A challenge to those who claim Quran states 5 salat daily
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I take salat absolutely as communication and seeking inspiration from God and it should be intelligible. Remember a part of The Book were salat is prescribed before an important testimony. Or were soldiers perform salat during a battle. It can be performed in any manner such as driving, riding, walking but best performed in a focused manner in calmness.
I sometimes perform salat while driving and I see results almost instantly. Opportunities arise. It is clear why we are recommended or explicitly told to perform the salat phenomenon.
I have abandoned the five prayer timings because I like many others felt no support from The Book on that matter. However, we should be conscious of God throughout the day and perform salat to help us with inspiration and choices. Salat is explicitly spoken out as prayers for guidance whenever you need some help.
Fixed prayer timing periods are however seemingly prescribed as morning and evening and then at night after that (before bedtime). I find little support for fixed prayers during daytime except for calls on your Lord for guidance in your daily life. The Book often repeats about glorification moments at the beginning and the end of the day. It does rarely even mention anything in the day except one that I suppose is misunderstood to meaning to establish regular prayer/salat whenever required throughout the day as in receiving inspiration and active guidance.
Birds have their salat too and that is how they are mindful of God through the way they are programmed for following God's system without any question such as flying in a certain formation or their species' special sound. And spiders have a distinct pattern on their web. They have autonomous salat. Humans are a bit more free willed and require our input but once commenced is rewarded by God's active guidance and inspiration to make our life choices and directions.
We can say one if not the sole reason for salat is that we may have God's Will be done according to His System and Judgment. We seek to perform all our deeds by connecting to God's superior Judgement.
We do not connect to God in salat to parrot a certain sequence that we trigger some magical buff. And we ought to know what we say during salat meaning the words must be thought through and it should be done in normal voice. Salat in a traditional way I could do on a bottle of booze but perhaps not if I wanted an intelligible communication. It all adds up, does it not?
And with a bottle of booze God's link with superior Judgment is impaired.
Peace
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Peace Wakas.
Thank you for your post.
Here are the verses you requested
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Muhammad A Follower of Abraham*
16123
Then we inspired you (Muhammad) to follow the religion of Abraham,* the monotheist; he never was an idol worshiper.We made them imams who guided in accordance with our commandments, and we taught them how to work righteousness, and how to observe the Salat and the obligatory charity (Zakat)....
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Peace Bender.
Thank you for your question.
Check these verses out1439
"Praise be to God for granting me, despite my old age, Ismail and Isaac. My Lord answers the prayers.1440
"My Lord, make me one who consistently observes Salat, and also my children. Our Lord, please answer my prayers.And
2172
And we granted him Isaac and Jacob as a gift, and we made them both righteous.2173
We made them imams who guided in accordance with our commandments, and we taught them how to work righteousness, and how to observe the Salat and the Zakat.* To us, they were devoted worshipers.GOD bless you .
Peace.
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Peace Bender.
Thank you for your question.
Check these verses out1439
"Praise be to God for granting me, despite my old age, Ismail and Isaac. My Lord answers the prayers.1440
"My Lord, make me one who consistently observes Salat, and also my children. Our Lord, please answer my prayers.And
2172
And we granted him Isaac and Jacob as a gift, and we made them both righteous.2173
We made them imams who guided in accordance with our commandments, and we taught them how to work righteousness, and how to observe the Salat and the Zakat.* To us, they were devoted worshipers.GOD bless you .
Peace.
Salaam good logic,
Yes I can see that the word sallaat is used in those verses, but I do not understand how you derived that it ORGINATED from Ibrahim.
Salaam,
Bender -
Peace Bender.
I do not recall seeing "salat" mentioned before Abraham either in the bible or Qoran. Even though GOD mentioned Noah, Adam...
Unless you or others know otherwise.
So I am assuming " salat" originated with Abraham?
Thank you brother.
Peace.
