Is releasing slaves in America(negros) same as releasing slaves in Egypt(Israeli
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I didn't say that.. where did you get that idea?
I got it from you
They never labeled the Asian imported labor as "slaves" although many of them were working in worse condition than the African imported counterpart (which they labeled as slaves), such as "Low to no salary given", "Lack of food, water and sanitation", "Forced Labor" etc...
And why you put a "Competition Framework" line of thinking here?
Like as if we're trying to decide who received the worst treatment?The two are by no means comparable one group was stripped by force and enslaved and treated as less than livestock, while the other migrated much later on in American history during the gold rush mostly by choice for opportunity.
You are confusing periods of history and you are downplaying African enslavement terribly by comparing it with "Chinese migrant labor".
You are the one who put it into a comparative framework by claiming that Asian imported workers were in worse conditions, I will cite you againThey never labeled the Asian imported labor as "slaves" although many of them were working in worse condition than the African imported counterpart (which they labeled as slaves), such as "Low to no salary given", "Lack of food, water and sanitation", "Forced Labor" etc...
Fact wise.. Both group received bad treatments.. with different "label"...
Look at you again trying to compare the two.
You cannot just generalize and say they both received bad treatment, because by doing so you are clearly downplaying/undermining the atrocities and extreme injustice committed against one group and still is occurring today disproportionately towards this same group.
Your words and thoughts have done great injustice to the suffering of your African brothers by trying to compare it to voluntary migration and employment conditions of the other group.
Did the africans migrate or were they stripped from their motherlands and stacked lack sardines in ships and shackled to one another?
They were thrown over board if there was too much weight!
There is not much sense in your attempt to compare the two and it is my duty as a truther to remind you of it.I do aware that such pattern exist on "every supremacist"...
They're trying to downplay the insanity and brutality of "their own social group".
Such as, but not limited to, the Japanese Supremacist, Arab Supremacist, Islam Supremacist etc..Yet I can also say that you're trying to downplay the suffering of "Asian imported workers" during 19th century North America British Colony.... Are you a "Japanese Supremacist"? or "American Supremacist"?
YOU are the one clearly downplaying African enslavement by calling it employment condition and claiming Asian migrant workers were in worse working conditions. Do not try to flip the script your words are in bold red letters.
I am pointing out your mistakes and trying to educate you about the black struggle which is ongoing.First.. I didn't said that the "black enslavement" in North America British Colony was not bad.. <see above>
That's right you said that Asian workers were working in worse conditions nope
Shall I cite you again?They never labeled the Asian imported labor as "slaves" although many of them were working in worse condition than the African imported counterpart (which they labeled as slaves), such as "Low to no salary given", "Lack of food, water and sanitation", "Forced Labor" etc...
Chopping off hands and feet, mutilation of genitals, burned alive, women being hanged, rapings and molestations. And I want to add "Crucifixion" and "Beheading"..
We still have those NOW even as we speak don't we?
(Although might not be towards North American blacks in North America)And we can also observe NOW.. that police are disproportionately prone to target and kill blacks. It still is not over for the blacks my friend, how can the Asian migrant workers have had it worse?
As an addition, this is not an issue of "skin color".. this is rooted in arrogance and supremacy based on social group. An example The story of Hutu and Tutsi in 20th century. both has similar dark skin color.
http//www.history.com/topics/rwandan-genocideNo, slavery and racism in America despite what you are saying was and still is based on skin color and race. That is the fact.
The claim was that Africans were inferior to whites and were a race born to be in servitude to them and this is what they taught to them and themselves. Same concept with African colonialism. The question in the thread clearly brought up the issue of race as it uses a word such as negro (by the way an offensive term might I add again). I still haven't understood the question of this thread.
Anyway I am well aware of the genocide in Rwanda, but that is not the same as Race Supremacism. What happened in Rwanda is of the same nature of that which goes on in Arab countries amongst sectarians and in Asian countries like in Myanmar and in Tibet and so forth. Tribal conflicts.
