The Shahada
-
Peace Tony
I agree with what you wrote, i just have a small thought that i would share.
First i want to clarify that i do not do the shehada which includes prophet Mohamed name ever since i followed the quraan alone cause God name is never associated with any other names (la illah illa allah is mentioned alone). But of course i believe in all the messengers including Mohamed without any discrimination between them.
386 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.
From the above verse God didnt critisize the believers who did witness that the massenger is true.
Were you there when Muhammad was assigned as a messenger?
Does that mean that people who was there should witness the messenger? if the answer is yes, so God didnt critisize the hypocrites for saying they bear witness, but cause they did not say it sincerly, they say with their tongue what is not in there hearts.
peace
-
386 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.
From the above verse God didnt critisize the believers who did witness that the massenger is true.
Does that mean that people who was there should witness the messenger? if the answer is yes, so God didnt critisize the hypocrites for saying they bear witness, but cause they did not say it sincerly, they say with their tongue what is not in there hearts.
The above aya is talking about those people who were actually present then, and who witnessed (shahda) the truth being presented by Mohammad(pbuh) yet later they converted back.
It does not talk about any testification of his prophethood
The emphasis is on witnessing the truth being presented by the apostle, Not on testification that he is the prophet, even those people could not testify, because they did not witness Mohammad pbuh being crowned as a prophet/messenger.
siki
-
Peace Siki,
The above aya is talking about those people who were actually present then, and who witnessed (shahda) the truth being presented by Mohammad(pbuh) yet later they converted back.
It does not talk about any testification of his prophethood
The emphasis is on witnessing the truth being presented by the apostle, Not on testification that he is the prophet, even those people could not testify, because they did not witness Mohammad pbuh being crowned as a prophet/messenger.
bravo
You beat me to it )
Indeed they were testifying to the truth and not his messengership, otherwise there is a huge contradiction with many other verses in al-quran (see Tony's post).
-
Peace BelH,
What you have said above are the words of God that Mohamed taught you in the book he wrote and believed in and followed. And the reason you are repeating them is because you accepted his teachings as a divine teachings; thus you are Testifying that he is the Prophet of God.
If the Jews and christian do not accept Mohamed, they are violating 2-285
This is ridiculous. The scriptures say that Abraham was a muslim/submitter; did he too accept Mohammed as a prophet and messenger? Moses and Aaron were also among the muslims, as was Jesus. None of them ever said, "Ash-hadu an Muhammad ar rasuwlu Allah" in their testimony. The scriptures state very plainly that Abraham was neither a Nazarene (or "Christian" or a Jew. Regardless, though, you never answered my question
Since the Quran is complete and fully detailed, why isn't your shahaada (i.e. "Ash-hadu an la ilaaha illa Allah wa'ash-hadu an Muhammad ar-rasuwlu Allah" in the Quran?
Can you answer this, brother? Do you think God forgot to put it in there? He clearly states in the scripture that the Quran is perfect, complete, and fully detailed; and the only shahaada included in the book is, "La ilaaha ila Allah" (There is no god but/except Allah). So, why isn't your shahaada also included in the reading if it is the testimony that we are all told to declare?
Peace,
Ahmad
-
Peace all
I say if a Christian, who believes in God and Jesus and Moses and all prophets, wants to become a Moslem, He or she will have to complete what is missing in His submission to God--accepting Mohamed as a Prophet.He will have to complete his submission in front of who ??? You and me or God, who knows that Mohammad was indeed His messenger
Otherwise, what would you ask the Christian to do in order to become a Moslem?
This can be done simply by believing and applying the teachings of the Qur'an in everyday life. This is the only way to accept Prophet Mohamed as the messenger of God as Mohamed was the one who received and delivered God's words (guidance) to us in the form of the Qur?an.
peace -
Dear Edip and all Salaam
I would have not posted any further after my first post on this thread but since I see persons, persons who lack in knowldge keep on beating the same old drum that we do not discriminate among messengers and so on....
I doubt if most of them actually know what Shahada is? and why it came in to use? the one which includes the name of Muhammad in it?It was only You EDIP, i did not accepted this from.
First of all please tell me How the hell is it shirk? if some one says Muhammad is Rasul of Allah? people here just try to bring out the issues which are supposed to be non issues.
