The Source of everything that exists is infinitely gentle
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I feel God. I would say that if we get in touch with our essence or should I say our conscience we can feel the truth about God.
The way I see the truth is that there is an infinite Source of everything that exists, whom people traditionally call God and Hem is( I say Hem instead of Him or Her) is best described by myself in one word as Gentleness. The Source of everything that exists is infinitely Gentle.
Thanks
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I feel God.
The Source of everything that exists is infinitely Gentle.I have no idea what your intentions are with this thread. I just have 1 question if you think you feel something, why would you want to substantiate it with something physical, like what is the source of 15?
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As evidenced by this verse
2186 - And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me, so they should answer My call and believe in Me that they may walk in the right way.
In my experience it has only been by paying attention to the most subtle of the subtlest signs in reality that one hears God loud, booming and clear, constantly in communication with the soul.
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I am going to copy and paste first post and ad something on the bottom
I feel God. I would say that if we get in touch with our essence or should I say our conscience we can feel the truth about God.
The way I see the truth is that there is an infinite Source of everything that exists, whom people traditionally call God and Hem is( I say Hem instead of Him or Her) is best described by myself in one word as Gentleness. The Source of everything that exists is infinitely Gentle.
Thanks
And to ad that everything is OK. So there is never any need to be to hard on yourself. It's OK therefore to be reasonable.
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Simple, subtle, yet touching )
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Do you see infinite gentleness in the descriptions of what will happen to the unbelievers in hell?
How do you understand the following?
34 Those who disbelieve in God's revelations incur severe retribution. God is Almighty, Avenger
5.95 God has pardoned past offenses.But if anyone returns to such an offense, God will avenge it. God is Almighty, Avenger
7136 Consequently we avenged their actions, and drowned them in the sea.
4416 The day we strike the big stroke, we will avenge.And for the believers, what are your thoughts about how infinite gentleness can exist when the desired outcome is fear? 2150 Do not fear them, and fear me instead.
3175 Do not fear them, fear me instead if you are believers
515 Say I fear if I disobeyed my Lord the retribution of an awesome day. -
Lena do you not think that if God pleased, the punishment of Hell could be infinitely more horrendous than it is already? What is death by drowning when humans do death by a thousand cuts?
If your perfect judgement states a group has earned a severe punishment and also you are the merciful, then surely are you not going to give them the least severe punishment that is still severe and of equal retribution?
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Lena do you not think that if God pleased, the punishment of Hell could be infinitely more horrendous than it is already?
What can be more horrendous than the following torture?
Sura 456 Surely those who disbelieve in our revelations, we will condemn them to the hellfire. Whenever their skins are burnt, we will give them new skins. Thus they will suffer continuously.
Sura 2219 -22
As for those who disbelieve, they will have clothes of fire tailored for them. Hellish liquid will be poured on top of their heads.
It will cause their isides to melt, as well as their skins. They will be confined to iron pots. Whenever they try to exit such misery, they will be forced back in. "taste the agony of burning".I am wondering, is the thought of torture and punishment an effective deterrant to sin? Is this kind of religious talk acceptable in a humane society? What are the reasons for these graphic descriptions of terrible punishments being in Quran?
Research shows that the use of negative incentives and "punishment " does little to change behaviour in the long term. In fact it can actually escalate unwanted behaviours as I can testify from my own personal experience of being a child raised with the "deterrant" of violent punishment. My thoughts are that it is a true act of love to treat a sinner / criminal with human dignity and to provide every effort to rehabilitate them while condemning the sin they have committed (and supporting the victims/ victims family).
Also, I see loss of freedom as an ultimate solution rather than a punishment. While it may be necessary to keep those who cannot be rehabilitated away from society (eg psychopaths), in any humane, modern and just society, the emphasis is not on punishment but on rehabilitation. Therefore, for those who have to be deprived of their freedom in the interests of protecting society, they must be kept in conditions that provide for human dignity (including work and education).
In the Christian religion, the gospel of Jesus is based on Jesus teachings about Gods love for sinners, rather than on Gods punishment of sinners. First John 48-9 says, ?Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
Romans 5 1-11 teaches the radical idea that God loves the sinner
According to many Christians, the gospel of LOVE that Jesus preached (and the sacrifice of Jesus) was a new contract with God which abrogated the punishment orientated Old Testament and prepared us for living in a humane modern society.The Quran has many verses testifying to Gods infinite mercy and forgiveness which are ultimate forms of God's love for us along with the allegory of Paradise. Certainly I have found that to be a sinner and to have access to Gods mercy and forgiveness upon my repentance is an exquisite feeling of love! Thinking of the allegory of the hell fire is terrifying and scary, but does it really change the behaviour of unbelievers and sinners?
