Is Prophet Muhammad?s duty to deliver Quran only?: No
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Here is some example of correct understanding of verses
- Preservation five daily salat time, way to conduct them, ?.
- Ramadan ~30 days fasting, breakfast right after sunset,?..
- Hajj when to perform them and how
- Pre-wash for salat
- Salat during war
- And many more
The correct understanding has been preserved for us. We do them just the way Prophet Muhammad did them.
I replied only because i don't want you to misunderstand my previous post.
I do not agree with your point #1, #2, and probably #3 and #5 as well, since i have yet to see what you mean by "Hajj" and "Salat during war". The points being
"five daily salat"
"Ramadan ~ fasting"Please don't take them too lightly. There is so much more in Al-Salaat and Al-Siyaam.
Peace
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Please speak only for yourself. Thanks. peace
I have no issue whatsoever with people following conjecture if they think it helps them. I do have an issue with people claiming, like you do, that this is what everyone is doing or should do.
Peace Leyna,
I gave the correct understanding of some verses. If you do not agree then you are not included in the ?us?.
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Where do we find these correct understandings preserved?
In the ahadeeth of course. )
Am I the only one getting tired of reading arguments like this? I came here because I am not interested anymore in this sort of discussion, because I would like to engage in an interesting and spiritually enlightening exchange of thoughts, because I am sick and tired of the same old same old Sunni arguments, the arrogance and the constant bullying, insulting and game playing if you don't follow their understanding.
It's irritating and tiresome that exactly those kinds of discussions seem to take over the board recently.
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So the verses in Quran referring to these are all wrong and no one could understand them so they needed to be 'corrected'?
Where do we find these correct understandings preserved?
How do you do # 4?
Peace Ayisha,
Here is my logic for acquiring the correct salat
- The Quran is preserved
- The salat rite is preserved because Quran is preserved
- We learn salat before we are able to read the Quran
- Allah teaches us the salat first
- We see our parents, relatives, neighbor? perform salat when we are baby
- When we are able to walk our parents take us to mosque and we observed salat
- By age five we know how to perform salat, its timing??yet we don?t read book
- This is how Allah preserved the salat (as practiced by Prophet Muhammad) for us
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In the ahadeeth of course. )
Am I the only one getting tired of reading arguments like this? I came here because I am not interested anymore in this sort of discussion, because I would like to engage in an interesting and spiritually enlightening exchange of thoughts, because I am sick and tired of the same old same old Sunni arguments, the arrogance and the constant bullying, insulting and game playing if you don't follow their understanding.
It's irritating and tiresome that exactly those kinds of discussions seem to take over the board recently.
http//www.imagebanana.com/img/q6owvuis/033102bad_1_prv.gif
2563 - The worshipers of the Most Gracious are those who tread the earth gently, and when the ignorant speak to them, they only utter peace.
Peace!
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Here is my logic for acquiring the correct salat
- The Quran is preserved
- The salat rite is preserved because Quran is preserved
- We learn salat before we are able to read the Quran
- Allah teaches us the salat first
- We see our parents, relatives, neighbor? perform salat when we are baby
- When we are able to walk our parents take us to mosque and we observed salat
- By age five we know how to perform salat, its timing??yet we don?t read book
- This is how Allah preserved the salat (as practiced by Prophet Muhammad) for us
Again ? I suggest you speak for yourself only. Not everyone on here has observed their parents etc. performing salat from an early age on. And I am sure that among those who did, not everyone observed the very same thing, because there are differences in how people perform it, according to local traditions, which school of jurisprudence they adhere to and so on and so forth.
So how is a convert supposed to learn ritual prayer? Who is he supposed to believe, which technique is he supposed to follow? If the convert is a woman, should she cover her head during prayer as the majority of born Muslims do, despite the fact that there is nothing in the Qur'an telling us that this is an obligation?
Your argument above is completely illogical. You are basically saying we should follow some dubious traditions because that's what people have been doing for ages. It's exactly what the Qur'an advises us against.
The fact is, they have said "We found our fathers following a certain way, and we are following in their footsteps."
And similarly, We did not send a warner to a town, except its carefree ones said "We found our fathers following a certain way, and we are being guided in their footsteps."
He said "What if I brought to you better a guidance than what you found your fathers upon?
They said "We are disbelievers in that with which you have been sent."
Consequently, We took revenge upon them. So see how was the consequences of the deniers.
4323?25
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Peace Ayisha,
Here is my logic for acquiring the correct salat
- The Quran is preserved
- The salat rite is preserved because Quran is preserved
- We learn salat before we are able to read the Quran
- Allah teaches us the salat first
- We see our parents, relatives, neighbor? perform salat when we are baby
- When we are able to walk our parents take us to mosque and we observed salat
- By age five we know how to perform salat, its timing??yet we don?t read book
- This is how Allah preserved the salat (as practiced by Prophet Muhammad) for us
ok, so basically you follow what your fathers followed even though they may follow nothing but conjecture and you are taught not to questions it.