It is not the same at all as saying because you are different than me, because you are black you are inferior to me. Again your attempt to compare Slavery and racism with tribal conflicts shows a bit of a lack of knowledge on these issues.I do not have an issue with you personally at all brother, but I feel it s extremely important for us to correct each other where we cn.
As a self-proclaimed activist and Africana studies student I am very conscious of all the issues surrounding enslavement and discrimination of the African race whether we are talking North America, Central(african descendant latinos are marginalized and discriminated against,)South America (check out how black Brazilians are being targeted by the police), South Africa (actually the whole of Africa due to colonialism)in their own motherland Africans have suffered apartheid and much worse from white supremacism, in Europe people of African descent are constantly being discriminated against look at a famous soccer star issue with racism today Mario Ballotelli having bananas thrown at him and called a monkey from uncivilized white supremacists, I am also aware of the same in the Middle East with Israel discriminating against Ethiopians and black Palestinians (referring to them as Cushi) and the Arab nation pretending as if they did not have a huge role in the Atlantic Slave Trade.
Look at the tribulations African people are still going through today worldwide. I barely touched on the tip of the iceberg to give you a sense. But if I were to mention all of history and present day suffering I would not have enough time and space.
How dare you say Asian migrants were in worse conditions?
That is highly offensive to intelligence and the African peoples' suffering brotherWe are muslimina and truthers so let us propagate the truth and be careful in our words
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I do notlike victimism, I think it that ressorting to it diminishes a person.
As far as I can see in the strongest racism today is shown against Arabs-Muslims. That is today.
BUT one thing I have to say, as far as I know of history, the greatest crime and cruelty has ben exercised against the black people brought to America from Africa en the most horrifying conditions, whereby may be half of them died in the journey. No wonder those who were left were strong and survivors. Those who were not did not have a chance to overlive the transport. And then at destiny, fortunes in different place and circumstances diferred, but they were slaves alright, chattel and cruelties, as we all know were very common because really there was little they could do.
An one think I respect n blacks today (and may somebody comes now and tell me that not all of them are like that) is that they do not ressort to victimism and play that card continuously to exact payment (I am not talking about money) from people of today for past doom and they do not blind themselves to the plights of others just becaue their ancestors were so horribly offended and humilliated. That, as far as a I am concerned is the say to be. To stand up for justice and your rights without giving in to creating past guilt in others. May be they could exploit their ancestors suffering for getting pay off today out of creating fuilty feelings, but sincerely I would not respect them for that, but I do respect them for not doing it and for not being blind to the plight of others today and because they are able tojoin causes that are not just them themselves.
I wish everbody who would have a claim to pity for the past would do that.
Salaam
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I do notlike victimism, I think it that ressorting to it diminishes a person.
Could you elaborate on the victimizing. Are you referring to me victimizing the black people?
If so, which statements do you consider victimizing? As far as I am concerned all that which I stated is historical and contemporary FACTS.
How does me highlighting the plight of a people diminish me as a person?As far as I can see in the strongest racism today is shown against Arabs-Muslims. That is today.
But Muslims are not all Arabs and not all Arabs are Muslims. The discrimination Muslim face is not racism.
Is your statement also and effort to victimize Arabs-Muslims?The fact of the matter is blacks are discriminated against everywhere today in every continent even amongst their "Arab-Muslim" brethren
BUT one thing I have to say, as far as I know of history, the greatest crime and cruelty has ben exercised against the black people brought to America from Africa en the most horrifying conditions, whereby may be half of them died in the journey. No wonder those who were left were strong and survivors. Those who were not did not have a chance to overlive the transport. And then at destiny, fortunes in different place and circumstances diferred, but they were slaves alright, chattel and cruelties, as we all know were very common because really there was little they could do.
