Except what Allah wills thee to forget ??
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Peace mubashir55.
Again mistranslation of the scripture causes difficulties that are not there, let us give few more verses to get the context and hopefully the meaning?
876 We will recite to you; do not forget.
877 Everything is in accordance with GOD's will; He knows what is declared, and what is hidden.
878 We will direct you to the easiest path.
879 Therefore, you shall remind; perhaps the reminder will benefit.
8710 The reverent will take heed.
8711 The wicked will avoid it.This confirms there is no abrogation. "Do not forget" Follow the word of GOD only!
Peace.Pl good logic, do not follow the footprints of Asad, by trying to translate the Arabix Text even without knowing about the particularities of the words used therein.
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Peace Mazhar.
I told you before , I do not follow anyone ( idols) except my Lord.
GOD teaches/explains/guides with HIS words. All translations are there for checking/analysing/comparing.
Peace.
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Peace Mazhar.
I told you before , I do not follow anyone ( idols) except my Lord.
GOD teaches/explains/guides with HIS words. All translations are there for checking/analysing/comparing.
Peace.
This is an idols whisper, nothing else. Principles of translation are laid down and world wide accepted. Not following the accepted norms but find such excuses is satanic whispers. Take care and remain fascinated.
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Thanks for your help Good Logic
Dear Mazhar,
Kindly provide us with (which in your view is) a better translation of the verse/s being discussed.
For those of us who do not know Arabic it becomes confusing when translators do not do a proper job or read secondary sources into the Qur'an.
Please read the way more than 25 translators render this verse at www.islamawakned.com. They are supposed to know what they are doing!!
Question Why would Allah make the Messenger "forget" Qur'an which he was told to preach!! He needed to remember releveant verses to make a point when discussing vital issues with his audience!!
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Thanks for your help Good Logic
Dear Mazhar,
Kindly provide us with (which in your view is) a better translation of the verse/s being discussed.
For those of us who do not know Arabic it becomes confusing when translators do not do a proper job or read secondary sources into the Qur'an.
Please read the way more than 25 translators render this verse at www.islamawakned.com. They are supposed to know what they are doing!!
Question Why would Allah make the Messenger "forget" Qur'an which he was told to preach!! He needed to remember releveant verses to make a point when discussing vital issues with his audience!!
The point is missed. What is being translated? The Arabic text of Qur'aan. Can you put underneath it in target language a future verb under the past verb?
What to say of 25 if there were hundred doing the same thing they are to be discarded with one stroke.First read the individual words. The first word begins with "seen", future particle-removes away the point in time of speech---it has recurrence meanings in future----the verb suffixed to it is doubly transitive----where is second object of verb in the translations?
Shaa is Past Verb. How can you translate it in present and future proposition?
Had Asad known and verified it as doubly transitive verb he might not had given his explanatory note like that.
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Question Why would Allah make the Messenger "forget" Qur'an which he was told to preach!! He needed to remember releveant verses to make a point when discussing vital issues with his audience!!
Salaam Mubashir,
There is no mention of the Messenger in aayat quoted, it is referring to reader.
mmKhan
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Kindly provide us with (which in your view is) a better translation of the verse/s being discussed.
Qur'aan has nowhere allowed the translators to bring in their views. It is clarified that this is not poetry. In poetry everybody has a right to bring in his own interpretations including meanings of personal choice.
Every particle and word must be fully translated in the target language to avoid the translational loss and resultant distortion of the concept and thought conveyed in that text. Every word must be fully translated. In one to one talk the known objective is elided to retain the succint nature of language.
We in future too will cause gradual-intermittent reading to you the Messenger the text of Qur'aan.
The result of this reading is that you the Messenger do not, and will never forget it.
The reason for not forgetting is none except that Allah the Exalted did not so will.
It is fact that He the Exalted fully knows that which is manifestly visible and that which is hidden .
And We will cause comfort for you by gradual reading for purpose of convenience -
Qur'aan has nowhere allowed the translators to bring in their views. It is clarified that this is not poetry. In poetry everybody has a right to bring in his own interpretations including meanings of personal choice.
Every particle and word must be fully translated in the target language to avoid the translational loss and resultant distortion of the concept and thought conveyed in that text. Every word must be fully translated. In one to one talk the known objective is elided to retain the succint nature of language.
We in future too will cause gradual-intermittent reading to you the Messenger the text of Qur'aan.
The result of this reading is that you the Messenger do not, and will never forget it.
The reason for not forgetting is none except that Allah the Exalted did not so will.
It is fact that He the Exalted fully knows that which is manifestly visible and that which is hidden .
