Can we pray for our christian friends?
-
Good point you made. If you heard a lecture by Gary Miller, a Christian convert to Islam who used to be a Christian clergy, he said that he used to ask his teachers at the clergy what does it mean God has a son and what kind of son is that and yet he was never able to get an answer. It was unexplainable. Gary Miller used to conduct lectures with Ahmed Deedat.
But the Koran does talk about Jews and Christians as monotheist. And these religions claim monotheism. I think that Jesus was a test because of his unique nature. His birth was unique and he left the Earth uniquely. Just like the Koran is ahistorical so we were left with the Sunni and Shia fitna. The Koran does not talk about places and names and biographies and so the later generation had to manufacture them. I think its a fitna to see what people will do later on.
But in the end faith is an individual issue. And the Koran did talk about Jews and Christians as monotheist. But not all have faith. Therefore just like we do against Sunni and Shias, we must attcak their doctrine and not their faith as we do not know what really goes insiode the mind of a Christian since the Trinity is actually impossible.
2.62] Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve
Not all of them are alike; a party of the people of the Book stand for the right, they recite the Verses of God during the hours of the night, prostrating themselves in prayer. They believe in God and the Last Day; they enjoin good and forbid wrong; and they hasten in good works; and they are among the righteous. And whatever good they do, nothing will be rejected of them; for God knows well those who are God fearing. 3113-115
And there are, certainly, among the people of the Book, those who believe in God and in that which has been revealed to you, and in that which has been revealed to them, humbling themselves before God. They do not sell the Verses of God for a little price, for them is a reward with their Lord. Surely, God is Swift in account. 3199
So here the Koran recognizes that there are Jewish believers and Christian believers. We must focus on attacking the Trinity doctrine or the teachings of the Talmud and Sunnah and not faith since we never will know who hasfaith in God and who does not. What a Christian may say about Jesus is one thing and what he actually believes is another. We can never really know because the Trinity is unexplainable.
Just as a side note Sunnies and shiites are among 'people of the book' .
Peace
-
The celebration of Christmas is a good example of that, it is not scriptural however Christians celebrate Christmas and even at different times like the Ethiopian Church and Eastern Orthodox Church. However you will never be able to establish something like that in Islam without some religious evidence.
How about the "Mawlid"??
There's no Mawlid on Hadith/Sunna is it?
It was justified by "Ijma Ulema" as commanded by their Emir/Sultan...
Similarly with Christmas.. justified through "Pope Edict".. as commanded by Constantine..And I agree.. Eid-Al-Adha, The Tawaf and Kissing the black stone.. got it's 'authority' from Hadith/Sunna..
They need to create the hadith/sunna to justify those... apparently they didn't stop there..Just as a side note Sunnies and shiites are among 'people of the book' .
Good point..
Salam / Peace
-
How about the "Mawlid"??
There's no Mawlid on Hadith/Sunna is it?
It was justified by "Ijma Ulema" as commanded by their Emir/Sultan...
Similarly with Christmas.. justified through "Pope Edict".. as commanded by Constantine..And I agree.. Eid-Al-Adha, The Tawaf and Kissing the black stone.. got it's 'authority' from Hadith/Sunna..
They need to create the hadith/sunna to justify those... apparently they didn't stop there..Good point..
Salam / Peace
Good point about the Mawlid but isn't that the reason why the Salafis reject it? They say it is not the Sunnah. Yes Sufism did diverge but they were able to do so because the Sufi sheikhs enjoyed authority. Sufism is a very unique aspect of Islam but the reason I think they are slowly dying now is precisely that their enemies label them as not being the followers of the Sunnah.
But good point and now I see why some have said Sufism is very similar to Christianity.
-
Sure you can it's not forbidden in Quran..
-
The people of the Book in the Koran are the Jews.
No. plz read
4171 O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.
Sunnies and shiites are among 'people of the book.
No. They are believers. According to Quran, believers are the people who accept what was sent to Mohammad. Sunnies and shiites accept Quran as divine scripture. But they don't follow it properly ,that's why Mohammad's only complaint about his people will not be that they rejected anything or associated partners to Allah but just
2530 The messenger said, "My Lord, my people have deserted this Quran."
People of the book are those who already had scripture before revelation of Quran. They are practically christians and jews (and may be some more). Someone among the people of the book, after being introduced with Quran's message becomes a "believer or rejecter of the people of the book" depending whether he accepts or rejects the message.