I asked about #4 though, this was not #4
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Yes, but they have been trying so hard not to actually say that
As I said ? game playing. nope
The purpose of their posts is simply to have people going around in circles wasting their time on ridiculous arguments. It's their way of trying to block serious and intelligent discussions.
ignore ignore ignoreI admire your energy, intelligence, knowledge and the way you present your arguments, Ayisha, but I also wonder why you bother. It's clear this is never going to get anywhere.
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It was transmitted after he died? why not while he was alive?
No the transmission occurred while he was alive. Perhaps you are unaware of the history and the facts.
Prophet Muhammad tried to establish Allah system in Mecca but failed.
He established Allah?s system in Medina (Yatrib). Then this system was transmitted to Mecca, neighboring town, neighboring country, and afterward to Spain and so on.
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Way Finder
This is pure conjecture... The inscription is clearly written in ancient arabic therefore it was common to the arabs... Similar to the name Allah itself... Arabs knew all these... the problem was their focus... and association to these names... this is what Muhammad came to change and rectify. The name Ar-Rahman is even present is some pre-islamic poetry in sabaen. Moreover, the name was also very well known among the people of the Book. So just because one or two men seems to believe it otherwise does not change this fact. From the inscription itself... It suggests that Ar-Rahman was even a deity in the pre-islamic arabia since the writing has been made in the name of Ar-Rahman.
So spare us with bogus claims and conjecture.
Conjecture? are you sure it is Conjecture? You are proving that despite being well versed in Arabic You have no understanding of Quran
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And when it is said unto them Prostrate to al-Rahmn! they say And what is al-Rahmn? Are we to prostrate to whatever thou biddest us? And it increaseth aversion in them.
Will you not believe then?
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Leyna
Am I the only one getting tired of reading arguments like this? I came here because I am not interested anymore in this sort of discussion, because I would like to engage in an interesting and spiritually enlightening exchange of thoughts, because I am sick and tired of the same old same old Sunni arguments, the arrogance and the constant bullying, insulting and game playing if you don't follow their understanding.
It's irritating and tiresome that exactly those kinds of discussions seem to take over the board recently.
Just don't pretend to be so scholarly.
No one here has presented Hadith or even called for it as a support for any argument.
It is only you! people here have read your discussions too, just take a look at those before commenting on others. -
As I said ? game playing. nope
The purpose of their posts is simply to have people going around in circles wasting their time on ridiculous arguments. It's their way of trying to block serious and intelligent discussions.
ignore ignore ignore
Yes I agree, but here it doesnt stop the intelligent discussions, they are still going on and they are gret to learn and read while these circular guys keep chasing their tails.I admire your energy, intelligence, knowledge and the way you present your arguments, Ayisha, but I also wonder why you bother. It's clear this is never going to get anywhere.
It does go somewhere, it exposes them for who and what they are whereas they would normally be inserting more poison into intelligent conversations. But yes it is tiring, but you know me, if I see BS I have to tread in it and splatter them with it. jedi And if I can get just one person to see the blatant shirk and total contradictions of a certain translation then I'm happy peace
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No the transmission occurred while he was alive. Perhaps you are unaware of the history and the facts.
Prophet Muhammad tried to establish Allah system in Mecca but failed.
He established Allah?s system in Medina (Yatrib). Then this system was transmitted to Mecca, neighboring town, neighboring country, and afterward to Spain and so on.
Thats not what you first said though.
"For example, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) implementation of Allah?s system on earth can be transmitted. In fact, this is what has happened after he died. Then the system got corrupted
so, how about #4
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Rajah
So how many days you fast?
How many times you pray daily?Ayisha
Is that your business?
It is none of my business dear Ash, but if you answer this will help me in my argument, that the times you pray and the days you fast are different from many other people's understanding, here and world over.
Because you said That all the Ayats are already explained, then why we have many different understandings for how many times we have to pray? or even pray or not in the first place, will you give it a moment of thought to this.Those who think that Allah had given Wisdom to Messengers as per Ayats mentioned above are very confident that it is
Five times a day, they all repeat all say it 5 times a day, but I see that so called Quran aloners are shifting through one to another, they are CONFUSED.It is not that I am supporting Hadith, I just want your serious comments on these.
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Yes I agree, but here it doesnt stop the intelligent discussions, they are still going on and they are gret to learn and read while these circular guys keep chasing their tails.
Yeah, I see your point. I remember that discussing things with ignorant idiots (speaking in general, not referring to anyone on this board) would help me in a strange way to become more secure of my own point of view. When being forced to present your opinion in a logical manner and back it up with facts, you have to research things again, put your thoughts and findings into words etc., and that can indeed be helpful.
But yes it is tiring, but you know me, if I see BS I have to tread in it and splatter them with it. jedi And if I can get just one person to see the blatant shirk and total contradictions of a certain translation then I'm happy peace
Hey, I wasn't telling you to stop. peace Just saying my opinion. It seems to me that whenever I look at this board recently, there is one of those dudes going on and on about the same thing. I agree that they are just exposing themselves, and it surprises me that they don't seem to be embarrassed about that, but, hey, as long as you're enjoying yourself (which you obviously are), that's fine.
I guess I am just too exhausted at the moment, so I feel I have no time or energy for this sort of thing.