Some questions regarding Islam
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Hey everyone. I have a couple of questions I would like to ask you all. As you probably know, it is currently fashionable in some circles to argue that Islam sanctions terrorism and wishes to establish a global caliphate. the usual 'proofs' are the history of the Islamic empires and koranic verses sanctioning violence. How do you respond to these claims? Another argument (propogated by some Muslims too) is that the Prophet married Aisha when she was nine. A case in point is this Islamic site which aims to refute the claims of reformist Muslims that she was older
http//www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Refutation_to_Muslim_Apologetics_against_Aisha's_Age_of_Consummation
How do you respond to such people?
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Quran 1216
transliteration
Wajaoo abahum AAishaanyabkoon
translation
And they came to their father at night, weeping.the word from that verse is
ishan , that means "early at night"anyone else find the word "Aisha" in the Quran?
316
And of the people is he who buys the amusement of speech to mislead from the way of Allah without knowledge and who takes it in ridicule. Those will have a humiliating punishment.The Ottoman Khalifate Empire is Dead, thus Most Hadith, and History they use, Mislead them from staying Alive.
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Hey everyone. I have a couple of questions I would like to ask you all. As you probably know, it is currently fashionable in some circles to argue that Islam sanctions terrorism and wishes to establish a global caliphate.
Islam wishes, Islam sanctions.. the word "islam" is one of the most abused, misused and misunderstood word in human history..
the usual 'proofs' are the history of the Islamic empires and koranic verses sanctioning violence. How do you respond to these claims?
And now we have "Islamic Empire" too.. great...
There are no such thing as 'islamic empire', 'islamic civlization' etc..
The word 'islam' has been harnessed for over many centuries and up until now by politicians to fulfill their agenda.. (world domination, oppressing and enslaving other people, killing/assassination of enemy, territory/wealth acquisition etc..)The written history of the so-called "Khulafa ar Rashidin", "Fatimid Empire", "Abbassid Empire", 'Ottoman Empire" etc.. are indeed full of brutality and atrocities.
I don't feel the need to 'respond' to that..
I just agree with it.. according to the 'written history' there are lot of brutality and atrocities done in the past performed by "Khulafa ar Rashidin", "Fatimid Empire", "Abbassid Empire", 'Ottoman Empire", "Roman Empire", "Mongol Empire", "Catholic Church", "Nazi Germany", "Soviet Union", "USA Government", "Japan Empire" etc..Salam / Peace
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I accept your points about the caliphate. However, I do not feel you responded adequately to my point regarding Aisha's age when consumation occurred. I linked to a (Muslim) site arguing that she was nine. Merely responding that the Hadith are not reliable (as the first poster did) is not enough. What arguments support this claim? Thanks.
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We are not hadithists.
Most of us consider hadith to be the way satan tried to distort the religion, when he couldn`t distort the text (quran) because God protected it.
In the Quran, marriage is legal from the age of puberty. So any partner of Mohammed, must have been that age or over. So if hadith-aisha isn`t entirely made up, she would have to be that age, or over. If you know well the Quran, you can see that hadith-mohammed is wildly in conflict with it, and so made up. So the same goes for "aisha".
There
s plenty of other people who do research on Aishas age, and accept hadith. I suggest reading for instance, http//www.muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm -
I accept your points about the caliphate. However, I do not feel you responded adequately to my point regarding Aisha's age when consumation occurred. I linked to a (Muslim) site arguing that she was nine. Merely responding that the Hadith are not reliable (as the first poster did) is not enough. What arguments support this claim? Thanks.
If someone told me that aisha was nine when Muhammad married her, I would as a 200% quranists ask that person to prove the exsistence of Muhammad and aisha in first place.. quran does not speak abiyt them so I really don't know if they exsisted.
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I accept your points about the caliphate. However, I do not feel you responded adequately to my point regarding Aisha's age when consumation occurred. I linked to a (Muslim) site arguing that she was nine. Merely responding that the Hadith are not reliable (as the first poster did) is not enough. What arguments support this claim? Thanks.
Salaam HyperEntity
No offence, but you realize what "kind" of muslims we are, right? We do not use hadith as divine guidance. If prophet Muhammed was married to a girl called Aisha at the age of 5,6,9 or 89 doesn't make a difference to us. We do not follow prophet Muhammed, we follow the Quran.
Hadith is irrelevant to us.
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I am aware you do not believe in the hadith. But most Muslims do. How would you convince those Muslims that they are wrong?
@Paradox Uncreated I have already seen that site. How do you respond to the link I provided? And on what basis do you reject the hadith?
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I am aware you do not believe in the hadith. But most Muslims do. How would you convince those Muslims that they are wrong?
