Fasting and ramadan according to quran
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There is nothing wrong with fasting 30 days. I do so and I feel it does good for me. However, I would not denounce anyone who does fasting in another way. The main sentence, according to my understanding, is "fasting is prescribed for you as it was for the ones before you", an the rest is just a recommendation, or implementation rule.
The main meaning of "Quran only" is using your own heart and brain instead of following self-declared scholars, so do what you are convinced of.
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There is nothing wrong with fasting 30 days. I do so and I feel it does good for me. However, I would not denounce anyone who does fasting in another way. The main sentence, according to my understanding, is "fasting is prescribed for you as it was for the ones before you", an the rest is just a recommendation, or implementation rule.
The main meaning of "Quran only" is using your own heart and brain instead of following self-declared scholars, so do what you are convinced of.
OK, but, who are those before you? "as it was for the ones before you"... Jews don't fast that way, Christians fast only Wednesdays and Fridays I think... so it is still not clear...
Thanks -
Peace
Each individual has the right to follow what he believes. There is no problem if someone fast for thirty days or 365 days that is his look out but as far as Quran is concerned it never says that a believer has to fast the whole month. For more than 1400 years the so called scholars have failed to interpret AYYAME MADUDAT.
For a certain number of days / Days numbered and few / (Fast) a certain number of days / a limited number of days./ (Fasting) for a fixed number of days.
Ask the scholars what is number of days / days number and few / certain number of days / limited number of days/ fixed number of days.
Why are they afraid of writing FULL MONTH OF RAMADHAN. or 30 days of Ramadhan or 29 days of Ramadhan.
Quran explicitly says AYYAME MADUDAT and AYYAME MADUDAT does not mean FULL MONTH/29/30 DAYS
And remember Allah on the days numbered. Then whosoever hastens in two days on him is no sin, and whosoever delayeth, On him is no sin this for him who feareth. So fear Allah, and know that verily unto Him shall ye be gathered. (2 203)
How many days to remember Allah during Hajj. Is it four months? Ask the scholars what is AYYAME MADUDAT and see what reply what you get.
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OK, but, who are those before you? "as it was for the ones before you"... Jews don't fast that way, Christians fast only Wednesdays and Fridays I think... so it is still not clear...
ThanksPeace GODsubmitter,
We have 2 examples in alquran for sawm from people before us Meriem and Zakaria. Please check them and see what you can get.
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OK, but, who are those before you? "as it was for the ones before you"... Jews don't fast that way, Christians fast only Wednesdays and Fridays I think... so it is still not clear...
ThanksI understand the sentence as meaning "everyone should fast in some way or other", not "fast exactly as the ones before you". So first the general law fast = restrict yourself voluntarily for some time, in order to learn sef-control and get nearer to your creator. Then the proposal how to fast (in case you don't have another dea how to fast).
And as long as I am not sure of another way, I keep the traditional fasting, as it is also easier if you know many others are doing the same. God wants to make it easy for us, not hard.
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Peace GODsubmitter,
We have 2 examples in alquran for sawm from people before us Meriem and Zakaria. Please check them and see what you can get.
Thank you.
And thanks to Reee, too.
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Hail godsubmitter
--- Quote from GODsubmitter on June 15, 2015, 074108 PM ---OK, but, who are those before you? "as it was for the ones before you"... Jews don't fast that way, Christians fast only Wednesdays and Fridays I think... so it is still not clear...
For your information, Christians, at least orthodox ones, used to fast for a whole month (and more) to commemorate Christ's days in the desert by a fast, in March I think. This is their invention though as far as I am concerned because the Biblical Gospels speak nothing of such as a matter of command. 40 in Semitic languages is usually a metaphor for "many", just as the number 7 means "several", so it may be a mistake. Later interpreters thought it was meant to be literal. Just reflect on all instances of 7 and 40; either you think GOD is obsessed with those numbers or they are not literal. I also observed that 70 (7 * 10) is marking multitudes of. Such as were 70 people who came to Moses on the mount in Biblical tradition, but they could have been more as the word likely means loads of people. Or it could be a similar way that we say several dozens today in the ancient time.
Jews used to fast in the past. The reason people fast in these traditions is to control the beast in themselves and not to lose the mind to desirous and oblivious consumption. And one has to remember Jesus was a Jew, and if one thinks the Biblical Gospels are true, then obviously the Jews were fasting. Jesus would have argued that you do not do it for GOD though but for your own sake. GOD has no needs.
