What happens to a Muslim who does not pray?
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God - or the creator - does not speak to people directly but through signs.
In past days, messengers and prophets were sent to people but this stopped over 1000 years ago. The personal message was replaced by a human invention, the book. The book dictates what rituals humans have to perform in order to escape punishment. The book describes the most important requirement, faith, and then, after the existence of this creator has been established, several factors, called pillars, are established.
My question what do you think happens to a believer/follower/submitter/Muslim who lives a quiet life as a maths teacher, believes a god, the Islamic god and creator, exists and is responsible for everything - yet does not pray, does not pay anything to anybody, does not fast and never travels to Mecca?
What happens on Judgment Day?
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My question what do you think happens to a believer/follower/submitter/Muslim who lives a quiet life as a maths teacher, believes a god, the Islamic god and creator, exists and is responsible for everything - yet does not pray, does not pay anything to anybody, does not fast and never travels to Mecca?
What happens on Judgment Day?
Answer to first question One who does not pray, will save his time for other acts.
Answer to second question The result on Judgment Day will depend on how much one acted to benefit society at large.
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It all depends on the context what reason did the person had that he did not pray?
Also, what do you define as "pray"? Frequent remembrance of God is just as important as performing the "ritual prayer" frequently.
And remember that noone knows the real answer to such a question. Our only source of information is the Quran, and the Quran says that only those who believe and do good deeds will be succesfull. At the same time, those who do not perform the salat (in general) are classified as evil. (I'll have to find the verse for reference, I don't know it out of my head)
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God - or the creator - does not speak to people directly but through signs.
In past days, messengers and prophets were sent to people but this stopped over 1000 years ago. The personal message was replaced by a human invention, the book. The book dictates what rituals humans have to perform in order to escape punishment. The book describes the most important requirement, faith, and then, after the existence of this creator has been established, several factors, called pillars, are established.
My question what do you think happens to a believer/follower/submitter/Muslim who lives a quiet life as a maths teacher, believes a god, the Islamic god and creator, exists and is responsible for everything - yet does not pray, does not pay anything to anybody, does not fast and never travels to Mecca?
What happens on Judgment Day?
Very good question.
I must protest against you wrote "Islamic god" though.
God is not Islamic but universal, and is written with capital G.
Peace -
I have and did not find the answer - which is why I am here, asking the experts. If you don't know the answer, that's fine. But telling me to read the Koran is a bit of a cheap shot, don't you think?
I agree with Wakas, read the Quran. No offence StopsS but you are approaching the book as it is a rulebook with all the answers. If you continue to read the Quran you will eventually, God willing, see the Quran helps you to find all the answers, not giving them to you served on a platter.
Allah is the one that judges you. If you read the Quran you will understand that whatever is coming to us on judgement day will be given by Allah to us individually, no punishment, forgivness nor reward will be the same.
Only Allah knows what is in your heart, nobody here on earth could ever tell you what punishment/rewards you will recieve on judgement day.
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God - or the creator - does not speak to people directly but through signs.
I am afraid that you reach the wrong conclusions. Please check 4251.
In past days, messengers and prophets were sent to people but this stopped over 1000 years ago. The personal message was replaced by a human invention, the book. The book dictates what rituals humans have to perform in order to escape punishment. The book describes the most important requirement, faith, and then, after the existence of this creator has been established, several factors, called pillars, are established.
Red Wrong again! The concept is simple, we have been created to serve God . WHATEVER He asked us to do, we have to do, if He wants us to stop all rituals, we have to stop all rituals this is what serving Him is. God still communicates with us and He gives instructions and we have to follow them.
Blue There are NO the most important requirement and the less important requirements in alQuraan. Even if it is small order from our Lord, we have to obey. There is no existence of so called pillars in alQuraan.
If you don't find your answers from alQuraan, then it is not a good sign, please take a look at 1745-46.
My question what do you think happens to a believer/follower/submitter/Muslim who lives a quiet life as a maths teacher, believes a god, the Islamic god and creator, exists and is responsible for everything - yet does not pray, does not pay anything to anybody, does not fast and never travels to Mecca?
What happens on Judgment Day?
I recommend you to understand this, it may help you inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
Answer to first question One who does not pray, will save his time for other acts.
Answer to second question The result on Judgment Day will depend on how much one acted to benefit society at large.
That sounds reasonable and logical.
Is that you or the Koran speaking?
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It all depends on the context what reason did the person had that he did not pray?
Also, what do you define as "pray"? Frequent remembrance of God is just as important as performing the "ritual prayer" frequently.
And remember that noone knows the real answer to such a question. Our only source of information is the Quran, and the Quran says that only those who believe and do good deeds will be succesfull. At the same time, those who do not perform the salat (in general) are classified as evil. (I'll have to find the verse for reference, I don't know it out of my head)
Exactly. That is why I am asking. I am referring to all 4 pillars, which are not fulfilled. Non-believers will be punished, no question, but I am curious what understanding people here have when it comes to the grey areas for people who DO believe, but little else.
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Very good question.
I must protest against you wrote "Islamic god" though.
