New Article: what is 'al HaJJ' according to The Quran?
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Peace Alkitab,
773 And to Thamud, We sent their brother Saleh, he said ?My people, serve God, you have no god besides Him; clarity has come to you from your Lord, this is the camel of God, in her you have a sign, so leave her to eat in God?s earth, and do not harm her, else the painful retribution will take you.?
Is this sign something forced or something to be obeyed by free will?
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Peace Alkitab,
773 And to Thamud, We sent their brother Saleh, he said ?My people, serve God, you have no god besides Him; clarity has come to you from your Lord, this is the camel of God, in her you have a sign, so leave her to eat in God?s earth, and do not harm her, else the painful retribution will take you.?
Is this sign something forced or something to be obeyed by free will?
Salam Timur ,
The she-Camel itself is a sign to the people of Thamud because the she-camel was been sent to them.
The sign was sent to them
- 54 - 27
Indeed, We are sending the she-camel as trial for them, so watch them and be patient.
The sign was sent to them to confirm the messenger Salah's preaching , that he is carrying a message from allaah.
- 17 - 59
And nothing has prevented Us from sending signs except that the former peoples denied them. And We gave Thamud the she-camel as a visible sign, but they wronged her. And We send not the signs except as a warning.
- 7 - 73
And to the Thamud their brother salih. He said, "O my people, serve Allah ; you have no ilah other than Him. There has come to you clear evidence from your Lord. This is the she-camel of Allah to you as a sign. So leave her to eat within Allah 's land and do not touch her with harm, lest there seize you a painful punishment.
The sign was a trial , and they were asked to abey allah's command regarding that sign , which is
- 7 - 73
And to the Thamud their brother salih. He said, "O my people, worship Allah ; you have no deity other than Him. There has come to you clear evidence from your Lord. This is the she-camel of Allah to you as a sign. So leave her to eat within Allah 's land and do not touch her with harm, lest there seize you a painful punishment.
and
- 26 - 155
He said, "This is a she-camel. For her is a drink, and for you is a drink, on a known day.
- 26 - 156
And do not touch her with harm, lest you be seized by the punishment of a terrible day."
As for Zakaryiaah the sign ( becoming speechless ) was for him to have confident about the fact that he is going to have child. Don't forget that he asked about a sign , why ? because he want to be confident , and this doesn't mean he wasn't believing
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Salam,
Wakas thank you for the thorough and in depth article on the topic. I have been trying to get to the bottom of all the rituals we are "supposedly" meant to be doing. these posts with the study helps so much.
The only things i would say is that for beginners as in (ARABIC LANGUAGE) it gets a bit confusing as its more targeted towards people who have already studied arabic and understand the grammatical nuances. However, it really is amazing the amount of research and care you have taken so may Allah reward you with the wisdom, knowledge and clarity you seek. I havent done as much language research but from very glaringly obvious contradtictions around the Cuboid in Mecca i was very sure that the we have got it wrong and we are in the wrong vacininty to start with. verses which for a novice like me are still very clear. EG. The verse which talks about the how they pass the signs of luts people day and night. That was enough. However there are many more. Anyone with a subjective and non dogmatic mind set can get to the truth as this is the sign where Allah guides whom he pleases.
NoShirk - I have to agree with your explaination.
Can you explain that finally what hajj is and where and when are we supposed to do it? Its only if these practices were adhered to and upheld that we would now be in requirement to do them but clearly the religion of Mohammed has been lost and so we must take what we can of the sciptures and use our reason and logic to litmus test it and move on. We must now ignore the rituals, find our salat (contact/prayer/meditation), give charity and be kind and above all be monethiests. God will give us new signs and help us become a nation again. We must stop searching the past and move to the future. We have the Quran as a guidance for that.
Ashraf - I have to say your explaination i found the best as it made logical sense also. Please can you elaborate on the below
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w/salaam Affy77,
I agree that for beginners this article will not be an easy read. However, in my articles I do try and make them relatively easy to check by providing references/tools. I strongly recommend using the links etc. It would take some time to check however as it is a lot of content.
If there was any part(s) in particular that were complex/confusing, please let me know, so I can see if I can simplify or explain them better.
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Salam Wakas and everyone,
As a third person i will advise you to take up this debate with Noshirk and Al kithab and other learned free-minders as this subject is still in question. I still cannot establish if we are supposed to do hajj? when we should do it? and what are the rituals that should be adhered to. I think you guys have enough knowledge amongst you to come to a conclusion Inshallah.
I would advise holding off on the article and exploring some of the points raised by the others. I do agree with the theory that all prohpets argued and put well reasoned and logical arguments to gain traction with the non believers and others. This is how they spread the message and delivered the message. He was a messenger after all as are we all really if we say we are believers, of course we are not prophets with miracles but we do have our minds and the guidance with us and can spread the message. How better than to have an annual recruitment day? Hajj? We lay the arguments and people get free food they see the good and the reasoning and how great accepting Islam is. This invite is after all to all of mankind? No? Its just basic logic in my opinion, no matter how much study of language.
