Too many differences? Or what do you think?
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I have had huge problems with my wife who is of Shia upbringing and it was almost psychopathic at times, until a turning point where I miraculously managed, through the grace of God, to have her eyes opened.
What made her finally change her beliefs?
I think you will have some big problems with him, but sometimes it is your destiny. Living together without either of you changing will be nearly impossible, but I think it will end in either one changes or divorce, frankly said.
I know, it makes me a little sad, thinking that we might end up in divorce over this. We both tend to be a bit stubborn, so this will definitely cause problems if either of us try to change each other. Insh'Allah I can help him, if it is God's will.
Remember, living in the so-called Islamic countries as a woman can lead you into a deathtrap, if your husband is being unrighteous. I was "lucky" being a man, in that regard.
I understand exactly what you're saying here, I've read plenty of articles of women being abused and killed in these so-called Islamic countries too. I'll have to take this approach very carefully, thanks for your input.
Peace and Blessings be Unto You and Your Wife peace
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Anyway I think you get the drift. if the guy is serious he should be open about discussing anything. A few months is hard to gauge how authentic someone is but who knows, meet him see his character in person and discuss things.
I'm hoping to get all of these questions out of the way before we plan anything more concrete. He appears to be somewhat strict, but at the same time open minded a bit. I hope we can find an understanding, Insh'Allah.
Even if you marry someone of the same beliefs people differ in opinions. So maybe just ask yourself could he tolerate and accept you as you are? Would he bend over backwards to make his kids exactly like him or would he be ok if they imitated you? will you help each other grow and make a positive difference to each others lives, etc.
Just don't rush into anything. All the best inshallah
These are important questions to keep in mind too, thank you for bringing them to me. I will definitely have to know all of these things before jumping into marriage.
Peace and Blessings peace
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Take it from me, I know what that is like, despite how al hamdulilah loving and close my relationship in my marriage is right now. We are both from different cultures America/Egypt and although we are both new Quranists...the cultural differences even in our GREAT relationship...puts some weight on my shoulders. I wouldn't say it strains our relationship, but I find myself kinda sad inside that he will never understand where I am coming from, nor will I of him. I dream somehow we move to live in the States, especially now that my family is there, even though I know the US is not the best place to live for the next decade (upcoming economic crisis, police tyranny..etc) and I feel like I'm lying to myself staying here in Egypt. But I love him and could never leave him. Ok maybe I could never go back to the US because of certain circumstances, but I can't help but wish it was possible.
I think I understand what you're saying here, sometimes when I speak about certain things, he has no idea where I'm coming from, and just calls me crazy lol. Insh'Allah you can have a way to move back to the states.
So realistically, I think you should give this some more thought and think about how things will be later on between you two. Do you see yourself being resentful or him? Will your compromises/goals change? It seems you have such a long bridge to walk to meet each other midway. I pray it works out for you both, but I thought I'd just tell you to make a conscious decision.
Resentful, not at all. I mean I get pretty fired up sometimes, but I always end up happy again. I think it's possible for us to meet on middle grounds, hopefully, only God knows for now. Thank you very much, and yes before I make my decision, I have to put my feelings aside and view this relationship logically.
Peace and Blessings be Unto You and Your Husband peace
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I wonder what image he has of you in his mind. Who is he imagining to live with? He won't be living with the image of you... he will be living with the real you. Images often tend to be more rosy cosy than reality. Is he expecting you, consciously or unconsciously, to change?
Anyhow, not sure whether this was of any help. I pray for your happy marriage and that you'll get someone who really suits you!
Well I think he has an image of me being new to Islam, and being somewhat misguided, so he is very understanding about me questioning mainstream Islam. Hopefully I can discuss this with him soon, if it doesn't work out I hope God will guide him, Insh'Allah.
Peace and Blessings peace
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Salaam missdee,
I think it was my steadfastness and prayers and help from God. Certain things are a secret which I cannot reveal unfortunately.
Guess I was stubborn and refused to give up despite major mental torture. I actually gave up at a point and that is when God intervened.
Now I am where I am.
Good luck to you, sister, if you choose this man you may have a long and tough time ahead, but always follow God's will. Many stubborn sect members are difficult to change from their ideas (because Satan has inflicted them) and it takes mercy from God to be able to change them. It all comes down to God's will.
