Shocking Facts about pork industry
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For some reason i can't eat pork. The smell and psychological effect it has on me of the thought of a pig rolling in it's own crap is enough to put me off, even if it does it for logical reasons, such as protecting it from sunlight or parasites. I believe there are psychological reasons as well as physical reason, however, the physical reasons are the most important for me - pork's advantages for me do not outweigh it's disadvantages, in fact, to the contrary (this is what i know so far).
Pork isn't the only thing we shouldn't be eating if we base it on the reading. The god wants us to have a healthy diet, hence mentions that we should eat the best foods of which are "good and pure". If i'm honest, my rejection of pork started of psychologically.
I knew someone who lived in India in the rural areas...He said every morning, the villagers would get up and go to the fields for their morning crap and would sit down in a line and um, defecate... and after they were done someone would shout 'release the pigs' which involved a guy with a pig tied to a leash and this pig would eat the crap one after the other. All very efficient I must admit, and he said they could only train the pigs to do so...others weren't as interested in eating crap. True story. Not the only place I've heard of people sitting down in a line for their morning rituals in rural areas but the pig bit was interesting. And not the first time I've been thankful for not having eaten pork.
You are a dirty animal.
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Somebody got to be on the pig?s side.......It is easy to bully something who cannot speak for itself. Mr FearGod is calling the pig a dirty animal, I call him a dirty animal......Childish but fair. I apologise for my childish behaviour. But if mr FearGod really fears God then he should remember the pig is created by the God that he fears.
I have had it up to my ears in people trying to "prove" that we are not supposed to eat pork because the pig is a dirty animal.
Every creature on this planet is the creation of Allah. It is wrongful to classify one of Allahs creatures as "dirty" because they do not fit in to our idea of what "clean" is. To me, not showing respect towards all Allahs creations is the same as not showing respect towards our fellow humans.
It just comes across as ignorance and shallowness. To me, posting youtube clips to prove pigs are dirty is the same as a nazi showing pictures from concentration camps saying "See I told you jews are dirty". Mr FearGod does not understand the circumstances, that it is mankind that has degraded the pig, not the pig itself. As you wrote Savage Carrot, people are even teaching the pig to eat human faeces........To me that says more about the human than the pig.
A pig without human influnce is a very clever animal and they have an amazing ability to adapt to different climates. They have a remarkable sense of family, a mother pig would defend her babies to death if attacked. They like to roll around in dirt and mud to keep cool, just like elephants, lions, dogs, dolphins and many more mammals they do not have sweat glands. Furthermore the mud hides their scent away so predators have difficulties finding them. Pigs are genetically similar to humans and therefore prone to be affected by the same illnesses as us.The domestic pig is the result of humans changing the creation of Allah by pedigree. Don't blame the pig for this.
I will fight racism wherever I find it, peace out.
http//1.bp.blogspot.com/-EDlccook6aI/Tm4E05_Je6I/AAAAAAAABBc/6Wks6t0IT4w/s1600/Wild%2BBoar%2B2%2B1%2B%2Brs.jpg -
If an animal eats shit, I'll call it a dirty animal because to me it is dirty. I'm balanced with my 'animal racism' across the board. Not sure if StopS or whoever the comment was directed towards eats shit. They can confess if they want...I won't judge cough
Trying to stand up for the rights of animals is all well and good, but singling out a member on the boards and calling him/her a dirty animal is not fair, it's wrong unless you have access to certain private information about the creature's hygiene or whatever habits. I've had it up to my ears with people missing the forest for the trees if we're exchanging peeves. Every animal can be as unique as it wants and I agree that just because it's dirty doesn't mean that we won't eat it, people eat snails or roadkill regardless of the health risks they pose. The question is should we. As far as pork goes, it's pretty clear cut we can't in the quran...why we can't is what we can debate till the pigs come home, and we do.
peace
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I read an article that had a few explanations of the dangers of pork. This is what it said
If you have a problem with pork, then so be it. But dragging false information into this is not ok. Where is this article? Could you provide a link, please?
I have no idea who wrote the paper you see fit to quote here and what their research was based on, but how can you call this scientific?
If you look at their own definition of what they do it says
"The Islamic Organization for Medical Science (IOMS) was formed to fill a need for the Muslim "Ummah" (worldwide nation), to clarify the Islamic point of view of certain medical practices, to collect Islamic medical heritage and to determine how to apply it to modern day medical practice."So you can see they admit themselves that they are not science but religion based. Just because they have the word "science" in their name does not make them scientific.
