Sufi Quranist Muslim? Anyone?
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Hi Andantino,
I am very interested in this path. I am fascinated by the mystical. However I find it very difficult to find a path into it. If you find some good resources, please share them.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peace -
There are many excellent resources one can find with God's guidance, God wiling.
One of the best is Rumi.
But I think it is rather difficult to achieve anything significant without a true Teacher (although there are many, many fake ones, since Sufism became "in" and popular even for the "New-Agers".
Real Sufism has nothing to do with institutionalized religions.
It might be just one of the many paths towards Divinity.Peace.
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Hi Andantino,
I am very interested in this path. I am fascinated by the mystical. However I find it very difficult to find a path into it. If you find some good resources, please share them.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peaceFor a Quranist the only Sufi path that can be followed without problems is the universal Sufism like Inayat Khan and not Sunni Sufism of the likes of Nawawi and Ghazali etc. That Sufism is a wolf in sheep's clothings.
http//www.spiritual-learning.org/message/khanindex.html
Boxer Muhammad Ali is a great fan of Inayat Khan. Inayat Khan does not follow a religious tradition but is a monotheist Sufi.
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Sufism seemingly has even more sub-branches than 'standard Islam' has. Almost all claim to follow hadith very rigidly, but at the same time there seems to be little consensus amongst any of the people (that I've come across) that claim to be sufis.
A lot of sufi poetry is nice though.
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Correct me if I'm wrong my brothers but, isn't a "Quranist" a Muslim who follows the teachings of the Qur'an "alone"?!
Suffis belong to different uruq or "orders"?congregations formed around a master... Which makes them, in my opinion, no different than Sunnis and Shia (followers of man-made tradition)!Is the Qur'an not enough for you?!
Peace.
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Salam folks
just want to know if there any of Quranist who follow sufi path here?
im considering to follow this path now, since Sufism doesn't view people based on their religion, even tho Sufism has a very strong Islamic InfluenceI've met and discussed with plenty of people who claimed they're a Suffi.
From my perspective most of them are nice and good people.Their 'culture' is a blend of Buddhism, thus if you want to 'follow/study their path', better start studying Buddhism as well.
Salam / Peace
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I am a Quranist who believe in some Sufi practices. For a long time, I had some rationalist tendencies but now I realise the Quran lends itself more to a Sufi style reading rather than a bland cut and paste style rationalistic one. Sufism has much to offer Quranism, in my opinion.
A good guy to read is Ibn Arabi, especially his Fusus Al-Hikam. It's partly summarised in Sufi Metaphysics and the Quranic Prophets by Ronald Netter.
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For a Quranist the only Sufi path that can be followed without problems is the universal Sufism like Inayat Khan and not Sunni Sufism of the likes of Nawawi and Ghazali etc. That Sufism is a wolf in sheep's clothings.
http//www.spiritual-learning.org/message/khanindex.html
Boxer Muhammad Ali is a great fan of Inayat Khan. Inayat Khan does not follow a religious tradition but is a monotheist Sufi.
thanks bigmo, is inayat khan a Muslim?
Hi Andantino,
I am very interested in this path. I am fascinated by the mystical. However I find it very difficult to find a path into it. If you find some good resources, please share them.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peaceShalom dude, its true! actually long ago i kinda have a trouble with this path because i saw it as a cult. You know, many sufi in my place act like a Paranormal that could see other people destiny or future, and some claim can do a miracle but they just don't want to show it.
but after i learn it from the right Sufi guy, i found it quite fascinating and beautiful, especially since i listen to their meditation Music. im a musician and i really love their composition, its so simple yet divinely beautiful.
well actually it isn't hard to find Tarekat (i don't know in english, it some kind of sufi class) in my country, but its indeed hard to find the inclusive one, because many of them required their followers to be a Sunni Muslim.
Sufism seemingly has even more sub-branches than 'standard Islam' has. Almost all claim to follow hadith very rigidly, but at the same time there seems to be little consensus amongst any of the people (that I've come across) that claim to be sufis.
A lot of sufi poetry is nice though.
you right! my sufi folks never ever get fanatic to hadith things, yet they still use some wisdom in it. They even use buddhism book and hinduism book, and.. BIBLE
but they solely holding the Quran alone as a source of all religious matters (but sometimes, they take hadith too)
Correct me if I'm wrong my brothers but, isn't a "Quranist" a Muslim who follows the teachings of the Qur'an "alone"?!
Suffis belong to different uruq or "orders"?congregations formed around a master... Which makes them, in my opinion, no different than Sunnis and Shia (followers of man-made tradition)!Is the Qur'an not enough for you?!
Peace.
i don't know about you and all people that has some sentiment to non-Quranist group (especially to sunni-shia). But, seriously i don't have any problem to take many wisdom and good things from anywhere, and yes include sunni and shia, therefore, i don't mind to be a Quranist that follow a Sufi path. and for the Masters things, they just LEAD our "ritual" stuffs and preach some khutbah, we as a sufi doesn't have to take the masters as sunnis take the Ulamas.
