Hadith and Quran
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Also, if we are not to believe in Hadith, How many wives did Prophet Mohammad have? what was his age when he received Quran's revelation for the first time? How can you find these information and based on what sources? or You do not need to know?
Some hadiths are used as history and you dont need to follow some one history. !
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Peace,
I know Hadithes are absurd and they contradict Holy Koran. but why are Hadith fake while Koran is not? I heard same people who collected these sayings also helped in compiling of Quran? so how is that Hadith are fake and Quran remains unchanged?
Hadith are acknowldged to be works of men and are of inferior literature quality with proven errors/contradictions/fables. Quran is claimed to be the word of God and is able to hold up to scrutiny and objective reading/analysis.
As for the claim that the same people who collected the hadith compiled the Quran...Well, that is exactly what it is "a claim" since the Quran asserts on its own that it was completed and even compiled at the hands of the prophet with the inspiration given by God.
Also, if we are not to believe in Hadith, How many wives did Prophet Mohammad have? what was his age when he received Quran's revelation for the first time? How can you find these information and based on what sources? or You do not need to know?
What was his hair color? How tall was he? What about his hobbies? What was his Facebook username? Did he have a Twiter account?....We can go on with such rubish questions until J-day since they obviously have no value to our salvation and to finding/holding the path of God.
Also, if we are not to believe in Hadith, How many wives did Prophet Mohammad have? what was his age when he received Quran's revelation for the first time? How can you find these information and based on what sources? or You do not need to know?
Se my comment above.
More importantly, why the song and dance? From your early posts it is clear you neither believe in the Quran as being the word of God nor in Islam as a system. So why pretend to worry about the Hadith and the Quran since neither have appealed to you?
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The Quran = 100% fact/truth/perfect
Ahadith = mix of truth and falsehood (hence weak and strong hadith)The Quran = recorded under the DIRECT supervision of prophet Muhammad
Ahadith = not recorded under the DIRECT supervision of prophet MuhammadThe Quran = written AND memorised word for word as soon as it was transmitted
Ahadith = no-one ever claimed to record and memorise ahadith word for word as soon as it was transmittedPeace
Where is that very original script of the Quran which was written in Prophet PBUH 's direct supervision?
Second question memorized by whome? Companions of the Prophet PBUH who are supposedly responsible for tampering the whole Islam.So why not Quran in memorization?Regards
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Peace
Where is that very original script of the Quran which was written in Prophet PBUH 's direct supervision?
Second question memorized by whome? Companions of the Prophet PBUH who are supposedly responsible for tampering the whole Islam.So why not Quran in memorization?Regards
Are the chickens coming home to roost?
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598775.msg216002#msg216002
;D -
Are the chickens coming home to roost?
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598775.msg216002#msg216002
;Dyay yay
When one is helpless to answer ,such replies are expected.
I was sure you could never answer.
Your maximum reply would be "www.blablalblabla.com"
Regards -
yay yay
When one is helpless to answer ,such replies are expected.
I was sure you could never answer.
Your maximum reply would be "www.blablalblabla.com"
RegardsAh, the irony. A mirror would do you wonders.
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Peace,
Hadith are acknowldged to be works of men and are of inferior literature quality with proven errors/contradictions/fables. Quran is claimed to be the word of God and is able to hold up to scrutiny and objective reading/analysis.
As for the claim that the same people who collected the hadith compiled the Quran...Well, that is exactly what it is "a claim" since the Quran asserts on its own that it was completed and even compiled at the hands of the prophet with the inspiration given by God.
What was his hair color? How tall was he? What about his hobbies? What was his Facebook username? Did he have a Twiter account?....We can go on with such rubish questions until J-day since they obviously have no value to our salvation and to finding/holding the path of God.
Se my comment above.
More importantly, why the song and dance? From your early posts it is clear you neither believe in the Quran as being the word of God nor in Islam as a system. So why pretend to worry about the Hadith and the Quran since neither have appealed to you?
