Use of the word Allah as a name, even when speaking English
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I completely agree. So what is the problem with translation Allah to God?
nothing, what's the problem with saying Allah? just because today in society people have bias and prejudice against mulsims and associate things with them? please the crowd? to me that's your argument. some people say salam instead of peace, should we stomp on them too? or is that ok because they do it amongst muslims and if muslims have bias it's not as bad as non muslims?
I don't think it's a big deal either way. if you feel people can relate to you more when you speak religion and say "God", by all means do what you're comfortable with.
peace/salam
take your pick )
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Haha no it's not about pleasing the crowd, although I do think a connection would be made with non-Arabs easier if people spoke in their language, it's just human nature.
What this is more about is whether or not it is God's name and the religion states somewhere that that is so and I just haven't noticed it, and also a confusion people seem to have as to what is Islamic and what is Arabic culture.
I feel that He has no name in Islam and the so called '99 names of God' are characteristics to help us understand him.
And yes I know that the Quran uses the term 'names' for them, but they aren't names, they're characteristics, and he remains nameless.
An understanding of the word Allah would stop such things as riots in Malaysia and people forcing others to use Allah when speaking other languages.And also in the bigger picture I feel that most Muslims are confused about what is Islamic and what is Arab, and end up Arabizing themselves in an effort to become more religious.
I'm living in the UK now and I find it really frequent all over the country that East-Asian Muslims wear the Arabic thobe, or long white robe. To me that's odd because they don't do so in the Middle East, they wear their own distinct robe. Many also don the shemagh, or ghutra.Now if these things bring a person closer to their religion, then all the best to them. But I fear that there is a shockingly large amount of people walking around this world in complete confusion as to what is Islamic and what is simply Arabic culture.
At the end of the day, I just want people to know what the word means, and if they use it all the time they do so by choice. There's a horrible trend these days where every Muslim feels they have the right to tell other Muslims what is wrong and what is right.
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A Personal Name and Title held by a Personality is never translated in any other language. We call either by personal name or Title of Personality. I cannot translate Fir'aoun in Urdu except using such of the alphabets of my language which give the pronunciation/speech sound as near to it as possible, since it is Title of the King of old Egypt. Why then to translate the Title and Personal Name of the Creator. We call Him Allah to show distinction and retain our individuality that We show allegiance to Allah Who is The Only Ilaha. If some does not want to retain his individuality with reference to whose servant is he and wants to remain vague as we use fake identities on the net, then it is a different story.
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No you call him Phir'aoun because we do not have his name anymore. So Phir'aoun has become his name. We call Muhammad by his name because that is his name. Humans have names so that we can address each other and because there are many of us.
However God is only 1, and He is not human. He is an abstract concept unlike us, so why do we feel the need to give him a name? He is not masculine, yet the term Allah is masculine. The term Allat is feminine (Allat was a pagan god from before Islam). But God is neither masculine nor feminine so why give him a masculine name? God is a concept, as is Allah.
God isn't Al-Rahmaan or Al-Raheem, he is ALL of them. They are ALL his names. So if you wanted to address God by his name you would have to refer to him by all his names at once, or simply use the expression God, which is Allah in Arabic.
And I hope that made sense.
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The connection might be easier but if they know you define Allah as God they will be able to comprehend, it wouldn?t be an issue.
Name.. no name dunno entirely to comment but people need to associate. The word Allah is used to associate with God, their Lord the One and Only. Others associate different things with God so saying Allah may help single other associations. the Quran uses the word "Allah" what's the big deal besides if you think no name why say God? you'll need to start defining God to people who already have a definition. sounds like you're just complicating things
few verses say thalika biana allahu haqq 226, 2262, 3130
Other things as well
4711 That is because Allah is the Protector of those who believe, but those who reject Allah have no protector.
Haqq could be seen as an attribute Allah the name given to..
Haven?t seen all occurrences. Yes Asma alhusna can be seen as characteristics but also why not a name what does ?isma/ism? = to?
I don?t think an understanding would stop riots, actually I remember reading Malaysian?s wanted to ban non muslims using the word ?Allah?.
Sure there may be some confusion of arab and Islam. But there is nothing wrong with taking things from another culture and adopting them.
ask yourself why do these east asian muslims wear the thobe? Lol you see people in kaffiyeh (shemegh/ghutra) that?s interesting nice to see more males in hijab haha
People have identities they like to associate with, cant tell people you?re an idiot for wearing that because you think it?s more Islamic. well you could but i think that'll create more riot
Now if these things bring a person closer to their religion, then all the best to them. But I fear that there is a shockingly large amount of people walking around this world in complete confusion as to what is Islamic and what is simply Arabic culture.