God is not Islamic but universal, and is written with capital G.
PeaceProtest acknowledged.
- I maintain that different people have different understandings, concepts and attributes of their personal god, so, no, I don't agree with your idea of a single and galactic super-natural being. I am just making sure we are talking about the god described in the Koran and not the ones with sons or any other one.
- I have explained this before I don't intend to offend or show any disrespect or insult by writing god with a normal g as god is not a name, but a function. Bast, Vishnu and Thor are examples for named gods and are written with a capital g by convention.
Back to my question ... and you answer or opinion is .....
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I am afraid that you reach the wrong conclusions. Please check 4251.
Thank you for correcting my mistake. Yes, I did indeed forget the last part
It is not fitting for a man that Allah should speak to him except by inspiration, or from behind a veil
and the "from behind a veil" escaped me.Red Wrong again! The concept is simple, we have been created to serve God . WHATEVER He asked us to do, we have to do, if He wants us to stop all rituals, we have to stop all rituals this is what serving Him is. God still communicates with us and He gives instructions and we have to follow them.
Well, that is exactly what my sentence means - or I wanted it to mean anyway. So my question to you is what do you personally think will happen to a well-behaved, believing Muslim who does not pray or pay or go on Hajj? Will he suffer for eternity together with the idolaters and non-believers?
Blue There are NO the most important requirement and the less important requirements in alQuraan. Even if it is small order from our Lord, we have to obey. There is no existence of so called pillars in alQuraan.
Here I disagree with you. There are sins which will be forgiven but others will not be forgiven, indicating a ranking list. But that is irrelevant to my question.
What happens if you do NOT follow all the orders?I was using the word pillar to refer to the commonly understood concept of Islamic rituals. If you object to the word, ignore it, I think you know what I mean.
If you don't find your answers from alQuraan, then it is not a good sign, please take a look at 1745-46.
I recommend you to understand this, it may help you inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhanThe Koran is generally totally vague and ambiguous, which is why so much interpretation is required and which is why we have so many groups all following the same book. Instead of never finding an answer I thought I'd use the means available to the inquisitive mind in the 21st century and on top of asking the local Imam - who did not give me an answer - I come here to ask the experts. Easy, really.
The link you provided only confused me more, as it mentions an account and how it must be balanced and kept clean - all things I don't remember reading in the Koran and it poses the question "when Allah is not going to forgive us", which is basically impossible for an all-merciful being.
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Salam StopS
I think you become a good answer from brother mmkhan- references from the Quran.
Al Rahman is the teacher from the Quran- so i will not give you MY understanding, because this will be subjective- i think you must read the Quran and then ASK.
Our nefs can lead us to follow a path or to understand anything wrong (see Sura al Schams) and the one who follow his own desires can go astray- all this go in the same direction as the 'whisperings' from our brain tempt---
So Godsubmitter once told me anything i will never forget again Allah don't need us or our prayers- prayers are for ourselves as meditations are for ourselves. we will become humble and quite through it. (because we learn to control our desires, emotions, feelings etc. and to used it in a good manner) .
i don;t know it this was really helpful. sorry.
peace -
There is so much ambiguity not because the koran is but because people have chosen to basically invent their own definitions, rituals, interpretations and such. I think it is hard for people to accept that God wishes no hardship in religion.
God did not tell me to take a portion of my money and give it away. (i do pay nearly 40% of my income in taxes). If I give money to help someone else out or for a good cause like cancer research and such, it would be a good thing and will be rewarded but I won't be punished for not doing so.
God did not tell me to spend thousands of dollars, going through the hardship of pilgrimage to Mecca, throwing stones, circling around this building wearing white garb. I think we could eradicate poverty or at least do a lot towards fighting poverty with all the money that millions of people spend every year.
God did not say salat=ritual of worship to be done like people have defined.
Now, God did say 262 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.
So the answer to your question is in the Koran, sura 262.
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i think you must read the Quran and then ASK.
That's what I said, that's what I did and now I am asking.
Our nefs can lead us to follow a path or to understand anything wrong (see Sura al Schams) and the one who follow his own desires can go astray- all this go in the same direction as the 'whisperings' from our brain
My desire is to pass my knowledge on to others and be a good person. And now I learn this is called "going astray" sob
I don't have anything whispering to me. Not that I know of, anyway.So Godsubmitter once told me anything i will never forget again Allah don't need us or our prayers- prayers are for ourselves as meditations are for ourselves. we will become humble and quite through it. (because we learn to control our desires, emotions, feelings etc. and to used it in a good manner) .
i don;t know it this was really helpful. sorry.
peaceI asked something a little different, but I now know how you feel about prayers and their meaning, thank you.
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There is so much ambiguity not because the koran is but because people have chosen to basically invent their own definitions, rituals, interpretations and such. I think it is hard for people to accept that God wishes no hardship in religion.
God did not tell me to take a portion of my money and give it away. (i do pay nearly 40% of my income in taxes). If I give money to help someone else out or for a good cause like cancer research and such, it would be a good thing and will be rewarded but I won't be punished for not doing so.