And We will cause comfort for you by gradual reading for purpose of convenienceQur'aan has nowhere allowed the translators to bring in their views
We in future too will cause gradual-intermittent reading to you the Messenger the text of Qur'aan.
The result of this reading is that you the Messenger do not, and will never forget it.
The reason for not forgetting is none except that Allah the Exalted did not so will.
It is fact that He the Exalted fully knows that which is manifestly visible and that which is hidden .
And We will cause comfort for you by gradual reading for purpose of convenience&
May Allah protect and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Arabic Pronouns are DEFINITE. "Ka" denotes only and only a specific person. In translation the personal pronouns needbe translated for the reader of target language. It is not ones thought. What is in the parentheses that is done by me while mentioned him the Messenger obeying the command given to me as believer elsewhere in Qur'aan.
The discourse is about reading and forgetting---issue is about memory----reading the text is apparent-visible on paper---nothing to do with forgetting----its other part is in memory--the hidden aspect of data-text. Purpose of convenience is understood--the discharge of his assignment---when you at other places the objective of gradual revelation and reading---it is for the comfort and to make the job of the Messenger easy.
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Agreed! But who will decide who is that specific person? I say it is reader because if it is referring to messenger it is said so as rasool or nabi.
Ok. But before "Ka" there is another pronoun in the verb that refers to the Subject of Verb. It is "We". What you say whom "We" refers and why?
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Ok. But before "Ka" there is another pronoun in the verb that refers to the Subject of Verb. It is "We". What you say whom "We" refers and why?
Why you always change topic brother?
Anyways, "WE" is not referring to Allah for sure. If you want, I can write an article on WE confirming that it is not referring to Allah, inshaAllah.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Why you always change topic brother?
Anyways, "WE" is not referring to Allah for sure. If you want, I can write an article on WE confirming that it is not referring to Allah, inshaAllah. )
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhanIt is the same topic----to first learn abc about pronouns before giving judgments. "We" needs to be associated first, since this Pronoun is the Subject of Verb, the Object of verb comes later on. First refer the Pronoun "We"--identifying who they are.
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It is the same topic----to first learn abc about pronouns before giving judgments. "We" needs to be associated first, since this Pronoun is the Subject of Verb, the Object of verb comes later on. First refer the Pronoun "We"--identifying who they are.
Why you repeat it again when I have already given you answer who WE is as per my understanding? hmm
mmKhan
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Why you repeat it again when I have already given you answer who WE is as per my understanding? hmm
mmKhan
You have not given. Pronoun has to be specified. "We" refers to whom? Saying "it is not referring to Allah" does not specify as to who are referred by "We".
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You have not given. Pronoun has to be specified. "We" refers to whom? Saying "it is not referring to Allah" does not specify as to who are referred by "We".
I THINK, "we" may be referring to some authorities who work for Allah. If you have answer please enlighten me but please please please with an aayat.
mmKhan
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I THINK, "we" may be referring to some authorities who work for Allah. If you have answer please enlighten me but please please please with an aayat.
mmKhan
And you earlier said that "Ka" pronoun is for the reader, say mmkhan when he is the reader. In the light of meanings of these two pronouns what you mean is "I think some authories who work for Allah read to me, mmkhan". however you have not yet specified who those authorities are since pronoun is always definite. Similarly your thinking does not tell me what those authorities keep reading to you, mmkhan.
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Thank you all for your comments/suggestions.
Just wanted to share another interpretation that has been suggested
"And Allah created you; then He will take you in death. And among you is he who is reversed to the most decrepit age so that he will not know, after knowledge, a thing. Indeed, Allah is Knowing and Competent." 1670
Allah has willed that when a man reaches old age he ".. will not know, after knowledge, a thing."
This is the will of Allah mentioned in 876-7 i.e. Allah will make the addressee read and he will not forget, except what Allah has willed i.e. the phenomenon mentioned in 1670 that when man reaches old age he becomes forgetful.
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This is what is ensured about the Messenger that he will never be in this category.
Know it that Allah the Exalted has created you people. Afterwards , He alienates/segregates you people
However, there is someone living amongst you who is made to regressively return towards the relatively dependent-feeble of the period of life culminating at nethermost-non verbal infancy.
The explanation-reason-effect of regression is that henceforth he might not trace/separate/locate/ acknowledge-retrieve knowledge of something, after having attained knowledge.
It is a certain fact that Allah the Exalted is eternally the all-Knowing, eternally the dominant.Read about Alzheimer.
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=14947.msg139905#msg139905