did Qur'anists know that the prophet has mentioned them ?
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Well, I don't know her and have no wish to be like her. Not sure what makes you think I should feel that way.
Yes, I know that's why I said you will not be like her even in your dreams , so I'm not thinking , it's a fact .
Says who? You?
it was called the verse of Hijab by the Sahaba.
If it is silly, then could you please kindly show me where in the verse the word hijab is being mentioned? Must be my lack of knowledge that I can't discover it.
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}. ( 31‏this is the verse the so-called Hijab's verse, Hijab is a term of covering and what stated in the verse is covering . Hijab is an arabic term and it means "cover or veil or whithheld" so what mentioned this verse is Hijab.
Then where are you from?
fftopic
You sound just like a number of Egyptians I used to discuss faith with. Same arguments, same condescending style, same avoiding of questions adn resorting to ad hominem attacks.
well, I don't sound like them, in fact I'm different from them, because they have a problem in controling their feelings. anyways I'm not an Egyptian and sorry to say that I don't like them (no offence if there is any egyptian here).
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this is the verse the so-called Hijab's verse
I did not ask what the verse is called, I pinted out that the word "hijab" is not to be found in there.
Hijab is a term of covering and what stated in the verse is covering . Hijab is an arabic term and it means "cover or veil or whithheld"
I know what hajaba / means.
so what mentioned this verse is Hijab.
THE WORD "HIJAB" in the QURAN
"Hijab" is the term used by many Muslims women to describe their head cover that may or may not include covering their face except their eyes, and sometimes covering also one eye. The Arabic word "Hijab" can be translated into veil or yashmak. Other meanings for the word "Hijab" include, screen, cover(ing), mantle, curtain, drapes, partition, division, divider.
Can we find the word "Hijab" in the Quran??
The word "Hijab" appeared in the Quran 7 times, five of them as "Hijab" and two times as "Hijaban," these are 746, 3353, 3832, 415, 4251, 1745 & 1917.
None of these "Hijab" words are used in the Quran in reference to what the traditional Muslims call today (Hijab) as a dress code for the Muslim woman.
God knows that generations after Muhammed's death the Muslims will use the word "Hijab" to invent a dress code that He never authorized. God used the word "Hijab" ahead of them just as He used the word "Hadith" ahead of them.
Hijab in the Quran has nothing to do with the Muslim Women dress code.
http//free-minds.org/scarf
well, I don't sound like them, in fact I'm different from them, because they have a problem in controling their feelings.
rotfl
Do they? In which way? -
Salam
Al-`Irbad ibn Sariyah (may Allah be pleased with him) reported that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said ?Would any of you think, reclining on his couch, that Allah would only describe what is forbidden in the Qur?an? I tell you, by Allah, that I have warned and commanded and prohibited things that are as important as what is in the Qur?an, if not more so.? (Reported by Abu Dawud, Kitab al-Khiraj wal-imarah wal-fay'
The most shocking thing? What I find shocking about this hadith is how obviously it contradicts the Qur'an, as has been shown by others on here.
This hadith is always quoted in texts about the supposed "authority of sunnah", I've read it countless times. nope
I actually am under the opposite opinion of this hadith. As a community leader I am sure the Prophet (S) had a lot of things to say and decisions to make dealing with the situations of the time in light of the Quran. However the Quran is what is being protected by Allah, so I would think the most important commands would be in the Quran.
For example The Prophet (S) in on hadith prohibits gold for men, this supposed to be related to the verse in the Quran that says "Don't be extravagant". This hadith may be true, however it may not (as hadith is not protected by Allah on Quran) However extravagance can have different meanings in different societies in different time periods. There for the Quran can not become dated.
I can't understand why the most important commandments would be in something that is not protected by Allah. What the hadith never got collected (as the first two caliphs ordered)?
I am just throwing ideas out here, I am not a scholar in any way. Allah knows best.
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I did not ask what the verse is called, I pinted out that the word "hijab" is not to be found in there.
it is not important to find the exact word, what it matters is that the words there lead to the meanings of cover which is in turn means Hijab .
ok let's see "the predators from the strain of the big cats in the jungle are exsiting to keep balance in nature " . so without looking what they mean by the strain of the big cats, we will know that they mean tigers . I think we need to mention tigers in the sentence to understand that we're talking about tigers. brickwall
I know what hajaba / means.
You know that you take the wrong word ... is "" not "" . the word that you have stated, means something else
THE WORD "HIJAB" in the QURAN
"Hijab" is the term used by many Muslims women to describe their head cover that may or may not include covering their face except their eyes, and sometimes covering also one eye. The Arabic word "Hijab" can be translated into veil or yashmak. Other meanings for the word "Hijab" include, screen, cover(ing), mantle, curtain, drapes, partition, division, divider.