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Salaams all
I wish I had enough time to read all previous comments before I post but unfortunately don't so forgive me if I say something repeated or out of context.
The way I see salaat
2125
Meaning Take your prayer from the Station of Ibraheem.
For me this ayat is enough and that's how I pray, how they do in our Islamic capital Makkah.This is the only way the whole ummah will pray in unity. The point of Congregation is unity.
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Lately I am more inclined to think that Salat is inspiration and connection to the Divinity when we achieve the enlightened state without our thoughts (programing-data playing in our minds from memories) and we align with the Divinity, that's why it is said in the Qur'an that birds know their Salat.
Now, perhaps at one stage, the 5 daily ritual/namaz may be useful to someone in a mode of taming or disciplining his ego and his mundane/pagan nature...
PS
Abraham might have been a historical person, but he is certainly more a symbol (Brahma) (Av-ram=Aba r*m, then Avraham) and "he" didn't originate or invent the alignment with the Divinity, "he" is just a symbol of that total adherence.Peace
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Peace Bender.
I do not recall seeing "salat" mentioned before Abraham either in the bible or Qoran. Even though GOD mentioned Noah, Adam...
Unless you or others know otherwise.
So I am assuming " salat" originated with Abraham?
Thank you brother.
Peace.
Salaam good logic,
I find this very strange reasoning. Is this method of reasoning only for sallaat or also for other things?
Just a couple of things that comes to mind now
==> 1958 Those are the ones whom God has blessed from among the prophets from the progeny of Adam, and those We carried with Noah, and from the progeny of Abraham and Israel, and from whom We have guided and chosen. When the revelations of the Almighty are recited to them, they fall down prostrating, and in tears.
1959 Then, generations came after THEM who lost the SALLAAT and followed desires. They will find their consequences.
who are THEM in 1959 does it include also Adam and Nuh, if not why not?==> 3117 O my son, hold the contact prayer and advocate righteousness and prohibit vice, and be patient to what befalls you. These are the most honorable traits.
can you prove that Luqmaan and his son where AFTER Ibrahim?==> 1087 And We inspired to Moses and his brother "Let your people leave their homes in Egypt, and let these homes be your qibla, and hold the contact prayer. And give good news to the believers."
qibla orginated from Musa and Harun?==> 1926 "So eat and drink and be happy. If you see any human being, then say 'I have vowed an SAWMAN for the Almighty, so I will not talk today to any of mankind.'"
Sawm orginated from Meryem?==> 2173 is not ONLY about Ibrahim, so not sure why you left the others out of competition.
salaam,
Bender -
Lately I am more inclined to think that Salat is inspiration and connection to the Divinity when we achieve the enlightened state without our thoughts (programing-data playing in our minds from memories) and we align with the Divinity, that's why it is said in the Qur'an that birds know their Salat.
Now I'm also think the same.
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Peace Bender.
Thank you for your post.
Have you forgotten the verse I gave you? {16123}
GOD did not ask to follow " milat" Luqman" or " noah" or "Adam"...
He asked to follow " millat" Abraham. Does "millat" include the rites that include "salat"?
GOD bless you brother.
Peace.
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Peace Bender.
Thank you for your post.
Have you forgotten the verse I gave you? {16123}
GOD did not ask to follow " milat" Luqman" or " noah" or "Adam"...
He asked to follow " millat" Abraham. Does "millat" include the rites that include "salat"?
GOD bless you brother.
Peace.
Salaam,
Your claim was "salaat orginated from Ibrahim" so I do not see a link with your reaction above hmm
RED I dunno, you tell me. I don't even know that sallaat has rites.
Salaam,
Bender -
Peace Bender.
Thank you once more.