How much trust do you have on some one who has memorized the Quran, coz the same person has also memorized Hadithes. U reject his Hadith and accept his Quran's memorization. You say there are no inconsitencies in Quran while Hadith is full of incosistencies. but what about this, blind man!
Do you have answers for them?
Samples of Quranic Contradictions, Inconsistencies and Errors.
?And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation? (Quran 2533).
1- Numerical Contradictions
2- Creation of the Heaven and Earth
3- Sun-set and Sun-rise
4- A Resting Place For Sun!?
5- Why Allah Created Stars!
6- Is Sky/Heaven A ROOF or Canopy Over the Earth?
7- Does Sun Rotate Around the Earth?
8- Does Earth Spread Out Like Carpet (flat)
9- Is Man Created From Clotted Blood?
10- Is Religion Compulsive or is it not?
Prepared by Syed Kamran Mirza
Special Note Quranic ayats are taken mostly from translated Quran by Maulana A. Yousuf Ali and Maulana Muhiuddin Khan.
Numerical contradictions
There are many numerical contradictions in the Quran. Can God make so much error in doing simple calculations?
How many days did it take to create Heavens and Earth ?
Quran 7 54 Your gurdian-Lord is Allah who created the heavens and earth in Six Days
Quran 10 3 Verily your Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and earth in Six Days
Quran 117 He it is Who created the heavens and earth in Six Days
Quran-2529 He Who created the heavens and earth and all that is between, in Six DaysThe above verses clearly state that God created the heaven and Allah created the heaven and the Earth in 6 days. But the verses below stated-
Quran 41 9 Is it that ye deny Him who created the earth in Two Days ?
Quran 41 10 He set on the (earth) Mountains standing firm high above it, and bestowed blessing on the earth, and measured therein all things to give them nourishment in due proportion, in FOUR DAYS?
Quran 41 12 So He completed them (heavens) as seven firmaments in Two days and ?
Now do the math 2(for earth) + 4(for nourishment) + 2 (for heavens) = 8 days; and not 6 days
Similar mistakes you can see in the verse Quran 4 11 - 12, and Quran 4 176 in inheritance law. In these verses one can see the total property after adding all distributed parties adds up more than the available property, i.e., totals become more than 1 which are 1.125 and 1.25. How come ? A gross mathematical errors, is not it ?
Allah?s Days Equal to 1000 Years or 50,000 Years?
Quran 22 47 A day in the sight of the Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning. Quran-325 To Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be a thousands years of your rekoning
Quran 70 4 The angels and the spirit ascend unto him in a day the measure whereof is Fifty thousands years.
So, which one is it? Is the day of Allah equal to 1,000 earth years or 50,000 earth years?
Creation of the Heaven and Earth
Which one was created first? As you will see in the verses below, Allah at one time says that Earth was created first and another time he says that the Heaven was created first.
Quran 2 29 It is He who hath created for you all things that are on Earth; THEN He turned to the Heaven and made them into seven firmaments (Skies)?.
Quran 79 27 - 30 Are you the harder to create, or is the heaven that He built? He raised the height thereof and ordered it; and He has made dark the night thereof, and He brought forth the morning thereof. And after that, He spread (flattened) the earth
Now, does it match modern science? Do you believe that, Earth was created first, after that, God created Heaven? Modern science tells us that? Or How come SEVEN firmaments (layers)? Modern science tells us that, actually there is no such thing Sky is no ?roof? over us. It is only a space with no known boundary at all. These verses simply reinforce the ancient idea of ROOF over us which is called SKY, is it not so? How funny!
Sun-set and Sun-rise
Koran teaches us that the Sun sets in a muddy spring
Quran 18 86 Till, when he (the traveller Zul-qarnain) reached the setting-place of the Sun, he found it going down into a muddy spring?
Quran 18 90 Till, when he reached the rising-place of the Sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had appointed no shelter from it.