3199 Surely, some followers of the previous scriptures do believe in GOD, and in what was revealed to you, and in what was revealed to them. They reverence GOD, and they never trade away GOD's revelations for a cheap price. These will receive their recompense from their Lord. GOD is the most efficient in reckoning.
peace
-
Good answer... bravo
It's a sectarian spirit for 'not to pray' / 'not to help' / 'not to bless' those who are 'THEM' and 'NOT US'...
yes , and it's also a sectarian spirit to call those who maintain salat and give zaakat "Mohammadans" and "mushreeks" while calling themselves "monoteists" instead muslims and befriending those who reject Quran.
-
No. plz read
4171 O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.
No. They are believers. According to Quran, believers are the people who accept what was sent to Mohammad. Sunnies and shiites accept Quran as divine scripture. But they don't follow it properly ,that's why Mohammad's only complaint about his people will not be that they rejected anything or associated partners to Allah but just
2530 The messenger said, "My Lord, my people have deserted this Quran."
People of the book are those who already had scripture before revelation of Quran. They are practically christians and jews (and may be some more). Someone among the people of the book, after being introduced with Quran's message becomes a "believer or rejecter of the people of the book" depending whether he accepts or rejects the message.
3199 Surely, some followers of the previous scriptures do believe in GOD, and in what was revealed to you, and in what was revealed to them. They reverence GOD, and they never trade away GOD's revelations for a cheap price. These will receive their recompense from their Lord. GOD is the most efficient in reckoning.
peace
People of the book are the Jews and not Christians. The Rabbis to this day will tell you they rejected Jesus because he claimed to be god. However the real reason why they rejected him is the same reason Sunnis and Shias reject us.
4.153.173 The people of the Book ask thee to cause a book to descend to them from heaven Indeed they asked Moses for an even greater (miracle), for they said "Show us Allah in public," but they were dazed for their presumption, with thunder and lightning. Yet they worshipped the calf even after clear signs had come to them; even so we forgave them; and gave Moses manifest proofs of authority. And for their covenant we raised over them (the towering height) of Mount (Sinai); and (on another occasion) we said "Enter the gate with humility"; and (once again) we commanded them "Transgress not in the matter of the sabbath." And we took from them a solemn covenant. (They have incurred divine displeasure) In that they broke their covenant; that they rejected the signs of Allah. that they slew the Messengers in defiance of right; that they said, "Our hearts are the wrappings (which preserve Allah.s Word; We need no more)";- Nay, Allah hath set the seal on their hearts for their blasphemy, and little is it they believe;- That they rejected Faith; that they uttered against Mary a grave false charge; That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not- Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;- And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;- For the iniquity of the Jews We made unlawful for them certain (foods) good and wholesome which had been lawful for them;- in that they hindered many from Allah.s Way;- That they took usury, though they were forbidden; and that they devoured men's substance wrongfully;- we have prepared for those among them who reject faith a grievous punishment. But those among them who are well-grounded in knowledge, and the believers, believe in what hath been revealed to thee and what was revealed before thee And (especially) those who establish regular prayer and practise regular charity and believe in Allah and in the Last Day To them shall We soon give a great reward. We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers after him we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and solomon, and to David We gave the Psalms. Of some apostles We have already told thee the story; of others We have not;- and to Moses Allah spoke direct;- Messenger. who gave good news as well as warning, that mankind, after (the coming) of the apostles, should have no plea against Allah. For Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise. But Allah beareth witness that what He hath sent unto thee He hath sent from His (own) knowledge, and the angels bear witness But enough is Allah for a witness. Those who reject Faith and keep off (men) from the way of Allah, have verily strayed far, far away from the Path. Those who reject Faith and do wrong,- Allah will not forgive them nor guide them to any way- Except the way of Hell, to dwell therein for ever. And this to Allah is easy. O Mankind! The Messenger hath come to you in truth from Allah. believe in him It is best for you. But if ye reject Faith, to Allah belong all things in the heavens and on earth And Allah is All-knowing, All-wise. O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him so believe in Allah and His apostles. Say not "Trinity" desist it will be better for you for Allah is one Allah. Glory be to Him (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs. Christ disdaineth nor to serve and worship Allah, nor do the angels, those nearest (to Allah) those who disdain His worship and are arrogant,-He will gather them all together unto Himself to (answer). But to those who believe and do deeds of righteousness, He will give their (due) rewards,- and more, out of His bounty But those who are disdainful and arrogant, He will punish with a grievous penalty; Nor will they find, besides Allah, any to protect or help them.