Hijab is covering everything, there is another words about head covering and or hair covering and khimar. they translated them into one world which is wrong . in arabic the covering differ but Hijab as an arabic word means covering the whole body.
Can we find the word "Hijab" in the Quran??
The word "Hijab" appeared in the Quran 7 times, five of them as "Hijab" and two times as "Hijaban," these are 746, 3353, 3832, 415, 4251, 1745 & 1917.
see above ..the first post.
None of these "Hijab" words are used in the Quran in reference to what the traditional Muslims call today (Hijab) as a dress code for the Muslim woman.
God knows that generations after Muhammed's death the Muslims will use the word "Hijab" to invent a dress code that He never authorized. God used the word "Hijab" ahead of them just as He used the word "Hadith" ahead of them.
Hijab in the Quran has nothing to do with the Muslim Women dress code.
I don't know what are you talking about?
you have said before that you're a student of truth , as I see you're following what the guys here in freemind said and wrote.http//free-minds.org/scarf
rotfl
Do they? In which way?Yes, they do, well sorry I'll not tell you in wich way because they are after all brothers in Islam
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"the predators from the strain of the big cats in the jungle are exsiting to keep balance in nature" . so without looking what they mean by the strain of the big cats, we will know that they mean tigers .
You assume this is referring to tigers. It could also mean lions or cheetahs, for example.
You know that you take the wrong word ... is "" not "" . the word that you have stated, means something else
I suggest you check a dictionary of Arabic.
Hijab as an arabic word means covering the whole body.
If God wanted the word to mean something that covers the whole body, why didn't he explicitly mention it in the verse you call the "hijab verse"?
you have said before that you're a student of truth
Where?
I would assume we are all truthseekers here in some way or another, no?
as I see you're following what the guys here in freemind said and wrote.
Erm ... no. I follow my own conclusions as to what is right. Some people here feel the same way about some issues as I do, others don't. If you haven't noticed, not everyone on this board thinks alike, there are lots of different opinions on many issues.
You have been on here longer than me, I am surprised you haven't noticed. ???
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You assume this is referring to tigers. It could also mean lions or cheetahs, for example.
Yes, you're right. My point is without giving the exact word, we can understand the meaning of the sentence and make our interpretation . the verse talks about Hijab , the end of the story.
I suggest you check a dictionary of Arabic.
humm... No thanks . I'm an Born Arabic , why I should look for what I already knew?
If God wanted the word to mean something that covers the whole body, why didn't he explicitly mention it in the verse you call the "hijab verse"?
As I said God gave you mind to make your own interpretation, and if you read the verse very well, you'll find that the verse talks about Hijab .
I didn't find the verse in english , look for the english version and go deep in inderstanding it.Where?
I would assume we are all truthseekers here in some way or another, no?
No.
Erm ... no. I follow my own conclusions as to what is right. Some people here feel the same way about some issues as I do, others don't. If you haven't noticed, not everyone on this board thinks alike, there are lots of different opinions on many issues.
You have been on here longer than me, I am surprised you haven't noticed. ???
Maybe or Maybe not.
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As I said God gave you mind to make your own interpretation, and if you read the verse very well, you'll find that the verse talks about Hijab .
I didn't find the verse in english , look for the english version and go deep in inderstanding it.Listen, bro, maybe you should make up your mind whether you want to talk about ahadeeth or hijab. If you want to debate hijab, be my guest, but let's do so in the appropriate place.
As for the verse in question -- I have read it in various languages, including Arabic, and I can not find a command to cover the head in there. If you feel that when God asks women to cover their cleavage, He actually means they should cover their head, that's fine with me. If you insist the verse leaves no room for other interpretations, I disagree though.
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Let us remember
2946 And do not argue with the people of the Scripture except in the best manner; except for those who are wicked amongst them; and say "We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is the same; to Him we submit."
I would think today this could apply to the Quranist vs the Pro-Hadith and all in between, as well as "The people of the scripture."
In Reza Aslan's book "No god but God", he says "Muslims, Christians, and Jews who seem so often to mistake religion for faith and scripture for God."
We can argue all day, but only Allah knows best and for all of us here who strive to follow and understand the will of Allah (whichever side you may be on) may Allah be pleased with our struggle and recognize that we are doing are best to submit hail to the will of Allah.
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Listen, bro, maybe you should make up your mind whether you want to talk about ahadeeth or hijab. If you want to debate hijab, be my guest, but let's do so in the appropriate place.
