Please help me understand 4:15-4:16
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Yes, this subject has been dealt with at several times. I find it laborious to search the forum, but hopefully you are more skilled than I am to do it. If you do not succed, I will try this week end at least to rerieve the messages I put in them, so that through them you can at least get to the rest.
A piece of advice do not take for granted the correctness of any translation or intrpretation. The Qur'an is not bound by them, nor shuld we be bound.
Salaam
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Salam Khadija,
I would not say they are harsher since the women being accused of "fahisha" are only being held in the home until God makes for them a "way" (could be marriage or repenting as 417 highlights).
As for the men, since they are the breadwinners they are not being restricted in the homes, but they are being harmed/annoyed/hassled until the cease their "fahisha".
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Salam Khadija,
I would not say they are harsher since the women being accused of "fahisha" are only being held in the home until God makes for them a "way" (could be marriage or repenting as 417 highlights).
As for the men, since they are the breadwinners they are not being restricted in the homes, but they are being harmed/annoyed/hassled until the cease their "fahisha".
"then if those witnesses testified then for that reason you people restrict/restrain them in their houses".
Perhaps restraining private meetings of lesbians is the most sure way of overcoming this "lustful disease". Once they are kept at their homes they will not have ocassion of meeting another lesbian. Is there anything harsh if a lesbian is required to stay back at her home?
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I do not think in 4.15 or 4.15 it is a question of any punishment. It is traditional interpretation that says that 4.15 is about lesbians, but theres is nothing to indicate it except that it talks about women and it is in plural, that is more than to women. Whereas in 4.16 the subject is dual, that is, it talks about TWO men.
As somebody suggested in one of the threads, and I subscribe to that interpretation, 4.15 is about prostitutes. In the whole not a word is said about them. But prostitution is a part of life in societies and prostitutes inmost cases are very exploited women. What I understand the aya says, is that if women peddle their "services" and there are four witnesses of that, then they should be taken off the stret and housed properly. It does not say "confine them to their houses", it says "take them into the houses", so it is implied that they are not in the houses at the time, and it is not implied that they do have a house. They are where, if four people can see them do their fahisha? The street? Nowhere it says that it is a punishment. Bearing in mind that it is in the Sura Nisa' which deals with the care of unprotected vulnerable persons, it is not a surprise that those women should be taken care of. Taken off the street and offered the possibility of living decently, may be learn a trade or get a husband. What kind of a legal punishment is a punishment that may last as well five minutes as the whole life? and Again nowhere says ther is a punishment. Neither is a punishment contemplated in 4.16.
Salaam
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What if it is 1 men and 1 women, could you still use duality "allazan", ?
Yes of course. My oversight. It could be one of each sex or two males. I was thinking in terms of where it could mean homosexuality, and concentrated specially con 4.15. But your are right, indeed, in 4.16 can both cases.
This was dealt with at length in another thread, and several possible understandings of both ayas were considered. If you can locate it with the search function, you may look into it.
Thanks for pointing it out.
Salaam
