A forum section called "Consensus"?
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Peace Hicham.
Please let me clarify what I mean by " Ambiguous" topics.
GOD does not give a choice on " Submission to HIM" ( upholding HIS authority Alone) ,nor does HE give a choice on commandements.
However, on Serving HIM/ worship, the guidelines leave some choice for the individuals, GOD knows/recognises each individual and how much they can bear. ( like salat, zakat, sawm,...) I call these " Ambiguous topics.
Peace. -
SA.
@ Brother/Sister Savage_Carrot.
You are entirely right, i didn't not explain fully on my first post because i wanted to see the response from others before clarifying further.
(Please remember that this is just a seemingly draft of my idea, and in no way final)What i had personally in mind is that perhaps, the moderators of FM could point out a couple of members they know and trust, who are not biased towards one way of thinking even if they have their own opinions on certain topics.
These members would run this certain subsection of the forums, call it whatever.This subsection will hold threads of most topics, and within these threads, opionions can be added only by these appointed members.
A thread, say it was on the topic of Salaat
Would include, what i know from memory of what i have read here and there.- An understanding of what salaat is
- Arguemented discussions of it being twice a day, 3 times a day etc.
A link referring to each discussions or other articles relating to the discussions on salaat.
Thread closed!
Then, lets say someone posts an article on salaat which gives an entirely different point of view on this matter.
And it cannot be entirely argued against, members of the forum can then opt for this new view to be added to the closed thread on Salaat. The appointed members will then take it into consideration(or however we agree to make it work) to add to the closed consensus thread or not.In this way we keep discussions alive and easy to find, and we also help to create a database of important issues that capture the mental time of many.
@ Brother/sister Good Logic.
I understand what you mean, which is why i was thinking there should be certain criterias to adding to such a thread.
F. example that the Qu'ran is indeed the book of Allah and "GOD does not give a choice on " Submission to HIM" ( upholding HIS authority Alone) ,nor does HE give a choice on commandements." as you said.
Therefore, any discussions regarding doubting the Qu'ran in itself or anything else that questions belief would not make it to the consensus thread and will remain a discussion amongst members.
In this way, in my opinion, we uphold the general idea of free discussion without comprimizing the word of Allah.
Remember, that it is still an idea, and in no way perfected.
We could help each other to make it work.
I really think it would benefit many with such a place to learn more about the Qu'ran. -
w/salaam Hicham, all,
I think this is a good idea in principle. I tried something similar for the salat section, and even though it was rarely referred to, it does seem to have a lot of views, so I assume it is working somewhat.
I just called it Compilation of discussions on aspects of salat
Rather than a new section however, I think within each section, e.g. "hajj", a summary/compilation thread can be made sticky, similar to the above thread on salat.
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SA.
@ Brother/Sister Savage_Carrot.
You are entirely right, i didn't not explain fully on my first post because i wanted to see the response from others before clarifying further.
(Please remember that this is just a seemingly draft of my idea, and in no way final)What i had personally in mind is that perhaps, the moderators of FM could point out a couple of members they know and trust, who are not biased towards one way of thinking even if they have their own opinions on certain topics.
These members would run this certain subsection of the forums, call it whatever.This subsection will hold threads of most topics, and within these threads, opionions can be added only by these appointed members.
A thread, say it was on the topic of Salaat
Would include, what i know from memory of what i have read here and there.- An understanding of what salaat is
- Arguemented discussions of it being twice a day, 3 times a day etc.
A link referring to each discussions or other articles relating to the discussions on salaat.
Thread closed!
Then, lets say someone posts an article on salaat which gives an entirely different point of view on this matter.
And it cannot be entirely argued against, members of the forum can then opt for this new view to be added to the closed thread on Salaat. The appointed members will then take it into consideration(or however we agree to make it work) to add to the closed consensus thread or not.In this way we keep discussions alive and easy to find, and we also help to create a database of important issues that capture the mental time of many.
I suggested a stickied and/or locked thread because it would serve a similar purpose as having a separate category and additionally, would not limit us to only certain members doing it. The admin could give any view added or that they add themselves a once over seeing if it is meeting a basic criteria of being understood from the quran etc even if it's something they may not agree with.
Something like this
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598319.0
One could have a consistent format for the way it's added with a blurb and then the link to the discussion. Many members have their own threads about their understandings in the first post and then go on to discuss them etc. I think that's more dynamic and up to date rather than adding a static understanding and then having it disproved, changing their minds, asking for edits and deletions etc. They can do that all on their discussion thread and we'd have to read those threads obviously even if they are a 100 pages. If you're asking for a more article based format, then we have those as well but along with it are things like understanding a verse differently but not a whole article on the ramifications etc so on. So are we asking for article based/complete understandings? Or more like different views even if it's just a verse? Or both?
