The concept of "Sin"
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it cant happen..thats what Im wondering..if this was a test then what is the point of creating handicapped children etc, who cannot perform at the level of other people...if a possible answer is to show other people how blessed they are, then thats not really fair on the people themselves..
im studying more..insha allah i will have abetter understanding in due time with patience and perseverence..i do not have any alternate answer as to what is the purpose of our life on earth, if not a chance to prove to ourselves whether we deserve heaven/hell...peace sis sarah, i have considered what you said before i posted...it makes sense to some extent. my argument is then why put islamic/quranic laws for all mankind, if all of mankind is not capable enough to fulfill or live up to the requirements.ofcourse it makes sense for a psychotic killer to be put to death, but then again some people are hardwired to be less attuned to emotions..more violent in other words..how can God, with His ultimate justice put the same wordly laws on that person who is less capable of controlling violent urges than other people. there are people who cant help stealing, they dont realise what theyr doing..some people are more prone to depression...why put evryone in the same boat, when there are clearly different situations for every individual on this earth?
The short answer is everyone is not in the same boat.
Different situations/circumstances/etc. affect to what degree one's soul is burdened or lightened through positive and negative actions.
See, e.g., 3330 and 425 which describe different punishments for the same action, depending on who the doer of the action is.
Also see 335 and 2286 for the general idea that it is purposeful intentions that affect one's spiritual evolution, and that individual capacities are accounted for with regard to the tests in each life. This speaks directly to your question of laws applying to those who cannot control urges, e.g.
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Salaam Sis,
thats what Im wondering..if this was a test then what is the point of creating handicapped children etc, who cannot perform at the level of other people...if a possible answer is to show other people how blessed they are, then thats not really fair on the people themselves..
As Sis Sarah pointed out previously, no one has the same circumstances and they will judged accordingly. I am unsure what you are proposing with ?equal chance?. Does it mean everyone should be born with exactly the same physical traits, emotional tendencies, level of intelligence, skills and capabilities? Does that mean everyone should be born in the same geographical environment, cause some people might consider it is unfair for some people to fast more due to the longer duration of one day? If that is so, then we will be like robots.
The concept of equality and fairness varies with different people. A person may be born with certain deficiencies, and yet he is thankful for life because he has many friends who love him. On the other hand, a person may be born perfectly and is physically capable and attractive, but is grudging because he does not live in a loving and peaceful environment. It all depends on what you make your circumstances to be. You choose to think that you are not given equal chance because you focus on what you can not do, rather than what you can do.
There are many different ways to prove ourselves worthy. Someone may not be able to walk, but he uses his hands to write and his mouth to reach to others, for the better of mankind. Someone may not have excess of money, but he uses his time and energy to volunteer etc. God will account for that. Just remember with every hardship, there is ease. With every weakness, there is strength. It is essentially our choice if we want to focus on the hardship rather than the ease, and vice versa, and ultimately shape our actions accordingly.
Anyway, all this talk reminds me of a guy who was born without arms and legs. People will see how unfortunate he is, and he was depressed at one stage of his life, and yet he overcame time. He is happy with life (at least with what I can see on the surface anyway), and does the most of it. He is happier and able to give more than people who were born with everything
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8ZuKF3dxCY
im studying more..insha allah i will have abetter understanding in due time with patience and perseverence..i do not have any alternate answer as to what is the purpose of our life on earth, if not a chance to prove to ourselves whether we deserve heaven/hell...
It is good that you constantly strive for knowledge, but don?t let that frustrate you. Take it slowly. As some people have pointed out to me before Islam is supposed to be a system that serves us. It is a sign of God?s mercy to us. When you start feeling uneasy and discontented when you do something for Islam, step back and think. Maybe there is nothing wrong with Islam and God, maybe it?s just our perspectives, our endless worrying, our excessive analysis and calculation that makes our Deen seems so complicated. We are supposed to enjoy what we do, and not stress over it too much. When we stress too much and not feel contented at all, then we really miss the spirit of Islam. If you feel certain things are off, then don?t do it if they will impose burdens upon you. Save that for later, when you attain more knowledge and more confidence with your innocence. Go with what you are sure you know, and that will make you contented.