"That having been said, scientific research has discovered some health hazards related to pork . The following summary is extracted from a scientific paper on the website of the Islamic Organization for Medical Sciences
Wrong! The following is not a scientifically accurate paper. It is not based on scientific research or results.
"The more important and definitely proven hazards connected with the consumption of pork are the two parasitic zoonoses, trichinellosis and systemic cysticercosis. Both these infections can be life threatening and their prevention requires difficult measures including change of food habits.
Nonsensical claim. "definitely proven" where, how, by what means, on what group using what methodology?
They "CAN" be life threatening? When? How? Under what conditions? In what group? How often?
"difficult measures" being what? In what order and dosage? In how many? How difficult? What is difficult? Difficult for whom how many times?Of the non-communicable diseases attributable to pork consumption (food) allergy and liver cirrhosis have been shown to occur
What type? How often? How many? What percentage? What group? What error margin and how many .........................
This is crazy!!! This is some guy looking for some words which sound threatening to people and to try and frighten them away from pork using ancient superstitions and voodoo.
Stop doing stupid things like this. Please stop being so gullible and try to stick to facts when looking at science. Don't mix science with religion!
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Somebody got to be on the pig?s side.......It is easy to bully something who cannot speak for itself. Mr FearGod is calling the pig a dirty animal, I call him a dirty animal......Childish but fair. I apologise for my childish behaviour. But if mr FearGod really fears God then he should remember the pig is created by the God that he fears.
I have had it up to my ears in people trying to "prove" that we are not supposed to eat pork because the pig is a dirty animal.
Every creature on this planet is the creation of Allah. It is wrongful to classify one of Allahs creatures as "dirty" because they do not fit in to our idea of what "clean" is. To me, not showing respect towards all Allahs creations is the same as not showing respect towards our fellow humans.
It just comes across as ignorance and shallowness. To me, posting youtube clips to prove pigs are dirty is the same as a nazi showing pictures from concentration camps saying "See I told you jews are dirty". Mr FearGod does not understand the circumstances, that it is mankind that has degraded the pig, not the pig itself. As you wrote Savage Carrot, people are even teaching the pig to eat human faeces........To me that says more about the human than the pig.
A pig without human influnce is a very clever animal and they have an amazing ability to adapt to different climates. They have a remarkable sense of family, a mother pig would defend her babies to death if attacked. They like to roll around in dirt and mud to keep cool, just like elephants, lions, dogs, dolphins and many more mammals they do not have sweat glands. Furthermore the mud hides their scent away so predators have difficulties finding them. Pigs are genetically similar to humans and therefore prone to be affected by the same illnesses as us.The domestic pig is the result of humans changing the creation of Allah by pedigree. Don't blame the pig for this.
I will fight racism wherever I find it, peace out.
Please don't compare pigs to humans,you can compare them to yourself and to your dirty mind.
Muslims regard the pig as a dirty , unclean and impure animal.
But your silly excuse that god created it then we shouldn't call it a dirty animal.
So what do you call the roach,a clean insect which lives in the sinks.
can you eat your food if the roach walked over it ?,i guess you'll eat it because thats god's creation too.
Your logic is a stupid one.
its like saying why god created pigs if it'll be dirty,i guess to test the dirty minds as yours.
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If you have a problem with pork, then so be it. But dragging false information into this is not ok. Where is this article? Could you provide a link, please?
I have no idea who wrote the paper you see fit to quote here and what their research was based on, but how can you call this scientific?
If you look at their own definition of what they do it says
"The Islamic Organization for Medical Science (IOMS) was formed to fill a need for the Muslim "Ummah" (worldwide nation), to clarify the Islamic point of view of certain medical practices, to collect Islamic medical heritage and to determine how to apply it to modern day medical practice."So you can see they admit themselves that they are not science but religion based. Just because they have the word "science" in their name does not make them scientific.
Wrong! The following is not a scientifically accurate paper. It is not based on scientific research or results. Nonsensical claim. "definitely proven" where, how, by what means, on what group using what methodology?
They "CAN" be life threatening? When? How? Under what conditions? In what group? How often?
"difficult measures" being what? In what order and dosage? In how many? How difficult? What is difficult? Difficult for whom how many times?