God bless you and hope you will be kept safe
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Guess I was stubborn and refused to give up despite major mental torture. I actually gave up at a point and that is when God intervened.
Now I am where I am.
I think I might experience the same mental torture, but I hope to be where you are someday, Insh'Allah.
Good luck to you, sister, if you choose this man you may have a long and tough time ahead, but always follow God's will. Many stubborn sect members are difficult to change from their ideas (because Satan has inflicted them) and it takes mercy from God to be able to change them. It all comes down to God's will.
God bless you and hope you will be kept safe
Thank you very much, if I find there is no window for change, I might just have to let him be. I wouldn't want to stress him or myself. But God willing, there is hope.
God Bless )
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I think the best advice i can give you is to seek Allahs advice. Ask Him what you should do. You can never go wrong there.
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I think you should make very clear to him what you are not going to do to please him and what you will not take from him, and put that in a marriage contract. If he accepts well and good, if not then do not marry. Wverything that you leave in the dark will haunt you with certainty or you will be asieged all the time and led to the making you feel guilty tactic so good and popular amongst many manipulative men, who love you very much, very much, provided they always have their way.
May be he is not manipulative and is just himself manipulated, but that you should make it very clear, that if he is manipulated, YOU WILL NOT BE AND LEAST OF ALL BY HIM. Be clear and firm and stick to it EVER and do not fear to be blunt and to stand without any shadow of doubt by you principles and you likes, he is taking a wife not a follower or a conquered convert or something of the kind. And enver give him any possibility to believe that that will change.
Salaam
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I think you should make very clear to him what you are not going to do to please him and what you will not take from him, and put that in a marriage contract. If he accepts well and good, if not then do not marry. Wverything that you leave in the dark will haunt you with certainty or you will be asieged all the time and led to the making you feel guilty tactic so good and popular amongst many manipulative men, who love you very much, very much, provided they always have their way.
You make excellent points here, and if we do end up marrying, I'll make sure to make a sound marriage contract, and I hope he is not among the manipulating men (
May be he is not manipulative and is just himself manipulated, but that you should make it very clear, that if he is manipulated, YOU WILL NOT BE AND LEAST OF ALL BY HIM. Be clear and firm and stick to it EVER and do not fear to be blunt and to stand without any shadow of doubt by you principles and you likes, he is taking a wife not a follower or a conquered convert or something of the kind. And enver give him any possibility to believe that that will change.
Salaam
We have our debates and arguments from time to time, he calls me arrogant, and I call him stubborn. But even with all of this, we still manage to try to understand and respect each other, and I want him to know that I believe what I believe, and I don't want him to ever try to force me into his own set of beliefs, as you said he is taking a wife, not a conquered convert, he is well aware I am a critical thinker
Thank you for your input, and God Bless peace
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Miss Dee, my advice is... If he is a hardcore Sunni... and you're unwilling to spend your life wearing a veil and listening to Hadith to justify your oppression... You should turn the other way and RUN. I understand human psychology and Sunni culture. He definitely wants you as his wife but he's thinking he will change you over time. If you are not wanting to change. Get out regardless of the chemistry you may have with him. Big problems lay ahead sister. I grew up traditional Muslim.. Kinda. God gave me the courage to leave my families religion and follow Quran alone. My girlfriend (who I intend to marry Insha Allah) as luck would have it is also a 24 year old Mexican girl. Raised Catholic but never bought into it. She genuinely had a desire for the truth and it was a progression but after reading Quran and seeing the proof behind it, she whole heartedly accepted Quranist Islam. If she had not (and I didn't want to influence her decision), I would not have stayed with her. I don't want our kids going to church, celebrating pagan rituals, etc in the future. I had already made my decision but wanted to see if she would see the truth and accept it because we have great chemistry and she's my best Friend. But Practically, to raise a family and commit for life, that's not enough. It seems like you're in a similar dilemma. Perhaps your boyfriend does have the strength to accept the truth. But you won't find out until you test him. Make it clear what your standards are and what you expect from a husband. Make every logical argument as to why you believe what you believe. If he is sincere and sees the truth... Alhamdulillah. If he's attached to his childhood beliefs and can't see logic... You will be living life as a Sunni woman. Either be willing to accept it or RUN! May God bless you with the best decision for your future and hereafter. Peace!