Secondly please read verse 253 of chapter 2
These messengers; we blessed some of them more than others. For example, GOD spoke to one, and we raised some of them to higher ranks. And we gave Jesus, son of Mary, profound miracles and supported him with the Holy Spirit. Had GOD willed, their followers would not have fought with each other, after the clear proofs had come to them. Instead, they disputed among themselves; some of them believed, and some disbelieved. Had GOD willed, they would not have fought. Everything is in accordance with GOD's will
Do we understand something from this? or we have to debate the issue in detail. If some one has time he or she can read the thread "Praise be to Muhammad Rasul Allah" before discussing.
Some one even wrote that "The scriptures say that Abraham was a muslim/submitter; did he too accept Mohammed as a prophet and messenger? Moses and Aaron were also among the muslims, as was Jesus. None of them ever said, "Ash-hadu an Muhammad ar rasuwlu Allah" in their testimony" I guess Ahmed Bilal and some one else from Ahmed Bilal one can accept such sensless comments but for others who share the similar thoughts
Please try to understand what is "Shahada" and at time of Prophet Muhammad why it was necessary to bear the witness for one who enetered the religon of Allah.
No one as EDIP has wrongly pointed out, makes Muhammad equivalent to Allah, by merely stating that Muhammad is Rasul of Allah.Some sunnis or may be most sunnis exaggerate, they are to be taught with love and effection and not scorned away.
One writes "were you there when Muhammad was assigned as a messenger?"
Pure non sense and ignorance of Quran!Were you there when Jesus was born without a father?
were you there when Moses went up the hill to fetch the pail of water?
were you there when Quran was revealed little by little?Those who oppose this SHAHADA have not gone through history, to make it short when MUhammad announced his Messengership the most criticism was on his MESSENGERSHIP and the MESSAGE he brought, no one doubted on ALLAH, ALLAH was a fimilar name, Almost each one in that area was familar with GOD and JEWS were strongest advocates of ONE ALLAH, so were Christains and MAny Arabs though they had Different God's for different tribes.
Did JEWS argued about ALLAH or ABRAHAM or MOSES, Did Christians argued about all these Messengers?, NO THEY argued about the Messengership of Muhammad, even the tribes of Quraish did argued about his Messengership, So it was very important and necessary to believe and say that "MUhammad is RAsul of Allah", by the followers of Islam.
-
Did JEWS argued about ALLAH or ABRAHAM or MOSES, Did Christians argued about all these Messengers?, NO THEY argued about the Messengership of Muhammad, even the tribes of Quraish did argued about his Messengership, So it was very important and necessary to believe and say that "MUhammad is RAsul of Allah", by the followers of Islam.
If it was so, how came it is not anywhere commanded in the Quran?
I really can't imagine a scene like this;
Muhammad "You all jews and christians, you should make a testimony that I am the messenger of God, lest you all shall be torched by fire for eternity".As matter of fact none of the other prophets had ever mandated such ridiculous statement...
And if Muhammad did request of such act, I'm not sure if he is a true prophet....Some references from the Quran,
Jesus's disciples
But when Jesus perceived unbelief on their part, he said Who will be my helpers in Allah's way?
The disciples said We are helpers of Allah We believe in Allah and bear witness that we are submitting ones (Muslim).
(352)If testifying about Jesus's (or someone else, e.g. Muhammad) messengership was important, the verse should read
We believe in Allah and we bear witness that you (Jesus) are indeed messenger of God.When his Lord said to him, Be a Muslim, he said I submit myself to the Lord of the worlds.
(2131)Whoever submits himself entirely to Allah and he is the doer of good (to others) he has his reward from his Lord, and there is no fear for him nor shall he grieve.
(2112)Now to get some fact straight
- Many of Muhammad's helpers (Anshar) were actually Christian Jews...
- The Quraish/Pagan Arabs were outraged due to Muhammad and friends slandering and "insult" of their gods and godeses, as well as their foolish, irrational and illogical myth and beliefs. Just like some of the people nowadays outraged to someone who is slandering and posting insult of their foolish, irrational and illogical myth and beliefs.
Old habits die hard.. as matter of fact; the "Muslim" (with capital) still retain much of the customs and myth from the paganistic era anyway.
