Do you take the Qur'an literally?
-
Hi,
I've come to the conclusion that the Qur'an as a whole cannot be taken literally, this would simply be impossible and irrational.
Anyone who reads the Qur'an carefully will clearly see that there are plenty of verses that were only relevant to the conditions of the Arabs of Arabia at the time. There is actually no person on earth, no country on earth, and no organization on earth that follows the entire Qur'an literally. Even those who think they do. But if you tell any Muslim that there are verses that are NOT universal or verses that should NOT be taken LITERALLY they go berserk...
The Qur'an is not an encyclopedia, not "everything" can be find in the Qur'an. And it's not a book of law or economics or anything similar that we could easily apply in our life. The Qur'an was one of God's "interventions" in human history in a particular region in a particular time in history. Sure, there are beautiful universal messages as well, but to believe that the entire Qur'an can be taken literally and applied at any time in any region on earth is insanity. We can and should only be inspired by the Qur'an...
Your thoughts? What does the "Qur'an" mean to you?
-
I think Quran is a living book and it is applicable for all the times. The wisdom contained therein is not time bound. Anyone can get guidance from it at anytime if it is approached with a clean slate, without any pre-conceived concepts, tafseers or reasons/incidents for revealing verses etc. Whoever opens it to get guidance can get it as per individual's capacity.
Peace
-
I've come to the conclusion that the Qur'an as a whole cannot be taken literally, this would simply be impossible and irrational.
Well said Novice
I think Quran is a living book and it is applicable for all the times. The wisdom contained therein is not time bound.
Literally
strictly adhering to basic meaning in a way based on the basic or explicit meaning of a word or text
Grand Qur'aan is a non-fiction book. It must be interpreted literally. When you do so, the time-frames mentioned therein are taken care.
Its title indicates that it is a living book, time-space wraped to a compact dot.
Grand Qur'aan is alive in time and space
-
I've come to the conclusion that the Qur'an as a whole cannot be taken literally, this would simply be impossible and irrational.
That's a spot on statement. Someone with somewhat thinking capacities and rationality would come to the same conclusion, if they weren't so thoroughly religiously indoctrinated (which all of us have gone through actually).
There is actually no person on earth, no country on earth, and no organization on earth that follows the entire Qur'an literally. Even those who think they do. But if you tell any Muslim that there are verses that are NOT universal or verses that should NOT be taken LITERALLY they go berserk...
True. Exactly what I have gone through. I guess they want to hold on that the Quran is 100% infallible word of the Creator. And anything slightly else they would lose their head. Their rose-coloured lenses would drop off. They are also scared of losing a steady moral system that they are accustomed to, and the "sweetness of faith" as well. Also we suffer a lot in our lives in general, so thinking the God of the Quran is someone we can rely on to reward us for our pain is comforting and our pain becomes less and more manageable in a way.
Sure, there are beautiful universal messages as well, but to believe that the entire Qur'an can be taken literally and applied at any time in any region on earth is insanity.
A lot of the Quran actually, if taken literally, or applied literally in this world, is insanity. I even feel it would have been insanity for any ages at all. Which is what makes me thoroughly doubt regarding the Quran. Either the interpretations are WAY off, or the Arabic text of the Quran has been tampered with, or the Quran is not the Word of God. I am currently investigating slowly, before I end up deciding on the third possibility.
I sometimes think ISIS is doing a better job at implementing some of the Quran's verses in it's literal way, instead of many Muslims who play interpretation acrobatics with the verses, end up having mud fights with each other on whose interpretation is correct and later end up using their normal conscience and reasoning to do what is right, instead of following the Quran literally. And the same Muslims later look at some of the actions of ISIS with horror, such as wondering how they mustered so much hatred against the non-Muslims, instead of going to the Quran and apart from a few verses, seeing hundreds of verses spewing the same hatred against the non-Muslims.
Peace.
-
You can take the Quran as a guide, if it is interpreted as intended by the Author, but if you follow the false interpretations then you must think carefully.
Have faith
Salaam
-
Teh Qur?an itself says for instance for Paradise and jehannam that it is speaking in mathal, paraboles or whatever one wants to call them. But other things it does say that it is uite clear and without imbiguity.
So it is to be taken literally where it is meant literally and as mathal where it is meant that way.
But, of course, you must first understand, what it says and not jump to whatever idiocy may come to the mind either of the reader or of those the reader is following when reading the Qur'an or a translation.