What type? How often? How many? What percentage? What group? What error margin and how many .........................This is crazy!!! This is some guy looking for some words which sound threatening to people and to try and frighten them away from pork using ancient superstitions and voodoo.
Stop doing stupid things like this. Please stop being so gullible and try to stick to facts when looking at science. Don't mix science with religion!
If i remember correctly (because i do not have the links), the first quote was from a medical blog post from a supposed doctor, though i had my suspicions that the person may have been biased and directing everything bad towards pigs. However, the second quote about Singapore was definitely nothing to do with religion as far as i was concerned. Regardless if they are religious sites or actual medical sites, there is the same trend found that pork contains the highest level of visible fat, about 180 mg/100 g. In terms of the how what when and wheres? I couldn't find proper reasoning for it yet... no site is giving precise facts which is a bit annoying, i thought maybe it was me who couldn't find it, hence posting the quotes and seeing if someone would elaborate on the 'facts' posted. I believe the only threat that i found which is the most likely threat and the most dangerous is the one you previously mentioned - Trichinella spiralis, but i need to read into this more. I might just give this thread a miss for the time being, clearly i can't find any solid evidence from a scientific perspective that is strong enough to condemn pork altogether.
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If an animal eats shit, I'll call it a dirty animal because to me it is dirty. I'm balanced with my 'animal racism' across the board. Not sure if StopS or whoever the comment was directed towards eats shit. They can confess if they want...I won't judge cough
Trying to stand up for the rights of animals is all well and good, but singling out a member on the boards and calling him/her a dirty animal is not fair, it's wrong unless you have access to certain private information about the creature's hygiene or whatever habits. I've had it up to my ears with people missing the forest for the trees if we're exchanging peeves. Every animal can be as unique as it wants and I agree that just because it's dirty doesn't mean that we won't eat it, people eat snails or roadkill regardless of the health risks they pose. The question is should we. As far as pork goes, it's pretty clear cut we can't in the quran...why we can't is what we can debate till the pigs come home, and we do.
If someone claims that the pig is dirty because it does what it has been taught or what is in its nature to do, then he or she should first think about what is in human nature to do. We do not like what pigs like and we have certainly been trained to dislike their behaviour. But does that make it ok to describe in derogatory way whatever deviates from our nature?
It is a very vague description you have Savage to classify something as dirty just because you happen not to agree with its behaviour, I would even go to the extent and say that is quite the contrary to your belief that you have a balanced animal racism. How many pigs have you known and befriended, Savage? I bet you if you would go and spend some time with a couple of them, got to know them a little you soon realize they are cleaner than what you think. They are just happy being pigs and they live their pig life doing what pigs do, please do not think they are dirty because you heard a story about a poo eating pig in India. Or even worse.......youtube.....
Humans, not pigs, are destroying this earth faster than what we care to admit. We are polluting the air, land and sea. The farmers are trying to maximise their profit by using all different kinds of chemicals to get super-size animals. We are happily eating the meat because it is......cheap.........Who is the dirty one?
Next time someone says the pig or any other kind of animal is dirty then you should take a moment and really think about which animal is dirtiest. The one who rolls around in mud all day or the one destroying Allahs creation? I would never dare to call an animal in a derogatory manner because they have been created and blessed by Allah.
Without us nature would be in perfect balance, just the way Allah (with the help of the Quran) is asking us humans to live as well. Unfortunately we are too stupid to realize that we are the dumb ones and the rest of Allahs creations are the ones that "get" it.Maybe all of you that think the pig is dirty should take a look in the mirror first. Eventhough animals act like animals we are the dirty ones.
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If someone claims that the pig is dirty because it does what it has been taught or what is in its nature to do, then he or she should first think about what is in human nature to do. We do not like what pigs like and we have certainly been trained to dislike their behaviour. But does that make it ok to describe in derogatory way whatever deviates from our nature?
It is a very vague description you have Savage to classify something as dirty just because you happen not to agree with its behaviour, I would even go to the extent and say that is quite the contrary to your belief that you have a balanced animal racism. How many pigs have you known and befriended, Savage? I bet you if you would go and spend some time with a couple of them, got to know them a little you soon realize they are cleaner than what you think. They are just happy being pigs and they live their pig life doing what pigs do, please do not think they are dirty because you heard a story about a poo eating pig in India. Or even worse.......youtube.....
