Categories of people in the context of islamic reform movement

Edip_Yuksel

Whether we like it or not, generalization and categorization is a human way of processing information and an evolved mechanism for survival. It is also a product of economy in language and communication. So, I suggest the following main categories (I excluded the apathetic groups) in the context of the Islamic Reform movement

Those who claim to be MUSLIMS

Promoters of reform via Quran alone, reason and wisdom (Reformists or Monotheists)
Promoters of modernism via revision, that is, ignoring the Quranic instructions on legal and social issues as Historic irrelevancies (Historic Revisionists)
Promoters of spiritual peace via religious orders and apolitical stand (Sufis)
Promoters of revival via emulation of early Muslims by ignoring the sectarian jurisprudence and re-discovering Hadith and Sunna (Salafis)
Promoters of sectarian polarization (Shiite or Sunni Radicals)
Promoters of sharia-based theocracies through further radicalization of the third and fourth positions, that is focusing on military war against the external enemies and their internal puppets (Islamist Fascists, Taliban)

Those who do NOT claim to be MUSLIMS

Friendly well-wishers (Progressive Liberals, Relativists, Isolationists)
Friendly critics and theo-engineers (Orientalists, Humanists)
Hostile critics (Evangelists)
Paranoid warmongers and war-profiteers (Neocons, Wrong-wing Evangelists, Nationalists)
Pro-genocide pro-torture Crusaders (Christianist, Armageddonist, or Zionist Fascists)

I believe that the first two categories of the Non-muslims will contribute more or less to our cause, and I do also believe that we should confront the 4th and 5th groups, whose mindset and attitude is no different than of the Islamist Fascists and Taliban.

What do you think? Would you like to help me improve this list?

savage_carrot

peace,

Promoters of modernism via revision, that is, ignoring the Quranic instructions on legal and social issues as Historic irrelevancies (Historic Revisionists)

I don't see how modernism via revision equates to ignoring the quranic instructions on legal and social issues as historic irrelevancies? Revising would be going over it and reconsidering/changing/editing etc, modernism would be using "now" to revise it according to what we think "now" so in essence it would be interpreting the quranic instructions on legal and social issues to relate to "now"/what we think "now". Factors such as external sources considered as law used to interpret previously might be a reason that revision might be a good idea later/now, or that things came up later/now that weren't included in previous interpretations but have a good basis to be included according to the text etc. Those that would ignore/drop them altogether wouldn't revise it? They might call it irrelevant/relevant to a particular time and drop out of following/discussing them (thus ignoring them) but not revise them?

shadowpuppet

This has become a human rights rights issue, at this point
...and I personally don't care, one way or another, which religion any advocate of such rights clings to -- or doesn't.

All due respect, I think it should be number one on the list.

seattletruth

Whether we like it or not, generalization and categorization is a human way of processing information and an evolved mechanism for survival. It is also a product of economy in language and communication. So, I suggest the following main categories (I excluded the apathetic groups) in the context of the Islamic Reform movement

Those who claim to be MUSLIMS

Promoters of reform via Quran alone, reason and wisdom (Reformists or Monotheists)
Promoters of modernism via revision, that is, ignoring the Quranic instructions on legal and social issues as Historic irrelevancies (Historic Revisionists)
Promoters of spiritual peace via religious orders and apolitical stand (Sufis)
Promoters of revival via emulation of early Muslims by ignoring the sectarian jurisprudence and re-discovering Hadith and Sunna (Salafis)
Promoters of sectarian polarization (Shiite or Sunni Radicals)
Promoters of sharia-based theocracies through further radicalization of the third and fourth positions, that is focusing on military war against the external enemies and their internal puppets (Islamist Fascists, Taliban)

Those who do NOT claim to be MUSLIMS

Friendly well-wishers (Progressive Liberals, Relativists, Isolationists)
Friendly critics and theo-engineers (Orientalists, Humanists)
Hostile critics (Evangelists)
Paranoid warmongers and war-profiteers (Neocons, Wrong-wing Evangelists, Nationalists)
Pro-genocide pro-torture Crusaders (Christianist, Armageddonist, or Zionist Fascists)

I believe that the first two categories of the Non-muslims will contribute more or less to our cause, and I do also believe that we should confront the 4th and 5th groups, whose mindset and attitude is no different than of the Islamist Fascists and Taliban.