As can be seen it is talking about the Jews and not Christians. Christians are refered to as "nasara" in the Koran. I am not sure about the Trinity part. So it could be refering to Christians as well however looking at the context it seems to be talking about Jews.
-
In general the people of the book can either be the Jews or the Christians or both depending on the context of the verses in the Quran.
For example? Sura 4152 obviously is talking about the Jews alone.
4153 The people of the book ask you to bring down to them a book from the heavens. They had asked Moses for even more than that, for they said, "Let us see God plainly!", so the lightning bolt took them for their wickedness. Then they took the calf after the proof had come to them, and We pardoned them for this; We gave Moses a clear authority.
Whilst sura 4171 is talking about the Christians?
4171 O people of the book, do not overstep in your system, nor say about God except the truth. Jesus the son of Mary was no more than God's messenger and the fulfillment of His word to Mary, and an inspiration from Him. So acknowledge God and His messengers, and do not say, "Trinity." Cease, for it is better for you.(Christians are the ones who use the term "trinity" Not the Jews.) God is only One god, be He glorified that He should have a son! To Him is all that is in the heavens and what is in the earth. God is enough as a caretaker.
The verse above is saying that whoever the people of the book are they are saying ?trinity? . God says ?Cease, for it is better for you.?. Which group of people uses the word trinity??? Isn't it the Christians?
In sura 3199 this verse is referring to both the Jews and Christians since both are recipients of the pervious scripture (The Torah and the Injeel)
3199 Surely, some followers of the previous scriptures do believe in GOD, and in what was revealed to you, and in what was revealed to them. They reverence GOD, and they never trade away GOD's revelations for a cheap price. These will receive their recompense from their Lord. GOD is the most efficient in reckoning.
Basically anyone who are students any of the scriptures (the Torah, the Injeel and the Quran) are more or less people of the book so in fact sunnies and shites are people of the book as well. HOWEVER the term ?people of the book? as used in the Quran generally specifies only two groups , the Jews and the Christians because of the CONTEXT of the verses.
Peace,
Kevin
-
yes , and it's also a sectarian spirit to call those who maintain salat and give zaakat "Mohammadans" and "mushreeks" while calling themselves "monoteists" instead muslims and befriending those who reject Quran.
Islam in all its manifestations absolutely rejects the Quran. Have you ever studied their doctors and theologians? What they teach necessarily implies a rejection of the Quran, it doesn't matter what they otherwise claim. In fact the Jewish Rabbi who rejects the Quran openly, probably without knowing anything about it, is more honest, in that he does not claim that the Quran supports his false religion. According to your reasoning, as long as a roman catholic says he believes in the Quran, then nothing he teaches or does can put him outside of revealed truth. The post Quranic religion called Islam is shirk because it rejects the word of God as its final authority, and therefore gives the glory, that belongs to God alone, to their demons, which they camouflage as traditions.
As far as salah and zakaah go, well you simply beg the question. Why is their religious practice definitional? Ironically their doctors teach that you CANNOT do salah and zaakah without their satanic traditions, as the word of God is wholly impotent to provide the "necessary details". Yet here you are defending the teachings of these people, as if they were of God! In their satanic religion you are NOT a "muslim" precisely because you faithfully accept the word of God as sufficient, and yet you cite their "salah" and their "zaakah" as proof of their orthodoxy!
-
- When someone rejecting Quran it's his/her own business with Allah, not ours D Unless that person harm us, now thats become our 'business'. When that person dont harm us do we have to hate them? Read these, only a few examples written in Quran
-Wealth and buildings are the beauty of this life. But the good deeds that remain behind are better with your Lord for a reward, and better for hope. (1846)
-Kind words and forgiveness is far better than a charity that is followed by harm. God is Rich, Compassionate. (2263) - Who said that ? Salat and Zakat are mentioned in Quran as part of our duties as Muslims.