Humans, not pigs, are destroying this earth faster than what we care to admit. We are polluting the air, land and sea. The farmers are trying to maximise their profit by using all different kinds of chemicals to get super-size animals. We are happily eating the meat because it is......cheap.........Who is the dirty one?
Next time someone says the pig or any other kind of animal is dirty then you should take a moment and really think about which animal is dirtiest. The one who rolls around in mud all day or the one destroying Allahs creation? I would never dare to call an animal in a derogatory manner because they have been created and blessed by Allah.
Without us nature would be in perfect balance, just the way Allah (with the help of the Quran) is asking us humans to live as well. Unfortunately we are too stupid to realize that we are the dumb ones and the rest of Allahs creations are the ones that "get" it.Maybe all of you that think the pig is dirty should take a look in the mirror first. Eventhough animals act like animals we are the dirty ones.
Selam Emil,
I'm curious what your reasoning is behind not eating pork. I have no problem with pigs, even if they roll in crap, it may put me off a little but then I have chickens in my garden who step in crap and sometimes step on me but this is animal nature. I'd say I find some people much dirtier than animals in many respects. I don't eat pork for personal reasons, I don't like the smell, the taste etc but I'm curious what your reasoning is behind Allah prohibiting consumption of pork.
Thanks
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Selam Emil,
I'm curious what your reasoning is behind not eating pork. I have no problem with pigs, even if they roll in crap, it may put me off a little but then I have chickens in my garden who step in crap and sometimes step on me but this is animal nature. I'd say I find some people much dirtier than animals in many respects. I don't eat pork for personal reasons, I don't like the smell, the taste etc but I'm curious what your reasoning is behind Allah prohibiting consumption of pork.
Thanks
Because i guess the blind faith. ???
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Well let's let Emil answer that shall we? I'm sure most people here know that blind faith is condemned and I doubt Emil would do this, so let's just await their explanation rather than speaking on behalf of people.
Agree,and i am wondering too for what reason he avoid pork other than blind faith.
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Please don't compare pigs to humans,you can compare them to yourself and to your dirty mind
First of all I want to apologize for calling you a dirty animal. I did not mean it in a physical hygeinic way, it was more of a reflection that if someone calls or claims something that cannot speak for itself as dirty, then that act could be considered dirty and quite animalistic (to talk before contemplation).
Muslims regard the pig as a dirty , unclean and impure animal.
It is funny that you should mention this because I have been wondering about this. Exactly what muslims see the pig as dirty, unclean and impure? All I know is that I heard a story that they had to put extra security in the Kabul zoo during the swine-flu episode a couple of years ago. There was an angry mob outside who wanted to kill the only living pig in Afghanistan. Are those the muslims you are talking about?
But your silly excuse that god created it then we shouldn't call it a dirty animal.
So what do you call the roach,a clean insect which lives in the sinks.God created all but there are many things we can consider dirty. For example my kids when they have been to the playground. It is in a pigs nature to act in a way that pigs are supposed to act. I dont think it is a silly excuse to NOT talk about an animal in a derogatory manner because Allah has created a living thing that does not follow my understanding of what is dirty and not.
The cockroach is one of Allah greater creatures. It can adapt to any kind of surrounding. It can swim, fly and run fast as hell. It never gets sick, can eat virtually anything and they breed like rabbits. You know they say that roach is probably the only animal that will survive a nuclear bomb? Pretty darn amazing creature. They are scary though and I scream like a little girl when I see them. But just because they happen to like MY dirty sink does not give me the excuse to think I am more "important" in the eyes of Allah.....I would never consider them lower than me. They are here for a reason, they were put on this earth by Allah and I am not going to disrespect anything that He has created.
can you eat your food if the roach walked over it ?,i guess you'll eat it because thats god's creation too.
I have been taught that cockroaches can spread diseases so no, of course not I would not put myself in the risk of catching something. But does that mean I would consider the roach "dirty" in the sense you mean. No way.....
Your logic is a stupid one.
It has nothing to do with logic, it has to do with respect for animals and the absolute ridicilous notion to try and justify our dietary prohibition with science, biology and hearsay. I am sorry but I cannot read your words without thinking of this bishop in South Africa that said God created apartheid because He does not want whites and blacks to mix..and since whites were better humans than blacks (in the eyes of God) the white man should rule over the black man...... You are saying the same thing basically, that God does not want us to eat pork because it is a filthy animal and it will make us sick so we better separate and segragate from this filthy animal......I grant you that the prohibition of pork is very difficult to explain. But nonetheless we should not belittle one of God's creations just because we are looking for an answer.
its like saying why god created pigs if it'll be dirty,i guess to test the dirty minds as yours.