I've met and discussed with plenty of people who claimed they're a Suffi.
From my perspective most of them are nice and good people.Their 'culture' is a blend of Buddhism, thus if you want to 'follow/study their path', better start studying Buddhism as well.
Salam / Peace
my sufi folks told me to study from everywhere, since God spread His signs throughout the entire universe. and of course that include buddhism )
but me personally, i don't have any interest to buddhism.
I am a Quranist who believe in some Sufi practices. For a long time, I had some rationalist tendencies but now I realise the Quran lends itself more to a Sufi style reading rather than a bland cut and paste style rationalistic one. Sufism has much to offer Quranism, in my opinion.
A good guy to read is Ibn Arabi, especially his Fusus Al-Hikam. It's partly summarised in Sufi Metaphysics and the Quranic Prophets by Ronald Netter.
me too a Rationalist, but then i begin to rethink that being a full Rationalist cannot bring any peace for my soul and mind, therefore it seems i need to take some "mystic" way to achieve my better understanding of universe and GOD
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Andatino, I think this is a problem with some Quranists - ultra rationalism. They fail to realise the subjective nature of logic and equate their interpretation based on their limited logic as authoritative interpretations. It's exactly the same problem with Traditional Islam. I wrote an essay on it here
http//quranology.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/dictionaries-and-grammar-old-hadith-wine-in-new-bottles/
Over the last 1-2 years, I rethought my approach and now think the Quran is more like a mirror, we attain realisations based on our station in the journey. It's a much more organic reading.
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Andatino, I think this is a problem with some Quranists - ultra rationalism. They fail to realise the subjective nature of logic and equate their interpretation based on their limited logic as authoritative interpretations. It's exactly the same problem with Traditional Islam. I wrote an essay on it here
http//quranology.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/dictionaries-and-grammar-old-hadith-wine-in-new-bottles/
Over the last 1-2 years, I rethought my approach and now think the Quran is more like a mirror, we attain realisations based on our station in the journey. It's a much more organic reading.
ah, so you're pak cik Farouk! D
your essay are interesting, especially on the point when you say "we don't need dictionary to understand the Quran". for some reason i might agreem but then Question popped in my Head, then how we study the Quran?
because recently im thinking, that we MIGHT BE don't need the Quran anymore to have faith to Allah the ONE TRUE GOD? pls don't call me infidel lol
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Wow, I've become a pakcik now. I used to be abang P
That's a very good question. How do you understand the Quran without dictionaries? I would ask how do you understand the Quran WITH dictionaries? Just as we rejected the authority of hadith because we don't believe it came from the Prophet, we should question when and where dictionaries came about. Who made them, who are these people who we never met and were they objective?
But to answer your question, I think we need to go to the living Arabic language. People speak Arabic and the language is an organic one. I speak English and Malay and probably consulted their dictionaries for 1% of my vocabulary. Language is a living human experience not found in dead texts. With dead texts, all you get are unverified proposals of meanings. I was just looking through the word 'mukalibeen' (in 5/4) and found that Lane's lexicon had MANY MANY meanings. Yet when I checked a popular resource , the only meaning which came out is 'dog'. Dictionaries get edited when the author cannot fathom certain meanings (like Nadwi's 'Dictionary of the Holy Quran). His own intellectual limitations prevent his objectivity. If it happens now, how can we be sure it didn't happen before?
We need to tap into this organic language and utilise the internal principles of tafseer in the Quran itself. For example, if you ask an Arab what is 'deen' , he is likely to say 'religion'. Religion is a set of rules and ordinances and beliefs. Can we shape the meaning with the Quran? I believe we can, by connecting the word with other words and seeing the chapters in which they appear. Everything in the text is purposeful. There are no passing comments in the Quran. If we utilise this information well, I feel we can arrive at the intended meaning.
The Quran is a map. You can travel the path without a map. I don't call people infidel or spreaders of falsehood or anything. People have a right to their views. I don't believe not using the Quran makes you an infidel at all anyway ) You should submit to the signs in your own life.
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Salaam,
This "Sufi" thing sounds interesting. An approach involving several aspects from different religions instead of being stuck on traditional Islamic views.
Meditation from Buddhism seems to be very helpful to progress spiritually. And that sort of thing.
This is true Islam.
God bless you
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thanks bigmo, is inayat khan a Muslim?