- Muslim should abide only God.. not some imam/fellow person.. Even Rasulullah was sent by Allah only to deliver Allah's message.. not to create his own law. Because a Muslim is a Monoteist,
- Say, I warn you only through the Revelation. But the deaf can hear nothing when they are warned (2145)
- When someone rejecting Quran it's his/her own business with Allah, not ours D Unless that person harm us, now thats become our 'business'. When that person dont harm us do we have to hate them? Read these, only a few examples written in Quran
-
yes , and it's also a sectarian spirit to call those who maintain salat and give zaakat "Mohammadans" and "mushreeks" while calling themselves "monoteists" instead muslims and befriending those who reject Quran.
I don't see it as 'sectarians' to call anyone anything.... (e.g. Americans, Africans, Asians, Mohammedans, Christians, Buddhist, Wahhabis, Suffis, Sallafis, Catholics, Saudis, Atheists, Footballers, Actors, Actress, Socialists, Nationalists, Zionists, Tourists, Capitalists.. and so on and so forth)
As long as they don't incite hatred towards those who they regards as "NOT US" but "THEM"..
-
Now I really feel Like praying to God so that he would guide her in life but am not sure what would Quran say to that. I know that you are not supose to pray for polytheists and Catholics do have their saint thing that they are big on.
So, yeah can we pray for Catholics and other Christians, also can we pray for atheists who have helped us in life? Pray to God to guide them to himself.
Dear Brother
You are justifiably in confusion because most of the Muslims including those who have strong conviction that "Quran" is an only source for the knowledge of Deen e Islam. obviously it is very difficult to break the shackles around our necks by the traditions and sometime we perceive un-intentionally according to the traditions ( Islamic History, Biography of Prophet and Hadith). Therefore a misconception prevail among Muslims.
I understand that your question is actual not for Dua but for (Prayer, (you wish that the person who helped you in every manner must be rewarded by Allah Subhanna) The word Al-Dua'a ( you called prayer) is defined as under
Definition
Da?a also spelled as ?Dua? meaning ?to call someone?. Therefore, ?ad- da?a? means ?the forefinger which is used as a sign to call someone?. ?ad dayiah? denotes ? the cry of the horses in a battle?. Hu?a minni dawatar rajul convey ?he is at distance where a man?s voice can reach him; he is at a calling distance. (Taj) ?Ibn- e- Faaris? said its basic meanings are ?to incline someone towards oneself eloquently by speech or conversation?. Dayahu alal ameer, means he took him to ameer (leader); in this context ?dayi ?is not only one who calls but also someone who persuade you to someone else (for example to an ideology); or call someone.iddia?oo,(yad- da-oon) means ?to wish or desire? (Taj ul Urus); ?to call on someone, repeatedly?.(672 Tadau alaih, means ?they gathered against him?. tada?a alaihal aduwu min kulli jaa?nib, means ?the enemy attacked him from all sides?. tadaa?atilhaitaan means ?walls fall down one by one?.
( Taj ul Urus) Da?autuhu zaida, means I named him Zaid ad dayee-o means adopted son ? (taj) plural is ad-ia-oo 334 ad daayiah means the milk that is left behind in the teats of the animals so that the left over milk may obtain with its help, at the time of, milking the animal again; (taj) by the reason - cause.
Such things, which entice and excite emotions of human called, ad dawa-ee (Muheet) (these meanings should be kept in mind because they throw light on the meaning of the word dua ? Call? ). Wad-oo shohada?akum 223, means ?call those who will help you?. in Surah Kahaf, nadao and da?a have been used as synonym;
1852. In Surah Airaaf, 7.193, AAalaykum adaAAawtumoohum am antum mitoon(a) has been used as antonym; which means to be quiet as such da?a would mean to call. In Surah Baqarra, verse # 261, fa(o)dAAu lan rabbaka means Call upon your ?Rubb? for us.Al-dAAua call- request - applies for.
An excerpt from Lughat ul Quran by Mr.GA.Pervaiz
if you need further information about this,please go to http//rmakhtar.logspot.com
Peace!
-
salam bigmo, all
plz read 4171 more carefully4171 O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of YOUR religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity."............
Whose religion is the religion told in 4171, the limits of which are transgressed. christians' or jews' religion ?
Basically anyone who are students any of the scriptures (the Torah, the Injeel and the Quran) are more or less people of the book so in fact sunnies and shites are people of the book as well.
So accordingly prophet Mohammad and sahaba were also people of the book. D so are we all. If everybody is people of the book then what's the use of using the term "people of the book" ? D
HOWEVER the term ?people of the book? as used in the Quran generally specifies only two groups , the Jews and the Christians because of the CONTEXT of the verses.