Again, Im sorry for calling you a dirty animal. But I do not know if my dirty mind needs to be tested just because I respect all living creatures. The truth is God created the pig and the pig does what pigs are supposed to do. They do not go against God. By saying that the pig is not a islamic animal (you claim it to be dirty, unclean and generally speaking quite disgusting) you are questioning Allahs creation......maybe you do not fear God after all.
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Selam Emil,
I'm curious what your reasoning is behind not eating pork. I have no problem with pigs, even if they roll in crap, it may put me off a little but then I have chickens in my garden who step in crap and sometimes step on me but this is animal nature. I'd say I find some people much dirtier than animals in many respects. I don't eat pork for personal reasons, I don't like the smell, the taste etc but I'm curious what your reasoning is behind Allah prohibiting consumption of pork.
Thanks
Salam Sushi
I find the pork prohibition extremely hard to explain. I have turned this question in and out and I have gone through all the reasons but none of them will hold "in a court of law". I have however started to eliminate reasons
- Not good for our health.............Can be easily compared to potato chips, Allah has not forbidden potato chips eventhough they are not healthy.
- Dirty animal................................My kind of pig that lives in my country (like the one I posted a picture of before) is not dirtier than moose, deer or any other mammal living here.
- What else........oh yeah, all the older scriptures that pigs are evil and Jesus performed a miracle by transferring the craziness in a man's head to a herd of pigs which then committed suicide by drowning themselves............Sorry, don't believe in that.
I am leaning towards the fact that once domesticated the pig is indeed difficult to breed and not really good for the local environment. They destroy more than they build and they are not supposed to live in such large groups as they do on a farm. They are also the only animal which is bred solely for their meat. We cannot make clothes from their wool, drink their milk or eat their eggs. Without any kind of Quranic evidence I feel it is wrong to breed an animal only for the sake of their meat......They are also receptable to many of the same diseases as us humans, maybe we should let them be?
Another rather unorthodox idea I have is that the pig is perhaps too good for us to eat? I mean it is a highly intelligent animal, maybe the pig is Allah's favourite animal? Sounds nuts, I know......but maybe.... hmm.......Anyways it is just a point to make, that not all is how we think it is.
The bottom line is dear Sushi is that out of all the Quranic verses, the pork prohibition stumps me completely. However, I do not eat pork not out of blind faith as mr FearGod says but rather because I do not want to eat an animal that has not been respected during its lifetieme and is only born for the sake of meat. I am sorry but I have not been able to connect my reasons to the Quran, but Inshalla before I die I will perhaps understand more.
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First of all I want to apologize for calling you a dirty animal. I did not mean it in a physical hygeinic way, it was more of a reflection that if someone calls or claims something that cannot speak for itself as dirty, then that act could be considered dirty and quite animalistic (to talk before contemplation).
Its O.K
It is funny that you should mention this because I have been wondering about this. Exactly what muslims see the pig as dirty, unclean and impure? All I know is that I heard a story that they had to put extra security in the Kabul zoo during the swine-flu episode a couple of years ago. There was an angry mob outside who wanted to kill the only living pig in Afghanistan. Are those the muslims you are talking about?
Yes i agree it is awful to kill god's creation such as mices , roaches ,mosquitos.
But i hope god will forgive me doing that because sometimes i am pushed for doing so,
but i am sure god won't put me in hell for doing that,God is merciful.and i can add how bad we are that we kill god's creation for eating chicken ,lamb ,beef
and also the poor pig as you have seen in the OP.God created all but there are many things we can consider dirty. For example my kids when they have been to the playground. It is in a pigs nature to act in a way that pigs are supposed to act. I dont think it is a silly excuse to NOT talk about an animal in a derogatory manner because Allah has created a living thing that does not follow my understanding of what is dirty and not.
Yes we insulted their feelings and that is kind of gossiping. ???
The cockroach is one of Allah greater creatures. It can adapt to any kind of surrounding. It can swim, fly and run fast as hell. It never gets sick, can eat virtually anything and they breed like rabbits. You know they say that roach is probably the only animal that will survive a nuclear bomb? Pretty darn amazing creature. They are scary though and I scream like a little girl when I see them. But just because they happen to like MY dirty sink does not give me the excuse to think I am more "important" in the eyes of Allah.....I would never consider them lower than me. They are here for a reason, they were put on this earth by Allah and I am not going to disrespect anything that He has created.