Remember most muslims are traditionalists who believe in hadith with little or no doubt. They believe they NEED to emulate the prophet in all acts and deeds in everything. Their association with supposed hadith may impede on their culture and tradition but at the end of the day it?s a choice they make, regardless of reasoning.
At the end of the day, I just want people to know what the word means, and if they use it all the time they do so by choice. There's a horrible trend these days where every Muslim feels they have the right to tell other Muslims what is wrong and what is right.
You think people don?t know what Allah means? Lol ok well I believe they do know also again muslims feel the need to correct wrong and right because of tradition haven?t you heard the hadith along the lines of ?if you see wrong correct it with your hands if you can?t, correct it with your words, if you can?t correct it in your mind and that?s the weakest of faith??
Besides that disregarding that it?s normal for people to tell others what they feel is wrong and right and muslims should support each other for good and against bad
3110 Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors.
God isn't Al-Rahmaan or Al-Raheem, he is ALL of them. They are ALL his names. So if you wanted to address God by his name you would have to refer to him by all his names at once, or simply use the expression God, which is Allah in Arabic.
i disagree read 17110 also with your logic, if you had a nick name, a middle name, a surname and another name you associated with would i need to call you all those names to address you? just because they are ALL your name? somehow i don't think so.
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However God is only 1
Mazhar A. Nurani is only 1 in all the worlds that exist. Can you challenge it? Only 1 concept will become evident when you call that 1 by name and not by concept. Name introduces and makes a Personality Distinct, Unique and Individualized. If Ar Rahman is not the personal name how would you translate the possessive Arabic phrase "Ism Allah". I need not say that the indefinite noun Ism has become definite noun "The Name of Allah" now find The Name of Allah
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You think people don?t know what Allah means? Lol ok well I believe they do know also again muslims feel the need to correct wrong and right because of tradition haven?t you heard the hadith along the lines of ?if you see wrong correct it with your hands if you can?t, correct it with your words, if you can?t correct it in your mind and that?s the weakest of faith??
Well honestly, I would argue that many people don't know what it means. If you asked them you would simply get a standard response of, "it is God's name". I think Arabs will know the etymology of Al and Ilah, but others probably won't unless they've had some training in Arabic.
About correcting others. I don't mind being corrected if it is something I didn't know and it was a learned person correcting me. But what I'm talking about is every teenager off the street thinking they're an authority on Islamic jurisprudence.
i disagree read 17110 also with your logic, if you had a nick name, a middle name, a surname and another name you associated with would i need to call you all those names to address you? just because they are ALL your name? somehow i don't think so.
Yes we've been discussing 17110, see above I gave a detailed response to it.
As for names, I'm not God. If you see me and meet me you will have an understanding of who I am. But to understand God we need all of his names.
I'm just philosophizing here and being a devil's advocate...I don't literally mean that we should always refer to God by all his names, I'm just trying to express how necessary those names are to Him.Mazhar A. Nurani is only 1 in all the worlds that exist. Can you challenge it?
Haha I probably could if I wanted to. I know for a fact that there are literally hundreds of people with my name out there...so it wouldn't surprise me at all if there was another Mazhar Nurani lurking somewhere around the world.
A quick google search came up with this guy
http//www.facebook.com/people/Mazhar-Nurani/513942057
Is that you Mazhar? Hahah no offense but you don't look like an Islamic authority.If Ar Rahman is not the personal name how would you translate the possessive Arabic phrase "Ism Allah". I need not say that the indefinite noun Ism has become definite noun "The Name of Allah" now find The Name of Allah
Don't put words in my mouth Mazhar. I'm trying to find out whether there is anything in the religion that specifically states that we should call Allah regardless of language.
I'm only suggesting that Muslims call Allah by whatever translation they have for the word 'God' when speaking other languages, and that other Muslims shouldn't force them to use the term Allah exclusively.So far the best argument has been 17110, but even that is ambiguous.
a) Because the command "Qul" is used all over the Quran and shouldn't then be taken to mean "Qul "b)Because if it meant to literally "call Him Allah or call Him Al-Rahmaan when you mention Him", then all the other names are false and shouldn't be used.
Therefore, we can state that the true meaning of 17110 is to call unto Him in prayer or when we are in need.
It also seems to me that publishers are now moving to exclusively use the term Allah in the translations of the Quran.
