:: Gh-Fa-Ra does not mean forgive/forgiveness ::
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I am not exactly sure how I started thinking of this topic again. But now I realize that I may be lying about God if I say He is the forgiver of sins. But is it lying? If God punishes us in this world and purifies us that can be considered overlooking and forgiving our sins, right? Then on the Day of Judgment, those things would not be mentioned? So it is overlooking, or forgiving, or pardoning? However, the verse I posted last (4237), I don't understand how WE are supposed to do that??
Salam glorytothegracious,
You mentioned 'the day of judgement', but to me 'yawmi alddeen' means 'the time of obligation/accountability'.
Say you told the lie, when 'your obligation' (deenaka) was to tell the truth. So God will determine 'the time of obligation/accountability' for you. Usually it starts with a realization of the lie. It will haunt you so that perhaps you may want to make amends by begging for forgiveness from God and the implicated party. But if you ignore the realization, then in 'the end' (yawmi al-akhirati) you will get the punishment 'permanently' (khalidoon) until the time of departing from this world @death.
And all these happens in this worldly life, since to me there are three phases of life
• created in the spiritual realm (ghayb = present in absence) the same time as the first man
• born into this world by assuming a physical body and given a temporary life
• back to the spiritual realm
We have feel (happy or sad, assured or fear, calmness or agitated, ease or pain, etc.) because we have the physical body that comes with the heart and the mind. In the spiritual relm, there is no feel because we do not possess the physical aspects (heart and mind) to feel.
There is of course the shielded realm (barzakh), but this is for those who, in this worldly life, have gone astray from the godly path, thus they couldn't find the return path to God. Their bodies may have rottened to dust in the graves but their 'selves' (anfus) are in limbo - neither in this worldly realm nor in the spiritual realm. They could not find the way of return to 'rahmatu allah'.
To those people currently living in this world, like you and me now, the selves of those people noted in the above paragraph remain in a passive or inactive state.
While those people who were truly in the godly path, especially true servants of God, their selves are alive or in an active state in us. Please read 2154.
But this is my personal comprehension, and it is alright by me if you choose to ignore this because this is very much a subject of metaphysics (AAilmu alghayb).
Cheers!
Mohammed Noh -
Peace,
how does your understanding fit into how we are supposed to "forgive" others?
2263 Kind words and forgiveness are far
better than charity that is followed by
harm. God is Rich, Compassionate.Peace,
This is the only place I am stuck... May Allah increase our knowledge pr
Also, why doesn't God punish in this life and keep account clean when we commit idolatry? 4116
God does not punish in this life and keep account clean to have partners set up with Him, but He punishes in this life and keeps account clean other than that for whom He pleases.
Why not punish for such a severe sin? Are we going to be punished for it on the Day of Judgment then? So there is no hope? Or maybe that is where 1971 comes in? Will we be purified by entering the hellfire? Or maybe the verse is only referring to those who are "worst opposition to the Gracious." (1969)
Almost all will be in punishment always, as many of the believers are into shirk 12106.
I understand this, because, if Allah punish people who commit shirk, then the punishment will be very severe which people may not able to handle it. Why I said that? I said that on the basis of other aayaat, like Musa, punched a man to death and he was punished for 8 or 10 years 2827. And he has to work for others 2827. He has to live out of the benefits and pleasure of palace with great difficulties 2821-24.
This is all happened because he asked his Lord for Ga-Fa-Ra and it was given 2816. So, punishment is based on level of sin.
As per 1970, it is not referring to all and 1972 clarifies that Muttaqeen will not be effected.
5118 I think is during the Day of Judgment, right?
I don't think so.. It is about past. Please note the word "Iz" in 19116. Iz refers to past.
Iz = When . For example, you can take a look at 283, 284, 293, etc..
Iza = When . For example, please take a look at 291, 56, etc..833 But God was not to punish them while you are with them, nor will God punish them while they continue to seek forgiveness.
Or...
833 But God was not to punish (liyuadhibahum) them while you are with them, nor will God punish them in this life and keep their account clean while they continue to seek punishment in this life and a clean account."
I think you are getting confuse between a3zaab and maghfirat, both of them are not same 833. A3zaab is for those who do bad deeds/sins and they are unbelievers/mushriks 834. And maghfirat is not severe as a3zaab . And Allah will not give a3zaab if someone ask for maghfirat 833.
And I also understand that bad deeds is very different than sins . Sayyiaat may include only ourselves and zunoob may include others as well.
I don't know how far I am able to explain it..
4237 Those who avoid gross sins and lewdness, and when they are angered, they forgive (yaghfirna).
Answer to 4237 is given in 4239-40, inshaAllah.
I am not exactly sure how I started thinking of this topic again. But now I realize that I may be lying about God if I say He is the forgiver of sins. But is it lying? If God punishes us in this world and purifies us that can be considered overlooking and forgiving our sins, right? Then on the Day of Judgment, those things would not be mentioned? So it is overlooking, or forgiving, or pardoning? However, the verse I posted last (4237), I don't understand how WE are supposed to do that??
Red I think those things might be mentioned on the Day of Judgement but it will be clarified by mentioning its punishment in worldly life when asked for maghfirat. This is how I understand or may be those things will not be mentioned. I don't have any aayat to support this, and waiting for Allah to clarify this.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
Peace,
2 263. This is the only place I am stuck... May Allah increase our knowledge pr
Then High above all be Allah, the True King. And be not in haste with the Quran before its revelation is completed to you, and say "May Allah! Increase me in knowledge."
2 263 and 42 43. The Checkmate, by Allah for this discussion! Reading Quran through grammar and dictionary is obsolete, useless; all we shall do is to wait until His Communication through Revelation reaches each of us according to each one's context and situations; only then an ayat could be of Guidance, that delivers each one from his path of error.
Peace.
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The Quran gives us a marvellous tool in zeroing in on the correct meaning and that is its wide vocabulary. For those who say maghfirah is forgiveness, what then is afw (in 9/43 for example)? Those who say it's a synonym would need to ask the question - why did God use two different words to mean the same thing? If he is al-lathif al-kabeer (the subtle, the informing), was He being less al-lathif al-kabeer in either maghfirah or afw? It must be the height of absurdity in claiming Quran as 'furqan' if the furqan (literally a seperator which should separate two different sounds) is dismissed in favour of dictionaries.
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The Quran gives us a marvellous tool in zeroing in on the correct meaning and that is its wide vocabulary. For those who say maghfirah is forgiveness, what then is afw (in 9/43 for example)? Those who say it's a synonym would need to ask the question - why did God use two different words to mean the same thing? If he is al-lathif al-kabeer (the subtle, the informing), was He being less al-lathif al-kabeer in either maghfirah or afw? It must be the height of absurdity in claiming Quran as 'furqan' if the furqan (literally a seperator which should separate two different sounds) is dismissed in favour of dictionaries.
Sorry to have to put this here but as I have no other way of contacting you... I tried to reply to your PM but I can't because it says you can't receive personal messages?
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Every action is an impulse which affects all around it, as we drop a solid dense object in water and it creates (concentric) circular waves. The root g-f-r describes removing effects of bad impulse we created by our action. For example, if we insult somebody whenever we meet him that action of insulting him will still have an effect on both of us, unless he "forgave us".
We're doing bad things not just because we're bad persons in our nefs, but also due to not knowing better (way). We do our best but it comes out something very bad. His raHmet is needed in these situations when we can't help ourselves, and raHmet comes as His help to overcome an issue we're not able to solve. So, if we created a bad impulse, removing its effects is not the only thing we need, but we also need His raHmet to help us not to create the same or similar impulses again.