9/11 Burning Of Quran Must Go On!
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Peace Alen,
If you read the news I linked above, the burning of the Book of Truth was still carried out but by different reverends and in Tennessee, not Florida.
Peace.
tauhid101.Peace,
Respect.I'm not worried.
This won't change anything.
In fact, it might - God knows best - increase the number of thsoe people who will be interested in reading The Qur'an but not because someone wanted to burn it, because the curiosity has enver been so big as it is these days.When ever I mention that hijab is not Islamic let alone compulsory and similar examples and then I say that I got proof from The Qur'an, I get the attention from bunch of people. Imagine if I dedicated more enegry and will to this.
God bless you,
Peace.
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The burning of Quran must happen on 9/11 by the Christians, so the veil shall be removed, the wolf shall come out of the lambs cloths. The World shall know that not only Muslims are fanatics and Extremists.
Rajaah.. the world already knew that.. nearly most of sectarian folks (Sunnis, SHiites, Catholics, JW, whatever) are indeed lunatics, stupid, fanatics and extremists. But the good thing is that those sectarian lunatics had a tendency to kill each other! Which is good!
A self-elimination! The world will definitely be a better world without their presencesthough it is Man made? Can Muslims burn Bible in their countries?
Yes of course why not?? Muslims can burn any book they wanted (Quran, Bible, Torah, Newsweek, Time Magazine) in the good ol' USA! As long as they own the book that is! and not somebody else's book.
Whatever the case, I think we shall support the burning of Quranic copies, so the truth may prevail.
I neither support or against it.. I just think that it is a stupid thing to do...
A group of lunatics doing stupid things... doesn't deserves much attention at all.Salam / Peace
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Salaam Jaffar
I neither support or against it.. I just think that it is a stupid thing to do...
A group of lunatics doing stupid things... doesn't deserves much attention at all.Salam / Peace
What made TJ stop burning the Quran after all that stunt?
Yes it is stupid thing, but in this way many ignorant Europeans who only think that there are fanatics in Muslims can see the other side of coin, any way it went on if not through Terry Jones, through another fanatic.
I just want the real side of these Christians come out, they are hiding under the umbrella of civilized society but in their minds Many Many out there are as fanatics as may be Some Muslims.Remember George Bush Junior calling the war on Iraq and Iran as Crusades, and Majority of the Good OL American society supporting him.
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Rajaah.. the world already knew that.. nearly most of sectarian folks (Sunnis, SHiites, Catholics, JW, whatever) are indeed lunatics, stupid, fanatics and extremists. But the good thing is that those sectarian lunatics had a tendency to kill each other! Which is good!
A self-elimination! The world will definitely be a better world without their presences
Yes of course why not?? Muslims can burn any book they wanted (Quran, Bible, Torah, Newsweek, Time Magazine) in the good ol' USA! As long as they own the book that is! and not somebody else's book.I neither support or against it.. I just think that it is a stupid thing to do...
A group of lunatics doing stupid things... doesn't deserves much attention at all.Salam / Peace
Peace,
Respect.I disagree.
I think they shouldn't kill themselves out, self-elimination would be wrong, why not set an example, a good exmaple, so that they can see what they can be and maybe they will join us in goodness, God willing, you never know. God knows best.Let's not call names, bro.
Qur'an 4911.Peace. handshake
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Alen
I disagree.
I think they shouldn't kill themselves out, self-elimination would be wrong, why not set an example, a good exmaple, so that they can see what they can be and maybe they will join us in goodness, God willing, you never know. God knows best.Being good will not do. There have been numerous good examples in shape of many good people, but were they able to stop extremism. Look at Gandhi's the tolerance doctrine, how the Britons teared it apart at Jallanwala garden and at various occasions. Did tolerance earned you Bosnia? they had to fought the evil with IROn hands!
and the question it seems to all you have closed your ears to, Why did Terry Jones not burned Quran? -
Alen
Being good will not do. There have been numerous good examples in shape of many good people, but were they able to stop extremism. Look at Gandhi's the tolerance doctrine, how the Britons teared it apart at Jallanwala garden and at various occasions. Did tolerance earned you Bosnia? they had to fought the evil with IROn hands!
and the question it seems to all you have closed your ears to, Why did Terry Jones not burned Quran?Peace,
Respect.I guess we should fight him academically.