An one think I respect n blacks today (and may somebody comes now and tell me that not all of them are like that) is that they do not ressort to victimism and play that card continuously to exact payment (I am not talking about money) from people of today for past doom and they do not blind themselves to the plights of others just becaue their ancestors were so horribly offended and humilliated. That, as far as a I am concerned is the say to be. To stand up for justice and your rights without giving in to creating past guilt in others. May be they could exploit their ancestors suffering for getting pay off today out of creating fuilty feelings, but sincerely I would not respect them for that, but I do respect them for not doing it and for not being blind to the plight of others today and because they are able tojoin causes that are not just them themselves.
I wish everbody who would have a claim to pity for the past would do that.
Salaam
I agree with mostly everything you said. I am not disagreeing with you, I am merely adding my views to your comments.
The fact of the matter is that blacks are still facing discrimination and racism today WORLDWIDE in every content at every level financially, socially, they are marginalized to low income urban areas, they're wage is much less than the caucasoid counterparts for the same positions, they are racially profiled by the police everywhere.It is not only a matter of the past or dwelling on the past.
Slavery is fairly recent! We are talking 200 and something years ago!
And after that there was Segregation up until the 1960s barely 50 years ago!
It is inevitable to make clear connections between the slavery system and the treatment of blacks today.
They way blacks are treated today is a direct result of slavery, wouldn't you say?
Therefore, I do not see the issue with talking about slavery and educating about slavery.
Claiming that those who do so are paying the victim card is the most loaded sack of racist garbage I have heard throughout my lifetime, usually from Supremacist apologetics and those who wish to censor history and undermine the discrimination still evident TODAY.
So please refrain from depicting me and those who stand up for the rights of oppressed people like the Quran urges us to do as people playing the victim card.
Was Nat Turner playing the victim card?
Was Booker T. Washington playing the victim card?
Was W.e.b. Du Bois playing the victim card?
Was Marcus Garvey playing the victim card?
Was Martin Luther King playing the victim card?
Was Malcolm X playing the victim card?
Did Rosa Park?
You are insulting all the Civil Rights movement by claiming that we (all of us) shouldn't advocate for attention to the atrocities of the past which are still affecting the present!We should encourage referring to the atrocities of the past so that history does not repeat itself!
Why is it okay for Jews to keep referring to the Holocaust, but not okay for blacks to refer to SLAVERY, SEGREGATION, APARTHEID, GENOCIDE and etcetera??Hurry you seem very BIAS
Open up your heart and mind to the flaw in your victimizing argument -
By victimism I understand that a erson see herself as a victim and not anything as the main thing. I know that to be victimised is, I have been so because I am a woman or because I amnot the kind of woman that would be expected of me. Ok. But I refuse to seemyself as a vitim. That is accepting what the victimarians would want to make of me their making. I am a person, a woman but not their victim. I hoe you undersand what I men. Not that I say they are not maing a victim of me, but that I do not accept that role. In that sense I would loose my self resect and dignity If a saw myself as a victim. As some psycho fan would say, I am not a victim, I am a queen, eve if some eople would like me to accept a lesser role.
I amnot saying that there is no racism aywhere now, but I amsaying that the most pervading racism promoted today is against Muslim-Arabs and I hifenate it because people make of Muslims and or Arabs a single bunch. People do notmake a distinct4ion between Muslims and Arabs, for their kind of racism their fury is against them indistinctly. Of course I know perfectly the difference between an Arab and a Muslim, but the racism that is being promoted is the one that amalgamates both.
When I speak of exploiting victimism, I think mainly about zionnism. Racists zionnists today exploit the Jews having been victims of perscution to get away with their own persecution and genocide of other people. That to me is lack of dignity and self respect.
Gypsies have been and are victims of racism too in Europe, but they do not claim previleges for their ancestors or themselves being victims. They also suffered genocide at the hands of the nazis and at other hands, but they do not exploit that fact to claim special privileges. I respect that and the fact that in spite of all the discrimination they have not been traitors to their countries. They did not sell themselves to any enemy. That, to me, deserves a lot of respect.
In fact gypsies are still mostly underprivileged.