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Miss Dee, my advice is... If he is a hardcore Sunni... and you're unwilling to spend your life wearing a veil and listening to Hadith to justify your oppression... You should turn the other way and RUN. I understand human psychology and Sunni culture. He definitely wants you as his wife but he's thinking he will change you over time. If you are not wanting to change. Get out regardless of the chemistry you may have with him. Big problems lay ahead sister. I grew up traditional Muslim.. Kinda. God gave me the courage to leave my families religion and follow Quran alone. My girlfriend (who I intend to marry Insha Allah) as luck would have it is also a 24 year old Mexican girl. Raised Catholic but never bought into it. She genuinely had a desire for the truth and it was a progression but after reading Quran and seeing the proof behind it, she whole heartedly accepted Quranist Islam. If she had not (and I didn't want to influence her decision), I would not have stayed with her. I don't want our kids going to church, celebrating pagan rituals, etc in the future. I had already made my decision but wanted to see if she would see the truth and accept it because we have great chemistry and she's my best Friend. But Practically, to raise a family and commit for life, that's not enough. It seems like you're in a similar dilemma. Perhaps your boyfriend does have the strength to accept the truth. But you won't find out until you test him. Make it clear what your standards are and what you expect from a husband. Make every logical argument as to why you believe what you believe. If he is sincere and sees the truth... Alhamdulillah. If he's attached to his childhood beliefs and can't see logic... You will be living life as a Sunni woman. Either be willing to accept it or RUN! May God bless you with the best decision for your future and hereafter. Peace!
We actually discussed it today, and he said, "I love you and I want to help you change for the better", and I couldn't help but cry after he said this. He felt bad after, and told me he intends to better himself also. He's also asked me if I'd ever wear the veil, and I'm actually open to it, but I'm not ready at the moment. If I do choose to wear it, it has to be for God, not for him, and he agreed. Then he said he loves me for who I am now, and would only try to help me be a better person, not a completely new one. I told him, why did he choose me, when he could have just courted a "normal" Sunni girl, and he just said because you're crazy, you have your own mind, and a pure heart. I need to set a few guidelines before we finally meet, so there won't be any surprises. He already knows I am highly critical of the Hadiths, but at the same time, I am open to accept a few of them since not all of them contradict the Qu'ran. These I can take only as commentary, and not absolute truth. I told him I could also read the Bible and Torah, for further research, and only accept what agrees with the Qu'ran, and dismiss anything that contradicts it. So he has an idea how my mind works. Not to mention, the numerous debates we've had over certain Hadiths, like the ones that permit killing for apostasy, stoning for adultery, and the famous 9 year old Aisha. He is open to debate these, but admits, he is not certain about every single Hadith, so I'm hoping he is at least flexible, Insh'Allah.
I am happy to hear about your girlfriend opening her mind to the truth, and not wholeheartedly accepting Hadiths as divine revelation, as we only have our Holy Qu'ran for this. I wish you 2 blessings and happiness, God willing, you can marry soon, and live a long and strong life )
Peace peace
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I am sorry but this veil thing, pounding on it and the being ready for it or not being ready for it. Do you mean you, out of yourself would think wearing a veil would be for God's sake? Do you really believe it? That God thinks women are better or closer to him with veil while men are ok no matter how? If so, I am afraid he is already tamed you.
No veil is going to get you closer to God. I am all for freedom of dress for everybody, but this insistence on women's veil as if it was part of faith more so than the males covering of the head is something that is destroying societies as surely as any other superstition and extra exigence on women. Because it is an extra duty on women. That is not the Qur'an that is pure cheek. When will you be ready to put on a veil if you do not believe in it? If you believe in it, that is your business, although I do not see any reason tob elieve that, but that is your business. But if you do not believe in it, you are giving him falso hopes, you are giving in to him. Do not loose an inch. Don't you ever let him entertain any hope that you are going to do what he thinks is right that you do. He should be fully contented with what he thinks is right that he does provided that does not consist of pestering you with his little narrow pecking whims.
Otherwise I will have to give you the same advice as Amer.