Salaam
-
@Man of Faith
You can take the Quran as a guide, if it is interpreted as intended by the Author, but if you follow the false interpretations then you must think carefully.
It looks like people had rather prefer mud-fights and blaming everybody else left and right rather than thinking carefully over the source that they are trying to interpret. It's NOT the people and their character's fault here to a large extent, it is the source itself. At least starting with seeing if the Quran was ever translated properly in the first place. And after the "proper" translation has been done, seeing whether it suits the humanistic, progressive and just vision that a lot of the world apart from the Muslims have embraced for themselves.
-
I sometimes think ISIS is doing a better job at implementing some of the Quran's verses in it's literal way, instead of many Muslims who play interpretation acrobatics with the verses, end up having mud fights with each other on whose interpretation is correct and later end up using their normal conscience and reasoning to do what is right, instead of following the Quran literally. And the same Muslims later look at some of the actions of ISIS with horror, such as wondering how they mustered so much hatred against the non-Muslims, instead of going to the Quran and apart from a few verses, seeing hundreds of verses spewing the same hatred against the non-Muslims.
I think the problem lies in applying the meaning of the word "Muslim" as it is used today to the Quran. There was no such thing like a religion called Islam when the Quran was pronounced. The Hebrew Bible is full of complaints and curses against the Jews, but no one would say it it antisemitic but it has ti be read as "internat critique". The same applies to Quran, it is a critique about atrocities within the community (of believers, in the case of Jews and Christians, and of the same tribe, in case of the Arabs), not against the Other.
-
Hello Reee,
I wish I understood people's complete opinions further regarding the Quran. I really do not wish to see interpretation acrobatics being at play. As a start, people could start finding what is the meaning of the word "kafir" as used hundreds of times in the Quran.
-
Oh we have found that meaning, don't worry, cut I doubt that it does interest you. You seem to catch up to any straw to just disqualify anythign that is answered to you and instead speak at interpretation acrobatics, but reject that what you have been fed, or you say so, about the Qur'an may have been indeed interretation acrobatics. A problem you will not have with the West which they have rally been saints all along.
-
A lot of the Quran actually, if taken literally, or applied literally in this world, is insanity. I even feel it would have been insanity for any ages at all. Which is what makes me thoroughly doubt regarding the Quran. Either the interpretations are WAY off, or the Arabic text of the Quran has been tampered with, or the Quran is not the Word of God. I am currently investigating slowly, before I end up deciding on the third possibility.
Personally, I do think it's the word of God but equally important as the Qur'an, perhaps even more important, is that God has given us a brain to use and be creative as humans. There are verses about the universe etc. that no human could have said 1400 years ago. And they are all correct. Secondly, the information in the DNA alone and everything else in the universe clearly points to an intelligent Creator. And I think He must have communicated with us at some point.
When I look at all other scriptures and religions, I inevitably come to the conclusion that Islam is the most rational religion of all. There are still some verses I have doubts about, I won't deny that but I assume it's because of my lack of understanding. Basically, I don't see a more rational option than to believe in God, do good deeds and be hopeful about life after death. If there was no God, everything would have been totally meaningless, and all the criminals and murderers on earth would get away with their crimes, which I find very hard to believe.
One of the biggest problems I still have is why an atheist who dedicates his whole life to help other people would be thrown in Hell for eternity. That simply doesn't make sense to me whatsoever. But I believe that God is just and that this will not be the case. I know if instead of being born to Turkish parents, I was born in Mexico , I wouldn't have been a Muslim today. There is no question. So just because you were born in Saudi Arabia, Turkey or Pakistan does not and cannot guarantee you a free ticket to Paradise.
-
I think Quran is a living book and it is applicable for all the times. The wisdom contained therein is not time bound. Anyone can get guidance from it at anytime if it is approached with a clean slate, without any pre-conceived concepts, tafseers or reasons/incidents for revealing verses etc. Whoever opens it to get guidance can get it as per individual's capacity.
Peace
Are you sure?
Do you "free a slave" when you commit a sin? Ever done so?
And do you hunt when you come out of ihram (at Hajj)? According to the Qur'an we should all hunt when coming out of ihram.
Who does that at Hajj? Ther are many more examples believe me.
During war God tells us to take all the women of the enemy and make them our "Jariyah" (Concubine).
Do you support that? ISIS does exactly that.
-
Well said Novice
Literallystrictly adhering to basic meaning in a way based on the basic or explicit meaning of a word or text
Grand Qur'aan is a non-fiction book. It must be interpreted literally. When you do so, the time-frames mentioned therein are taken care.