Serious scientific errors here! Firstly, it is scientifically accepted fact that, the Sun never go down in a muddy spring. Secondly, this seems to presuppose a FLAT Earth, otherwise how can there be an extreme point in the West or in the East? A sunrise there would be basically just the same as at any other place on this earth, at land or sea. It would still look as if it is setting ?far away?. It does say, that he reached THE PLACE where the Sun sets and in his second Journey the place where it rises.
A resting place for Sun!?
Quran 36 38 And the sun runneth on unto a resting place for him. That is the measuring of the Mighty, the Wise.
Quran 36 39 And for the moon We have appointed mansions till she return like an old shrivelled palm leaf.
Quran 36 40 It is not for Sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit.Allah is indeed a big scientist. Where is sun and where is moon situated? Can anybody tell me how they could collide/meet/overtake each other? Are the sun and the moon neighbors to each other? I have the answer for this error Ancient Allah saw (bare eye observations) sun and moon traveling from east to west seemingly in the same Sky area or same path, without colliding, causing day and night etc. Allah hardly could imagine that all these phenomena are simply due to Earth?s rotation and NOT by Sun?s rotation. Sun is stationary for Earth, because earth is stuck in the sun?s Gravity, like we are stuck in earth?s gravity. Allah never says any where in the whole Quran that, EARTH ROTATES. Perhaps Allah could not feel earth?s rotation.
A resting place for sun WAS CONFIRMED BY HADITHS?
Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 54, Number 421
Sahih Bukhari Hadiths Abzur Ghifari (ra) narrated one day Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) asked me, ?Abzar do you know after setting where does Sun go?? I replied, I do not know, only Allah?s apostle can say better. Then Prophet (SA) replied, ?After setting, the sun remains prostrated under Allah?s Aro?sh and waits for Allah?s command for rising again in the East. Day will come when sun will not get permission to rise again and Qeyamot will fall upon Earth?.Can anybody tell me what is it? It was the superstitious belief of ancient people reflected in the Quran and Hadiths by Allah. A 10-year-old boy would not tell such fairy tale story today.
Why Allah Created Stars!
Quran gives us further scientific knowledge by telling us that the stars were created by Allah as missiles to throw at the devils
Quran 67 5 And We have (from of old) adorned the lowest heaven (sky) with lamps, and We have made such (Lamps as) missiles to drive away Satans?
Quran 37 6-8 We have indeed decorated the lower heaven (sky) with beauty (in) the stars, (for beauty) and for guard against all obstinate rebellious Satans. So they should not strain their ears in the direction of the Exalted Assembly but be cast away from every side.
Thus, the stars are nothing but missiles to throw at devils so that they may not eavesdrop on the heavenly council. Once again we find how Allah was high on his superstitious weirdness.
Is Sky/Heaven A ROOF or Canopy Over the Earth?
Quran 21 32 And We have made the sky a roof withheld (from them). Yet they turn away from its portents.
Quran 31 10 He hath created the heavens (Skies) without supports (pillars) that ye can see, and hath cast into the earth firm Mountains/Hills, so that it quake not with you; and He hath dispersed?
Quran 2 22 Who has made the earth your couch, And the heavens (Sky) your canopy
Modern science tells us- whole thing around the earth is space and there is no boundary even if we go Billions of light years away in all directions. Questions are When there is no sky above us then how in the world, it needs pillars for support? Do we really have a roof above us? Is there a canopy above the Earth? Is there anything called above or beneath us? Are mountains there to prevent Earth from shaking? Give me a break!
Once again Allah considered sky as roof over the Earth, which will broke/shattered during dooms day
Quran 78 19 And the heavens (sky) Shall be broken (opened) as if there were doors opens?
Quran 82 1 When the Sky is cleft asunder
Quran 69 16 And the sky will be Rent asunder, for it will That day be flimsy (soft)
Quran 81 2 When the stars fall, losing their luster.