Salaam
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I am sorry but this veil thing, pounding on it and the being ready for it or not being ready for it. Do you mean you, out of yourself would think wearing a veil would be for God's sake? Do you really believe it? That God thinks women are better or closer to him with veil while men are ok no matter how? If so, I am afraid he is already tamed you.
No veil is going to get you closer to God. I am all for freedom of dress for everybody, but this insistence on women's veil as if it was part of faith more so than the males covering of the head is something that is destroying societies as surely as any other superstition and extra exigence on women. Because it is an extra duty on women. That is not the Qur'an that is pure cheek. When will you be ready to put on a veil if you do not believe in it? If you believe in it, that is your business, although I do not see any reason tob elieve that, but that is your business. But if you do not believe in it, you are giving him falso hopes, you are giving in to him. Do not loose an inch. Don't you ever let him entertain any hope that you are going to do what he thinks is right that you do. He should be fully contented with what he thinks is right that he does provided that does not consist of pestering you with his little narrow pecking whims.
Otherwise I will have to give you the same advice as Amer.
Salaam
Salam,
I've actually thought about wearing the veil before I met him, I just don't really feel its required in Islam, it's just an extra form of modesty in my opinion, and believe it or not in some parts of the world men wear it too. I'm not thinking I will suddenly be on the top of God's list if I wear it, it's just a piece of cloth, and we all know the best thing a believer can wear is righteousness. If I choose to wear it in the future it's my decision, not his. I told him, if you like me, you'll accept me with or without it. Trust me, I know first hand how manipulating and damaging men can be. I grew up with a violent, alcoholic father, through the grace of God alone I have managed to make peace with him. Recently, he's asked me about the Qur'an (Alhamdulillah), and God willing he will see the errors he has made.
Most of my life, I grew up opposing my dad, debating him in every little thing. This has made me have a strong passion for what I believe, and even if I'm not sure about the veil, one thing I am sure of, is that I'm not going to allow anybody to tell me what to do. This man has called me difficult, stubborn, and he's perfectly aware of how I am. The more he tries to break my will, the stronger it actually gets. I believe all women should make their own choices, even if some people believe the veil is oppressive, many times women wear it out of their own accord. When they placed a ban on veils, women protested angrily in the streets, and not all of these women come from a Muslim upbringing. Anyways, this is just how I think, everybody is entitled to their own beliefs, and I honestly respect everyone. Thank you for your input.
Peace and Blessings peace
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First imposition wearing the veil.
Whether you want to wear it or not, the fact remains that he has asked something of you which you currently do not do. Why has this question, which is so closely linked to a certain type of mentality, been asked of you. The psychology behind this is of crucial consideration to you whether you consider it to be or not. If you really want an answer to your initial queries, I suggest you deconstruct and analyse these telling nuggets which, I believe, will reveal the truth to you more than what you directly ask him in regards to life after marriage. This veiling business is given high importance by Sunni men. As time passes, you will probably find more expectations to conform on your shoulders. It just so happens that your fella is a Sunni, but I would advise you the same of anyone always look beyond to the subtext!
By the way, did you say that you hadn't actually met this fella? If that's the case then all this could be a case of much ado over nothing.
Salaam.
Sajda.
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First imposition wearing the veil.
Whether you want to wear it or not, the fact remains that he has asked something of you which you currently do not do. Why has this question, which is so closely linked to a certain type of mentality, been asked of you. The psychology behind this is of crucial consideration to you whether you consider it to be or not. If you really want an answer to your initial queries, I suggest you deconstruct and analyse these telling nuggets which, I believe, will reveal the truth to you more than what you directly ask him in regards to life after marriage. This veiling business is given high importance by Sunni men. As time passes, you will probably find more expectations to conform on your shoulders. It just so happens that your fella is a Sunni, but I would advise you the same of anyone always look beyond to the subtext!
By the way, did you say that you hadn't actually met this fella? If that's the case then all this could be a case of much ado over nothing.
Salaam.
Sajda.
I have been thinking about his questions. Putting my feelings aside, this situation can either get progressively better or wost, at this moment I do not know. Worst case scenario in my mind, is if we find some type of middle ground then great for us you know, and if we don't then we can just stop speaking to each other and move on with our lives. Even if he puts up a face of acceptance, then later on tries to impose his beliefs upon me or if I find myself unhappy, I can always divorce him.