So don't crush it with your shoes.
I have been taught that cockroaches can spread diseases so no, of course not I would not put myself in the risk of catching something. But does that mean I would consider the roach "dirty" in the sense you mean. No way.....
No don't consider it dirty,that is kind of gossiping.
It has nothing to do with logic, it has to do with respect for animals and the absolute ridicilous notion to try and justify our dietary prohibition with science, biology and hearsay. I am sorry but I cannot read your words without thinking of this bishop in South Africa that said God created apartheid because He does not want whites and blacks to mix..and since whites were better humans than blacks (in the eyes of God) the white man should rule over the black man...... You are saying the same thing basically. God does not want us to eat pork because it is a filthy animal and it will make us sick......I grant you that the prohibition of pork is very difficult to explain. But nonetheless we should not belittle one of God's creations just because we are looking for an answer.
Say 'I find nothing in what has been revealed to me that forbids any one to eat of any food except the dead, running blood, and the flesh of swine for these are unclean and that which has been hallowed in its slaughter to other than Allah. But whoever is constrained to eat of any of these, not intending to sin or transgress, then your Lord is Forgiving, the Most Merciful. (6145)
Oh sorry,the verse says unclean. (
Again, Im sorry for calling you a dirty animal. But I do not know if my dirty mind needs to be tested because I respect all living creatures. The truth is God created the pig and the pig does what pigs are supposed to do. They do not go against God. By saying that the pig is not a islamic animal (you claim it to be dirty, unclean and generally speaking quite disgusting) you are questioning Allahs creation......maybe you do not fear God after all.
You are so sad about pigs and that tells it all.
Play with open cards.
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and i can add how bad we are that we kill god's creation for eating chicken ,lamb ,beef
and also the poor pig as you have seen in the OP.Who said anything about eating pork? I never said that, I am only looking for respect for animals
You are so sad about pigs and that tells it all.
Stop talking like I understand what you are saying. I am sad whenever another living creature is not respected, what does that tell you?
Play with open cards.
confused
Say 'I find nothing in what has been revealed to me that forbids any one to eat of any food except the dead, running blood, and the flesh of swine for these are unclean and that which has been hallowed in its slaughter to other than Allah. But whoever is constrained to eat of any of these, not intending to sin or transgress, then your Lord is Forgiving, the Most Merciful. (6145)
Oh sorry,the verse says unclean.Yes I am fully aware it says unclean, but it is mistake to say that unclean means not good for us in the health-wise manner. Why? Because you cannot defend that argument without being dogmatic. You can be proven wrong, you understand what I mean? And the only way you can defend yourself is by not listening to reason.
There is a deeper meaning to it my brother, you got to open your mind to other possibilities than the one that first pops in your mind. I will give you an example of my reasoning. For all of those that speak arabic please inform me if I am wrong, I only derive my conclusions from the english/swedish translationIn 6145 it states that certain meat products are "un-clean". The opposite of un-clean should logically speaking be clean.
In 2222 it states to approach a woman only when they are clean (not menstruating). Logical conclusion to that means the woman is un-clean when they are menstruating.
The english Quran uses unclean to describe pork and clean to describe a non-menstruating woman. If the pig is an un-clean animal, then a menstruating woman can be compared to a pig..........
I don't know about you but I do not think it is wise to call a menstruating woman a pig....... Therefore it is a mistake to accept the un-clean in 6145 as "unhygenic" or "bad for health" without further investigation. There are more layers to understanding the pork prohibition than meets the eye.
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In 2222 it states to approach a woman only when they are clean (not menstruating). Logical conclusion to that means the woman is un-clean when they are menstruating.
Selam Emil,
This is kinda unrelated to the thread, however I thought i'd like to provide a better translation of 2222. A woman being thought of as "unclean" whilst menstruating is an old view dating back many many years ago where people thought that that kind of blood from a woman at that time of the month is sacred. Here is the best translation from brother Mazhar
And they people ask you, the messenger regarding the Menstruation/Menstrual discharge period of wives.
You tell them, "The menstrual discharge is a cause of little vexation.
For this reason therefore, you people consciously refrain/restrain-stay away "performing sexually-enter semen" with such of wives who are in the state of the Menstruation//Menstrual discharge period.