Yousuf Ali comments in his Tafsir beautiful blue-sky overhead (which we take for granted in sunshine) will be shattered to pieces. Modern science tells us that there is no such thing as roof/sky or any canopy over the Earth; rather all around Earth is a limitless space. Only Allah knows what will break/shatter or will get soft/flimsy or how doors will open , there is no walls, where from doors will come? In some Ayats Allah threatened kafirs by saying ?I (Allah) will throw broken pieces of sky over your head.?
Does Sun Rotate Around the Earth?
Quran 31 29 Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day and He merges Day into Night; That He has subjected the sun and moon (to His law), each running its course for a term (time) appointed.
Quran 21 33 It is He who created The Night and Day, And the Sun and Moon; each of them Swim (float) along in its own course.
Ayats mentioned above could be found over and over again and again almost in every pages of Quran. Because, Allah standing in the open Arab desert saw very well that, every morning SUN is rising from the East and gradually (appointed time or fixed time) setting to the West, and as a result, day and night follows. Allah truly mentioned this wrong knowledge (sun moving) of pre-historic people. Every time Allah mentioned Sun & Moon, He mentioned day & night, as if it is due to sun?s movement day and night follows. But surprisingly, all the hypocrite Mullahs giving false credit to Allah by saying look Quran told about sun?s movement 1400 years ago which modern science only found out now. In real world, sun takes 225 millions of years to make just one complete circle through the solar Universe. And obviously this movement of sun has nothing to do with DAY & NIGHT of the earth. Actually, Sun is stationary in relation to the Earth, because the Earth is stuck to the giant gravitation force of the Sun, and the Earth also moves along with the Sun wherever it goes, just the way we are stuck to the Earth?s gravitation force and do not feel its movement at all.
Why then, Allah was telling the Sun?s movement again and again. I have already mentioned above, why Allah was hysteric about the Sun?s movements. Now dishonest Mullahs are claiming science here. I wonder, why Allah has to mentioned about the Sun?s 225 millions year journey (which is even unimaginable to mankind) to tell about day and night? What relation Sun?s movement has with the day and night?
Does Earth Spread Out Like Carpet (flat)?
Quran 15 19 And the earth We have spread out (like a carpet); set thereon Mountains firm and immovable;
Quran 78 6-7 Have We not made the earth as a wide expanse, And the mountains as pegs (anchor)?
Allah was sure that earth is flat like a carpet and mountains are there to anchor the earth so that earth does not shake with us. Allah is really merciful scientist.
Is Man Created From Clotted Blood?
Quran-2314 Then fashioned We the drop (semen) a CLOT OF CONGEALED BLOOD then fashioned We the Clot a little lump (foetus), fashioned We the little lump into bones, then clothed the bones with flesh, and then produced it another creation. So blessed be Allah, the Best of Creators. ( Bengali translated Quran said ?Zamaa?t Raokto theeke Manoosh banieesi? And this Ayat has been repeated again and again throughout the Quran ) Quran-7538 Then he becomes a CLOT; then (Allah) shaped and fashioned?
Quran 96 2 Created man, out of a mere clot of congealed blood
There are serious scientific problems here
Blood clot cannot grow into anything. This idea also came from the Greek. Aristotle erroneously believed that, humans are originated from the action of male semen upon female menstrual blood, which is absolutely an incorrect assumption. Quran?s assertion on Clot (alaqa) is completely wrong about human development, since there is absolutely no stage during which the embryo consists of a clot. The only situation in which an embryo might appear like a clot is during a miscarriage, in which case the clotted blood that is seen to emerge (much of which comes from mother) is solidified and by definition no longer alive. Therefore, if ever an embryo appeared to look like a clot it would never develop any further into a human; it would be a dead mass of bloody miscarrying flesh. Since Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) had some thirteen wives it is entirely possible that he would be very familiar with miscarriages.
Modern science tells us that, the formation of human embryo is a seamless continuation from conception to birth; hence there are no hard- and- fast boundaries of stages as Quran describes. Quran describes 4 stages, which matches exactly with Galenic description of development of human embryo (which was proved wrong by modern science).