I have re-read the arguments and i feel strongly that Noshirk is raising some valid points. Ashraf i like the way you wrote but i have to say after re-reading it that type of an understanding only leads me to doubt as it makes me think that the quran is not timeless or universal but rather only catering for the needs of a small demographic in the middle east centuries ago. The God is everyones God and there is a lot of man kind outside of the gulf peninsula, hence my reason nor logic allows me to beleive that the whole subject is about hunting restrictions etc, finding a loophole in restricted seasons etc, perhaps it was relevant then? I would love to read more from you guys on this if you can keep the debate going?
The biggest question raised in my mind is that who and how did we get to Mecca, the circling of the kaa'ba ,? Why with such clear geographical clues did we end up there? are we wasting our time even trying to find out? Perhaps we just be good to each other and belive in the oness of god? it may be good enough? I know i am loosing the will and getting more and more confused to be honest.... brickwall
I look forward to your replies if any inshallah.
Affy
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Salam Wakas and everyone,
I know i am loosing the will and getting more and more confused to be honest.... brickwall
Affy
Salaam sis,
This is normal when we see that a lot (if not all) of what we were taught have some serious flaws.
Especially in the beginning of our journeys, sometimes it is almost overwhelming. If we not hold strong to Allah then we will for sure fall back from where we tried to escape from. But if we strive in the way of Allah and have patience, He will for sure get us out of these confusions and show us the correct direction.Salaam,
Bender -
w/salaam Affy77,
I still cannot establish if we are supposed to do hajj?
al hajj, as per Quran, seems to require an authority (whether it be an individual or community) to setup a framework wherein the criteria for al hajj is met, and can thus take place. If no such setup exists, then I do not see how one can do al hajj at the present time.
If you meant Traditional Mecca-Hajj, then sure one can do that, but whether they would be fulfilling a Quranic hajj is another matter.when we should do it?
when as in when specifically in the calendar was not covered in the article.
and what are the rituals that should be adhered to.
discussed in the article.
rguments and people get free food they see the good and the reasoning and how great accepting Islam is. This invite is after all to all of mankind? No? Its just basic logic in my opinion, no matter how much study of language.
I personally did not see any evidence from member noshirk, and have already replied to him.
The biggest question raised in my mind is that who and how did we get to Mecca, the circling of the kaa'ba ,? Why with such clear geographical clues did we end up there? are we wasting our time even trying to find out? Perhaps we just be good to each other and belive in the oness of god? it may be good enough? I know i am loosing the will and getting more and more confused to be honest.... brickwall
Personally, I think Quran is quite clear that the believers utilised the inviolable time of acknowledgement (al masjid al haram) and the homage/commemoration/conference (al hajj) in the latter stages of revelation. It seems they were simply tools to bring God's system/message/plan to fruition.
In my view, it is likely, the location was not set, as al hajj was criteria-led, and was later set by the ruling elites. -
Hi,
I have briefly read the threads which say the pilgrimage place is not Mecca it is Jerusalem.
To save me having to comb through all of the threads can anyone tell me if they too currently hold this view?
I am wondering because I have already been on a kind of pilgrimage to Jerusalem (serious - I went on a school trip in 1999) and visited all the jewish/christian sites (although I can't remember if we went to that golden dome mosque place or if that is even significant). Does this mean I have fufilled the pilgrimage commandment?
Or does it not apply to me anyway?
Thanks.
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Peace Jane,
I consider it to not be any pilgrimage at all but the related verses speak of joining and accepting God and the guidance.
But you can always have faith in whatever you like.
God bless you
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From Quran, it is clear "al hajj" is an event of some sort, involving various regulations and activities. We also know that Abraham and Moses were living in a time wherein "al hajj" was taking place, in their respective localities.
It is very likely that there was NOT only one "al hajj" that existed, and what I mean by that is that in the entire Arabia/continent (or perhaps world) it is unlikely only one "al hajj" for all people of the world existed. More likely, several "al hajj" existed, in various localities, of various peoples. With various differences for each.If we accept the above, then it seems logical to distinguish one "hajj" from another. In my view, that is what Quran is doing when it uses the phrase "...so whoever did HJJ (at/of) the House or enlivened/visited..." in 2158.
If we take it to mean "did HJJ (of) the house" it is referring to the house of God, an institution/system. This can be seen when Quran uses "people of the house" - clearly not referring to one physical house building, but a people living under God's roof, so to speak, His system, His deen/obligation etc.
For example, if a HJJ existed setup by a people and let's say it was known for commemorating yellow stone idols, it may have been termed by the people of the region/surround as "hajj (of) the yellow gods" or whatever.If we take it to mean "did HJJ (at) the house", which is also possible, "the house" will refer to the area wherein this event is taking place (where the various regulations are in force, where the people meet-up etc). This physical space in Quran is termed "al bayt al haram" / "the inviolable house". Simply shortened to "al bayt" here, which is more apt.