How about this
How about we invite him for a talk?
How about we start with this website> http//www.evilbible.com/Murder.htmI mean, I respect all people but the author of this website has taken a little bit too far. Nevertheless, it's a start.
The contradictions in The Bible were approached today at Speaker's Corner in the Hyde Park, London, UK by me and few others.
We defeated several chrsitians and they decided to go home. They were also speechless regarding the trinity and the crucifixion.God know sbest.
Peace. eat -
Now if the people who did what was highlighted in bold are'nt extremists then what should we call them then ???
i said we shouldnt loosely call people extreme, i dont have a problem with saying it when its obvious, but if its said all the time it looses all meaning and i'd never class what alen was accused of saying in the same group as people burning and smearing faeces feces on the quran.
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i said we shouldnt loosely call people extreme, i dont have a problem with saying it when its obvious, but if its said all the time it looses all meaning and i'd never class what alen was accused of saying in the same group as people burning and smearing faeces feces on the quran.
In terms of Sunni's and Shia's, who refer to hadith which as we all know on this forum have pretty extremist views on women,apostacy,forced conversion etc, the word "extremist" is rightly and not loosley applicable to them.
Regrading the burning of The Qur'an.
They have done worse things to The Book in Guantanamo Jail, yes? Would you agree to this? We have already witnessed what has been done to Qur'an. I witness every sunday, almost, what non-muslims say about Qur'an, Islam and muslims. If I had a cmarea, I'd bring evidence but maybe later, God willing.
nevertheless, someone will burn The Qur'an and then some sunni will react. God forbid should another expalosion happen but we all know that there is something called cause and effect.Well of course I would not agree with it, but thats not the point. The point is the Islamaphobic idiots are going to do it anyway whether we agree with it or not.
I'm not worried.
This won't change anything.
In fact, it might - God knows best - increase the number of thsoe people who will be interested in reading The Qur'an but not because someone wanted to burn it, because the curiosity has enver been so big as it is these days.You've just made the point that I was trying to make from the start.
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george
In terms of Sunni's and Shia's, who refer to hadith which as we all know on this forum have pretty extremist views on women,apostacy,forced conversion etc, the word "extremist" is rightly and not loosley applicable to them.
You seem to me a half baked Quranist! can you please quote some of the Hadith you are mentioning?
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george
You seem to me a half baked Quranist! can you please quote some of the Hadith you are mentioning?Sahih Bukhary 8/102 and Hanbel 4/86
"If a monkey, a black dog or a woman passes infront of a praying person, his
prayer is nullified."Sahih Bukhary 76/53
"Bad omen is in the woman, the horse and the home."Translation of Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3371
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa'id al Khadri (Allah he pleased with him) O Abu Sa'id, did
you hear Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) mentioning al-'azl? He said Yes,
and added We went out with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) on the
expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we
desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same
time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with
them but by observing 'azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of
semen to avoid-conception). But we said We are doing an act whereas Allah's
Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah's Messenger (may peace
be upon him), and he said It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to
be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born."The prophet gave permission to kill children and women in war" (Bukhari, Jihad/146; Abu Dawud
113).Sahih Muslim (4194) ?Abdullah ibn Abbas reported that ?Umar ibn Al- Khattab sat on
the pulpit of Allah?s Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said Verily Allah sent
Muhammad (may peace be upon him) with truth and He sent down the Book upon him,
and the verse of stoning was included in what was sent down to him. We recited it,
retained it in our memory and understood it. Allah?s Messenger (may peace be upon
him) awarded the punishment of stoning to death (to the married adulterer and
adulteress) and, after him, we also awarded the punishment of stoning. I am afraid that,
with the lapse of time, the people (may forget it) and may say We do not find the
punishment of stoning in the Book of Allah, and thus go astray by abandoning this duty
prescribed by Allah. Stoning is a duty laid down in Allah?s Book for married men and
women who commit adultery when proof is established, or if there is pregnancy." (Sahih
Muslim, Vol. III, p. 912, #4194)"A man from the tribe of Banu Aslam came to the Prophet and informed him that he had committed
illegal sexual intercourse and he bore witness four times against himself. The Prophet ordered him to be
stoned to death as he was married." (Bukhari, hadith 6814)"The hell will be filled with mostly women; women are deficient in intelligence and religion (Muslim,
Iman 34/132; Muslim, Iydayn 4; Tirmizi, Iman 6/2613; Ibn Majah, Fitan 19/4003; Ahmad b. Hanbal,
Musnad, II/373-374, II/318; Abu Dawud, Sunna 15/4679; Nasai, Iydayn 19).You seem to me to be a half arsed hadith follower if you need me a "Quranist" to quote the hadith which you "claim" to be following.
