homosexulaity

zenje

Well said Kyle,

O you who believe, it is not lawful for you to inherit the women by force, nor that you become harsh with them to take away some of what you have given them, unless they commit a clear lewdness. And live with them in kindness. If you dislike them, then perhaps you may dislike something and God makes in it much good.

Peace. )

unknownuser

Peace be upon you Zenje,

perfect verse! D

hlatif

Thank you brothers and sisters for all of your responses,

I do have some observations that I need your contribution in

1- We have to agree that most of your opinions were based on your own personal feelings rather than direct rulings in the Qur'an.
2- The Qur'an is very clear and direct when it comes to Adultery. The link to Homosexuality in the Lut Story is indirect.
3- If GOD destroyed the people of Lut for the crime of "male Homosexulaity", then why did he destroy the men and the women in the town?

26166
26166 And leave the wives your Lord created for you ? Nay, but ye are froward folk.
According to this Ayah, the women were some sort of victims.
4- What is your opinion on female homosexuality?The Qur'an does not talk about it.
5- What is your opinion of "Ghilmanun mukhalladoon" in paradise?

Thank you brothers and sisters for your opinions in advance.

Salam

Hussein

Green_Leaves

Peace,

This is my opinion (as much as possible based on the Quran)

idea We are told in the Quran that we must submit to God's will.

idea We are also told that those who refused to do so incurred God's wrath upon themeselves - be them average humans or even a prophet (notice, God even punished Jonah for not submitting to God's will and abandoning God's project, just like the pharoh was punished).

idea We are also told that God does whatever pleases God.

idea If God made you a man and someone a woman, do you not agree that was God's will?

idea If yes, then to God's will we must submit. "Submitting" means we ought to do the jobs that God has already sorted out for us (namely, women and men marry, set up a family, children, etc).

idea If you refuse God's will by saying I won't submit to the arrangement you've already made, then in my opinion that's disobeying God.

That's my humble opinion, but God knows best.

Idris

peace be upon you hlatif

Thank you brothers and sisters for all of your responses,

I do have some observations that I need your contribution in

1- We have to agree that most of your opinions were based on your own personal feelings rather than direct rulings in the Qur'an.
2- The Qur'an is very clear and direct when it comes to Adultery. The link to Homosexuality in the Lut Story is indirect.
3- If GOD destroyed the people of Lut for the crime of "male Homosexulaity", then why did he destroy the men and the women in the town?

26166
26166 And leave the wives your Lord created for you ? Nay, but ye are froward folk.
According to this Ayah, the women were some sort of victims.
4- What is your opinion on female homosexuality?The Qur'an does not talk about it.
5- What is your opinion of "Ghilmanun mukhalladoon" in paradise?

Thank you brothers and sisters for your opinions in advance.

Salam

Hussein

to answer some of your questions

3-they weren't destroyed for male homosexuality alone, check the other verses speaking on this
4-if you know the Arabic (not implying you don't) then you can clearly see that 415-16 speak on a punishment for homosexuality by both male and female, so female homosexuality is wrong as well

Tony

Salam hlatif,

1- We have to agree that most of your opinions were based on your own personal feelings rather than direct rulings in the Qur'an.

We share the same observation.

2- The Qur'an is very clear and direct when it comes to Adultery. The link to Homosexuality in the Lut Story is indirect.

It is clear (the Lut story) regarding man to man sex, not woman to woman.

4- What is your opinion on female homosexuality?The Qur'an does not talk about it.

The Quran does talk about it.

23 5. And who guard their private parts,
23 6. Except before their mates or those whom their right hands possess, for they surely are not blameable

And as for those who are guilty of an indecency from among your women, call to witnesses against them four (witnesses) from among you; then if they bear witness confine them to the houses until death takes them away or Allah opens some way for them.

Peace!
Tony

Tony

However, one thing bugs me..I cannot see in the Quran any prohibition for woman to woman marriages. The prohibitions for marriage are all addressed to men, and it is clear that a man cannot marry another man.

I need your input regarding woman to woman marriages.. IN THE LIGHT OF THE QURAN.

Peace!

Sebs

Peace be upon you Tony,

Hi Tony...
I got a translation that was posted here by a brother..i cant really remember who it was..but its quite good i think you might have it also?
It is by Muhammad Ahemd & his doughter, Samira..do you know of it?

anyway this is what is writen

And those who came/do/commit (F) with the enormous deed/atrocious deed/ugly
deed/saying/adultery/fornication/homosexuality* ?_rYB??A from your women, so call a witness on them (F), four
from you, so if they witnessed* A?f?q, so hold them (F) in the houses/homes until the death* P?A makes them
(F) die, or God makes/manipulates* ??? for them (F) a way/means.

I dont know Arabic brother so i am relying on translation's...what do you think???

Thanks, Peace

Sebs

Green_Leaves

However, one thing bugs me..I cannot see in the Quran any prohibition for woman to woman marriages. The prohibitions for marriage are all addressed to men, and it is clear that a man cannot marry another man.