One good example is the 'prohibition' of praying or doing other ritual acts for women during their menstruation period.
The sect we know as "Islam" (with capital) today is actually a 'syncretic' religion of Quran teachings, Muhammad Occultism, Christianism, Judaism and Arab Paganism..With that being said, everyone has the full right to believe in whatever they wanted...
If you or anyone believe that shahada is logical and mandated/commanded by God thus you should recite the shahada daily, please recite the shahada...
You have the full right to do so.. as long as it doesn't hurt / injure other people or violate other people's right and well being.Salam / Peace
-
Those who oppose this SHAHADA have not gone through history, to make it short when MUhammad announced his Messengership the most criticism was on his MESSENGERSHIP and the MESSAGE he brought, no one doubted on ALLAH, ALLAH was a fimilar name, Almost each one in that area was familar with GOD and JEWS were strongest advocates of ONE ALLAH, so were Christains and MAny Arabs though they had Different God's for different tribes.
Salaam Rajah,
Why did Muhammad announced his Messenger ship.......To make people to believehe was delivering the message of God that all.
No one doubted Allah but they doubted that the Qur'an was the world of Allah through Mohammad. I hope you pay attention that Mohammad never wanted anyone to chant that he was the messenger but to accept that he has sincerely delivered the message from God.
Therefore those who take Quran to be the guidance from God automatically accept that Prophet Mohammad was the messenger of God as he is the one who delivered this message to us.Did JEWS argued about ALLAH or ABRAHAM or MOSES, Did Christians argued about all these Messengers?, NO THEY argued about the Messengership of Muhammad, even the tribes of Quraish did argued about his Messengership, So it was very important and necessary to believe and say that "MUhammad is RAsul of Allah", by the followers of Islam
Jew did not accept Jesus and Mohammad as prophets , so they did not acceptthe Bible and the Quran. .
peace
-
Peace Tony
I agree with what you wrote, i just have a small thought that i would share.
First i want to clarify that i do not do the shehada which includes prophet Mohamed name ever since i followed the quraan alone cause God name is never associated with any other names (la illah illa allah is mentioned alone). But of course i believe in all the messengers including Mohamed without any discrimination between them.
386 How can God guide a people who have rejected after believing, and they witnessed that the messenger is true, and the clarity had come to them? God does not guide the wicked people.
From the above verse God didnt critisize the believers who did witness that the massenger is true.
Were you there when Muhammad was assigned as a messenger?
Does that mean that people who was there should witness the messenger? if the answer is yes, so God didnt critisize the hypocrites for saying they bear witness, but cause they did not say it sincerly, they say with their tongue what is not in there hearts.
peace
The above aya is talking about those people who were actually present then, and who witnessed (shahda) the truth being presented by Mohammad(pbuh) yet later they converted back.
It does not talk about any testification of his prophethood
The emphasis is on witnessing the truth being presented by the apostle, Not on testification that he is the prophet, even those people could not testify, because they did not witness Mohammad pbuh being crowned as a prophet/messenger.
siki
Peace all
It took me a while to put the above posts together brickwall
Now, if you read Hope answer to Toni (the large letters), the following can be noted631 When the hypocrites come to you they say ?We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.? And God knows that you are His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are liars.
The quraic proof that you requested can be seen in the above Verse "We bear witness that you are the messenger".
That is what the new comers to Islam use to say. But in the case of the Hypocrites, they did not mean what they say with their Lips.Peace
-
salam belH,
i would like to ask a question,
who are the hypocrites, if you were to walk in the streets today, would you be able to identify them, do they have some kind of mark on there forehead.........
or did god discribe who they are by letting us know that they are those who do shahada to mohamad... -
salam belH,
i would like to ask a question,
who are the hypocrites, if you were to walk in the streets today, would you be able to identify them, do they have some kind of mark on there forehead.........
or did god discribe who they are by letting us know that they are those who do shahada to mohamad...Anna, do not be a hard headed brickwall
Okay...Let us focus on one Issue At the time of Prophet Mohamed, do the new comers to Islam say, with their LIPS, "We Bear Witness That Mohamed is God's Messanger" .
631 When the hypocrites come to you they say ?We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.? And God knows that you are His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are liars.