Why "generally" ? have you seen exceptions ? is there any single verse in which the term "people of the book" is used for muslims ? D
peace all
-
Bigmo
People of the book are the Jews and not Christians. The Rabbis to this day will tell you they rejected Jesus because he claimed to be god. However the real reason why they rejected him is the same reason Sunnis and Shias reject
Brother as I can see hhe quranic word for jew are simply 'hood' and when talking about jews only the quran stats 'jews'. But 'people of the book' as the word itself describes, are more than a group of people, its 'people who have a book'. The verse you just quoted regarding jews, what you forget is that it was during the time of moses when they had and still have torah hence they were/are included 'people of the book'. So the verse you just quoted, just confirms that jews are included in the people of the book and I believe muslims as well, since they really have hundreds of book which they follow
Hamzamultlu
So accordingly prophet Mohammad and sahaba were also people of the book. so are we all. If everybody is people of the book then what's the use of using the term "people of the book" ?
What is all this sudden talk about muhammad and sahaba? you sound like a real sunni o
Why "generally" ? have you seen exceptions ? is there any single verse in which the term "people of the book" is used for muslims ?
Muslims can both be from among 'the people of the book' and they can also be people who are not among 'people of the book'
And there are, certainly, among the people of the Scripture, those who believe in God and in that which has been revealed to you, and in that which has been revealed to them, humbling themselves before God. They do not sell the Verses of God for a little price, for them is a reward with their Lord. Surely, God is Swift in account. '(3199
Not all of them are alike; a party of the people of the Scripture stand for the right, they recite the Verses of God during the hours of the night, prostrating themselves in prayer. They believe in God and the Last Day; they enjoin Al-Ma'r?f and forbid Al-Munkar ; and they hasten in (all) good works; and they are among the righteous. And whatever good they do, nothing will be rejected of them; for God knows well those who are Al-Muttaq?n .(3113-115)
Verily! Those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in God and the Last Day and do righteous good deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve . (quran 262)
-
So accordingly prophet Mohammad and sahaba were also people of the book. so are we all. If everybody is people of the book then what's the use of using the term "people of the book" ?
Why "generally" ? have you seen exceptions ? is there any single verse in which the term "people of the book" is used for muslims ?
peace all
The people of the book is used to describe people who have scripture that is from God.
Hence the term ?the people of the BOOK? . Like the Torah and the Injeel, The Quran is also a BOOK!
So basically any person who studies the scripture are people of the book. This includes , sunnis, shites, Jews, Christians etc.
HOWEVER the term ?the people of the book? by context in the Quran is only used to describe the Jews and the Christians. Because they were used as EXAMPLES of people who had scripture from BEFORE.
Ok look at it this way. If the Quran wasn?t the last scripture we today would have been categorized in a new scripture with the Jews and the Christians as ?people of the book? since we study the Quran. The Quran is a book,a scripture just like the Injeel and the Torah.
Peace,
Kevin
-
The people of the book is used to describe people who have scripture that is from God.
You can use the term ?the people of the book? as you wish..no problem. The matter is for which particular people the term is used by ALLAH in Quran ? And surely each of such terms in Quran must correspond to particular people since otherwise Quran's message would be ambiguous, wouldn't it ? And as you also admit, the term ?the people of the book? by context in the Quran is only used to describe the Jews and the Christians.
If the Quran wasn?t the last scripture we today would have been categorized in a new scripture with the Jews and the Christians as ?people of the book? since we study the Quran.
If the Quran wasn?t the last scripture then ALLAH would have choosen the terms He used in Quran accordingly.
peace
-
You can use the term ?the people of the book? as you wish..no problem. The matter is for which particular people the term is used by ALLAH in Quran ? And surely each of such terms in Quran must correspond to particular people since otherwise Quran's message would be ambiguous, wouldn't it ? And as you also admit, the term ?the people of the book? by context in the Quran is only used to describe the Jews and the Christians.
If the Quran wasn?t the last scripture then ALLAH would have choosen the terms He used in Quran accordingly.
peace
People of the book in the quran is desribed for anyone with a book, and christians and jews had books so they are included. But you see, muslims also have a book called quran right? So they are also among people of the book. So when the prophet got these message he would be thinking about the people who had a book, mostly known as jews and christians but since Quran is timeless the 'people of the book' also means muslims today since they also have a book.
So muslims are also 'people of the book'