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Peace to all,
Well I get your point ths, but then why use the word GOd for God, its just a word from the germanic language for goddere, which was a nordic god, so why are you ok with using that word for God but not the word Allah, which to me is probably the best word to use, since I believe in the Quran and it uses Allah, and I believe the Quran is from Allah, then I am happy using that word over any other word from some left over pagan beleifs.
Kurt
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Peace Sarah,
what's the problem with saying Allah?
The problem is that as a proper name it is meaningless ungrammatical nonsense. It has to be a common noun. This is made absolutely clear by the great reading itself.
- And he is the god in the heavens and in the earth. He knows your hidden and your revealed, and what you earn.
Taking the word ?allah? in 63 as a proper name without translation makes the passage ungrammatical and reduces it to nonsense. It is as absurd as saying ?he is John of the house? as opposed to ?he is the man of the house?.
Also, the god himself clearly translates the word "allah" in the great reading. For example, in 1239, Joseph who didn't speak Arabic and lived long before Arabic was even invented says to his prison mates
Did Joseph use what would have been at his time and for his audience a gibberish word from a future language called Arabic that wasn't even invented yet? Of course not! Proposing that "allah" in 1239 is a proper name is no different than proposing that 1400 years ago in Arabic "allah" was literally named "" long before Modern English was invented.
Unfortunately, most translators have disregarded grammar and common sense. If even professional linguists and expert translators make such logical errors then it is no wonder that many people in the world wrongly believe ?allah? to be the proper name of an Arab deity and not the common universal concept of the (definite) god. It is also not surprising that even educated people have trouble with this simple concept, which is proof that there is a big difference between education and enlightment.
Peace and all best wishes,
Ayman
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Well I get your point ths, but then why use the word GOd for God, its just a word from the germanic language for goddere, which was a nordic god, so why are you ok with using that word for God but not the word Allah, which to me is probably the best word to use, since I believe in the Quran and it uses Allah, and I believe the Quran is from Allah, then I am happy using that word over any other word from some left over pagan beleifs.
Because this conversation is in English.
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http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/017.%20A2.gif
http//You, the Messenger tell them; "You people may call/address as Allah or call/address Him Ar'Reh'maan;http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/017.%20A4.gif
if/whenever you people call since for Him are the Names having distinction of exacting balance/appropriate/proportioned/equilibrium/virtue/admirable/absolutely void of negativity/ grandeur/just/absoluteness/beauty".http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/017.G%20Al%20Israa.htm
"god" whether with small g or capital g is not the name, in English it is noun but not name. And Allah is the Name.
And "al" in Allah is not definite article, it is part of the name;
Are you an Arab or an Arabic speaker? Do you know what the grammatical term " " means? Does it mean that the sentence has a proper name?
Peace,
Ayman
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Because this conversation is in English.
Hahah...ahhh that's what I've been trying to say all day.
Thanks Ayman, you put it succinctly and beautifully, as the true answer always is. And I can't think of anything else to add to your argument. Reading it as "He is the god in the heavens and the earth" makes absolute sense.
Salaam 3aleikum
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Peace ths,
I really understand your concern about issues of non-Arabic speaking muslims, assuming arabic cultures as Islamic. If singing for Islam, they use Arabic style of music. Till growing beard as sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad. This was really stress by groups of Jammah Tabligh from India, Pakistan or Bangladesh on beard issue. They say growing beard is one of the sunnah and quite important in their Maulana's book. I think Orthodox Jews also have thicker beard. What's the difference between Jews beard and Muslims beard? No difference.
The point, is Muhammad really making beard as an issue in his lifetime? I don't think so. If beard is to be so important as a Sunnah, I think it's not fair to muslim male in other parts of the world especially in Far East country where in biological factor, not so much beard on their chin. Muhammad had no time to inform his Arabic culture while delivering the message of QURAN. His task is only to deliver the message. No other thing.
So, all these ethnic cultures, biological factors have nothing to do with the Quran message from AlMighty God. Quran only stress on Tauhid or Oneness of God and reflect it in our daily lives and activities regardless of culture. God already mentioned in Quran, that He have created various types of races and cultures and languages on this planet Earth, to make everybody recognised each other. The only difference is understanding of God as a creator and what we sould do and we should not do.
Besides that also nothing to do with technological factor. Historically it happened many many years ago, where some so called muslim ulamaks reject television in their homes. I think Al-Qaeda also have many iPhones, Cds, DVD players, wireless internet facilities in their mountains.