I haven't met him, but as I stated before, we are meeting very soon, I'm thinking by the end of this month. When we do meet up, it's not going to lead to a casual boyfriend/girlfriend relationship, were going to discuss our potential marriage, and try to weigh out the pros and cons. I need to analyze everything before I meet him this day (Insh'Allah), so I can have a clear mind and set my standards. Thank you for your input.
Peace and Blessings peace
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and believe it or not in some parts of the world men wear it too.
Yes, sure, saudis wear it usually while in Saudia, and all throughout Muslims history men have covered their heads, but that precisely is the tricky part, that all of a sudden for men to cover or not cover is indifferent, but not for women, for women out of the blue to cover the head, something which was the usual thing for most men and women, suddenly for women becomes a religious duty, and the head becomes another sexual organ that should be covered. Just the use it is being made of it, is disgusting and repulsive.
Yes indeed women should dress as they choose, but the pressure and the signification being given to wearing something on the head is outright brainwshing and a travesty of religion and faith. For me a good reason to keep off it as if it was the devil just as I keep away from booze and gaming. Unless, of course I had a natural liking for it or if wearing it were for me an enjoyment, but then I think I would cringe that it could be confused with anything religious and on top of it that I would be supporting feminine subjugation without wanting to do so. Just as it happened in the past and happens in the present with the use of clothes and shoes that are not comfortable or can be even harmful and which women are led to dress or use because that is what is required for them receive approval in whatever environment or in whatever sense not to speak also of the need to undergo surgery because their first duty is always to be beautiful and to be young.
At any rate, something which always turns out be true is that it may be easy to start hijabing, but if you want to stop and you have people around who deem it your duty, you are in for a nasty ride.
Salaam
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Yes, sure, saudis wear it usually while in Saudia, and all throughout Muslims history men have covered their heads, but that precisely is the tricky part, that all of a sudden for men to cover or not cover is indifferent, but not for women, for women out of the blue to cover the head, something which was the usual thing for most men and women, suddenly for women becomes a religious duty, and the head becomes another sexual organ that should be covered. Just the use it is being made of it, is disgusting and repulsive.
I agree 100% with you on this, it's like modesty is only prescribed for women. I've presented him with different scenarios. Like recently he did his Umrah and in his pictures there were other men walking around topless, while the women were completely veiled. I told him how is this permissible? He said it's tradition, and I said some of these men have attractive bodies, if you are in a place of worship you want to avoid attraction. He said I don't know, and I said exactly because this behavior is hypocritical and has no religious basis. You wouldn't go around walking topless in the street or at work, so why would you do it there?
Yes indeed women should dress as they choose, but the pressure and the signification being given to wearing something on the head is outright brainwshing and a travesty of religion and faith. For me a good reason to keep off it as if it was the devil just as I keep away from booze and gaming. Unless, of course I had a natural liking for it or if wearing it were for me an enjoyment, but then I think I would cringe that it could be confused with anything religious and on top of it that I would be supporting feminine subjugation without wanting to do so. Just as it happened in the past and happens in the present with the use of clothes and shoes that are not comfortable or can be even harmful and which women are led to dress or use because that is what is required for them receive approval in whatever environment or in whatever sense not to speak also of the need to undergo surgery because their first duty is always to be beautiful and to be young.
Exactly, I'm thankful I'm not a slave to high heels and skimpy outfits just to fit in. I'd wear the veil for personal reasons, because I've never really cared what people have thought about me anyways. For many years I had this "heavy metal look", I was really into this music, loved playing guitar, and didn't mind the snobby stares I'd get from time to time. I guess it's all a matter of choice, as long as the choice was solely yours, and not propagated by mainstream media or social pressure.
At any rate, something which always turns out be true is that it may be easy to start hijabing, but if you want to stop and you have people around who deem it your duty, you are in for a nasty ride.
Salaam
I feel if it ever gets this bad, I don't think I could go through with it. I need someone who will respect and understand me, I would hate to always have to live justifying and defending my stances, it's not a comfortable life. I'm hoping we get these issues out of the way by the time we meet (Insh'Allah). Thank you for your response.
Peace and Blessings peace