Salaam
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By victimism I understand that a erson see herself as a victim and not anything as the main thing. I know that to be victimised is, I have been so because I am a woman or because I amnot the kind of woman that would be expected of me. Ok. But I refuse to seemyself as a vitim. That is accepting what the victimarians would want to make of me their making. I am a person, a woman but not their victim. I hoe you undersand what I men. Not that I say they are not maing a victim of me, but that I do not accept that role. In that sense I would loose my self resect and dignity If a saw myself as a victim. As some psycho fan would say, I am not a victim, I am a queen, eve if some eople would like me to accept a lesser role.
I amnot saying that there is no racism aywhere now, but I amsaying that the most pervading racism promoted today is against Muslim-Arabs and I hifenate it because people make of Muslims and or Arabs a single bunch. People do notmake a distinct4ion between Muslims and Arabs, for their kind of racism their fury is against them indistinctly. Of course I know perfectly the difference between an Arab and a Muslim, but the racism that is being promoted is the one that amalgamates both.
When I speak of exploiting victimism, I think mainly about zionnism. Racists zionnists today exploit the Jews having been victims of perscution to get away with their own persecution and genocide of other people. That to me is lack of dignity and self respect.
Gypsies have been and are victims of racism too in Europe, but they do not claim previleges for their ancestors or themselves being victims. They also suffered genocide at the hands of the nazis and at other hands, but they do not exploit that fact to claim special privileges. I respect that and the fact that in spite of all the discrimination they have not been traitors to their countries. They did not sell themselves to any enemy. That, to me, deserves a lot of respect.
In fact gypsies are still mostly underprivileged.
Salaam
Understood.
Salaam Huruf
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There is some misunderstanding brother. My post was in reply to 357 not you.
And I'm chillest dude you've ever seen bruh
I don't get what you're saying, I'm sorry.Are you saying that history keeps repeating itself?
What verses are you referring to? There are no verses in this thread so far. Please cite them, so I can know what you are talking about.
Freeing the necks is a term used in the Quran, beware of ridiculing your Lord's words fyeFor example
Surah9013
fakku
(It is) freeing N ? nominative masculine noun(90132)
raqabatin
a neck,It is not "a bit brainless"
I still do not understand what you are trying to convey in your post, I apologize.
my bad
freeing the neck refers to the burden around someone neck not as in freeing someone from slavery, also in debt freeing the neck of a slave one not able to pay refers to heads rolling .and yes read the bible simply read the book of genesis certian people from africa will not like other people from africa, and these men were our grandfathers. someone else could explain this better i'll have nothing to do with sectarianist.
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You are the one who put it into a comparative framework by claiming that Asian imported workers were in worse conditions, I will cite you againLook at you again trying to compare the two.
You cannot just generalize and say they both received bad treatment, because by doing so you are clearly downplaying/undermining the atrocities and extreme injustice committed against one group and still is occurring today disproportionately towards this same group.Example
A Chinese / Asian man working in a gold mine without food and salary.
B African man working in cotton plantation WITH food and without salary.There were a set of of African man who were living in better condition than the chinese / asian man.
That's a fact.
That's why i used the word "many".. referring to a set of individuals..
And NOT ALLYour words and thoughts have done great injustice to the suffering of your African brothers by trying to compare it to voluntary migration and employment conditions of the other group.
Many of the African men went to America with promise of 'better life' by the 'slave trader'.
The same story as the Asian men.
Little did they know that eventually they become slave.
But anyway that's not the main point..Did the africans migrate or were they stripped from their motherlands and stacked lack sardines in ships and shackled to one another?
Again the same case with the imported Asian labor
They were thrown over board if there was too much weight!I am pointing out your mistakes and trying to educate you about the black struggle which is ongoing.That's right you said that Asian workers were working in worse conditions nope
You deleted the word "many"... MANY Asian workers were working in worse conditions..
Although they didn't refer that as slavery while it is a SLAVERY.-- Skipping your ranting about race as it's not the main point --
Anyway I am well aware of the genocide in Rwanda, but that is not the same as Race Supremacism. What happened in Rwanda is of the same nature of that which goes on in Arab countries amongst sectarians and in Asian countries like in Myanmar and in Tibet and so forth. Tribal conflicts.