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Peace,
Respect.I'm not worried.
This won't change anything.
In fact, it might - God knows best - increase the number of thsoe people who will be interested in reading The Qur'an but not because someone wanted to burn it, because the curiosity has enver been so big as it is these days.Agree, it changes nothing about Islam and makes people want to look. I cannot for the life of me understand a so called Muslim actually shouting about burning the Quran MUST go on though! Whether it happened or not is irrelevant as the whole media coverage will make some look at it just to see 'why' some people feel such hate towards a book.
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george
You seem to me to be a half arsed hadith follower if you need me a "Quranist" to quote the hadith which you "claim" to be following.
i was not able to comprehend what you meant, but let me ask you do you know Arabic? if yes have you read the exact words for it in Arabic? if not how can you make such a big claim? You should verify it first. In translating Quran which is preserved by Allah, we have infinite ideas floating around, how could you be so sure about your claim if you have not read it in its original language.
george
Sahih Bukhary 8/102 and Hanbel 4/86
"If a monkey, a black dog or a woman passes infront of a praying person, his
prayer is nullified."Sahih Bukhary 76/53
"Bad omen is in the woman, the horse and the home."I have read slightly different from what you have...
the sixth volume of Imam Ahmad Ibn Hambal?s Musnad presents the true picture in this regard
Abu-Hassan reports that two people came to A?ishah and said to her that Abu Hurayrah narrates that the Prophet used to say that bad luck is to be found only in women, horses and houses. At this A?ishah replied By the God who revealed the Qur?an to the Prophet! The Prophet never said this; what he did say was that the People of the Jahilliyyah hold this opinion?I am ready to change my point of view, if you can show me with concrete evidence, that you know Arabic, understand "Hadith" and Why are you inclined towards the view that is against Quran, with details.
Thanks.
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george
i was not able to comprehend what you meant, but let me ask you do you know Arabic? if yes have you read the exact words for it in Arabic? if not how can you make such a big claim? You should verify it first. In translating Quran which is preserved by Allah, we have infinite ideas floating around, how could you be so sure about your claim if you have not read it in its original language.First of all if you are not able to comprehend what I meant then thats you own business, second I do not have to have read the exact words of those hadith in arabic to know that hadith goes against the Quran.
I may not know arabic but I do know what hadith looks like in arabic
750 ) )
(Quran verse 7750) In what other HADITH, then, will they, after this (Quran),
believe?george
I have read slightly different from what you have...Then provide your evidence of the differences......
I am ready to change my point of view, if you can show me with concrete evidence, that you know Arabic, understand "Hadith" and Why are you inclined towards the view that is against Quran, with details.
Thanks.
Oh please... don't give me that tripe about I can only know Arabic to understand Quran and to understand that hadith goes against Quran, otherwise why do we get so many arabic speaking so-called scholars all saying that they need "the hadith to explain the Quran" even though that the Quran is originally written in the same arabic that they are using to recite from it.
I do not need to know arabic to understand the Quran nor do I need to know arabic to know what hadith looks like in that language or that it goes against Quran.Here see for youself http//kushite.webs.com/hadiythexposed.htm
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george
First of all if you are not able to comprehend what I meant then thats you own business, second I do not have to have read the exact words of those hadith in arabic to know that hadith goes against the Quran.
Firstly, No that is not my business, you must be clear specially when bringing forward an allegation.
