is an act of devotion to the one God, to help me strengthen my resolve and discipline and to be mindful of those who have less food than me, whilst gaining health benefits and cleansing my body.
Agree yay
The mere fact that this fast is based on our observations of the moon and the sun - which man has used to deduce 365 days, 12 months, 52 weeks, 24 hours and many other measurements does not mean that we follow a Sun God or we worship a God of summer.
Now for me to agree, what is your proof from Quran that we have to use the sun to calculate the period of Month? Stragiht Answer brickwall
Otherwise, Farida claim about your worship of Sun is True
-
Exactly. But there are people who would say because you wake up and and are happy because the Sun is up, you are worshipping the Sun.
But your intention is purely acknowledging that the Sun is a creation from God that it is a sign from Him and we are thankful. The same applies, accept you are trying to fabricate a label for people who use the Sun, Moon and stars for indicators. If people use the stars to find their way when they are lost in the mountains, are they Star worshippers? Where is your logic?He has made subject to you the Night and the Day; the sun and the moon; and the stars are in subjection by His Command verily in this are Signs for men who are wise.
1612And marks and sign-posts; and by the stars (men) guide themselves.
1616Peace
Salaam Soof
Please read my reply to him in another thread; I think its under Hot Ramadhan, and that would explain to you more and do a bit of googling please.
I will be off to finish my fast so will catch up when yu have done some reading,
I have NO intention of fabrication, I only said what I observed from Aymans terminolgy and for me to try and get the upper hand is a very cheap way of communicatiing, so please dont say that i am fabricating. -
Agree, one night of Measure yay
Agree yay
Now for me to agree, what is your proof from Quran that we have to use the sun to calculate the period of Month? Stragiht Answer brickwall
Otherwise, Farida claim about your worship of Sun is True
Sorry belal. This is a different point to fasting because fasting is independent of the man-made calendar. This is the whole point in the discussion. My point was Men before us have used the Sun deduce the seasons, the days and the years whether or not it has PAGAN roots is irrelevant because it is not used in the Qur'an not even the 24 hours we live by! We live by a calendar but we observe our duties to God according to what God sends down alone.
For example God uses Dawn as the start of a new day whereas we say a new day starts at 0000. So the dawn of 21 september is the beginning of the day of 21 september, when sunsets it is the beginning of the night of the 21 september and so forth, but we use this when fasting, praying, and understanding the Qur'an even though we do not live our every day lives like that. The only things that have prevalance in our religion is what God Himself sent down as INDICATORS for us to use. And what did I quote in my last post? What did he send down and made subject to us?
He it is that cleaveth the day-break (from the dark) He makes the night for rest and tranquillity, and the sun and moon for the reckoning (of time) Such is the judgment and ordering of (Him), the Exalted in Power, the Omniscient.
696Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but if I use what God has created for Man and I obey this command
Among His Signs are the Night and the Day, and the Sun and the Moon. Do not prostrate to the sun and the moon, but prostrate to Allah, Who created them, if it is Him ye wish to serve.
4137Then I am only following what God has sent down and no pagan culture that seeks to engulf any of God's creations can detract from this guidance.
Peace
-
Sorry belal. This is a different point to fasting because fasting is independent of the man-made calendar. This is the whole point in the discussion. My point was Men before us have used the Sun deduce the seasons, the days and the years whether or not it has PAGAN roots is irrelevant because it is not used in the Qur'an not even the 24 hours we live by! We live by a calendar but we observe our duties to God according to what God sends down alone.
For example God uses Dawn as the start of a new day whereas we say a new day starts at 0000. So the dawn of 21 september is the beginning of the day of 21 september, when sunsets it is the beginning of the night of the 21 september and so forth, but we use this when fasting, praying, and understanding the Qur'an even though we do not live our every day lives like that. The only things that have prevalance in our religion is what God Himself sent down as INDICATORS for us to use. And what did I quote in my last post? What did he send down and made subject to us?Yes we are ordered to measuer the day (and week) by the Sun cycle, as the Quran says.
AgreeNow, correct me if I'm wrong, but if I use what God has created for Man and I obey this command
Among His Signs are the Night and the Day, and the Sun and the Moon. Do not prostrate to the sun and the moon, but prostrate to Allah, Who created them, if it is Him ye wish to serve.
4137Then I am only following what God has sent down and no pagan culture that seeks to engulf any of God's creations can detract from this guidance.
Peace
OK, Do you agree that
(
It is He Who made the sun to be a shining glory and the moon to be a light, and measured out stages for it that ye might know the number of years and the calculation. No wise did Allah create this but in truth and righteousness. (Thus) doth He explain His Signs in detail, for those who understand. (5)
Thus, the Moon Stages was created for us to calculate the period of month (and year = 12 month)
Do you agree or not; STRAIGHT ANSWER
Now, if the above is true, how should we calculate?
Well, if we are calculating Moon Cycle, we should count the days from the begining of cycle untill the end.They ask thee concerning the crescents. Say they are but signs to mark fixed periods of time for men, and for pilgrimage. It is no virtue if ye enter your houses from the back; it is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors and fear Allah that ye may prosper. (2-189)
What is the begining of the Moon Cycle is it the Waxing crescent or the wining crescent?
Well, I say the one that marks the begining of the Moon Cycle--the Waxing Crescent.DO you agree or not? Straight Answer?
-
It seems on this forum your purpose is to make an "Ayman" sect when all that was made was a simple article that people found truth in using the Qur'an alone. Whereas the Ramadhan that Sunni's practice is explained in the HADITH, hmmm.
PeaceSalaam again Soof
No I would disagree; Ayman's article is not just simple it is very misleading and could result in an already divided community fragmenting into oblivion. Other religions celebrate their special occassions on the same day, but we the followers of the Quran have our various, small pockets of special occassions each with his/her own day, and changing the Qur'an beyond recognition so that no one would value it any more.At the end of the day, we can't take anyone's word for anything, we have to verify it for ourselves as God commands us to do. If we blindly follow something we simply agree with, we are not using our brains, and more research is needed.
Exactly!! We are all expected to do our own search for the truth, we have the book and we have the brains and our faith in Allah that we would reach the core of the truth. Insha'Allah.
Please desist with referring to people as sheep/followers/sectarians. What does God say about backbiters, "would you like to eat the flesh of your dead brother?"
I apologise sincerly if you felt it was aimed at you; that was not my intention. -[
peace
-
Peace, soof and aymen
So what are you sayin?
-
Peace, soof and aymen
So what are you sayin?
And Bilal?