What do you think? Would you like to help me improve this list?

I like your list Edip... Just a couple questions / comments. When you talk about "Historic Revisionists" what do you mean? Are you referring to people who make 20th century hadith to re-write history, or what?

Also for #4 in the non-Muslim list, you list Nationalists as the ones who are the war-mongers. Yes, this can be the case, but many there is nothing wrong with being being a Nationalist, and most of us just want peace for our nation and not to be involved in wars of conquest. The real problem is the GLOBALISTS, not the nationalists.. The thing is that the Globalist war mongers use propaganda to sell their wars as Nationalist defense, when they are truly wars of conquest.

However Globalism is the truth threat to the world, and it is the wet dream of the neocons that you correctly point the finger... But really you cannot blame just the neo-cons, because the liberals nowadays are nothing but neo-neocons. Obama is an extension of Bush. Yeah, he made a lot of lies in his campaign, but in terms of REAL POLICY, he is EXACTLY the same as Bush. He extended and expanded the wars of conquest, he extended and expanded the Patriot Act, he extended and expanded rendition and torture, drone strikes and covert operations. You really need to be pointing the finger at the ENTIRE left / right paradigm. They are all nothing but globalist war mongers, and they are playing for the same banking cartel.

I applaud the fact that you did not point the finger at the entire right wing, for the far right Libertarians like Ron Paul / Rand Paul want NO wars abroad, they think its profoundly unconstitutional. Hell, even the left wing supports the wars now that Obama is in office. It just goes to show you how the whole pro wrestling match is a sham, and Obama is simply providing the globalists with left-cover so that the status quo never changes.

Peace.

RA786

@ Edips List....

LOVE IT! ;D

@SettleTruth,

I Interpreted Edips "Historic Revisionists" to mean Those who Not only Call themselves Muslims but Also wish to Reform Islam

For example, I remember Edip brought up a good Point....It is NOT Called Reformation Islam
It is called Islamic Reformation. There is a Big Difference.

Instead of having an Islamic (deen) Reform the Chaotic World.... These people wish to Reform ISLAM by use of the Chaotic World.

I.e. Changing Islam to Fit what the Current Status Quo is in Society.
If Society says Cannibalism is OK, then Islam must Agree...and If Tomorrow Society says Cannibalism is Immoral and Wrong, then Islam must then Change to Agree.

(Thats how I interpreted that category)

I think a Good Documentary to watch is "True Life Saudi Arabia"...Its seems the Saudi Arabian youth is having a Reform battle of their Own in Saudi Arabia.
http//www.mtv.com/videos/true-life-resist-the-power-saudi-arabia/1639546/playlist.jhtml

unknownuser

I know just the guy you need to talk to, he's all about Islamic reform and he has been since day 1. He even wrote a whole book about it and he's wise beyond his your years.

There are 3 types in manifest truth

1.) People who Reason THEN reform THEN reason THEN reform again, ad infinitum - Those going forwards
2.) Those who will not exercise reason until it directly affects them - the followers
3.) Promoters of chaos, who plot THEN observe the chaos THEN plot again - those going backwards

This is the criterion from our Lord. Anything else is a name for a person that we have devised, for good and for bad. If you are subject to those 3 names by ALLAH then the names you devise will reflect that and likewise for those who are not you. This results in quite an interaction of names being hurled around. To what end?

All of your list groups must be grouped according to this if you wish for peace.

Alen

Those who claim to be MUSLIMS

What do you think? Would you like to help me improve this list?

Peace,
Respect.