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w/salaam Hicham, all,
I think this is a good idea in principle. I tried something similar for the salat section, and even though it was rarely referred to, it does seem to have a lot of views, so I assume it is working somewhat.
I just called it Compilation of discussions on aspects of salat
Rather than a new section however, I think within each section, e.g. "hajj", a summary/compilation thread can be made sticky, similar to the above thread on salat.
Exactly so.
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SA!
The post as made by Wakas was very much what i had in mind.
Maybe with an added summary of sorts to the topic at hand + a short summary of different opinions(very short ones).As for its placement. I merely suggested a gathering of all posts such as that one under one subsection so as to create a database of sorts.
However, if it is easier and more convienient to do each topic under their respective forums, then that is how it should be.EDIT Naturally the biggest criteria would be to keep the post updated to reflect current discussions if there ever was any.
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Sounds good. If you have a compilation for different categories let us know. We can all work on it. I'd very much, like you, want it to have a consistent format with a short summary/blurb rather than just links too.
peace
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Greetings and Peace, all group
I'm not sure if "Consensus" is possible...maybe a section dedicated to subjects that is further divided into support for and against each individual subject. Double points for links to supporting threads!
An example follows
Big topic is Fasting.
Suptopic is Fasting is for ten days.
The subtopic could be partitioned into Yes, No, Yes (however...), and No (however...).
It is more honest to look at both sides of an argument, but those prone to actually argue have an area to voice their views without impeding the flow of information. If one supported the topic, they would post in "Yes" or "Yes, however..." and not post in "No." Anyone not supporting the topic would post in "No" or "No, however..." and not in "Yes." There are plenty of forums for anyone intending to "mix it up."
3918 The ones who listen to what is being said, and then follow the best of it. These are the ones whom GOD has guided, and these are the ones who possess intelligence.
Just an opinion.
ALLAH knows best!
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
I'm not sure if "Consensus" is possible...maybe a section dedicated to subjects that is further divided into support for and against each individual subject. Double points for links to supporting threads! )
An example follows
Big topic is Fasting.
Suptopic is Fasting is for ten days.
The subtopic could be partitioned into Yes, No, Yes (however...), and No (however...).
It is more honest to look at both sides of an argument, but those prone to actually argue have an area to voice their views without impeding the flow of information. If one supported the topic, they would post in "Yes" or "Yes, however..." and not post in "No." Anyone not supporting the topic would post in "No" or "No, however..." and not in "Yes." There are plenty of forums for anyone intending to "mix it up."
3918 The ones who listen to what is being said, and then follow the best of it. These are the ones whom GOD has guided, and these are the ones who possess intelligence.
Just an opinion.
ALLAH knows best!
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
SA.
I am unsure of exactly what you mean Brother Abdul-Hadi.
You would create 3 different threads for the same topic? a "Yes", "Maybe" and "No"?
Could you clarify, as it seems rather tedious.
@Savage_Carrot
At the moment, i do not have a compilation of different topics at all.
But a thread could be created in which we gather links for all sorts of hot topics and start working on creating the threads that are to be stickied, in the same manner as the one made by Brother Wakas. -
Peace,
Abdul-Hadi, not sure if I understand the concept correctly? At the moment what we want to do is a stickied thread in different categories with compilations of links to different discussions about common topics e.g. salat, hajj, dress issues etc
Hicham, I'll create a sticky thread in this section and we can start adding links under different headers and we can work out the format along with it if wanted. Once we have a decent amount, I'll create the stickies under the different categories and paste.
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http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9604158.0
The temp thread for now.
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Greetings and Peace, all group
SA.
I am unsure of exactly what you mean Brother Abdul-Hadi.
You would create 3 different threads for the same topic? a "Yes", "Maybe" and "No"?
Could you clarify, as it seems rather tedious.
@Savage_Carrot
At the moment, i do not have a compilation of different topics at all.
But a thread could be created in which we gather links for all sorts of hot topics and start working on creating the threads that are to be stickied, in the same manner as the one made by Brother Wakas.-[ Technically the suggestion was for four forks at the termination point of each subtopic (yes/yes;however/no/no;however). One would follow a topic to subtopic to the point of interest. Supporting and opposing viewpoints are offered, BUT in separate areas for clarity. It would be possible to go with just yes (support)/no (don't support)--however valuable input may be lost/obfuscated thereby.
I was suggesting starting a pyramid-style form of organization rather than stickies because understandings are so diverse that sometimes things get bogged down. (How many threads are there that go on for dozens or even hundreds of pages?) hmm
If the organization is put into place, the members of FM will populate the "sticks" of each branch with leaves; each according to their understanding, while at the same time not disturbing the efforts of others. This also helps make sure that no single understanding dominates. Mods and Admins can do what they do best, without getting tied up or becoming insta-scholars. )
There might be better plans; the post was an attempt to contribute.
May ALLAH see fit to Guide all seekers.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