@Paradox Uncreated I have already seen that
site. How do you respond to the link I provided? And on what basis do you reject the hadith?Are you sure the author is a muslim? How can we prove that they are wrong when they are right?
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Peace everyone!
As per hadith, let's use Deductive reasoning eh?
If His Majesty states that He Is the Truth (3130) and that he states the truth (334) and that the Quran is the truth (323 & 131) amd that everything after the truth is deemed falsehood by His Majesty's Wisdom (1033), then can we not conclude that Hadiths are falsehood by the reason of them comming after the truth. More importantly, by reason of His Majesty's Wisdom
"These are God's revelations that we recite to you truthfully. In which Hadith other than God and His revelations do they believe (456)Most Blessed is His Majesty, YAH, the Lord of the universe!
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I am aware you do not believe in the hadith. But most Muslims do. How would you convince those Muslims that they are wrong?
@Paradox Uncreated I have already seen that site. How do you respond to the link I provided? And on what basis do you reject the hadith?
Wiki islam is a very good site actually because it uncovers some of The hatefull muslim traditions and practices. However the problem with wikiislam is that it tends to generalize all muslims as a mean to justify USA's war crimes against muslims. Wiki islam totally ignore that not all muslims agree with the bad things in socalled Islamic traditions. there are Muslims like me who believe in democracy, secularism, human rights and 100% equality between men and women. But as usual nobody wants to hear the opinion of 'modern' Muslims like me or our interpretation of our religion simply because we ate not intresting. We don't provide viewers to the news channels, readers to the news papers or readers to Wiki islam. That's why our voice are never heard. If someone believes the hadith its okay with me as long as he does not harm anyone. And my respond to why i don't follow the hadith is that i don't believe in them even if i tried i won't be able to believe in them because they go against my morals which i believe gods guide me through. And as emil said that the age of aisha does not matter to us since we don't care about it. Personally i don't think she ever exsisted.
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I accept your points about the caliphate. However, I do not feel you responded adequately to my point regarding Aisha's age when consumation occurred. I linked to a (Muslim) site arguing that she was nine. Merely responding that the Hadith are not reliable (as the first poster did) is not enough. What arguments support this claim? Thanks.
Aisha who??
(That's actually the best answer)Linking 'Aisha' with islam (by the way islam is an 'attitude' / 'character' to me is as ridiculous as linking Paris Hilton with 'honest'.
Q You said you're an honest person, what do you say to Paris Hilton partying all day attitude?
A Paris who???Salam / Peace
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@Paradox Uncreated I have already seen that site. How do you respond to the link I provided? And on what basis do you reject the hadith?
I just said that confused
Well I can add that there are some wiki sites out there that seens to mask a lot of hatred, as religious teachings. For instance conservapedia. If wikiislam is anything like that, it`s garbage ofcourse. (I have never seen it before.)
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Poverty, that's the simple answer
All Hadith that Guide Believer to Success, is From Allah.
All Hadith that Mislead Disbeliever, is From Allah.226
Indeed, Allah is not timid to present an example - that of a mosquito or what is smaller than it. And those who have believed know that it is the truth from their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, they say, "What did Allah intend by this as an example?" He misleads many thereby and guides many thereby. And He misleads not except the defiantly disobedient,I reject Misleading Hadith. Hadith Bukhari have been practice for 100years, and the people who use it, is in poverty.
Material Prosperity is the most Effective.
People hardly think logically when they are dirt Poor."Hadith Bukhari, is Wrong, Misleading, Unreliable" types of Refutation, tightens the Close Mindedness of Sunnis.
Opening Their Minds key to show them the Truth, mere attacks, refutation, average Sunni simply Cement Shut their Mind
Changing people start by Opening their Mind.
If Mere words to Open their minds, I simply use Obey Jesus.Quran 61
praise is to Allah , who created the heavens and the earthBible 11
God created the heavens and the earth.How can Sunni Reject Bible 11 but Obey Quran 61 ? That's Illogical.
Only Open Mind can Change. Close Mind cannot.
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Salaam, HyperEntity.
You're going to find an endless debate on this topic, HyperEntity.
This is what the Hadith does to people and why they leave it behind.Personally, I am not much interested in a book which tells me to shave off my pubic hair and wipe my arse with a specific hand.
It's outright invasive, not to mention absurd. I don't allow it to affect me one way or the other, any more.There are some rational opinions out there regarding the subject but my choice is to just forsake the books as
more propaganda and leave right and wrong to the conscience Al Lah gave me, with or without a book to decipher it for me.Good luck to you.
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Are you sure you're a Muslim? Anyway, most of the replies I've seen so far basicaly say ''I don't believe this don't accept the hadith'. Why don't you accept the hadith? On what basis? That's what I want to know.