The only way I can understand the descriptions of torture of humans by God in Quran, and the constant reference to punishment, is to see these verses as allegorical and part of the social control techniques that God has provided for believers to internalise so that we remain on the straight path of righteousness.
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Conscience is very gentle and it comes from an infinitelly gentle Source of everything.
Can any one of you in your own words, by listening to your own conscience and reasoning write why would one and only infinite Source of everything be in need of punishing anyone in an eternal suffering?
Or why would Hem(I say Hem for God instead of Hhi or Her)be punishing anyone at all?
Thanks
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On both counts
3828 - Shall we treat those who believe and do good like the mischief-makers in the earth? Or shall we make those who guard (against evil) like the wicked?
Remember we cannot pick and choose the absolute truth. The absolute truth is ever abiding and irresistible yield willingly or unwillingly. God is the epitome of justice and mercy, as it is the case that punishment is required for those who commit evil, may I ask you to direct your attention to why punishment is earned rather than trying to shy away from the very clear self-evident reality in front of you. A reality where creatures have been feasting on each other over billions of years. Acknowledging the perfection of God one must find out what justice and mercy truly mean rather than holding our own ideals as the gold standard.
Surely We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to be unfaithful to it and feared from it, and man has turned unfaithful to it; surely he is unjust, ignorant;
So Allah will chastise the hypocritical men and the hypocritical women and the polytheistic men and the polytheistic women, and Allah will turn (mercifully) to the believing women, and Allah is Forgiving, MercifulWhile living creatures cannot always handle the pain and suffering, certainly God experiences the entire universe and certainly God can take the pain He dishes out to himself.
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Like I said, conscience is very gentle so whoever gave it to us would be infinitely gentle. Now, I want to ask everyone to look into their own conscience and write what does it feel like Source is like. Feel and then articulate the best you can. Pick from the thoughts that come to mind, like me.
Think about it. The Source of everything would have given us the ability to feel the truth about Hem( I say Hem instead of Him or Her). Otherwise Hem wouldn't be fair. Now, the infinite Source of everything who is infinitely good is fair to everyone.
Thanks
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People mostly, due to religion, have a very personified and human-like image of God. It's a image of a thing... but God is not a creation, and that's why we should not associate anything with it. We should not make images of God... mental images and constructs. This is where things go wrong and we go astray. Going astray is in essence 'not knowing God' and 'having a faulty image of God'. Understanding, seeing and feeling reality is the same as knowing God. It has nothing to do with blind faith... but all to do with perceiving and sensing.
It is not really God that punishes anyone... it is they themselves who create punishment for themselves by distancing themselves from God. We move away from reality, by going deeper into an illusion. This is to go astray. When we are in an illusion, we act accordingly, without heed for the principles of life. We are senseless and out of touch, wandering in darkness without knowing it. Being away from God is the same as punishment. It's a condition, not an action done by a vengeful guy-in-the-sky. Life is then all about moving back to God, back to reality, back to clarity and an open vision. This is done by purifying oneself with the help of the lessons one gets in life. When hardship hits you, it is a sign that there is some lesson to learn about reality, for one's improvement. If we at this moment, when things get tough and miserable, turn away and decide there is no God, or that God is unfair (which is the same as believing there is no God), then we are stuck... and we'll keep getting the same miserable lessons until we decide to learn, if ever.
Religion is unfortunately useless for achieving an experience of God. Religion demands conformity and shut down minds and spirits, and therefore often just leads deeper into stagnation and ignorance.
And we should be very careful in jumping to conclusions about what is justice, punishment, fairness, God, good, bad...
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I posted on one of the Buddhist forums a thread Is Buddha infinitely good and gentle and the following is in part an answer to my thread to wich I responded. Following was a part of a post posted by keithBC
by KeithBC ? Tue Oct 23, 2012 612 pm
As any parent or pet owner knows, sometimes being good means a firm and perhaps forceful "No!" So good, yes. Gentle, no
I would like to explain how you are also infinitely gentle, which is infinitely good
If you were in a so called nirvana( nirvana is what I believe the peace of the Source is like or similar) you wouldn't have to let's say partake in saying no when someone asks you for something. But on a so called "planet earth" as a human we might say no because it might be a more compassionate choice than saying yes.
So by being gentle, good and reasonable in this circumstance on "planet earth" than that's infinitely good and gentle. You should look at the circumstance you are in before you decide how good you are. You are allowed to give yourself reasons for doing what you do. Reasons are sometimes called excuses.
Thanks
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Is there anyone who might want to comment on what I have written. Remember there is nothing thats wrong to Source. Source is infinite and there is no end to Hems(I use Hem instead of Him or Her) compassion and gentleness. Evil is not wrong to the Source wich means free will means free will.
Thanks