As for the verse in question -- I have read it in various languages, including Arabic, and I can not find a command to cover the head in there. If you feel that when God asks women to cover their cleavage, He actually means they should cover their head, that's fine with me. If you insist the verse leaves no room for other interpretations, I disagree though.
ok, I think we should back to the topic.
and about Hijab , give the link where I can debate in it.Edit to add one more thing (you didn't read Qur'an using Arabic language, I've said that for one resaon that you didn't understand what the verses said)
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Let us remember
2946 And do not argue with the people of the Scripture except in the best manner; except for those who are wicked amongst them; and say "We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is the same; to Him we submit."the problem here in this forum is the context of the verses whether you like it or not, every verse in Qur'an shaded whith a context, if you think the opposite, well why would God sent Qur'an in division other than be merciful to his prophet and detain the message?
the verse that you have chose here is talking about a situation where the people of the scriptures (the other books from Allah "Zabour, Al-Enjil, A-Thawrate" ) and to make it very easy they are the Jewish and the chritians.
I would think today this could apply to the Quranist vs the Pro-Hadith and all in between, as well as "The people of the scripture."
there is no thing called Quranist, I've proved that they are just making up things about hadith and I can debate with them in every hadith that they can choose. those people who claimed themselves Quranists are trying to ruin Islam in other words rejecting hadith will make them in a state of confusion, they can't take everything from Qur'an neither they can interpret it very well. so the side is already for Sunnah people .
In Reza Aslan's book "No god but God", he says "Muslims, Christians, and Jews who seem so often to mistake religion for faith and scripture for God."
Islam is the last religion and it's the religion of God, why we should argue with them while they got the name of their religions from their prophets and even they don't. fabricated name of religions.
We can argue all day, but only Allah knows best and for all of us here who strive to follow and understand the will of Allah (whichever side you may be on) may Allah be pleased with our struggle and recognize that we are doing are best to submit hail to the will of Allah.
I can argue all the day just to show the truth, and the truth said that Qur'anists play a good roles of ruining Islam.
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Quran 1 hadith 1
whithout hadith you'll never know how to be a Muslim .
Ah so you're saying they're equal? That God and Mohammed are equal? Sounds like shirk to me.
I can argue all the day just to show the truth, and the truth said that Qur'anists play a good roles of ruining Islam.
Yeah because we're the ones abusing our wives and daughters, chopping people's hands off for theft, chopping innocent babies' bits off and stoning pregnant women to death... just to name a few
anyways I'm not an Egyptian and sorry to say that I don't like them (no offence if there is any egyptian here).
What a disgusting racist comment.
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I can argue all the day just to show the truth, and the truth said that Qur'anists play a good roles of ruining Islam.
Islam is ruined by violent people not by peacefull people, Islam it's ruined by the hadiths wich are blasphemys and helpful to motivate violence, wich it hasn't his place into Islam...
well, I don't sound like them, in fact I'm different from them, because they have a problem in controling their feelings. anyways I'm not an Egyptian and sorry to say that I don't like them (no offence if there is any egyptian here).
Do you call yourself muslim?, If someone says that all the muslims are terrorists, is he right to generalize?
Islam doesn't promotes racism, shame on you, for your racist comment, you should love your brothers not being racist... -
I think enough has been said in this thread. I just want to say to you "TheReformer1" you are my brother in Islam, just as I consider everyone on this forum, and everyone who believes in the only one worthy of worship, the ONE God, and do there best to submit to his will. We all have our differences, it's too bad we can't see past those and embrace our similarities. Nobody can say who is and who isn't a "Muslim" for only Allah knows what is in our heart. Praise be to Allah and may Allah forever guide us closer to the truth.
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Good morning http//www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/natur/nature-smiley-007.gif
you didn't read Qur'an using Arabic language
Yes, I did.
I've said that for one resaon that you didn't understand what the verses said)
What you mean is that I did not understand the verse the way you understand it. This logic is fallacious, it would mean that any native Arabic speaker who comes to different conclusions than you do, did not read the Qur'an in Arabic.
That doesn't make sense at all.
2946 And do not argue with the people of the Scripture except in the best manner; except for those who are wicked amongst them; and say "We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is the same; to Him we submit."
Thank you for the reminder. I agree that we should not resort to insults or condescending language when debating faith (or anything, for that matter).
In Reza Aslan's book "No god but God", he says "Muslims, Christians, and Jews who seem so often to mistake religion for faith and scripture for God."
Great book! I've recommended it to many people. http//www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/grinser/grinning-smiley-003.gif
Btw., Reza Aslan says that the next big clash will not be between "Islam and the West", but between the ultra-conservative and progressive forces within Islam itself. I believe he is probably right.
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Ah so you're saying they're equal? That God and Mohammed are equal? Sounds like shirk to me.
They are equal in obedience ( who obeys the prophet obeys God as well), God in the verse has made obedience of the prophet in the beginning of obeying him. so the priority is obeying the prophet and this thing lead to obey God.
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80] He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah; but if any turn away, We have not sent thee to watch over their (evil deeds).
shirk ? lol that was funny ...do you know the meanings of the word "shirk"?