Our purpose on earth? Well, everyone has different take and interpretation really. If you feel it is a chance for us to prove ourselves if we deserve heaven or hell, and see the wisdom in that, then it becomes your purpose of being here.
peace sis sarah, i have considered what you said before i posted...it makes sense to some extent. my argument is then why put islamic/quranic laws for all mankind, if all of mankind is not capable enough to fulfill or live up to the requirements.
The way I see it, Islam is not as rigid at all. There are provisions for people based on their circumstances. There are unlawful food for mankind, and yet if we are in poverty and forced by hunger, then it is not ?sinful? for us to eat the food. We are told to give regular charity, but the poor people are exempted from this commandment. And the list can go on. Hence why we are given the ability to think, to make judgments based on our knowledge.
Salaam.
/end of the preacher?s mode.
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it cant happen..thats what Im wondering..if this was a test then what is the point of creating handicapped children etc, who cannot perform at the level of other people...if a possible answer is to show other people how blessed they are, then thats not really fair on the people themselves..
im studying more..insha allah i will have abetter understanding in due time with patience and perseverence..i do not have any alternate answer as to what is the purpose of our life on earth, if not a chance to prove to ourselves whether we deserve heaven/hell...peace sis sarah, i have considered what you said before i posted...it makes sense to some extent. my argument is then why put islamic/quranic laws for all mankind, if all of mankind is not capable enough to fulfill or live up to the requirements.ofcourse it makes sense for a psychotic killer to be put to death, but then again some people are hardwired to be less attuned to emotions..more violent in other words..how can God, with His ultimate justice put the same wordly laws on that person who is less capable of controlling violent urges than other people. there are people who cant help stealing, they dont realise what theyr doing..some people are more prone to depression...why put evryone in the same boat, when there are clearly different situations for every individual on this earth?
Peace sis,
Here's another verse you should ponder.
2362 And We do not burden a soul except with what it can bear. And We have a record that speaks with the truth, they will not be wronged.
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Peace sis,
Here's another verse you should ponder.
2362 And We do not burden a soul except with what it can bear. And We have a record that speaks with the truth, they will not be wronged.
+1
IMO, the most relevant reference for your concern of "fairness" period. For we can't even actually delve into the minds of those we call 'psychotic', 'prone to depression', 'less attuned to emotions' etc. The second best approach would be to follow the advise from someone who actually knows everything that happens inside those minds and also, the consequences.
Re "chance to prove to ourselves whether we deserve heaven/hell", do you mind if i ask you, rraza, what is it that's so important about "us/ourselves" being "worthy/deserving" of heaven/hell?
Verse 5156 might be the answer to your question ("purpose" though at this moment i can't say that i'm 100% certain myself about the meaning of the last word. It is beyond heaven/hell for sure, and i can't emphasize enough how closely it is related to the Narrator of this verse.
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Actually what rraza is saying is very logical but her argument is been bullied by opposition's arguments.
Some one said that "we need a test to go in to next grade"
Did in the very first place we asked to be created, was my question? then why enroll us and promote us or test us to promote to next grade, that does not make any sense.2362 And We do not burden a soul except with what it can bear. And We have a record that speaks with the truth, they will not be wronged.
This verse is supposedly for an after life. It is talking about soul. But we see that often body bears which it can't bear and end result is ........?
Caveman Doctor
The short answer is everyone is not in the same boat.
Different situations/circumstances/etc. affect to what degree one's soul is burdened or lightened through positive and negative actions.
See, e.g., 3330 and 425 which describe different punishments for the same action, depending on who the doer of the action is.But Doc, why punishment in the first place? no matter in whichever boat you are, you are in this world on some one Else's terms and conditions some one else has defined the rules and roles then why punishment? why pain ? by that some one else.
Wootah
Aren't you following the thread?
Is this answer to my question?
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Actually what rraza is saying is very logical but her argument is been bullied by opposition's arguments.
Caveman Doctor
But Doc, why punishment in the first place? no matter in whichever boat you are, you are in this world on some one Else's terms and conditions some one else has defined the rules and roles then why punishment? why pain ? by that some one else.Pretty sure rraza isn't being bullied. At any rate, check out some of the earlier posts in this thread about 'punishment.' Might help to have a paradigm shift in how these issues could be thought about. With regard to being here on someone else's terms and conditions, you should check out 3372 and related verses.