GOGS/idolaters and MAGOGS/disbelievers theory
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Salam Johan
Theology of Cheikh dukhani is a little complicated and he wrote more than hundred pages in French. Cheikh Dukhani has many other amazing theories.
He divides humanity in three main categories
1- Idolaters=Muslims to scholars (humans that follows sheikhs, pastors rabiis etc?)
2- Disbelievers (who don?t believe in GOD)
3- Muslims to GodAccording to his definition
Mu?min=Muslim to God + Jihad (by money, fighting etc.)
Idolaters=believers that believe in God and other things and follow books written by humans and attributed to god.Notice that for Cheikh Dukhani, idolaters are the worst enemies of Muslims to God, even more than disbelievers. It is because they are big liers and they distort and pervert words of God. It is also, according to him, because idolaters are people who fought the prophets. All prophets came in original Gog territories.
However, Muslim can not be Muslims as we use to use this term. Muslims are who believe in God and the thereafter and make good things in name of god. They can be not Muslims in the sense we know actually and can be, falsely, classified for example as Christians or Jews or others. They received the book but not the last version called Koran.
Personally, I like the interpretation that good Christians and good Jews will be considered by God as Muslims to him.I think that the author don?t believe in the return of Jesus and in the Dajjal because there is no mention of them in Koran. In fact, he doesn?t believe that Jesus is the messie but consider that Yeshua Bin Nun, who he consider as the nephew of Moses, is the true issa ibn meriem . There is many Messies that appeared in history and all are false. All future Messies would be false.
The era settings for the history of Gog and Magog in Koran would be the era of Cyrus II.
According to this theory, the conquests conducted by Alexander the great, soon after Cyrus II era, could be considered as the first big wave of Magogs over the Gogs. The diffusion of Christiannity in Europe could be considered as the first big wave of Gogs over the Magogs.Allahou aalem
Salam noshirk,
I wonder if you're aware of this interpretation of muslim and mu'min.
I wonder if you see any difference in this interpretation with that of the sheikh.Do you think the sheikh believes that believing in the Quran would mean idolizing it?
Would love to learn more on the idea of messiah, since AFAIK it's not so clear either in the Quran on the subject.
Thanks
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Would love to learn more on the idea of messiah, since AFAIK it's not so clear either in the Quran on the subject.
Salaam Johan,
You missed something bro. It has to be "it's not so clear to me either in the Quran on the subject". You already know that AlQuraan explains everything in detail.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Salaam Johan,
You missed something bro. It has to be "it's not so clear to me either in the Quran on the subject". You already know that AlQuraan explains everything in detail.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhansalam mmKhan,
thanks for the correction bro, yes i misssed that out..
but perhaps you have favourite thread on it that you might want to share the link with me? -
to johan
Do you think the sheikh believes that believing in the Quran would mean idolizing it?
of course, no.
However the term coranist or quran only follower is not a quaran term and the coranist term looks like a name of a sect.
i like more the expression muslim to god used by Cheikh Dukhani. It is a quranic term.idolizing quran is a provoking sentence but we have to remember that islam is submission to god and not to his creation and that quran is a creation from god.
I think that studiyng only quran is not sufficient to understant islam.
we have to include all creation of god in th study. For example, olds testaments, all types of science, history...salam
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to johan
of course, no.
However the term coranist or quran only follower is not a quaran term and the coranist term looks like a name of a sect.
i like more the expression muslim to god used by Cheikh Dukhani. It is a quranic term.i agree as per verse 2278
idolizing quran is a provoking sentence but we have to remember that islam is submission to god and not to his creation and that quran is a creation from god.
i'm not sure if the word of God is His creation or is part of Him
though I would tend toward the latter
This expression seem to resonate to me better
Anything you say or do can and will be held against you in a court of law.I think that studiyng only quran is not sufficient to understant islam.
we have to include all creation of god in th study. For example, olds testaments, all types of science, history...salam
I agree partially about not focusing entirely on quran ("the book" on how to understand islam
only in the sens that is if the quran is taken literally
i.e. to stop at the quranic text without delving more on the symbolic meaning and it's implication of exploring the world around us
so we definitely need to explore the world around us as that is what the quran symbolically is implying us to doit may not be telling us to create labs for a seti program but we can derive that symbolically to mean that..hehe
I disagree about the previous scriptures being part of the study because it might mislead us, unless we take it only as an interpretation which can be falsified just as the interpretation of the physicist on the facts of physical properties derived from the observation of the universe
as interpretations and observations are man made
but ayaat kauniyyah the observed phenomenons are The Creator's willwallahua3lam
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salam mmKhan,
thanks for the correction bro, yes i misssed that out..
but perhaps you have favourite thread on it that you might want to share the link with me?Salaam brother Johan,
You are very welcome bro.
favorite thread on? hmm I did not get it really, please explain further. You mean on Gogs and Magogs? If yes, sorry I don't know any thread about it.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Salaam brother Johan,
You are very welcome bro.
favorite thread on? hmm I did not get it really, please explain further. You mean on Gogs and Magogs? If yes, sorry I don't know any thread about it.
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhanSalaam brother mmKhan,
no, what i meant was about the idea of messiah bro..
thanks and happy raya (taqabballah minna wa minkum, minal 3aideen wal faaizeen inshaallah)
won't be around for the next two-three weeks -
Salaam brother mmKhan,
no, what i meant was about the idea of messiah bro..
thanks and happy raya (taqabballah minna wa minkum, minal 3aideen wal faaizeen inshaallah)
won't be around for the next two-three weeksSalaam brother Johan,
I am planning to write something on Esa soon inshaAllah. Thanks and same to you, but what is raya? You mean Eid? or city of Nepal? P
BTW, taking leave for two-three weeks? Do you live in Arab country? .
May Allah increase us in knowledge and guide us to His true path pr
mmKhan -
Gog and Magog are people of northern area, which by the time of the Quran writing was largely uncharted and unknown.
The nomadic people inhabiting the "Northern Part" who has consistently strike fear due to their sudden attack and raid since ancient times.
They're recognized by many names throughout the century, starting from "The Hun", "The Turks", "The Mongols" etc..Scientifically they're being named as "Altaic People" due to the similarity of their language.
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altaic_languages.The Romans, The Persians and The Chinese share the similarities of this 'constant fear' about them. And ALL of them built some kind of wall to contain them. The most dazzling is not the wall made by Persians (Cyrus) or Romans but the wall made by the Chinese!
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Wall_of_ChinaWhich has proven to be not enough to hold the invasion of the "Barbaric People from The North".
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongol_conquestsSo as we speak now in current modern time..
The Altaic / Gog Magog people has indeed migrate, invade and spread nearly all across the globe. The history has recorded the devastating effect of the Hun Invasion, the Mongol invasion, the Turkic invasion and the German + Japanese invasion in WWII etc..Now they have mixed with the rest of humanity and now they have become "us".
The "Prophecy" has been fulfilled many centuries ago..Salam / Peace