I need your input regarding woman to woman marriages.. IN THE LIGHT OF THE QURAN.

Peace!

Peace,

Well, everything in the Quran is addressed to men. Even the place where it says don't marry idolworshipping women, it tells the man to not give away their daugthers to idolworshippers. Unlike men, it doesn't address the women asking them not the marry idolworhsipping men. The Quran never directly address anything to women as far as I know...I wonder whY???

But in light to your question, I believe the homosexuality laws apply to women too, just like the other laws that are not addressed to women do because there's that other verses, that says for the believing men, believing women....chaste men, chaste women...thus this verse equates both the good/bad deeds for men and women making it clear that what applies to men, applies to women too. And I seriously doubt if its a-okay with God if two women get married lol

Green_Leaves

The Quran does talk about it.

23 5. And who guard their private parts,
23 6. Except before their mates or those whom their right hands possess, for they surely are not blameable

And as for those who are guilty of an indecency from among your women, call to witnesses against them four (witnesses) from among you; then if they bear witness confine them to the houses until death takes them away or Allah opens some way for them.

Peace!
Tony

By the way, didn't you answer your own question couple of posts ago D

hlatif

Salam All,

I feel that I need to address 415 and 416.

Waallatee ya/teena alfahishatamin nisa-ikum faistashhidoo AAalayhinna arbaAAatanminkum fa-in shahidoo faamsikoohunna fee albuyooti hattayatawaffahunna almawtu aw yajAAala Allahu lahunnasabeelan
If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way.
16.
Waallathani ya/tiyanihaminkum faathoohuma fa-in taba waaslahafaaAAridoo AAanhuma inna Allaha kanatawwaban raheeman
If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful.

I think that two words here are key

alfahishata it means to do a bad thing in public or to announce it. This bad thing can be a sexual act of any kind (not necessarily gay)or even saying bad things, but the key is the in public part (According to my understanding of Qamus Muheet). This is why the punishment is to keep the women at their homes (So as not to go in public and commit such an act again)

Waallathan It was translated (Two men). It actually can mean (Two men or a man and a woman). The reason is that ALLATHAN is a male dual form. This form covers both sexes as long as there is a man there. The female dual form, in contrast covers only females.

Therefore those two AYAT may not be talking about Homosexuality as many suggested.

This is my humble opinion about those two issues.

Salam All

Hussein

TAJ

Salaam Hussein,

Waallathani ya/tiyanihaminkum faathoohuma fa-in taba waaslahafaaAAridoo AAanhuma inna Allaha kanatawwaban raheeman
If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful.
Waallathan It was translated (Two men). It actually can mean (Two men or a man and a woman). The reason is that ALLATHAN is a male dual form. This form covers both sexes as long as there is a man there. The female dual form, in contrast covers only females.

Therefore those two AYAT may not be talking about Homosexuality as many suggested.

So you think that is talking only about zina and not homosexuality!?

hlatif

Salam Taj,

I think that it can be either Zina or Homosexual acts, but the main thing about it is that the act was in public.

Salam

Hussein

Tony

Peace be upon you Tony,

Hi Tony...
I got a translation that was posted here by a brother..i cant really remember who it was..but its quite good i think you might have it also?
It is by Muhammad Ahemd & his doughter, Samira..do you know of it?

anyway this is what is writen

And those who came/do/commit (F) with the enormous deed/atrocious deed/ugly
deed/saying/adultery/fornication/homosexuality* ?_rYB??A from your women, so call a witness on them (F), four
from you, so if they witnessed* A?f?q, so hold them (F) in the houses/homes until the death* P?A makes them
(F) die, or God makes/manipulates* ??? for them (F) a way/means.

I dont know Arabic brother so i am relying on translation's...what do you think???

Thanks, Peace

Sebs

Salam Sebs,

I don't know Arabic either but I am confident that Fahsha is a general term for sexual indecency which would include adultery, fornication, homosexuality, dancing nude in public, etc.

Yes, I have heard of those translators and I want to have that one at least in my PC. Where can I download it?

Peace!
Tony

Tony

The Quran does talk about it.

23 5. And who guard their private parts,
23 6. Except before their mates or those whom their right hands possess, for they surely are not blameable

And as for those who are guilty of an indecency from among your women, call to witnesses against them four (witnesses) from among you; then if they bear witness confine them to the houses until death takes them away or Allah opens some way for them.

Peace!
Tony

By the way, didn't you answer your own question couple of posts ago

Salam greenleaves,

Any form of sexual intercourse outside marriage is indecent be it with the opposite sex or the same sex. And it is clear that male homosexuality is abhorred in the Quran. 415 does address women sex offenders and this is connected with 242. God in the Quran did not reprimand women for turning their natural desires towards women but instead prescribed a punishment for them in 415 for indecent acts. However, in today's weird society where same sex marriages are allowed in some countries, is sex among between two married females an "indecent" act?

That is why a have the question...Is woman to woman weddings allowed in the light of the Quran?

Peace!
Tony