Both of the above options have similar connotations, and whichever is chosen, doesn't really affect the message/application, or at least not that I can see.
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Hi,
I have briefly read the threads which say the pilgrimage place is not Mecca it is Jerusalem.
To save me having to comb through all of the threads can anyone tell me if they too currently hold this view?
I am wondering because I have already been on a kind of pilgrimage to Jerusalem (serious - I went on a school trip in 1999) and visited all the jewish/christian sites (although I can't remember if we went to that golden dome mosque place or if that is even significant). Does this mean I have fufilled the pilgrimage commandment?
Or does it not apply to me anyway?
Thanks.
Jane I believe you can answer that question yourself, were you consciously on that trip for hajj?
Secondly if you want to know if you've fulfilled it you won't find your answer here on this forum.
Study the Quran thoroughly for all the topics related to hajj and more, and pray humbly,
Allah is near the supplicant when he prays -
Here are some additional notes, from a discussion I had with another:
Quran doesn't tell us to face al kaabah
Those prior to Abraham faced any direction, so did Abraham 6:79 - but apparently things changed.
Moses/Jesus didn't face al kaabah
Btw, we know for a fact Moses and his people didn't (see 10:87).So, the only logical option left for your position is to say, despite the above (unexplainable?) info, we are instructed to follow the millat of Abraham so that means following his alleged qiblah, but the "change of qiblah" verses conflict with this position:
Just before introducing the "change of qiblah" Quran clearly states:2:140 Or do you say that Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the Patriarchs were all Jewish or Nazarene? Say: "Are you more knowledgeable or is God?" Who is more wicked than one who conceals a testimony with him from God? God is not unaware of what you do.
2:141 That is a nation that has passed away; to them is what they have earned, and to you is what you have earned; and you will not be asked regarding what they did.But we are being told to do what they did... allegedly. It gets worse:
2:142 The foolish from the people will say: "What has turned them from the qiblah/focal-point which they were on it?"...
How can this possibly be foolish when according to your understanding only Abraham(+his people) had this alleged qiblah, EVERYONE else seems to have had none or another, so far from being a foolish question, seems a logical question to ask.
The verses go on to cause problems for the common understanding, as detailed here:
https://mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-masjid-al-haram-Quran.htmlInterestingly, all Quranic evidence afaik is against a specific special direction (2:115, 2:142, 2:177, 2:239, 10:87). Explicitly so in fact.
"raised the foundation min/from the bayt" means "raised the foundation from a part of the bayt". ?
Foundation means the most basic or beginning part, what the rest stands on. So in Quran can bayt refer to an unbuilt bare plot or a basic structure such that one cannot even describe as having a foundation? Cite the verse please.
If you struggle, I guess you can cite a Classical Arabic dictionary reference.You take turn+wajh in 6:79 as non-physical and turn+wajh in "change of qiblah" verses as physical. Inconsistent.
And you never answered = is 6:79 exemplar of Abraham null and void now (since we have a cuboid kaabah to face)? Has 6:79 been abrogated?You said kaabah is still guidance and securing even when its demolished and flooded. And people in the vicinity murdered. Perhaps you can provide your criteria for how its securing, and how one can enter it when demolished/flooded/bloodshed.
for violation, the hady reach al kaabah [5:95]
do hajj/umrah but if prevented give hady, enjoyed give hady, reaches its lawful place [2:196]
lawful place is "al bayt al atiq" [22:33]
Since you take al kaabah as "al bayt al haram", and therefore also "al bayt al atiq" [see 22:29]
That means all the hady above will be going to al kaabah for slaughter and distribution.So let me ask again, is your position circuiting of kaabah should be going on AS WELL AS slaughtering thousands of animals and distributing their meat at kaabah?
Yes/NoAs admitted the kiswah mentions prophet's name AND there is the black stone. If you've ever been there you will know there is practices/responses going on that cant be described any other way than idolatry. Many seem to love that black stone. Clamber to touch it and kaabah etc.
I know from past comments many here (all?) do not include prophets name in salat because you say it contradicts Quran. Remembrance, salat is for God alone.
Thus using the same logic, inclusion of kiswah and black stone contradicts the verses in Q15, thus al kaabah in Makkah seems to fail the criteria by your own standard. Also see 22:30-31Hence why you imply it needs purified (like Abraham's dua). You also seemed to claim the original purpose or intent of God is what counts thus its ok to partake!
By that logic, if cuboid kaabah was full of many idols, decorated with even more etc its all good we can still partake?
If Jesus' pure message is mixed with trinitarian beliefs, its all good, we can partake?
If islam is quran mixed with hadith, its all good, we can still partake?Now, with regard to it being an area. There is actually lots of evidence. Arabic speakers will likely know "bayt" is commonly used for a town/place for example. See here for discussion:
https://mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-hajj-Quran.htmlAnd as always, may God guide us all and bless us and increase our knowledge.