Secondly you are already not following Quran by not verifying and depending on some anti Islamic sites for those Hadiths.I may not know arabic but I do know what hadith looks like in arabic
750 ) )
(Quran verse 7750) In what other HADITH, then, will they, after this (Quran),
believe?Typical Quranist reply!
You just mentioned a "Hadith" without verifying for yourself and trying to understand it, merely depending upon the meanings or translations of "some one". You are following "Hadith" of some one instead of "hadith" of Allah.
You are not following the above verse of QURAN , -
george
Firstly, No that is not my business, you must be clear specially when bringing forward an allegation.
Secondly you are already not following Quran by not verifying and depending on some anti Islamic sites for those Hadiths.And you still have'nt provided any evidence that there are differences from the hadiths I provided from "the way that you read them" after making such an allegation.
Typical Quranist reply!
You just mentioned a "Hadith" without verifying for yourself and trying to understand it, merely depending upon the meanings or translations of "some one". You are following "Hadith" of some one instead of "hadith" of Allah.
You are not following the above verse of QURAN ,Typical Hadith follower reply to dismiss the evidence I provided in the link as " anti-islamic websites" even though the site IS Islamic becuase it exposes your shirk and that you are not following the HADITH OF ALLAH, but the man made fabricated hadiths, of Abu, Hurraira, Muslim, Bukhari etc.
What anti-islamic website would glorify the Quran instead of bashing it, if it was indeed anti-islamic ??? )
You dismiss the actual arabic translation as "merely depending on the translations of some one" but yet you are depending on the "translations" of the Quran from hadith followers like Pickthall, Ali and others who have left out the word hadith from the English transilation deliberatley in order justify their following of hadith.
I have veryfied for myself that the word HADITH does appear in the original arabic becuase I have an ARABIC (with english transilation)version of the Quran but the word hadith is not in the english translation right next to it. hmmSince you know so much more arabic then me then what is the transilation of this word ???
Also I am still waiting for your evidence of "your" transilation of those hadiths that I posted from
"the way that you read them" ??? ) -
george
Typical Hadith follower reply to dismiss the evidence I provided in the link as " anti-islamic websites" even though the site IS Islamic becuase it exposes your shirk and that you are not following the HADITH OF ALLAH, but the man made fabricated hadiths, of Abu, Hurraira, Muslim, Bukhari etc.Yet confirming again that there is only a slight difference between Wahabis and Quranists.
Yet bringing forward allegations before verifying them, Do you know what is meaning of Shirk? How do I committed shirk?
How do you know that I am following Fabricated Hadith? How do you know those Hadith are fabricated, since you have not verified them, just copied it from anti Islamic sites.
Yet proving that you do not understand an iota of what you post, you do not read what others say? The link you mentioned was about the word "Hadith" did you also copied these "Hadiths" from that site?You dismiss the actual arabic translation as "merely depending on the translations of some one" but yet you are depending on the "translations" of the Quran from hadith followers like Pickthall, Ali and others who have left out the word hadith from the English transilation deliberatley in order justify their following of hadith
Yet an another allegation without verifying.
george
Since you know so much more arabic then me then what is the transilation of this word
it means, speech/ report/ which is new from amongst things
george
Also I am still waiting for your evidence of "your" transilation of those hadiths that I posted from
"the way that you read themhmmmm, I repeat it again without knowing Arabic you cannot get the correct meaning of any "Hadith" we have seen that in the case of Quran.
george"The hell will be filled with mostly women; women are deficient in intelligence and religion (Muslim,
Iman 34/132; Muslim, Iydayn 4; Tirmizi, Iman 6/2613; Ibn Majah, Fitan 19/4003; Ahmad b. Hanbal,
Musnad, II/373-374, II/318; Abu Dawud, Sunna 15/4679; Nasai, Iydayn 19).Muhammad Ali Hoonoti
The Quran is always fully articulate in vocabulary and style. Everything in the Quran is the exact saying of Allah. The Hadith is different in punctuality of language, because some Hadiths one related by the companions of the Prophet (SAAWS), they could have a different synonym or a different additional or omitted conjunction or article. This is what is called in the Hadith terminology "narration by meaning".By G.F HADDAD
The problem here is the misconception about the meaning. Even the plainest statement can become completely incoherent on the tongue of a retarded person or a pathological liar. The hadith here uses two figures of speech the first is hyperbole (mubalagha) meaning exaggeration in the words ?even a prudent, sensible man might be led astray by some of you? i.e. a fortiori an ordinary man. The second figure is synechdoche (majaz mursal) consisting in using the whole for the part intelligence to mean the specific legal testimony of a woman, and religion to mean the prayer and fast at the time of menses.