Other issue that I also wonder, in regards to anger of muslims all over the world towards the West. I knew it's because of oppression of the Israelis towards the Palestinians. The think is the way, we show anger by burning of US flags and Israeli flags and stamping by feet, set fire, trigger the guns and shooting in the air by the mask men. The burning of these flags also done in other countries. This kind of thing will never stop the aggression of the Israelis. Actually muslims should think for a second, why Almighty God, until now, not giving Palestinians on wining side? There might be something to be done on muslim side. In Quran, God said, contact Me, I'm near to you. Muslims all over the world pray day and night, crying to God for help, but still the Israelis became more aggresive from time to time.
Some muslim organizations call muslims to boycott American products. Well, if we want to boycott, why only boycott KFC, McDonald. Why not boycott Boeing aircraft, so that muslims who want to perform Hajj use other brand of airlines. Why using Windows product (also American product) in their computer but at the same time says "Down to America". I knew some so call ulamaks really angry towards the US in the speech and pray for the fall of US Government, but at the same time, their son or daughter was studying for a doctorate at US universities. If we pray for down with America, it will surely affect the muslims in America. We sould never pray for bad things. We should pray for good and hope God will switch the hearts of the non-Muslims from hatred to respect to the muslims. If we show aggression and explode ourselves with bomb because of God, then the non-Muslim will be more aggresive towards us. If we show respect and humble, we must know, the non-Muslims are also human, with hearts. We must don't and never knock their bulidings down, but knock their hearts.
All these kind of attitudes, is mainly because of wrong interpretation about Islam and Quran. History speaks for itself.
Peace.
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Peace ths,
So this has been bothering me for years and I figured it was time to get to the bottom of it.
Firstly let me apologize if this has been discussed before, I did a search, and did not come up with anything.
So,
What bothers me specifically is the use of the word Allah when people speak another language. Why is this done?
I am an Arabic speaker, and as I'm sure you all know, Allah simply means 'The God' in the Arabic language. It comes from Al (The) and Ilah (god).
Now, I'm sure you all know that the word Allah is also used by Arab Christians and Jews, and was even used to refer to God before Islam.
So why do people continue to use the term Allah when speaking English? God has no name in Islam in the sense of humans having arbitrary names like Michael, Dave, Adnan, etc. His names are characteristics, through which we can then understand him better. And the only one that is not a characteristic, but which is used as a name is Allah.
Why this is important
The reason this bothers me is because I think the overuse of the word Allah alienates Muslims from people of other religions. They begin to associate the term Allah with Muslims and see it as a foreign term used by "others". They do not associate the word with God.
However, if Muslims used the word 'God' when speaking English or other languages, this strikes a chord with people, and helps them understand the topic at hand with something they are familiar with and have thought about. It brings to their minds images of God that they have harbored since childhood, instead of turban-wearing terrorists, wife beaters, child molesters, and whatever other stereotypes Muslims now have.You are right in your intuition. Not translating the common noun "allah" is indeed bothersome. It hides from people the universal concept of the one god regardless of what language they speak. Not clarifying this universal concept and hiding it behind a meaningless proper name is not a lot different from what 3187 is telling us to do and warning us against
Let's not exchange clarifying the god's book for buying some petty elitist attitude about Arabic.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace all,
ths
We use the word ?god? or ?allah? to refer to god not that this is god?s names? that?s all.Ayman
Thanks for that, you?re right grammar issues play a part. However some people recognise ?allah? as a common universal concept of god not just a muslim/arab deity. There are people who think allah and god are different and that ?allah? is the god for the muslims, whereas god is their deity. Allah isn?t exclusive to muslims I know that. I guess for linguistic purposes sticking to one language would be more proper and less confusing? it?s just how people become accustomed to things. -
Yes I agree, well said.
I know YOU know what you're talking about. I'm not worried about that. I'm worried about the countless Muslims walking around the world thinking that it is in fact God's exclusive name by which he must be addressed. And despite the condescending attitude of people generally towards me posing this question, I think the magnitude of this debate proved that it's actually not commonly understood or thought about.
Couldn't agree more.
I thought I'd ask a 'simple' question to introduce myself in this forum, and I got instead quite a debate, but wait till I pull out the heavy questions!
Inshallah I'll get the opportunity to learn from you and get a deeper understanding of some of the problems that have been bothering me over the years. -
Salaam,
Allah does not mean God, as this term is a personification giving gender, the female equivalent being Goddess, if you are truly in search of truth, and not simply interested in confusion of religion, (Islam is not a religion it is a Deen), you should read this explanation.
http//servantofthelight.com/content/view/129/162/
If you want further clarity, read this one
http//servantofthelight.com/content/view/7/27/