Let me explain further, Why I think "salat" is part of the rites of "Millat" or " Deen"....of Abraham2124
Recall that Abraham was put to the test by his Lord, through certain commands, and he fulfilled them. (God) said, "I am appointing you an imam for the people." He said, "And also my descendants?" He said, "My covenant does not include the transgressors.2127
As Abraham raised the foundations of the shrine, together with Ismail (they prayed) "Our Lord, accept this from us. You are the Hearer, the Omniscient.2128
"Our Lord, make us Muslims to You, and from our descendants let there be a community of Muslims to You. Teach us the rites of our religion, and redeem us. You are the Redeemer, Most Merciful.2130
Who would forsake the Millat of Abraham, except one who fools his own soul? We have chosen him in this world, and in the Hereafter he will be with the righteous.2132
Moreover, Abraham exhorted his children to do the same, and so did Jacob "O my children, God has pointed out the Deen for you; do not die except as Muslimeen."I hope this clarifies for you my understanding of why I think the rites ,including "salat" have originated from Abraham.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Peace Bender.
Thank you once more.
Let me explain further, Why I think "salat" is part of the rites of "Millat" or " Deen"....of Abraham2124
Recall that Abraham was put to the test by his Lord, through certain commands, and he fulfilled them. (God) said, "I am appointing you an imam for the people." He said, "And also my descendants?" He said, "My covenant does not include the transgressors.2127
As Abraham raised the foundations of the shrine, together with Ismail (they prayed) "Our Lord, accept this from us. You are the Hearer, the Omniscient.2128
"Our Lord, make us Muslims to You, and from our descendants let there be a community of Muslims to You. Teach us the rites of our religion, and redeem us. You are the Redeemer, Most Merciful.2130
Who would forsake the Millat of Abraham, except one who fools his own soul? We have chosen him in this world, and in the Hereafter he will be with the righteous.2132
Moreover, Abraham exhorted his children to do the same, and so did Jacob "O my children, God has pointed out the Deen for you; do not die except as Muslimeen."I hope this clarifies for you my understanding of why I think the rites ,including "salat" have originated from Abraham.
GOD bless you.
Peace.Salaam,
Thanks for your analysis.
We can discuss this very long, but our methods and understandings are to different that a futher discussion will not be very fruitful I guess. And I think it is also off-topic.Salaam,
Bender -
Salam Wakas,
Lest it is lost by of topic
Salamun alaikum;
- Lane says Basic perception He clave, ; cut, or divided, lengthwise this is the primary signification, whence several others, to be mentioned below, are derived Time reference the light of morning; (Mgh, K because it is a cleaving of the darkness from before the light; (Mgh i. e., the redness of the sun in the darkness of night; (K the in the end of the night is like the in the beginning thereof (S, O it is twofold the first is called ; that which rises without extending laterally, (, Mgh, Msb,) which appears black, presenting itself like an obstacle (ا
2, 3, 4 These are mentioned in one compound sentence
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/011.%20Hud%20alaihissalm/11.114.gif
The figure of speech is climax; placement of words in ascending order towards the incoming moments of night.
The two timings for obeying the command are
It a possessive phrase for which reason Noon of first DUAL noun is dropped the two visual transitions-edges of the bright day tapering towards the incoming night.
The fourth is at
"the early moments of the night". This sentence/time is defined by referring to the Sun
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/017.%20Al%20Israa/17.78.gif
"the point in time of rubbing and smoothly getting away of the Sun to the boundary of night getting cool and dark".and
5 the definite time is
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Salam Wakas,
Do you think and translate the phrase as two corners on a straight line
http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/114.%20Anhaar%20Noon%20Haa%20Ra/2.gifhttp//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Tabweeb%20Part%202/01.Roots%20originating%20in%20Sura%20003/34.%20Tarfan%20Toi%20Ra%20Fa/2.gif
1.Fajr___________________________________________2 Isha
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Good idea
The common problems with 5 salat daily timings as per The Quran
http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.htmlSalam everybody, Its been a while since my last post but have been dipping in and out of the forum. I thought I'd share this response from bro Joseph to Wakas's critique. (A request from a sister).
http//quransmessage.com/critiques/Response%20to%20Wakas.htm