In the full version of the hadith the Prophet also orders the women to ask forgiveness and desist from frequently cursing their husbands. All this was spoken at a time of(1) the impending departure of the latter on jihad
(2) the impending departure of the Prophet from this world and
(3) the fact that ?Cursing the believer is like killing him.?The anti Islamic sites will always chose what suites them and half brains will follow them.
Karim
"Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men." (Sahih reported by Abu-Dawud (RA) The Prophet of Islam (peace be upon him) said, He said, ?Yes, for women are the twin halves of men.? (Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 113; Ahmad, 25663. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi)All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any
superiority over an Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any superiority over white
except by piety and good action. Learn that every Muslim is a brother to every Muslim and that the Muslims
constitute one brotherhood. Nothing shall be legitimate to a Muslim which belongs to a fellow Muslim unless it
was given freely and willingly. Do not, therefore, do injustice to yourselves. (Hafiz Ibn Hibban reported in al-Sahih
(11/203/#4862) via his isnad, from Fadalah ibn `Ubayd (Allah be pleased with him)Karim
May I add here that the translation of this Hadith as quoted by you is wrong, because it splits the relevant sentence and gives the Prophet's words in such a way that they appear to make a statement of fact. This is wrong, as I have explained.As for the other part, a full translation of it goes as follows ??I have seen hell and I have never seen any thing more horrific than what I saw then. I also saw that the majority of its dwellers are women. ? They asked ?On what grounds, Messenger of God? He said ?By their denial.? They said ?Their denial of God?? He answered ?No. Their denial of their spouses and their denial of kindness. You may be kind to one of them all the time, but when she finds fault with you she says I have never received any kindness from you.
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george
Typical Hadith follower reply to dismiss the evidence I provided in the link as " anti-islamic websites" even though the site IS Islamic becuase it exposes your shirk and that you are not following the HADITH OF ALLAH, but the man made fabricated hadiths, of Abu, Hurraira, Muslim, Bukhari etc.Yet confirming again that there is only a slight difference between Wahabis and Quranists.
rotfl rotfl
How do you know that I am following Fabricated Hadith? How do you know those Hadith are fabricated, since you have not verified them, just copied it from anti Islamic sites.
Such are the Signs of Allah, which We rehearse to thee in Truth; then in what HADITH will they believe after Allah and His Signs? 45.6
Whoevers hadith they are, they are not hadith of Allah
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george
Yet confirming again that there is only a slight difference between Wahabis and Quranists.
Yet bringing forward allegations before verifying them, Do you know what is meaning of Shirk? How do I committed shirk?
How do you know that I am following Fabricated Hadith? How do you know those Hadith are fabricated, since you have not verified them, just copied it from anti Islamic sites.
Yet proving that you do not understand an iota of what you post, you do not read what others say? The link you mentioned was about the word "Hadith" did you also copied these "Hadiths" from that site?Yet an another allegation without verifying.
Yet again confirming that you are an hadith follower by saying that link I provided was from an "anti-islamic" website becuase it slags off hadith, when you have'nt provided any proof to back up your claims.
Shirk=Ascribing partners to GOD/mentioning muhammeds or Jesus's name alongside GODS name in prayer/Idol Whorship/Following another source of guidence (hadith) not authorised by GOD.
If you do any of that YOU are commiting shirk.
Also well duh... of course it was about the word hadith as it is shown in the arabic version of the Quran and the fact that allmost everytime it is mentioned in the Quran it is condemend and yet proving that you do not understand an iota of what YOU post.The is a slightly bigger difference to wahabbis and "Quranists"
Wahabis follow fabricated hadith which contradicts the Quran and itself.