Yeah because we're the ones abusing our wives and daughters, chopping people's hands off for theft, chopping innocent babies' bits off and stoning pregnant women to death... just to name a few
Ah I was right about why Qur'anists rejecting the Hadiths, and you made me sure about that, sorry to say that you have a wrong idea about hadith, what you stated here are Liars about hadith. never a pregnant women stoned to death(this is an obvious lie), first of all the woman that you think that they have stoned here to death, they allowed her to give birth, and when she did, the man who accused her (her husband) Recanted his testimony because he remember that he had slept with her and he said to them that the baby is really his baby and after that they released the woman and they didn't stone it . Ah one more thing if she was guilty, they will take the baby and they will stone her to death but for her luck she wasn't. so again >>>>>>> misunderstanding the hadiths. and about chopping people's hands off for theft is also wrong because they didn't say "" with intensity in "" but they said "" with no intensity in "" plus the both of verb are different, so to conclude it means scratch off people's hands .
name any hadith and I'll show you where you've lost.
What a disgusting racist comment.
No, it's not (there is no Racist comment in the sentence), I don't like them for much of reasons, so it's not your business, and I said no offence to any egyptian here /if you're egyptian sorry.
why you didn't say to leyna the same thing when she made a comment about Egyptian, so I thing you want to make me in a position of the bad guy , well let me remind you I don't care about any comment about me (so release your tongue, the only thing that can take what you said is the board) -
reformer1, I recommend the following site
http//www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/thank you Wakas, I didn't find anything special in it other than a new information about Maine is in poland and squirels in Ohio(white squirels).
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Islam is ruined by violent people not by peacefull people, Islam it's ruined by the hadiths wich are blasphemys and helpful to motivate violence, wich it hasn't his place into Islam...
Hadiths never motivate any kind of voilence, they are provisions and laws and rules, look at the Dark side where voilence is just a term (you'll not understand this).
do you know why I said Qur'anists are going to ruin Islam ? I was talking to an atheist and he used this website to attack my beliefs, I've tried hard to show him the truth, but he was convinced that this website contain in it Muslims, but when he gave me the link, I realize that most of Muslims can be mutants.
and you know what he is still atheist because this website convince him that atheist is the right choice.that's because of Qur'anists.Do you call yourself muslim?, If someone says that all the muslims are terrorists, is he right to generalize?
Islam doesn't promotes racism, shame on you, for your racist comment, you should love your brothers not being racist...I don't care if he generalize or not, I can defend myself and defend the muslim communities and I'll show him the truth.
ah I think you've read the post of nsw1988, well sorry to say that she can't understand any post and she get blind when the post is mine . there is no racist in my post and I don't know how you define racisim? -
I think enough has been said in this thread. I just want to say to you "TheReformer1" you are my brother in Islam, just as I consider everyone on this forum, and everyone who believes in the only one worthy of worship, the ONE God, and do there best to submit to his will. We all have our differences, it's too bad we can't see past those and embrace our similarities. Nobody can say who is and who isn't a "Muslim" for only Allah knows what is in our heart. Praise be to Allah and may Allah forever guide us closer to the truth.
Thank you Ayyub for your nice post and I really agree with you, I'm not looking to defeat anyone here infact I'm here to show the truth because it's already there and men through history did a great efforts to bring to us the information from generation to generation, and people love study these things and prove its validity, so the question is why some bunch of Islam entered make this whole storm which in fact a storm in a tea cup ?
Peace Ayyub and really I consider everyone here as a brother in islam, but I think they don't .
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never a pregnant women stoned to death(this is an obvious lie), first of all the woman that you think that they have stoned here to death, they allowed her to give birth, and when she did, the man who accused her (her husband) Recanted his testimony because he remember that he had slept with her and he said to them that the baby is really his baby and after that they released the woman and they didn't stone it . Ah one more thing if she was guilty, they will take the baby and they will stone her to death but for her luck she wasn't. so again >>>>>>> misunderstanding the hadiths.
The point is that the Qur'an does not mention stoning as a punishment at all. And fact is that people are being stoned to death (and mutilated etc.) in the name of Islam, and that is just wrong.
(why you didn't say to leyna the same thing when she made a comment about Egyptian, so I thing you want to make me in a position of the bad guy
I did not make a negative comment about all Egyptians as you did. I was referring to a small number of them I debated with. The overwhelming majority of Egyptians I talk to in daily life do not behave like that. And I have lots of friends there who share my views on religion, alhamdullilah.
By the way, are you aware of the fact that Egypt also has a large Christian population? Just curious, because you were referring to them as "brothers" in one of your previous posts.
Thank you Ayyub for your nice post and I really agree with you, I'm not looking to defeat anyone here infact I'm here to show the truth
So what you are saying is that you are here in order to prove everyone wrong? Quite an ambitious endeavour, I'd say. wow
Why do you call yourself reformer when it is obvious that you are anything but? A bit contradictory, no? ???