And you should not associate/approach them for matrimonial nearness so long they may exhaust/drain out menstrual discharge.
Consequently, when they have exhausted/drained out making themselves cleansed for this reason/in this state, you people/husbands associate with them from the point of location and time Allah has decreed/appointed for you people.
Indeed Allah the Exalted appreciates and recognizes those who return/revert to proper conduct/point leading to right direction and He the Exalted appreciates and recognizes those who maintain cleanliness and purity. -
Salam Sushi
I find the pork prohibition extremely hard to explain. I have turned this question in and out and I have gone through all the reasons but none of them will hold "in a court of law". I have however started to eliminate reasons
- Not good for our health.............Can be easily compared to potato chips, Allah has not forbidden potato chips eventhough they are not healthy.
- Dirty animal................................My kind of pig that lives in my country (like the one I posted a picture of before) is not dirtier than moose, deer or any other mammal living here.
- What else........oh yeah, all the older scriptures that pigs are evil and Jesus performed a miracle by transferring the craziness in a man's head to a herd of pigs which then committed suicide by drowning themselves............Sorry, don't believe in that.
I am leaning towards the fact that once domesticated the pig is indeed difficult to breed and not really good for the local environment. They destroy more than they build and they are not supposed to live in such large groups as they do on a farm. They are also the only animal which is bred solely for their meat. We cannot make clothes from their wool, drink their milk or eat their eggs. Without any kind of Quranic evidence I feel it is wrong to breed an animal only for the sake of their meat......They are also receptable to many of the same diseases as us humans, maybe we should let them be?
Another rather unorthodox idea I have is that the pig is perhaps too good for us to eat? I mean it is a highly intelligent animal, maybe the pig is Allah's favourite animal? Sounds nuts, I know......but maybe.... hmm.......Anyways it is just a point to make, that not all is how we think it is.
The bottom line is dear Sushi is that out of all the Quranic verses, the pork prohibition stumps me completely. However, I do not eat pork not out of blind faith as mr FearGod says but rather because I do not want to eat an animal that has not been respected during its lifetieme and is only born for the sake of meat. I am sorry but I have not been able to connect my reasons to the Quran, but Inshalla before I die I will perhaps understand more.
Selam Emil,
I do not reckon Allah has a favourite animal, and most of the points made i would probably not accept as it isn't convincing enough. I think you have provided some good psychological reasons and also a point that a pig has the same susceptible diseases as us, but i think this needs to be looked into further.
I was reading the one verse that states the reason for not eating swine, and it's this one. I've listed all translations and the arabic aswell
6145 Say, "I do not find in what is inspired to me forbidden except that it be already dead, or blood poured forth, or the meat of pig, for it is foul; or what is corruptly dedicated to other than God." Whoever is forced without seeking disobedience or transgression, then your Lord is Forgiving, Compassionate.
6145 Say "I do not find in what is inspired to me forbidden except that it be already dead, or blood, or the meat of pig, for it is foul; or what is corruptly dedicated to other than God." Whoever is forced without seeking disobedience or transgression, then your Lord is Forgiving, Merciful.
6145 Say "In all that has been revealed unto me, I do not find anything forbidden to eat, if one wants to eat thereof, unless it be carrion, or blood poured forth, or the flesh of swine-for that, behold, is loathsome-or a sinful offering over which any name other than God's has been invoked. But if one is driven by necessity - neither coveting it nor exceeding his immediate need -then , behold, thy Sustainer is much-forgiving, a dispenser of grace."
6145 Say, "I do not find in the revelations given to me any food that is prohibited for any eater except (1) carrion, (2) running blood, (3) the meat of pigs, for it is contaminated, and (4) the meat of animals blasphemously dedicated to other than GOD." If one is forced (to eat these), without being deliberate or malicious, then your Lord is Forgiver, Most Merciful.
6145 Say, "I do not find in the revelation given to me, any food that is prohibited for one who wishes to eat except Carrion (dead meat), or running blood, or the flesh of swine - for, certainly, it is a barrier to moral development. Or, anything (not just meat) that, in defiance to commands, has been dedicated to other than God." If one is forced by dire need without being deliberate and without transgressing, your Lord is Forgiving, Merciful.