"Quranists" only follow the Quran.george
it means, speech/ report/ which is new from amongst thingsYou left out narration.
george
hmmmm, I repeat it again without knowing Arabic you cannot get the correct meaning of any "Hadith" we have seen that in the case of Quran.I repeat again you do not have to Arabic to understand the Quran otherwise why are there Arabic speaking Islamic scholars who claim that to "you need the hadith to explain the Quran" even though they speak the same Arabic that the Quran was originally written in ???
george
Muhammad Ali Hoonoti
The Quran is always fully articulate in vocabulary and style. Everything in the Quran is the exact saying of Allah. The Hadith is different in punctuality of language, because some Hadiths one related by the companions of the Prophet (SAAWS), they could have a different synonym or a different additional or omitted conjunction or article. This is what is called in the Hadith terminology "narration by meaning".By G.F HADDAD
The problem here is the misconception about the meaning. Even the plainest statement can become completely incoherent on the tongue of a retarded person or a pathological liar. The hadith here uses two figures of speech the first is hyperbole (mubalagha) meaning exaggeration in the words ?even a prudent, sensible man might be led astray by some of you? i.e. a fortiori an ordinary man. The second figure is synechdoche (majaz mursal) consisting in using the whole for the part intelligence to mean the specific legal testimony of a woman, and religion to mean the prayer and fast at the time of menses.
In the full version of the hadith the Prophet also orders the women to ask forgiveness and desist from frequently cursing their husbands. All this was spoken at a time of(1) the impending departure of the latter on jihad
(2) the impending departure of the Prophet from this world and
(3) the fact that ?Cursing the believer is like killing him.?The anti Islamic sites will always chose what suites them and half brains will follow them.
And only half brains would call an Islamic website which slags off hadith but praises the Quran as anti-islamic without verifying it.
Prove it's an anti-islamic website then if youre going to accuse it of being such as website???.
Yet an another allegation without verifying.
Karim
"Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men." (Sahih reported by Abu-Dawud (RA) The Prophet of Islam (peace be upon him) said, He said, ?Yes, for women are the twin halves of men.? (Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 113; Ahmad, 25663. Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi)All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any
superiority over an Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any superiority over white
except by piety and good action. Learn that every Muslim is a brother to every Muslim and that the Muslims
constitute one brotherhood. Nothing shall be legitimate to a Muslim which belongs to a fellow Muslim unless it
was given freely and willingly. Do not, therefore, do injustice to yourselves. (Hafiz Ibn Hibban reported in al-Sahih
(11/203/#4862) via his isnad, from Fadalah ibn `Ubayd (Allah be pleased with him)Karim
May I add here that the translation of this Hadith as quoted by you is wrong, because it splits the relevant sentence and gives the Prophet's words in such a way that they appear to make a statement of fact. This is wrong, as I have explained.As for the other part, a full translation of it goes as follows ??I have seen hell and I have never seen any thing more horrific than what I saw then. I also saw that the majority of its dwellers are women. ? They asked ?On what grounds, Messenger of God? He said ?By their denial.? They said ?Their denial of God?? He answered ?No. Their denial of their spouses and their denial of kindness. You may be kind to one of them all the time, but when she finds fault with you she says I have never received any kindness from you. ??
Where is the highlighted part mentioned in the Quran???
You only provided "evidence" of the translations of the hadiths that I posted for one of them in "the way that you read them" and even that "evidence" is based on "someone elses" translation, which was the same thing you were accusing me of.
The hadith that should be the most authentic is the hadith about Muhammad's
speech in Hujjat al-Wada (The Farewell Sermon) in which reportedly tens of
thousands of his companions listened. The last statement of this sermon is
reported in three different versionsI am leaving you the Quran and my sunna; you should follow both.
(Muwatta 46/3).
463I am leaving you the Quran and my relatives; you should follow both.
(Muslim 44/4/2408; Ibn Hanbal 4/366; Darimi 23/1/3319).I am leaving you the Quran; you should follow it. (Muslim 15/19/1218;
Ibn Majah 25/84/3074; Abu Dawud 11/56/1905)Now who's translation of these contradictory hadiths should we follow???