Opposite Meaning
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Peace, both of you, are you certain of what you are saying?
Badarwhy do you think?
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Peace
Thanks for the responses.
One of the reasons for my question is because I am currently studying the supposed concept of abrogation in Quran.
We find that the derivatives of "nasakha" that appear in 2106 & 2252 are usually understood in the vein of abrogation, cancellation, etc.
In 7154 & 4529, we find that the derivatives of "nasakha" are understood in the vein of something written down or preserved.
This poses a problem because canceling or annulling something is quite the opposite of preserving it.
I don't accept "nasakha" as abrogation, but would like some input on any other concepts that present themselves as contradictory in the way they are usually translated because I feel that they need to be dealt with. We must take up the challenge of any apparent contradictions in the Quran if we are truly seeking the truth.
Imraan
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Peace
Thanks for the responses.
One of the reasons for my question is because I am currently studying the supposed concept of abrogation in Quran.
We find that the derivatives of "nasakha" that appear in 2106 & 2252 are usually understood in the vein of abrogation, cancellation, etc.
In 7154 & 4529, we find that the derivatives of "nasakha" are understood in the vein of something written down or preserved.
This poses a problem because canceling or annulling something is quite the opposite of preserving it.
I don't accept "nasakha" as abrogation, but would like some input on any other concepts that present themselves as contradictory in the way they are usually translated because I feel that they need to be dealt with. We must take up the challenge of any apparent contradictions in the Quran if we are truly seeking the truth.
Imraan
One fact that needs to be remembered is that Qur'aan was revealed, as stated therein, gradually, and people were listening and knowing facts about it one after the other. And it was simulteneously being compiled as ONE UNIT after every revelation of Ayat/Surat. Natural effect is that the sequence/order of the UNIT kept changing.
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Those amongst the People of the Book and Pagans/Idolaters who have deliberately refused to accept do not love/desire it,
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that /further Soo'rat/Aaya'at of Book/something from blessing be sent upon you people from your Sustainer Lord.
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And Allah chooses/makes him exclusive for His Special Mercy whomsoever He wills.http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/temp%2002%20%202.106a.gif
We do not change the place of ayah or leave guarding it until We bring there/that place one better suited there than her or similar to that. are indeed a fabricator"-Read 16101]http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/002.02.B.083.%20G.htm
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And when We changed the place/location of an Ayah with the place/location of another Ayah,
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and Allah is well aware of what He has gradually revealed; , on replacement of location of an Ayah with the location of another Ayah they say alleging "You are indeed a fabricator".http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/016.%20An%20Nahl/016.%20F%20An%20Nahl.htm
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Peace
Thanks for the responses.
One of the reasons for my question is because I am currently studying the supposed concept of abrogation in Quran.
We find that the derivatives of "nasakha" that appear in 2106 & 2252 are usually understood in the vein of abrogation, cancellation, etc.
In 7154 & 4529, we find that the derivatives of "nasakha" are understood in the vein of something written down or preserved.
This poses a problem because canceling or annulling something is quite the opposite of preserving it.
I don't accept "nasakha" as abrogation, but would like some input on any other concepts that present themselves as contradictory in the way they are usually translated because I feel that they need to be dealt with. We must take up the challenge of any apparent contradictions in the Quran if we are truly seeking the truth.
ImraanNo, nasakha doesn't mean abrogate neither cancel, it's change the first situation by another one for decreasing the law of the first situation. like someone who has been judged to stay in jail for ever, then they decreased this punishment by limiting the period (40 years in jail or less) .
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No, nasakha doesn't mean abrogate neither cancel, it's change the first situation by another one for decreasing the law of the first situation. like someone who has been judged to stay in jail for ever, then they decreased this punishment by limiting the period (40 years in jail or less) .
Please quote some instance from the Qur'aan to make the point clearer. Thanks.
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Please quote some instance from the Qur'aan to make the point clearer. Thanks.
ok, You're welcome .
Mansoukh
{ {
"If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred," here in this verse God said that twenty of patient Muslims, will vanquish two hundred.
Nasekh which is decreasing the first situation and make it easy and acceptable .from twenty to hundred of them.
"For the present, Allah hath lightened your (task), for He knoweth that there is a weak spot in you but (even so), if there are a hundred of you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred,"
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ok, You're welcome .
Mansoukh
{ {
"If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred," here in this verse God said that twenty of patient Muslims, will vanquish two hundred.
Nasekh which is decreasing the first situation and make it easy and acceptable .from twenty to hundred of them.
"For the present, Allah hath lightened your (task), for He knoweth that there is a weak spot in you but (even so), if there are a hundred of you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred,"
Please read little bit carefully. You say after noticing weak spot Allah brought down the ratio from 1 to 10 to 1 to 2. Twenty patient men vanquish 200- ratio 1 to 10 and after spotting weak spot one hundred will vanquish only 200. The things are being almost ten times difficult.
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Please read little bit carefully. You say after noticing weak spot Allah brought down the ratio from 1 to 10 to 1 to 2. Twenty patient men vanquish 200- ratio 1 to 10 and after spotting weak spot one hundred will vanquish only 200. The things are being almost ten times difficult.
what do you mean ? I think you should read a little bit carefully .
20 men >>>>>going to fight >>>>>>>> 200 men it is hard and the result can't be even good for the 20 me.
so here came the "" .
100 men >>>> going to fight >>>>>>>>200 men . from 20 to 100 ...
which means one for two and this can be ok because God gave the Muslims the brave and the infidels the fear.
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what do you mean ? I think you should read a little bit carefully .