6145 Qul la ajidu feema oohiyailayya muharraman AAala taAAimin yatAAamuhuilla an yakoona maytatan aw daman masfoohan aw lahmakhinzeerin fa-innahu rijsun aw fisqan ohilla lighayri Allahibihi famani idturra ghayra baghin wala AAadinfa-inna rabbaka ghafoorun raheemun
6145
I reckon the word in bold is very important. If someone knows how to find the meanings of the arabic root words, could they find it being from the triliteral root r jm sn ( س, used 10 times in the reading as the noun rij's (س. I've found some of it's meanings
- abomination
- filth
- impure
- punishment
- evil
- wrath
The pig is not spoken of in a positive sense as far as i can tell. It is clearly being called impure for some reason, and we should not eat of it. I'm not sure if it really is implying some kind of health risk, or if it is being called impure for another reason such as rolling around in it's own dung, but then that's what it's meant to do... so i'm not too sure...
peace
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Salam Sushi
I do not reckon Allah has a favourite animal
Me neither only brainstorming...... however in so many things the truth turns out to be the exact opposite than what we thought from the beginning. Just want to keep the doors open so to say...
and most of the points made i would probably not accept as it isn't convincing enough
I actually agree......I haven't convinced myself either that it is what Allah had in mind. Me not eating pork is of course based on the Quran but unfortunately I cannot base my opinion about why we should not eat pork on the Quran. Not yet anyways.....
Is the term "clean" in 222 the direct opposite of "unclean" in 6145? I mean, in Arabic?
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Salam Sushi
Me neither ) only brainstorming...... however in so many things the truth turns out to be the exact opposite than what we thought from the beginning. Just want to keep the doors open so to say...
I actually agree......I haven't convinced myself either that it is what Allah had in mind. Me not eating pork is of course based on the Quran but unfortunately I cannot base my opinion about why we should not eat pork on the Quran. Not yet anyways.....
Is the term "clean" in 222 the direct opposite of "unclean" in 6145? I mean, in Arabic?
Selam Emil,
Brainstorming is all good , i hope i also find the answer before i die. Did you read the post i made before fully responding to your question? The one about menstruation? Anyway i think if we look at the arabic, in most cases the word "rij's" is used to denote impurity but not necessarily uncleanliness... though i'm not sure - awaiting someone arabic to shed some light...
peace
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Who said anything about eating pork? I never said that, I am only looking for respect for animals
Stop talking like I understand what you are saying. I am sad whenever another living creature is not respected, what does that tell you?
confusedYou didn't say a dirty roach,but it was easy for you to say that i am a dirty human. ???
Yes I am fully aware it says unclean, but it is mistake to say that unclean means not good for us in the health-wise manner. Why? Because you cannot defend that argument without being dogmatic. You can be proven wrong, you understand what I mean? And the only way you can defend yourself is by not listening to reason.
There is a deeper meaning to it my brother, you got to open your mind to other possibilities than the one that first pops in your mind. I will give you an example of my reasoning. For all of those that speak arabic please inform me if I am wrong, I only derive my conclusions from the english/swedish translationIn 6145 it states that certain meat products are "un-clean". The opposite of un-clean should logically speaking be clean.
In 2222 it states to approach a woman only when they are clean (not menstruating). Logical conclusion to that means the woman is un-clean when they are menstruating.
The english Quran uses unclean to describe pork and clean to describe a non-menstruating woman. If the pig is an un-clean animal, then a menstruating woman can be compared to a pig..........
I don't know about you but I do not think it is wise to call a menstruating woman a pig....... Therefore it is a mistake to accept the un-clean in 6145 as "unhygenic" or "bad for health" without further investigation. There are more layers to understanding the pork prohibition than meets the eye.
They will question thee concerning the monthly course. Say It is hurt; so go apart from women during the monthly course, and do not approach them till they are clean. When they have cleansed themselves, then come unto them as God has commanded you. Truly, God loves those who repent, and He loves those who cleanse themselves. (2222)
God here is talking about sexual intercourse at time of menstrual cycle to be avoided and to have the normal sex once woman is clean from her menstrual cycle.
i don't know how you mix things up and even god says it is hurt and didn't say haram as in the case of pork which is haram.
The menstrual cycle is disgusting yuck and god advices us not to approach woman at her period
because that isn't clean (disgusting) i don't know if its OK for you.So as the menstrual cycle and the view of blood is disgusting the samething is for the pork that eating his own dung and even eating dead animals.
both are disgusting , you made me feel sick just to imagine those things,bull****
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOddFhqWP9A