But the marathon-fasts are probably an invention. Longer periods of fasting have adverse effects on the body such as muscular decay etcetera, even if you eat in the night, because the body's system will enter into survival mode and diverting focus on primary functionality meaning it will utilize muscle tissue to allow you to hunt prey still energetically despite a crisis. Depots of fat are not an efficient source of energy because it has to reconverted. And the gluttonous overconsumption of food in the evening by many Muslims sort of nullifies the reason for the fast to begin with, i.e. to control consumption that the instincts do not let you forget how much and what you eat. Then it is just an unnecessary imposed suffering.
It is better to fast 1-2 days per week over the year than observe a fast over a month or even a week. If you mastered restraint through meditation and reflection you do not have to fast at all.
Be well
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Salam,
But the marathon-fasts are probably an invention. Longer periods of fasting have adverse effects on the body such as muscular decay etcetera, even if you eat in the night, because the body's system will enter into survival mode and diverting focus on primary functionality meaning it will utilize muscle tissue to allow you to hunt prey still energetically despite a crisis. Depots of fat are not an efficient source of energy because it has to reconverted. And the gluttonous overconsumption of food in the evening by many Muslims sort of nullifies the reason for the fast to begin with, i.e. to control consumption that the instincts do not let you forget how much and what you eat. Then it is just an unnecessary imposed suffering.
It is better to fast 1-2 days per week over the year than observe a fast over a month or even a week. If you mastered restraint through meditation and reflection you do not have to fast at all.
Be well
While I agree that long fasts are not so beneficial (just as going to any extreme for that matter), short fasts for say 10 days in a row, or once every week can have real health benefits. This area is not scientifically explored yet (it doesn't encourage consumption of any sort so why bother?) but there are claims that so called dry fasting can be the most effective in boosting immunlogical system and even fighting cancer.
The Russian doctor claims
Quote
Originally Posted by Dr. Filonov
Dehydration causes competition between healthy cells and pathological organisms for water. It is a real survival-of-the-fittest scenario. Inflammation cannot survive without water. A wet environment is ideal for the proliferation of pathological bacteria, viruses and worms ? water shortage is as devastating as fire for them. All dead or dying tissues will be expelled from the body. A water fast does the same thing but takes much longer to accomplish the goal.Dehydrated cells act as furnaces burning the toxic matter". .
http//www.curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=1913883
Dry fasting is claimed to even dissolve the cancer cells! To me that logic makes a lot of sense, although at first might seem counterintuitive. Even in the animals, for example dogs lose apettite while fighting with sickness and they get better.
I think that we somehow lost the aspect of health benefit from the sight. WHile fasting brings self control and can halp in growing spirituality, I think it is just as important in detoxifying body so I wouldn't see the point to give it up altogether, no matter how 'spiritual' the person is.
I have done some research on dry fasting as a practice outside of the islamic and judaic tradition and I have discovered the relevance of full moon, summer solstice and 10 days fasting in a very unlikely places, so I will try to post explanation soon.
Peace
M. -
Yes. I forgot to mention that short fasts do have certain health benefits, but if longer than a few days at most the health benefits turn over into yielding adverse health effects instead, as the body enters a kind of emergency mode to adapt to the irregular food intake as it sees the subject is in a crisis in terms of nutrition. And the irregular intake (since it is not a 24/7 fast) causes imbalance for the body which has problems utilizing the consumed food efficiently. Not to mention many actually eat more than they would normally do at the night of their marathon fasting period. There are people who cannot even fast those insane fasts because they would have pathological indications then, which is natural since there is much stress on the body's system.
Personally I find a firm decision to control and enforce on yourself to change your eating habits is much better than periodically fast, except perhaps 1-2 days. That also shows you abstain from this world as the traditional fasting is supposed to indicate. An idea could be to end the consumption of foods and desserts made from sugar since sugar is the worst legal drug in the world actually readily available. Addiction to sugar is bad and abstention from that reveals a lot of your faith.
Be well
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And yes, a short dry fast can likely be all good for us.
And the example with the dog can be good. But when it is healthy it will usually eat too much if you feed it excessively likening the problem of humans, and this is caused by instincts which is what we are supposed to control. So that was why I suggested personal consumption control as an alternative to extensive fasting periods. Fasting for the looks is also an instinctive drive so avoid. Better remove the desire for food by being aware when you are about to take unnecessary foods.