Its title indicates that it is a living book, time-space wraped to a compact dot.
Grand Qur'aan is alive in time and space
Please see my questions above to Novice.
-
Are you sure?
Do you "free a slave" when you commit a sin? Ever done so?
And do you hunt when you come out of ihram (at Hajj)? According to the Qur'an we should all hunt when coming out of ihram.
Who does that at Hajj? Ther are many more examples believe me.
Please refer to Ayah and firstly try to understand it yourself. You seem to have erred in understanding or comprehending what is written therein.
-
Please refer to Ayah and firstly try to understand it yourself. You seem to have erred in understanding or comprehending what is written therein.
Have to go now, but I assume you know that God tells us to take the women of the enemy during war and make them our concubines (jariah)? Throughout history that is exactly how Muslims understood and applied those Qur'anic verses. It wasn't inhumane, irrational or injust then, but now it would be of course.
-
One of the biggest problems I still have is why an atheist who dedicates his whole life to help other people would be thrown in Hell for eternity. That simply doesn't make sense to me whatsoever. But I believe that God is just and that this will not be the case. I know if instead of being born to Turkish parents, I was born in Mexico , I wouldn't have been a Muslim today. There is no question. So just because you were born in Saudi Arabia, Turkey or Pakistan does not and cannot guarantee you a free ticket to Paradise.
In my opinion, a self-declared atheist who dedicates his or her whole life to help others is not a non-believer. I think the "ahira" points to something bigger than our own egoistic strivings, and that includes the humanistic ideals the "atheist" may follow. He or she may as well be "muslim" in the sense of recognizing that we are all part of one wholeness. On the other side, there might be many formal Muslims that don't recognisze this, though I am not the one to judge others.
-
Have to go now, but I assume you know that God tells us to take the women of the enemy during war and make them our concubines (jariah)? Throughout history that is exactly how Muslims understood and applied those Qur'anic verses. It wasn't inhumane, irrational or injust then, but now it would be of course.
This is also gossip based statement. Quote the Ayah of Qur'aan which says like that.
-
Have to go now, but I assume you know that God tells us to take the women of the enemy during war and make them our concubines (jariah)? Throughout history that is exactly how Muslims understood and applied those Qur'anic verses. It wasn't inhumane, irrational or injust then, but now it would be of course.
Such rulings should be inhumane, irrational and unjust at any point of history. The very concept send fear, shivers and chills throughout me. Which woman would be okay in seeing her father, brother or husband killed and tortured and the same killers or torturers taking her away and having sex with her? And it is not consensual sex, it is rape. So essentially your viewpoints are saying rape was okay back then but not now.
And how on earth could a God sanction this? I know we are used to seeing irrational things asked and propagated by the God in the traditional interpretations of the Quran, but that doesn't mean people need to agree with them, but may just follow the words and "have faith" in them because that's what the scripture says.
Rape is never okay. Against any gender, any time in history. We should have this point cleared before moving on.
-
This is also gossip based statement. Quote the Ayah of Qur'aan which says like that.
Please interpret 'Ma malakat aymanukum' in the Quran, in a way that sounds satisfactory for all instances of occurrence of this phrase in the Quran.
-
In my opinion, a self-declared atheist who dedicates his or her whole life to help others is not a non-believer. I think the "ahira" points to something bigger than our own egoistic strivings, and that includes the humanistic ideals the "atheist" may follow. He or she may as well be "muslim" in the sense of recognizing that we are all part of one wholeness. On the other side, there might be many formal Muslims that don't recognisze this, though I am not the one to judge others.
Beyond any doubt it's possible for atheists to have humane principles. Though, you speak about "being part of one wholeness" and that's where atheism fails. If a person is a true atheist it implies the idea of that wholeness is not accepted as much as you are trying to represent in your statement. To realize this wholeness one must consider we are all made from stars, big bang, Gods design. Take Gods design out of that equation and there is no big bang, no stars, and no wholeness. So if a true atheist is applying humanistic ideals, one should question why he is doing so. Because rationally from the atheist perspective there is no reason to do so whatsoever. There is no wholeness in atheism, there is only chaos, coincidence and nihilism.
Only God knows what is in people's hearts (true intentions).
ps Science used to be always related to religion. Pondering on the origin of this reality and universe one has to face the God question sooner or later. Someone who is a self-declared atheist has fooled himself to believe science can solve, or has already answered these questions while not touching the subject of God.