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  4. The Ummah is the Disbelievers?

The Ummah is the Disbelievers?

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  • J Offline
    J Offline
    Jafar
    wrote on last edited by
    #27

    You can oppose God, and God grants respite to people as we are given a chance to change,

    I don't think so, as it violate the principle of "always in control".
    Even a petty event such as the fall of your hair will not happened if it's not in accordance to God's will..
    Thus everything happened as it was planned, flawlessly..

    It is not like God needs to fear anyone, but God does not destroy people instantly despite being in opposition even if The Master could. I call it mercy because I could have been killed before I had discovered the truth as I was not really an angel before.

    Again any being is not an 'enemy' or 'opposition' of God.
    The True God that is, because He / It always be in control.
    Everything submit, willingly or unwillingly..

    The Master wants to see who really struggle and show their faith.

    Given He has no limitation of time and space, He already know the answer to every question.
    So there's no need "to see who is really X" because it's known already...

    And if people oppose someone with faith, and God's ally, then their are logically God's enemy too.

    Again I don't think so, God has no "ally" or "enemy".
    Human does..
    Ask a group of human who is God's enemy?
    And the answer will always be "Our Enemy is God's Enemy! that's why we must kill them".

    Ally exist because there's an enemy, without enemy there will be no ally, without ally there will be no enemy.
    And I define enemy as those who are beyond control or those who pose a threat to one existence.

    Unless "enemy" is defined as "those who are not inline with the plan".
    Then yes God has many "enemies".. yet all of those enemies doesn't pose any threat at all.
    Or He need any help to 'eradicate' the enemies.

    The plan will be executed as it was planned, flawlessly.
    Everything submit, willingly or unwillingly..

    Sometimes events are like that the missionary goes to warn in a city about their transgressions and when they fail to heed God sends some misfortune upon them.

    A misfortune upon the misbehave is a fortune upon those who behave.
    An oppressor getting eradicated and become extinct is a misfortune for the oppressor but a fortune for the oppressed.

    That's among the evidence of the "What goes around comes around" law..

    And given to the fact that the oppressor has always meet their ill-fate in the end.
    It's clear that the plan is to make human less oppressive and more just as time progress..

    Those who are inline with the plan shall survive those who are not inline with the plan shall be eradicated.
    The survival of the nicest..

    God tests people or otherwise the test would be through already. God would not make all this without a purpose.

    I agree if it is "every event has it's purpose" a.k.a "every event caused a state which shall trigger / followed by another events".
    And given such fact, all events that followed an event can always be known prior to the happening of such event.
    For the one who possessed such capability and possessed no limit of thought and knowledge.

    Salam / Peace

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    • M Offline
      M Offline
      Man_of_Faith
      wrote on last edited by
      #28

      Peace,

      Planned or not, you can oppose God.

      Enemy or not, you can oppose God.

      Yet God put everything going. There is a reason God exposes us to this test. If God was not to test us then this world would be redundant and God would judge immediately. However, God would not create redundant things making the idea fallible or making God someone who is not thorough in planning.

      God has love and allies. But perchance you do not think that the recitation to X (allegedly Muhammad) is true?

      But the question was whether you can oppose God and if you oppose people who have faith in The Master you oppose God. People oppose people with faith all the time. If we started acting out on our faith more worldwide, grew, and God alone faith was becoming a threat then people, especially those who claim to uphold God's creed, would begin to oppose us and that was what happened all those times in the past including when the recitation was revealed. And if we are truly faithful ones then if someone oppose us then they oppose God as long as we do not transgress on the decree and the teachings of God.

      If you side with God then The Master will show give great protection and strength.

      Kufr is not traditionally opponent because people did not want to translate it that way because it causes much more hatred to emerge. That is inspiration from Satan.

      God bless you

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      • M Offline
        M Offline
        Man_of_Faith
        wrote on last edited by
        #29

        Peace,

        But verily everything is proceeding as The Master has foreseen already or I would never have discovered the path as God must have seen and known something about me as I was not really the role model of a 'man of faith' some years ago and I still have a long way to go.

        But the way we perceive things it is like a story of a long long motion picture and God make us believe that way so why not accept the game rules? We have active part of it and decisions seem to matter. And we can choose to live in the way of God OR oppose The Master.

        God bless you

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        • J Offline
          J Offline
          Jafar
          wrote on last edited by
          #30

          But the way we perceive things it is like a story of a long long motion picture and God make us believe that way so why not accept the game rules?

          It depends on the perspective, yet it's true that normally human perceive time as moving only in one direction.

          Although based on the study of things that is very small, we did found such thing is not always true.

          We have active part of it and decisions seem to matter. And we can choose to live in the way of God OR oppose The Master.

          The option is more of we can choose to accept or (try to) reject God's will.
          Rejecting only ends up in sorrow, suffering and other negative feelings and it's futile.

          That's what Jacob meant through the saying of "die not except in the state of islam".
          When it's time to leave this universe, accept it.
          In the same manner as it was once before, when it was the time to enter to this universe.
          What has happened in your life, all of your good and bad events, accept it.

          Or when Jesus said "So it is written, so it shall be done."

          Or when Siddharta explains further with "When (egocentric) desire has ceased, you'll experience nirvana. An acceptance, non-attachment, peace"

          That's the attitude of islam (dienul islam)

          Salam / Peace

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          • M Offline
            M Offline
            Man_of_Faith
            wrote on last edited by
            #31

            Peace brother Jafar,

            Surely we can only try to oppose God, but yet people try? Why is that?

            God bless you

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            • J Offline
              J Offline
              Jafar
              wrote on last edited by
              #32

              Surely we can only try to oppose God, but yet people try? Why is that?

              The truest answer will be because that's the way it's supposed to be..
              The above is actually the answer to any question.

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              • J Offline
                J Offline
                JavaLatte
                wrote on last edited by
                #33

                Surely we can only try to oppose God, but yet people try? Why is that?

                I suppose because they don't like all/some of God's rules/instructions/commands.

                What important is that we (ourselves) better not try to oppose God, not try it at all.

                Peace.

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                • T Offline
                  T Offline
                  Themaninblack
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #34

                  Because of ignorance and a lack of faith- Something that we have plenty of today as I see.

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                  • T Offline
                    T Offline
                    Themaninblack
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #35

                    Besides, why are some of you questioning whether if Muhammad's name was Muhammad. Do not question pointless things like that, instead ponder on the Qur'an our Lord revealed to us and be very thankful for it's message and the messenger Allah sent us. Please forgive my mistakes in writing this, I am using a phone.

                    Salaam, may Allah guide us all.

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                    • C Offline
                      C Offline
                      Crow
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #36

                      The fault of not following this or that teaching of the Qur'an does not in and of itself make one a 'disbeliever'- HOWEVER.... looking at this or that teaching of the Qur'an and simply denouncing it as false, in my personal opinion, DOES (in my opinion) make one a 'disbeliever'. We must acknowledge the teachings of the Qur'an, and accept them as the Word of Allah, and recognize them as being truthful and the standard to which we should all strive, even if we personally do not 'like' the teaching.

                      HAVING SAID THAT... I'm not about to go for the throat and pronounce takfir on that person- I may be wrong in my observation of that person, and he or she may just need a little nudge to get back on the straight path. I might not agree with the way they are practicing their understanding of the faith, but declaring one is a DISBELIEVER is not my place.

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