The fast for the Bani Israel is the fast of leavened bread which is also a controlled intake by removing all sorts of sweets. It is much healthier and reduces the addiction to sugar, thus why it probably was imposed in the first place and not just as a reminder from after the Exodus out of Egypt while they were in the desert for many years. The "no leavened bread" was misinterpreted but meant all but very basic food.
Be well
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Hail godsubmitter
For your information, Christians, at least orthodox ones, used to fast for a whole month (and more) to commemorate Christ's days in the desert by a fast, in March I think. This is their invention though as far as I am concerned because the Biblical Gospels speak nothing of such as a matter of command. 40 in Semitic languages is usually a metaphor for "many", just as the number 7 means "several", so it may be a mistake. Later interpreters thought it was meant to be literal. Just reflect on all instances of 7 and 40; either you think GOD is obsessed with those numbers or they are not literal. I also observed that 70 (7 * 10) is marking multitudes of. Such as were 70 people who came to Moses on the mount in Biblical tradition, but they could have been more as the word likely means loads of people. Or it could be a similar way that we say several dozens today in the ancient time.
Jews used to fast in the past. The reason people fast in these traditions is to control the beast in themselves and not to lose the mind to desirous and oblivious consumption. And one has to remember Jesus was a Jew, and if one thinks the Biblical Gospels are true, then obviously the Jews were fasting. Jesus would have argued that you do not do it for GOD though but for your own sake. GOD has no needs.
But the marathon-fasts are probably an invention. Longer periods of fasting have adverse effects on the body such as muscular decay etcetera, even if you eat in the night, because the body's system will enter into survival mode and diverting focus on primary functionality meaning it will utilize muscle tissue to allow you to hunt prey still energetically despite a crisis. Depots of fat are not an efficient source of energy because it has to reconverted. And the gluttonous overconsumption of food in the evening by many Muslims sort of nullifies the reason for the fast to begin with, i.e. to control consumption that the instincts do not let you forget how much and what you eat. Then it is just an unnecessary imposed suffering.
It is better to fast 1-2 days per week over the year than observe a fast over a month or even a week. If you mastered restraint through meditation and reflection you do not have to fast at all.
Be well
Thank you so much for this beautiful post. I see that you are studying things quite thoroughly and it is good to hear some specific answers instead of speculations and hypothesis that abound here.
I totally agree on the symbolic meaning of numbers, and as far as fast is concerned, people used to die because of hunger in the past so it is not logical to impose on oneself that kind of thing in a modern era.
I slightly disagree on a schizophrenic division between body and soul, although I agree that in some people the animal or uncivilized part is far stronger then the spiritual one... -
Salam,
While I agree that long fasts are not so beneficial (just as going to any extreme for that matter), short fasts for say 10 days in a row, or once every week can have real health benefits. This area is not scientifically explored yet (it doesn't encourage consumption of any sort so why bother?) but there are claims that so called dry fasting can be the most effective in boosting immunlogical system and even fighting cancer.
The Russian doctor claims
Quote
Originally Posted by Dr. Filonov
Dehydration causes competition between healthy cells and pathological organisms for water. It is a real survival-of-the-fittest scenario. Inflammation cannot survive without water. A wet environment is ideal for the proliferation of pathological bacteria, viruses and worms ? water shortage is as devastating as fire for them. All dead or dying tissues will be expelled from the body. A water fast does the same thing but takes much longer to accomplish the goal.Dehydrated cells act as furnaces burning the toxic matter". .
http//www.curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=1913883
Dry fasting is claimed to even dissolve the cancer cells! To me that logic makes a lot of sense, although at first might seem counterintuitive. Even in the animals, for example dogs lose apettite while fighting with sickness and they get better.
I think that we somehow lost the aspect of health benefit from the sight. WHile fasting brings self control and can halp in growing spirituality, I think it is just as important in detoxifying body so I wouldn't see the point to give it up altogether, no matter how 'spiritual' the person is.
I have done some research on dry fasting as a practice outside of the islamic and judaic tradition and I have discovered the relevance of full moon, summer solstice and 10 days fasting in a very unlikely places, so I will try to post explanation soon.
Peace
M.Thank you so much for this informative answer and I am looking very much forward to your interesting findings about dry fast etc...
