Which punishment do you feel is worse to have?
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Peace Family,
The thief, male or female, you shall mark their hands as a punishment for their
crime, and to serve as an example from GOD. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise.If one repents after committing this crime, and reforms, GOD redeems him.
GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.If you mark the hands, the community would know that this person is a thief
that would be sufficient. In addition, by only marking the hand, the perpetrator
has a chance to repent and live a normal life.peace
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What are you trying to say or point out?
Salaam
Salaam huruf,
I was thinking that in many aayaat Qa-Ta-A3 is used in not physical/literal way, such as in 227, 3127, 87, 9121, 1325, 2215, etc. And IF we are taking Qa-Ta-A3 in 538 in literal sense ONLY because of the word hands used in it, then why not to take the same in 1250?
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
Looking at this again, I think it becomes obvious that the verse does not imply "cutting off" the hand, else a clause on pity would have been appropriate, granted there is one for lashes for rapists (ie. ones who commit "zina".
In fact, marking/cutting the hand would also be quite implausible considering this.
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May be the question to be asked is who would you have pity for?
An abused woman in unhappy arranged loveless marriage to an arrogant vile abusive man who financially or for reasons cannot leave her husband finding comfort and love in the arms of another man who treats her like a human being.
Or
A professional thief who breaks into your house, ransacks your places, takes all that you have worked hard for and were given to you by family and friends. In this economy you are barely making ends meet living paycheck to paycheck, putting food on the table and not much savings in left in the bank account. The thief basically cleaned you out.
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Peace,
May be the question to be asked is who would you have pity for?
An abused woman in unhappy arranged loveless marriage to an arrogant vile abusive man who financially or for reasons cannot leave her husband finding comfort and love in the arms of another man who treats her like a human being.
Or
A professional thief who breaks into your house, ransacks your places, takes all that you have worked hard for and were given to you by family and friends. In this economy you are barely making ends meet living paycheck to paycheck, putting food on the table and not much savings in left in the bank account. The thief basically cleaned you out.
"Zina" is rape (thus the harsh earthly, physical punishment as well as punishment in the hereafter, except if pardoned). "FaHaSha" and it's derivatives refers to adultery. The punishment for adultery, the crime that you mentioned above, is in detailed in 415. There is no pity clause, by the way.
Also, if the thief is found, usually many of the stolen items can be recovered. If not, you cut from their means.
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Salaam huruf,
I was thinking that in many aayaat Qa-Ta-A3 is used in not physical/literal way, such as in 227, 3127, 87, 9121, 1325, 2215, etc. And IF we are taking Qa-Ta-A3 in 538 in literal sense ONLY because of the word hands used in it, then why not to take the same in 1250?
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhanIt is not the same verb in both ayas. At any rate it seems that in 12.50 women did not amputate their own hands.
On the other hand, if as you say by itself q-t-3 is used many times in the Qur'an not in the material sense and hands also are used in a non material sense repeatedly in the Qur'an, not much is left for the imagination. The material meaning lacks everything to be meaningul as a legal measure.
Murder is murder and is always taking a life, however theft can go from stealing a loaf of bread to stealing a whole country, both would be punished cutting a hand? It is a no brainer and a difficult way for the culprit to refund the victim, having to make more money with fewer hands.Salaam
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Salaam huruf,
I was thinking that in many aayaat Qa-Ta-A3 is used in not physical/literal way, such as in 227, 3127, 87, 9121, 1325, 2215, etc. And IF we are taking Qa-Ta-A3 in 538 in literal sense ONLY because of the word hands used in it, then why not to take the same in 1250?
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhanSalaamun alayka,
Well tafsirs say actually that they cutted their hands yes
But ofcourse in different way. In 538 it means chopping but in 1250 is means only cutting.Anyways I think the first problem is the correct definition of "aydiyahuma".
How does the blue/green Hand(s) look like if they are hands?
564 "... "
4810 "... ""Salaam,
Bender -
Peace,
"Zina" is rape (thus the harsh earthly, physical punishment as well as punishment in the hereafter, except if pardoned). "FaHaSha" and it's derivatives refers to adultery. The punishment for adultery, the crime that you mentioned above, is in detailed in 415. There is no pity clause, by the way.
Also, if the thief is found, usually many of the stolen items can be recovered. If not, you cut from their means.
I have also been troubled by the translation of 415.
If zina is rape then why would God also say punish the victim in 242? Says alzaniyatu walzani? And "bihama" is translated as pity for them. Also if zina is rape, why would anyone have pity for a rapist?
I feel so overwhelmed.
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It is not the same verb in both ayas. At any rate it seems that in 12.50 women did not amputate their own hands.
On the other hand, if as you say by itself q-t-3 is used many times in the Qur'an not in the material sense and hands also are used in a non material sense repeatedly in the Qur'an, not much is left for the imagination. The material meaning lacks everything to be meaningul as a legal measure.
Murder is murder and is always taking a life, however theft can go from stealing a loaf of bread to stealing a whole country, both would be punished cutting a hand? It is a no brainer and a difficult way for the culprit to refund the victim, having to make more money with fewer hands.Salaam
Salaam huruf,
I did not mean that way... sorry for not able to explain it well.
I mean, in many of the aayaat Qa-Ta-A3 is used in non physical sense. BUT when it comes with Yad in 538 people take it in literal sense, if so, then why don't they take 1250 also in literal sense.
We may need to look at point raised by brother Bender, the usage of Yad is different. Lets see if this fix this problem, inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
Peace,
I have also been troubled by the translation of 415.
Which translation, and in which way?
If zina is rape then why would God also say punish the victim in 242? Says alzaniyatu walzani? And "bihama" is translated as pity for them. Also if zina is rape, why would anyone have pity for a rapist?
Because there is no sexism. If a female rapes/molests a male, then the female is punished in the same way a male would be punished if he raped/molested someone. Do you find this puzzling or troubling? Everyone is equal in front of the law. And in regards to you latter question because some people have compassion in their heart.
In an article I will write up soon I will logically, using the Quran alone and no preconceptions or religious influence, prove to everyone that "zina" is rape, "FHSh" is adultery and some more things regarding the sexual laws of the Quran.