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Are you sure you're a Muslim? Anyway, most of the replies I've seen so far basicaly say ''I don't believe this don't accept the hadith'. Why don't you accept the hadith? On what basis? That's what I want to know.
I am a 'kuffar' according to the sunnis.. an apostate.. because IMHO sunni hadiths are full of jokes and ridiculous stories..
In sunni eyes I'm the same as the shiites, the ahmadis, the christians, the jews and all other heathen people (which the sunnis are not aware of) who rejected their hadiths..
And I'm fully OK with it.. I don't mind being a 'kuffar' as per sunni definition..Now.. HyperEntity are you a 'sunni kuffar'??
Salam / Peace
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I am a 'kuffar' according to the sunnis.. an apostate.. because IMHO sunni hadiths are full of jokes and ridiculous stories..
In sunni eyes I'm the same as the shiites, the ahmadis, the christians, the jews and all other heathen people (which the sunnis are not aware of) who rejected their hadiths..
And I'm fully OK with it.. I don't mind being a 'kuffar' as per sunni definition..Now.. HyperEntity are you a 'sunni kuffar'??
Salam / Peace
He just Reject "Sunni Hadith" that's all. but
BIGGER PROBLEM IS...
Can any Sunni help me find a Verse from Quran, forbidding Muslim Obeying Jesus?
Christians Claims is really Threatening;
Quran 61
praise is to Allah , who created the heavens and the earthBible 11
God created the heavens and the earth.Christians ask, "Why Disobey Bible 11, and Obey Quran 61, its Illogical."
Christians have found a way To Convert Muslim into Christian by Using the Quran!
332 Say, "Obey Allah and the Messenger."616 And when Jesus, the son of Mary, said, "O children of Israel, indeed I am the messenger of Allah"
4363 And when Jesus brought clear proofs, he said, "I have come to you with wisdom
and to make clear to you some of that over which you differ, so fear Allah and obey me.
2285 "We make no distinction between any of His messengers."
Only Quran can Refute that!
Sunni-Hadith-Rejector No need to reply this.
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Are you sure you're a Muslim? Anyway, most of the replies I've seen so far basicaly say ''I don't believe this don't accept the hadith'. Why don't you accept the hadith? On what basis? That's what I want to know.
Shalom,
Accept what hadith ? Let me talk about Hadith from Qur'an.
"Allah has sent down the best HADITH, a Bookwhich is consistent throughout, the one with paired statements. The skins of those who are concerned towards their Lord shiver from it, then their skins and their hearts soften up to the remembrance of God. Such is the guidance of God; He guides with it whoever He wills. And for whoever God misguides, then none can guide him."
So, I am already following the best of all narations(Hadith)
Let us see what Allah says about following other hadiths
"Have they not looked at the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that God has created? Perhaps their time is drawing near; so IN WHICH HADITH AFTER THIS ONE WILL THEY BELIEVE?"
"These are the ayaats of Allah that we recite to you truthfully. IN WHICH HADITH other than Allah and his ayaats do you believe ?"
"Let them produce a Hadith like this if they are truthful"
"In what HADITH after this will they believe?"
So, let me ask you, in what Hadith do you believe ?
PEACE
------------------------ Student of Allah -
Shalom,
Accept what hadith ? Let me talk about Hadith from Qur'an.
"Allah has sent down the best HADITH, a Bookwhich is consistent throughout, the one with paired statements. The skins of those who are concerned towards their Lord shiver from it, then their skins and their hearts soften up to the remembrance of God. Such is the guidance of God; He guides with it whoever He wills. And for whoever God misguides, then none can guide him."
So, I am already following the best of all narations(Hadith)
Let us see what Allah says about following other hadiths
"Have they not looked at the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that God has created? Perhaps their time is drawing near; so IN WHICH HADITH AFTER THIS ONE WILL THEY BELIEVE?"
"These are the ayaats of Allah that we recite to you truthfully. IN WHICH HADITH other than Allah and his ayaats do you believe ?"
"Let them produce a Hadith like this if they are truthful"
"In what HADITH after this will they believe?"
So, let me ask you, in what Hadith do you believe ?
PEACE
------------------------ Student of AllahHere Sunni arguments, Why Hadith is more than Quran-Book Alone.
"Have they not looked at the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that God has created? Perhaps their time is drawing near; so IN WHICH HADITH AFTER THIS ONE WILL THEY BELIEVE?"heavens and earth, is Allah's Hadith.
according to Sunni Scholars, Hadith Bukhari a collection of, Muhammad retelling Allah's Hadith.
Don't you all Hadith-Rejectors see the Futility against Hadith Bukhari?