Shalom dude, its true! actually long ago i kinda have a trouble with this path because i saw it as a cult. You know, many sufi in my place act like a Paranormal that could see other people destiny or future, and some claim can do a miracle but they just don't want to show it.
but after i learn it from the right Sufi guy, i found it quite fascinating and beautiful, especially since i listen to their meditation Music. im a musician and i really love their composition, its so simple yet divinely beautiful.
well actually it isn't hard to find Tarekat (i don't know in english, it some kind of sufi class) in my country, but its indeed hard to find the inclusive one, because many of them required their followers to be a Sunni Muslim.
you right! my sufi folks never ever get fanatic to hadith things, yet they still use some wisdom in it. They even use buddhism book and hinduism book, and.. BIBLE D
but they solely holding the Quran alone as a source of all religious matters (but sometimes, they take hadith too)
i don't know about you and all people that has some sentiment to non-Quranist group (especially to sunni-shia). But, seriously i don't have any problem to take many wisdom and good things from anywhere, and yes include sunni and shia, therefore, i don't mind to be a Quranist that follow a Sufi path. and for the Masters things, they just LEAD our "ritual" stuffs and preach some khutbah, we as a sufi doesn't have to take the masters as sunnis take the Ulamas.
my sufi folks told me to study from everywhere, since God spread His signs throughout the entire universe. and of course that include buddhism )
but me personally, i don't have any interest to buddhism.
me too a Rationalist, but then i begin to rethink that being a full Rationalist cannot bring any peace for my soul and mind, therefore it seems i need to take some "mystic" way to achieve my better understanding of universe and GODI don't think he followed Sunni Islam as such but he was a monotheist. I am not sure what you mean by "Muslim".
Foundational principles
Inayat Khan set forth ten principles that formed the foundational principles of his Universal Sufism
1.There is one God; the Eternal, the Only Being; None exists save He.
2.There is one master; the guiding spirit of all souls that constantly leads all followers toward the light.
3.There is one holy book; the sacred manuscript of nature, the only Scripture that can enlighten the reader.
4.There is one religion; unswerving progress in the right direction toward the Ideal, which fulfills every soul's life purpose.
5.There is one law; the law of reciprocity, which can be observed by a selfless conscience, together with a sense of awakened justice.
6.There is one brotherhood; the human brotherhood which unites the children of earth indiscriminately in the fatherhood of God. This was later adapted by followers to; "There is one Family, the Human Family, which unites the Children of Earth indiscriminately in the Parenthood of God."
7.There is one moral; the love which springs forth from self-denial and blooms in deeds of beneficence. ... (later alternative; "which springs forth from a willing heart, surrendered in service to God and Humanity, and which blooms in deeds of beneficence".
8.There is one object of praise; the beauty which uplifts the heart of its worshipper through all aspects from the seen to the unseen.
9.There is one truth; true knowledge of our being, within and without, which is the essence of Wisdom.
10.There is one path; annihilation of the false ego in the real (later alternative; "the effacement of the limited self in the Unlimited", which raises the mortal to immortality, in which resides all perfection.Inayat Khan's emphasis on spiritual liberty led many contemporary Westerners to think that his brand of Sufism is not inherently intertwined with Islam, although his followers continue to perform (Dhikr). There is a precedent of masters of the Chishti and some other orders not requiring non-Muslim followers to convert to Islam. The number of non-Muslim Sufis before the twentieth century, however, was usually relatively few.
http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inayat_Khan
Its a very good combination with the Quran.
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Peace, I suppose people could label me as a Quranist on the Sufi path. I'm a mureed in the Ruhaniat order. I ve been to one of their camp gatherings a few years ago and GW I'll go to the next camp this may. People of all backgrounds gather and glorify Allah. Dancing, music, workshops, it's a fun time and I look forward to going. It's a Sufi order chaining from Inayat Khan from Chistiya and before. I have read his books and I understand most of where he is coming from on ideas like language and religion. Very deep thoughts that strike me. As someone who strives to follow Quran, I've found fellowship with Sufis more so than people in other paths who get hung up in trying to 'save' me from hellfire.
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Peace,
Once a group or sect is formed with a name referring to the sect, then Allah says you have nothing to do with them; there are only two parties. One, that of Allah's; and all the rest are that of shaitaan's such as sunni. shia, 19, sufi etc.
6159 Indeed, those who have broke their righteousness and become splinters - you shall have nothing with them in anything. Their affair is only with Allah; then He will inform them about what they used to do.
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Yeah sufism teach us the way of life, philosphy like Buddism do
I agree that Quran has Sufism style, because inside Quran,only 40% talking about fiqh, and another 60% is socio ethics, way of life and some philosopy like mosquito example etc
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Sufism is about personal experience, even though it may be in communities. It is not so much about doctrine, but about experience, intimate experience. It cannot be dogmatic because that preemts that personal experience which is the aim. It is the ercetion of, excuse the redundance, "real" reality and therefore it is harder to put into words.
Of course, like everything it lends itself to be used by dilettantes and fake mystics and new age swallow stuff, and it is a danger, not of sufism itself but of the way people perceive mysticism or spirituality that they think that the more they get oblivious of the world, including even duties to family, if they get closer to god they are better. That is a danger, mysticism does not relieve of any duty earthly or not anybody, but on the other hand, it should help to make every duty a wayt to get closer to God.
Salaam