Use of 2nd person masculine singular in Arabic: can it be a generic reference?
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The issue was
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Also, The God says, "A command from Us - truly We are ever sending messengers -" (Q.445)The Messenger was the last of the prophets, but The God is "...ever sending messengers." "A mercy from thy Lord - truly He is the Hearing, the Knowing." (Q. 445-6)
Mazhar
The translator seems to have little bothered to first peep into some grammar book to know what does a deficient verb mean. Nor he seems to have bothered to first know the structure of the sentences in three worded last part Ayah. Nor he seems to have remembered or taken care the context and the reference to which the Ayah relates.First resolve about verb Kana.
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Among other things...asked and answered...but if you missed it, here it is again...
Using the "internal dictionary" of The Book (i.e., tasrif) I see when The God talks about Himself, He makes it clear how He uses the word "kana". The God uses "ma kana/kuna" to denote when He IS NOT doing something, for example, in 1964 (not forgetful) and 3628 (not sending) and uses inna kana when He IS doing something, for example in 3340 (ever knowing) 443 (ever warning) 445 (ever sending) and 7110 (ever forgiving).
According to the Quran, kana means "was/ever is". The God was and ever is Knowing, Forgiving, Sending, Warning. The God does not "stop knowing" or "stop warning" or "stop sending" or "stop forgiving" unless He specifically tells you that He is not doing it.
For the sake of simplicity, if a person is a medical doctor by profession, and he retires, in the past, he WAS a doctor, but in the present and future he doesnt stop being a doctor...he was and ever is going to be a medical doctor.
Using your line of reasoning, if kana means "past" and not continuous in the "present and future" then if he is not sending messengers in the present or future, then there is a problem in 661 and 737 because The God says that He sends messengers to take our souls at the time of death.
Moreover, in the ayat you quoted, 2845 The God is speaking to the Messenger informing him of certain things regarding Moses. If, as you claim, kana means past and not present or future how did the Messenger become the Messenger? The God said that He found Muhammad "dhallan" (astray) and He "fahada" (guided) him. 937 A messenger had to come to him AFTER Moses. Are you saying that there were no messengers after Moses?
The difference between what you understand kana to mean and what I understand lies in where we look to support our position. Your understanding of the verb "kana" is supported by outside references and dictionaries/lexicons etc., which is not a bad thing, because I do that too, since English is my first language. However, I take that research one step further and go back to The Book and see how The God uses that same word, using tasrif.
I trust The Book Alone and Allah's argument is the Conclusive Argument. In (6150) Allah tells the Messenger to say to the people
"Say Then Allah's is the Conclusive Argument..."
It is my hope that I conveyed my understanding to you clearly.
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After having gone through the entire statement I had pointed out
Now please give a second thought and grasp what you yourself have said
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According to the Quran, kana means "was/ever is".This signifies past upto the point in time of saying-reading it, NOT future.
Thanks"Say Then Allah's is the Conclusive Argument..."
Provided one does not coin his own meanings and assigns it to the words of Allah. Try to realize that deficient verb Kana only refers to past.
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ok...I am going to try this one more time...
I asked you
According to Q.445, is it your understanding that The God SENT messengers ("past transaction" and is NOT SENDING ("not continous in the present and future" messengers today?
Your response was YES...
Then, in the ayat you quoted, 2875, The God is speaking to the Messenger informing him of certain things regarding Moses. If, as you claim, kana means past and not present or future how did the Messenger become the Messenger?
The God said that He found Muhammad "dhallan" (astray) and He "fahada" (guided) him. (937) A messenger had to come to him AFTER Moses. Are you saying that there were no messengers sent after Moses?
An event. an act signified by past tense signifies time-line. The Day the Man was sent to Earth he was sent with this info that the guidance will keep coming from Him, the Sustainer Lord. The end is when the Guidance has since been sent for the entire humanity, unlike the past when it was local affair, for different nations, not global message. None, repeat none was the Messenger for entire humanity except the Last One.
This is pure conjecture with no support. Allah gives us the "time-line" that you speak of in 771-13.
Provided one does not coin his own meanings and assigns it to the words of Allah....
As I explained to you earlier, I use tasrif, the internal dictionary of The Book, which makes clear the definition of Quranic words...it appears, you on the other hand choose to rely only on outside sources made up of man-made rules of Arabic grammar...now i ask you, who is coining their own meaning and assigning it to the words of Allah?
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As I explained to you earlier, I use tasrif, the internal dictionary of The Book, which makes clear the definition of Quranic words...it appears, you on the other hand choose to rely only on outside sources made up of man-made rules of Arabic grammar...now i ask you, who is coining their own meaning and assigning it to the words of Allah?
Remaining on this methodology, start with Kana one by one where it signifies the future and not Past.
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With all due respect, brother, I really don't know what else to say to you even though I have given you ayat after ayat. I am not here to try to convince you of anything. The God has given us the gift of intelligence and I intend to utilize it to the fullest to know who my Creator is and what MY responsibility is to Him.
If you still understand that kana "signifies past upto the point in time of saying-reading it, NOT future." after I have given you 661 and 737, just to mention a few...
and that your "time-line" is "An event. an act signified by past tense signifies time-line. The Day the Man was sent to Earth he was sent with this info that the guidance will keep coming from Him, the Sustainer Lord. The end is when the Guidance has since been sent for the entire humanity, unlike the past when it was local affair, for different nations, not global message. None, repeat none was the Messenger for entire humanity except the Last One." (I really don't know where you got this statement from because you never cited your source...but anyway) after I have given you 771-13 where The God gives us HIS time-line...
then I am ok with that...I just disagree with your reasoning, logic and conclusion which is based on outside sources which are filled with conjecture, speculation and man-made rules of Arabic grammar.
We all have to stand before Our Creator at the appointed time when The God sends a messenger to take our soul (hint, hint, clue, clue ...he's ever sending messengers) and He will make clear to us at that point whether we were rightly guided or astray.
Are you willing to bet your soul on what your understand? if you are, fine...you will find out whether you were right or wrong at your appointed time.
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If you still understand that kana "signifies past upto the point in time of saying-reading it, NOT future." after I have given you 661 and 737, just to mention a few...
661 even does not have Kana in it.
737 Both places, it is past tense about past event.
I don't know where are you wandering to stick to ill got perception that Kana could denote future.
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I have already given you the ayats that refer to KANA...
Using the "internal dictionary" of The Book, you will see when The God talks about Himself, He makes it clear how He uses the word "kana". The God uses"ma kana/kuna" to denote when He IS NOT doing something, for example, in 1964 (not forgetful) and 3628 (not sending) and He uses "inna kana" when He IS doing something, for example in 3340 (ever knowing) 443 (ever warning) 445 (ever sending) and 7110 (ever forgiving).
The other ayats are supporting ayats...its called TASRIF. If, as you say these ayats, 661 and 737 reflect "past events" then are you saying that messengers used to come and take people's souls in the past but they are not doing that act in the present and future?
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The other ayats are supporting ayats...its called TASRIF. If, as you say these ayats, 661 and 737 reflect "past events" then are you saying that messengers used to come and take people's souls in the past but they are not doing that act in the present and future?
If this is what you think of Tasrif, may Allah the Exalted have mercy upon you.
661 has nothing to do with those Messengers sent with the Book to people. They are the Angels sent for a specific object metnioned therein-guards who also perform duty at the time of death of a person.
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I was curious to know why this topic interest you so, and I just noticed your fairly new post about "The Last Messenger, Muhammad"...
This discussion has turned into something I call "silly season" and I am moving on to another discussion.
Salaam