Is the Koran all from Allah?
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Ahhhh the old if you can't convince them confuse them argument. And better yet confuse them with heavy maths that they probably don't know. So they feel not only confused but stupid and inferior.
Putting on professor jacket (yes I have one)
As a person who does have the title "Tenured Associate Professor of Statistics" with a PhD in Statistics I do know a bit about probability. I do not claim to know everything about probability but I teach it at a university and have published many research articles in it.....Oh no. Stats makes me want to crawl into a hole and hide! Well good on you for tackling it. )
The probability of an event is a measure of the likelihood that the event will occur. Statisticians have agreed on the following rules and conventions.
(from http//stattrek.com/Help/Glossary.aspx)It doesn't mention that "you can only use it to understand how uncertain you are". Can you please explain?
peace
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peace JD,
Ahhhh the old if you can't convince them confuse them argument. And better yet confuse them with heavy maths that they probably don't know. So they feel not only confused but stupid and inferior.
Putting on professor jacket (yes I have one)
As a person who does have the title "Tenured Associate Professor of Statistics" with a PhD in Statistics I do know a bit about probability. I do not claim to know everything about probability but I teach it at a university and have published many research articles in it.....I think the above comment is quite patronising to the lay reader. As statistics and probability are not that difficult to understand. In fact, I cite the following example in the PDF
Lets say ?1 in 2? people of the general population are male, and ?1 in 4? males are
brown eyed. Now, in order to find the probability of finding a male with brown eyes
within the general population, all you do, is multiply both probabilities as follows 1/2 *
1/4 = 1/8 (which equates to a ?1 in 8? chance of finding a brown eyed male in the
general population).
Mathematicians prefer to state the probability value as a decimal, in this case that would
be ?0.125? (1/. It is also well established that probability values closer to the value of
one are more likely to occur than those furthest from one. If a value of one is obtained,
this means that it is a certainty, if a value of zero is obtained this means it is impossible.Are you implying the above is too confusing for people?
IF that were true, then I think pondering upon whether God exists or not or trying to understand The Quran will be the least of their problems.
What are you talking about??? using probability to PROVE something has to be true?!?! Probability is the language of uncertainty not the language of certainty. If you are certain then from a maths perspective you are deterministic. If you are uncertain you are "stochastic" or "probabilistic". You use probability to tell people YOU ARE UNCERTAIN. Rare events happen all the time. Ever read in the newspaper or hear on the news that someone won the lottery? The odds of winning the big prize in the Powerball lottery is around 1 in 53,000,000 (which is really small). But several people win this lottery every year. Sometimes every week.
Here is my point. Don't use probability to confuse people. You can't use probability to PROVE that something is true or something is not true. You can only use it to understand how uncertain you are about that something.
You may have some education in statistics, but it is clear you either did not read the article or if you did you did not understand it. Here are some nice quotes, taken directly from the article
First of all, I would like to point out that no-one can prove or disprove that
God exists, 100% beyond doubt, because this is impossible to do either way.If you believe that this is possible, then you could just as easily believe that The Quran is
man made. However, if you believe that this occurrence would be very rare (because the
odds are far too low) then, you should also consider that The Quran may in fact be the
word of GodI do not talk about certainty in the article.
If you wish to comment on something, it is recommended to actually read it before commenting on it.
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Wakas I can't be sure (it was a little unclear since JewishDude didn't mention anyone in the post) but he might have been referring to another commenter who spoke numerically in his/her post? But, like I said...not really sure. (and no stats to back up my idea )
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Sorry to offend anyone.
My comment is about the fact that people often confuse people in order to convince them. And then say if you don't understand then you aren't worthy of the knowledge. Think about the people who guard the hadith against interpretation. They say Itijihad is closed and you need to be an expert in order to understand it. That makes people feel inferior or plain stupid.
My personal opinion about mathematics/statistics is it allows me to see the patterns in the world that Allah created. There is a funny saying
Some use statistics like a drunkard uses a lamp post, he uses it for support instead of illumination. I think the same way about the Quran. People use it to support their position instead of using it for illumination.
Again if I offended any one I humbly ask for your forgiveness.
JewishDude
peace Shalom, Salam, Peace peace -
My personal opinion about mathematics/statistics is it allows me to see the patterns in the world that Allah created. There is a funny saying
Some use statistics like a drunkard uses a lamp post, he uses it for support instead of illumination. I think the same way about the Quran. People use it to support their position instead of using it for illumination.
Sweet quote, makes sense.
Are you implying the above is too confusing for people?
IF that were true, then I think pondering upon whether God exists or not or trying to understand The Quran will be the least of their problems.
I found it sexist personally and take offense to the rest of your statement P
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Pedantic as always ;D
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I have the impression that statistics has its uses in things that occur in great numbers, but for a specific thing, there are no statistics. You may draw statististics about how much formal or even informal education believers or non believers have, how many children, any amount of data you care to take into consideration, but to say, fulan such and such is he or she a believer or not, there are no statistics. To say there is a God by this definition, you cannot say by statistics. And then the definitions... How can we define what we cannot fathom or grasp?
It is a matter of existence or non existence, if something exists then what really exists we may call God, or we may call it something else, but the point is The thing we re calling. If we conceive of existence without meaning... that for instance, I cannot grasp. For me everything has meaning, so how can I grasp or interact we something that has no meaning, included myself. If something has meaning and it exists, and everything that exists exists, and is coherent and has meaning, call it by whatever you want, but it is only ONE, everything is ONE, and there a MIND that is ONE. Otherwise we would be chaos and we couldn't possibly be here pinching words.
And that is not a matter of probabilities, that is a fact.
Salaam
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Getting back to the topic,
In my opinion Quran is too trivial a thing to be compiled by Allah himself. I think HIS planning division must have floated the idea and Got it approved. HIS R&D cell, probably chalked a broad outline and then let the Owners/controllers for earthly affairs finish the job.
Once complete and approved, it must have been passed on to the messenger in charge (Gabriel) of inspectorate team, to be taken along in their next annual visit. They brought it down on one of the Shahar ur Ramadhan night some 14 centuries ago and handed it over to the last layer of controllers for deliverance across the border.
siki