God did not tell me to spend thousands of dollars, going through the hardship of pilgrimage to Mecca, throwing stones, circling around this building wearing white garb. I think we could eradicate poverty or at least do a lot towards fighting poverty with all the money that millions of people spend every year.
God did not say salat=ritual of worship to be done like people have defined.
Now, God did say 262 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.
So the answer to your question is in the Koran, sura 262.
I think if I were a Muslim this is what I would understand too.
I would have a bit of a problem reconciling the demand for worship, but I suppose that's manageable.
You make an interesting observation 262 absolves anyone who believes in a different entity and then analyses the "good works"? Am I correct in understanding this to be a notion of generosity, where people are told they need to believe in one god and be good people and this is the ultimate goal? Regardless of the other rituals. Hm, not bad! Makes sense.
That would leave only polytheists and non-believers out in the cold, well figuratively speaking. ;D
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Salam StopS
I think you become a good answer from brother mmkhan- references from the Quran.
Al Rahman is the teacher from the Quran- so i will not give you MY understanding, because this will be subjective- i think you must read the Quran and then ASK.
Our nefs can lead us to follow a path or to understand anything wrong (see Sura al Schams) and the one who follow his own desires can go astray- all this go in the same direction as the 'whisperings' from our brain tempt---
So Godsubmitter once told me anything i will never forget again Allah don't need us or our prayers- prayers are for ourselves as meditations are for ourselves. we will become humble and quite through it. (because we learn to control our desires, emotions, feelings etc. and to used it in a good manner) .
i don;t know it this was really helpful. sorry.
peaceExactly the same feelings as me mirjamnur.
My dad was asking me today why bother doing "salat", the learning connection/bond, and i said i do it most of the time at night because it acts as a meditation for me. God doesn't need my articulations to it, nor does it need absolutely anything from us. At the end of the day it benefits the person and can help prevent a person from leading astray. Maum meditation is also very similar to how i think salat/the bond should be done. I was asked if i do namaz, and my reply was that this is a word not found in the reading but a ritual created from the zoroastrianism around Persia. The main thing is to bare in mind that if you speak to god for private moments, repentance and requests (such as asking to be guided or be given peace, wisdom, tranquility and prosperity) this is the bond or learning connection you make with the creator, for YOUR benefit - remember, the creator is self-sufficient, it doesn't need your acts of what "salat" incorporates.
I think if I were a Muslim this is what I would understand too.
I would have a bit of a problem reconciling the demand for worship, but I suppose that's manageable.
You make an interesting observation 262 absolves anyone who believes in a different entity and then analyses the "good works"? Am I correct in understanding this to be a notion of generosity, where people are told they need to believe in one god and be good people and this is the ultimate goal? Regardless of the other rituals. Hm, not bad! Makes sense.
That would leave only polytheists and non-believers out in the cold, well figuratively speaking. ;D
Precisely ), what i defined as the "basic building blocks of life" and being a good person - one god and be a good person is the ultimate goal ).
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Allah don't need us or our prayers- prayers are for ourselves as meditations are for ourselves. we will become humble and quite through it. (because we learn to control our desires, emotions, feelings etc. and to used it in a good manner)
Absolutely, God has no needs. Praying is for us. now, God doesn't say that "prayer" has to be done a certain way and manner at specified time as people define and understand salat to be. Also, meditation or "prayer" doesn't per se lead to being humble. It is our actions and behavior that makes us humble. For instance if say someone betrays me and wrongs me which upsets me/angers me, natural tendency would be to react. So what would stop me from acting on my emotions? Not really the meditation/prayer done earlier but it is remembering God, consequences of actions and asking God (which is prayer) to help with dealing with the negative emotions and situation. Going and meditating as a way of clearing my head and controlling myself would help but in the minute to minute situations and circumstances throughout the day, it is the remembrance and reliance on God that really leads to controlling oneself and making choices/decisions.
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You make an interesting observation 262 absolves anyone who believes in a different entity and then analyses the "good works"? Am I correct in understanding this to be a notion of generosity, where people are told they need to believe in one god and be good people and this is the ultimate goal? Regardless of the other rituals. Hm, not bad! Makes sense.
Yes, basically that is it. I think this concept is too simple and people feel a need to have rituals that involves some kind of hardship/suffering. Being a good person and doing good works doesn't necessarily mean doing charitable work or being generous. How about just being good to your family, friends, neighbor, colleagues? Simple enough yet hard to do as arrogance, ego, selfishness, immaturity, stupidity and other human traits comes in play.
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Salam StopS
That's what I said, that's what I did and now I am asking.
sorry, i forget , i mean we should ask Allah firstMy desire is to pass my knowledge on to others and be a good person. And now I learn this is called "going astray" sob
I don't have anything whispering to me. Not that I know of, anyway.
i didn't speak from you- i didn't say that YOU GO ASTRAY- you read between the lines- it was a general statement (maybe because i stumbled over the same questions ) and include me (because i'm confusedI asked something a little different, but I now know how you feel about prayers and their meaning, thank you.
what i tried to say because we didn't pray for Allah and the Salat is not prescribed in detail how could Allah punish us for it??peace