Creation of bones and clothing of bones with flesh According to modern embryologists including Prof. Moore, the tissue from which bone originates, known as mesoderm, is the same tissue as that from which muscle (flesh) develops. Thus bone and muscles begin to develop simultaneously, rather than sequentially (as the Quran is telling us). Moreover, most of the muscle tissue that we humans have is laid down before birth, but bones continue to develop and calcify (strengthen with calcium) right into one?s teenage years. So it would be more accurate if the Quran had said that muscles started to develop at the same time as bones, but completed their development earlier. The idea that bones are clothed with flesh is not only scientifically completely wrong/false, but was directly copied from the ancient Greek doctor Galen?s hypothesis.
Also, the idea of saying ?made into bones and clothed the bones with muscle? came from the technique of making animal statue out of rod and cement or mud. People usually make the skeleton (out of rod or stick) first and, then cover it up with cement or mud. This is scarcely a scientific description of embryonic development. It is rather a description of an unlettered man.
Is Religion Compulsive Or Is It Not?
Quran 02 256 There is no Compulsion in religion?.
OR
Quran 9 29 Fight those who do not profess the true faith(Islam) till they pay the polltax (jiziya) with the hand of humility.
Quran 9 5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolators wherever ye find them and take them captive, and besiege them and prepare for them each ambush?.
Quran 47 4 When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads?.
Quran 2 191 And slay (kill) them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out such is the reward of those who suppress faith.
Quran 8 65 O Apostle ! rouse the believers to the fight of?.unbelievers.
Very often apologetics claim that, Islam is a religion of peace and there is no compulsion. Yet punishment of an apostate in Islam is, of course, death penalty.
In very many Ayats Allah claimed that, He has given this Quran in the easy and clear language so that, it will not be difficult to understand by the ordinary Arabs.
Quran 44 58 Verily, We have made This Quran easy in the tongue, in order that they may give heed.
No matter which translated Quran we read, the Quranic materials remain the same to us and every sentence is self explanatory and it does not take a rocket scientist to comprehend what is the message Allah wanted to transmit for Arabs. Yet, bigot Mullahs will always blame translators for Quranic contradictions/errors/inconsistencies etc. and will try to find lame excuses to cover up Allah?s ignorance.
Comments
The Holy Qur?an is full of inaccuracies, contradictions, inconsistencies, redundancies, no chronology or chapters, grammatical errors, etc. One can find hundreds of contradictions/errors/inconsistencies in the Holy Quran. The above-mentioned Ayats are just selected samples from the Quran. But still it is a miracle to those who are blindfolded bigots.
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What Sunnis are you talking about? -\ Most Sunnis put the Qur'aan far ahead of the hadiyths. In fact, ALL the Sunnis I know use the hadiyths as a guide, and they ALWAYS come secondary to the Qur'aan. I've never heard of a Sunni putting the hadiyths ahead of the Qur'aan, "al kitaabu Allah"... But as I've said before, not all Sunnis are the same. They have differing views and ideas on certain issues, and I can't say what the "all" do when it comes to adhering to the Qur'aan. Still, placing the hadiyths ABOVE the actual scripture is extremely unlikely in any fold of Sunnism...
the only sunni i talked to and who transformed into a salafi was alway quoting hadiths, always, and he would forget the quranic verses (what they mean) and always go back to hadith
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the only sunni i talked to and who transformed into a salafi was alway quoting hadiths, always, and he would forget the quranic verses (what they mean) and always go back to hadith
That's only because, usually, Salafis believe that the hadiyths explain the Qur'aan. So, even though the Qur'aan is placed higher than the hadiyths, it is unable to be understood by 'regular people' without the use of the hadiyths and sunna. This is the same thing that nearly all Sunnis believe. They're not (per se) putting the hadiyths above the Qur'aan; they just believe that reciting the hadiyths is just as good as reciting the Qur'aan, since the former explains the latter.