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There is no "adverse emergency mode" that kicks in.
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Hi progressive 1993,
Yes there is. The body will take its own reflexive measures in adapting to the new conditions.
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6-72 hours after eating
Now, whether you like it or not, you will enter into a state of ketosis should you go without food for six hours or more; this represents the first significant metabolic phase shift as you enter into starvation. At this point, all your glycogen stores will have been exhausted, and your body has no choice but to start hitting the fatty acids for energy. During lipolysis, fatty acids are directly broken down to produce ketone bodies.
Now all this is fine and well except for one very important thing your brain cannot use fatty acids directly as its fuel source. These fats are large and cannot cross the blood-brain barrier. So, for the first 24 to 48 hours without food, your brain will continue to use the remaining glucose stores as fuel, while the rest of the body goes into the ketosis cycle.
Trouble is, the glucose isn't enough; the brain requires about 120 g of glucose per day (the same amount of sugar found in three cans of soda!). At this rate, the brain would starve and die in about three days ? but clearly it does not. This is because your body has evolved a backup plan.
It's at this critical stage when the ketone bodies become all the more critical. Because they're short-chain derivatives of fatty acids, they function as tiny powerpacks that can cross the blood-brain barrier and in turn be used by the brain as an alternative metabolic fuel. Your brain will get about 30% of its energy from ketone bodies on day three, but by day four it will jump to 70%. Moreover, your brain's glucose requirement will drop from 120 g per day to 30 g once the body enters into this phase.
Fascinatingly, humans may be the only species who have brains that don't require the ongoing ingestion of glucose to function. Most animals are forced to break down skeletal muscles at a higher rate. The going theory is that, because we humans are so greatly dependent on our intelligence to survive, we have evolved the capacity to stay cognitively sharp while in the midst of prolonged starvation, thus allowing us to search for food.
Source http//io9.com/5941883/how-your-body-fights-to-keep-you-alive-when-youre-starving
You can wonder what happens to your brain capacity with these new reduced requirements. The body will adapt so that the ability to hunt for prey is enhanced given the circumstances.
And like I said, this is the survival mode that kicks in.
Be well
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Salaam MoF Godsubmitter and everyone,
I agree - the survival mode kicks in, but why do you assume that it is necessarily a bad thing? It is the toughest survival test for the weak and sick body cells. Only the healthiest and youngest cells are able to survive. Also, during the process of burning fat the body produces water, so it is not entirely 'dry' fast, but this type of water is the purest - with no 'extras' that we get from the tap or bottled water.Also, as MoF rigtly mentioned, the senses are sharpened, and also, arguably, the memory is sharpened too, which might remind our ancestors mode of 'remember where the food was'. Also, keep in mind that Quran says that the fasting was prescrbibed to the people before as well. In fact, when we look at many societies, some sort of fasting in one form or the other was present. in the societies with better developed food supplies these fasts were often as a part of religious and spiritual practice. In some others, they were due to some seasonal shortages. Also, there is a reason why in some christian ortodox traditions fasting was taking place in March, at least in Europe. In moderate climate, March was in the rural areas the time of food shortages after the fierce winters, time of hunger before the first, fresh food produce could sprout out in April. Until now in my language we have word for this period 'before-the-new', which is basically connotated with hunger. It would be interesting to also analyze the word 'prescribed' in that verse about fasting and see whether it refers to a kind of 'prescription' that was taken from 'the sky' or a kind of natural occurence. Could I ask you MoF to verify that for me, as my Arabic is not on such a level? Much obliged..
But I definitely agree that the monthly fasting spree followed by night feasts as in case of mainstream Muslim tradition is excessive. My guess is that either 1-2 days every other week or 10 days (I mean fasting from sunrise to sunset, which in Europe is around 12-16 hr) in a row may be just fine. Also, from my own experience, fasting usually contracts my stomac so during the evening supper I am not able to eat more than I could during a proper lunch on a normal day, so if fasting is applied with common sense, it doesnt make you overstuffed. Self control is part of this exercise so overcompensating with feasts overnight defeats the whole purpose.
There is no "adverse emergency mode" that kicks in.
exactly, the 'emergency mode' if you call it so is there to ensure survival, which by definition is a positive process
Thank you so much for this informative answer and I am looking very much forward to your interesting findings about dry fast etc...
Thank you Godsubmitter, glad it is interesting for you and will try to briefly put it down now