Now, remember we are focusing on one issue.
when reading the above verse, I can say that God is talking about the Hypocrites who Say what they do not mean, and not about the act of saying " We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.?salam belH,
i would like to ask a question,
who are the hypocrites, if you were to walk in the streets today, would you be able to identify them, do they have some kind of mark on there forehead.........rotfl No one can identify the Hypocrites except Allah. He is the only one who knows what is in our Heart; In other words, God knows if our intention matches what we SAY and DO.
(
Certain of the desert Arabs round about you are Hypocrites, as well as among the Madinah folk they are obstinate in hypocrisy thou knowest them not We know them twice shall We punish them, and in addition shall they be sent to a grievous penalty. (9-101)
Now, if you want to answer, please focus on the One Issue, and not the issue of Shahada Today.
police police police -
Anna, do not be a hard headed brickwall
rotfl
Now, if you want to answer, please focus on the One Issue, and not the issue of Shahada Today.
police police policeummmmmmmm, how about we concentrate today on how you found me hard headed, my questions humorous to you and what, like i have already had the police come to my home 3 times in the past weeks, you dont scare me, young man... i stand firm to my words and i will answer my own question
we can identify the hypocrites, just ask them to do shahada if they add mohamad, then you bring the police -
ummmmmmmm, how about we concentrate today on how you found me hard headed, my questions humorous to you and what, like i have already had the police come to my home 3 times in the past weeks, you dont scare me, young man... i stand firm to my words and i will answer my own question
we can identify the hypocrites, just ask them to do shahada if they add mohamad, then you bring the police PAnna, please reread the Verse, and do not be a HARD HEADED; otherwise, I'm not going to answer you any more... police please focus on my Question, Is the act of saying "we bear witness that Prophet Mohamed is God's Messenger" was a common act during prophet time?
-
Anna, please reread the Verse, and do not be a HARD HEADED; otherwise, I'm not going to answer you any more... police please focus on my Question, Is the act of saying "we bear witness that Prophet Mohamed is God's Messenger" was a common act during prophet time?
im sorry im busy laughing not time to answer rotfl group
-
Peace Raj-ah,
You said regarding me
Some one even wrote that "The scriptures say that Abraham was a muslim/submitter; did he too accept Mohammed as a prophet and messenger? Moses and Aaron were also among the muslims, as was Jesus. None of them ever said, "Ash-hadu an Muhammad ar rasuwlu Allah" in their testimony" I guess Ahmed Bilal and some one else from Ahmed Bilal one can accept such sensless comments but for others who share the similar thoughts
Please try to understand what is "Shahada" and at time of Prophet Muhammad why it was necessary to bear the witness for one who enetered the religon of Allah.Are you actually buying into your own worthless words? This doesn't make any sense at all! How do you know followers had to make a testimony about Mohammed before they entered into monotheism? If Mohammed was promoting pure monotheism, worship to GOD ALONE, why would he include his own name in a testimony dedicated to God? If we are advised not to make ANY DISTINCTION among any of the prophets and messengers, why would he tell you to say, "I bear witness that MOHAMMED is THE messenger of Allah"? Is he the only one? Stop preaching your shirk.
The Quran clearly claims to be perfect, complete, and fully detailed. Do you disagree with this? And if you agree that the Quran is what it claims to be, then
WHY ISN'T YOUR SHIRK SHAHAADA INCLUDED IN THE SCRIPTURES?Peace,
Ahmad
-
WHY ISN'T YOUR SHIRK SHAHAADA INCLUDED IN THE SCRIPTURES?
Peace,
Ahmad
Ahamd
Saying the Shahadda was common during the prophet timeOkay...Let us focus on one Issue At the time of Prophet Mohamed, do the new comers to Islam say, with their LIPS, "We Bear Witness That Mohamed is God's Messanger" .
631 When the hypocrites come to you they say ?We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.? And God knows that you are His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are liars.
when reading the above verse, I can say that God is talking about the Hypocrites who Say what they do not mean, and not about the act of saying " We bear witness that you are the messenger of God.?
rotfl No one can identify the Hypocrites except Allah. He is the only one who knows what is in our Heart; In other words, God knows if our intention matches what we SAY and DO.You do not need to throw the word of Shrik against someone who is supporting his claim with Quran. Shirk is when you say about God's religion what is not written in The Book.