Well, very sadly and extremely unfortunately, i've noticed this division among us as well, long time ago and others have too

those who follow Quran and no other book and that is all.
those who follow Quran alone like the first but believe that Rashad was the messenger of God or of the covenant and that 128, 129 of chapter 9 are satanic.

We really need to stop creating groups and destroy barriers not friendship in order to unite. I've been saying it for some time now ....

Peace.

RA786

Or how about this....

Those Who believe in Quran Alone, and Follow the Quran according to how it is Written using the Arabic Words that are there.
(For example, In the Quran it gives Instructions on washing your hands, face, feet, etc)....
Those who believe in the Quran alone (just like the 1st) but then They follow the Quran by using some sort of Complex Classical Arabic Authentic Word Machine where "Wash your face and Feet" Actually Means "Love Allah by doing Charity."

Or Instead of "Do not have sex on menstruation".....That actually means "Work hard by doing what you want".

So basically, This Group to me is the Most confusing as they have not created their own Quran Translation yet. Apparently their Translations are SO different, that Over the Course of 1,500 years....No one has ever been able to make a Translation like theirs.

Alen

Peace,
Respect.

Now, let's see if we can destroy the barriers that have been made over the years, decades and centuries and let's see if we can unite.
I've been trying this with several sunnis in London but i'm just not getting there. We definetely need an impartial judge. God knows best.

Peace.

MUNZIR_ALI

Whether we like it or not, generalization and categorization is a human way of processing information and an evolved mechanism for survival. It is also a product of economy in language and communication. So, I suggest the following main categories (I excluded the apathetic groups) in the context of the Islamic Reform movement

Those who claim to be MUSLIMS

Promoters of reform via Quran alone, reason and wisdom (Reformists or Monotheists)
Promoters of modernism via revision, that is, ignoring the Quranic instructions on legal and social issues as Historic irrelevancies (Historic Revisionists)
Promoters of spiritual peace via religious orders and apolitical stand (Sufis)
Promoters of revival via emulation of early Muslims by ignoring the sectarian jurisprudence and re-discovering Hadith and Sunna (Salafis)
Promoters of sectarian polarization (Shiite or Sunni Radicals)
Promoters of sharia-based theocracies through further radicalization of the third and fourth positions, that is focusing on military war against the external enemies and their internal puppets (Islamist Fascists, Taliban)

Those who do NOT claim to be MUSLIMS

Friendly well-wishers (Progressive Liberals, Relativists, Isolationists)
Friendly critics and theo-engineers (Orientalists, Humanists)
Hostile critics (Evangelists)
Paranoid warmongers and war-profiteers (Neocons, Wrong-wing Evangelists, Nationalists)
Pro-genocide pro-torture Crusaders (Christianist, Armageddonist, or Zionist Fascists)

I believe that the first two categories of the Non-muslims will contribute more or less to our cause, and I do also believe that we should confront the 4th and 5th groups, whose mindset and attitude is no different than of the Islamist Fascists and Taliban.

What do you think? Would you like to help me improve this list?

THis is the best list. it's fantastic in my opinion.

seattletruth

Or how about this....

Those who believe in the Quran alone (just like the 1st) but then They follow the Quran by using some sort of Complex Classical Arabic Authentic Word Machine where "Wash your face and Feet" Actually Means "Love Allah by doing Charity."

Or Instead of "Do not have sex on menstruation".....That actually means "Work hard by doing what you want".

LOL or like the guy on this forum that takes 954 where God says that humans were created in the perfect form, to mean that humans were created in an imperfect form, and we need to cut part of a baby's penis off permanently, or else it will rot off, cause God is an incompetent designer.

AlFajr

Those who believe in the Quran alone (just like the 1st) but then They follow the Quran by using some sort of Complex Classical Arabic Authentic Word Machine where "Wash your face and Feet" Actually Means "Love Allah by doing Charity."

You'll notice that no. 2 rarely cross-reference verses or use basic sense. When a verse is clear and they turn it into Gibberish its pretty easy to spot.