It is not the same at all as saying because you are different than me, because you are black you are inferior to me. Again your attempt to compare Slavery and racism with tribal conflicts shows a bit of a lack of knowledge on these issues.SUPREMACISM
Rooted from ARROGANCE and PRIDE.
IS THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL.That's the main point..
And NO SPECIFIC RACE / SKIN COLOR / ETHNICITY / RELIGION is immune from it.
Whenever there's a sign of PRIDE and ARROGANCE...
EVIL can be found nearby..I cite the Rwanda's massacre as an example...
How a set of human feel that they're superior than others.. in disregards of the 'skin color'.
We can see there isn't much of a difference between JAPANESE and CHINESE in skin color.. yet 500,000 people dead by the Japanese during Nanjing massacre. The Chinese to them were inferior race and it's justified to kill them for a 'better world'.We can see there isn't much of a difference between Turkish and Armenian, Arabs and Jews, Germans and Poland, Vikings and Saxon, Serbians and Bosnian, Sapiens and Neanderthal, Christians and Muslim, Jews and Christians, Orthodox and Catholics, Sunnis and Shiites and the list goes on and on..
Once a group of human feel that their group identity are superior compared to other..
Evil has took control of their sanity..Salam / Peace
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Example
A Chinese / Asian man working in a gold mine without food and salary.
B African man working in cotton plantation WITH food and without salary.There were a set of of African man who were living in better condition than the chinese / asian man.
That's a fact.
That's why i used the word "many".. referring to a set of individuals..
And NOT ALLMany of the African men went to America with promise of 'better life' by the 'slave trader'.
The same story as the Asian men.
Little did they know that eventually they become slave.
But anyway that's not the main point..
You deleted the word "many"... MANY Asian workers were working in worse conditions..
Although they didn't refer that as slavery while it is a SLAVERY.-- Skipping your ranting about race as it's not the main point --
SUPREMACISM
Rooted from ARROGANCE and PRIDE.
IS THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL.That's the main point..
And NO SPECIFIC RACE / SKIN COLOR / ETHNICITY / RELIGION is immune from it.
Whenever there's a sign of PRIDE and ARROGANCE...
EVIL can be found nearby..I cite the Rwanda's massacre as an example...
How a set of human feel that they're superior than others.. in disregards of the 'skin color'.
We can see there isn't much of a difference between JAPANESE and CHINESE in skin color.. yet 500,000 people dead by the Japanese during Nanjing massacre. The Chinese to them were inferior race and it's justified to kill them for a 'better world'.We can see there isn't much of a difference between Turkish and Armenian, Arabs and Jews, Germans and Poland, Vikings and Saxon, Serbians and Bosnian, Sapiens and Neanderthal, Christians and Muslim, Jews and Christians, Orthodox and Catholics, Sunnis and Shiites and the list goes on and on..
Once a group of human feel that their group identity are superior compared to other..
Evil has took control of their sanity..Salam / Peace
Your example A and B are not true at all.
Asian migrants migrated voluntarily and received low wages. How the heck can someone work and mine without having food?
Your statements are illogical
Further more blacks did not choose to migrate they were shackled and packed like sardines in ships and thrown over board.The difference between the two is like the east and west.
You are just plain IGNORANT my friend.
After all look at you still comparing and inventing lies attempting to portray th African enslavement as work and Asian migrant gold mine exploitation as slavery.
You are trying to replace history?No one except you has ever fabricated such ignorant garbage.
I feel ashamed to you even speak with such a person.Then you try to hint at people having pride and arrogance twice...
Check your on heart.
Because all this brother tried to do is illustrate straight historical facts.
Because you are clueless. You have no idea what you are talking about.....This correspondence has highlighted either your ignorance or bigotry
There is no face saving just much studying or self-reevaluating
Excuse me