20 men >>>>>going to fight >>>>>>>> 200 men it is hard and the result can't be even good for the 20 me.
so here came the "" .
100 men >>>> going to fight >>>>>>>>200 men . from 20 to 100 ...
which means one for two and this can be ok because God gave the Muslims the brave and the infidels the fear.
That is good. I wanted it. On the main issue you also consider that nothing is abrogated nor is cancelled. And even here nothing got changed, two possibilities-parameters are given, since it begins with the advice to urge believers and information is given with a conditional particle.
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O you the Elevated and Chosen One , urge upon the believers to participate in the imposed war for safety of true life.
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If there be twenty coolly perseverant men of determination amongst you they will overpower/dominate upon two hundred
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and if there are such one hundred men in you they will overpower/dominate upon one thousand men from those who have refused to accept/believe because they are a people who do not understand
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Now, henceforth Allah has lightened your obligation and He has exposed/made it known that amongst you are also physically weak people
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http//therefore, if there are one hundred coolly perseverant men of determination they will overpower/dominate two hundred
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and if there are such one hundred men in you they will overpower/dominate upon two thousand men with Allah's approval.Note that reference is for weak men amongst the believers and not "weak spot in you".
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/008.%20Al%20Anfaal/008.%20A%20Al%20Anfaal-6.htm
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2144
We see the turning of thy face (for guidance to the heavens now Shall We turn thee to a Qibla that shall please thee. Turn then Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque Wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction. The people of the Book know well that that is the truth from their Lord. Nor is Allah unmindful of what they do.
2217
They ask thee concerning fighting in the Prohibited Month. Say "Fighting therein is a grave (offence);
why do you think?
Peace, because of this.
Badar
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2144
We see the turning of thy face (for guidance to the heavens now Shall We turn thee to a Qibla that shall please thee. Turn then Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque Wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction. The people of the Book know well that that is the truth from their Lord. Nor is Allah unmindful of what they do.
2217
They ask thee concerning fighting in the Prohibited Month. Say "Fighting therein is a grave (offence);
Peace, because of this.
Badar
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They people ask you about instructions regarding engaging in war in the sacred month. Tell them, "It is a serious thing,
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/002.02.D.204.%20P.htmThere was not a single man when our Universe was created and its system were set in motion. About months, system was put in like this
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Certainly the count/number of months from Allah is twelve months in the Book of Allah from the Day He created the Skies and the Earth.
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Out of those twelve four are sacred months.http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/009.%20At%20Tauba/009.%20At%20Tauba.%20A.htm
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That is good. I wanted it. On the main issue you also consider that nothing is abrogated nor is cancelled. And even here nothing got changed, two possibilities-parameters are given, since it begins with the advice to urge believers and information is given with a conditional particle.
Yes, Good >> you got my point . God just has been merciful with him and he knew that they do whatever he asked them because they also knew that God in their side, so God decreased his order and by this way there is no cancel, no abrogate. but I prefer to say that he"God" changed his first order which is still valid after all just to show us (the new generation that God is merciful and we must not get frustated ).
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Yes, Good >> you got my point . God just has been merciful with him and he knew that they do whatever he asked them because they also knew that God in their side, so God decreased his order and by this way there is no cancel, no abrogate. but I prefer to say that he"God" changed his first order which is still valid after all just to show us (the new generation that God is merciful and we must not get frustated ).
If something is 'changed' from one thing to another then the previous is not valid. I think the point here is that there were 2 'points' the second not changing the first but adding another perameter to it. Change would refer to cancelling or abrogating what was changed. IMHO
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If something is 'changed' from one thing to another then the previous is not valid. I think the point here is that there were 2 'points' the second not changing the first but adding another perameter to it. Change would refer to cancelling or abrogating what was changed. IMHO
No, it's still valid in another way >>> changing it from situation to another one less than the first situation that doesn't mean that it changed totally .
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http//dictionary.reference.com/browse/changed
http//dictionary.reference.com/browse/addedI don't need to know the meaning of the word "change" I already knew its meanings , I just gave you a closer word to understand what I mean .
look someone has already understood what I mean ah I think they are two members, I know that you like opposite everything I said that doesn't mean that you can't understand .
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I don't need to know the meaning of the word "change" I already knew its meanings , I just gave you a closer word to understand what I mean .
look someone has already understood what I mean ah I think they are two members, I know that you like opposite everything I said that doesn't mean that you can't understand .
wow you even correct the English language too, im impressed. If you read correctly Mazhar also said nothing has changed but a new parameter added
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wow you even correct the English language too, im impressed. If you read correctly Mazhar also said nothing has changed but a new parameter added
Yes, he is right nothing changed . that's what I mean but it changes in a different way (decreasing the first). I can't describe a good word in english even a native speaker of english will not find a good word to describe what I mean.
change but not change >>>>> the Arabic is "" another unique word in arabic and especially in religion it means something else .
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Yes, he is right nothing changed . that's what I mean but it changes in a different way (decreasing the first). I can't describe a good word in english even a native speaker of english will not find a good word to describe what I mean.
change but not change >>>>> the Arabic is "" another unique word in arabic and especially in religion it means something else .
the word is 'added' not 'change'. It doesnt change (even in a different way) the meaning of the first part it adds to it, it does not decrease the first.
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the word is 'added' not 'change'. It doesnt change (even in a different way) the meaning of the first part it adds to it, it does not decrease the first.
well, you shouldn't talk about something you don't know anything about it . there is points in the verse show that there is a change, so stop pretending that you know .
change is "" not "" >> you don't know these things so stop putting yourself on shame .