Personal Identity and the Soul
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Peace Comrox,
You delve into the farthest bounds of human inquiry. Great question!
I think this question can be approached both corporeally and spiritually.
The corporeal approach will inevitably be overwhelmingly speculative for I don't feel that current scientific knowledge satisfactorily explains the essence or qualities of the soul. By 'soul' I mean 'the person' as distinct from its temporal experiences in this world, that is, 'the person' that probably existed before its entry into this world and the same 'person' that will be resurrected when the Hour comes to pass. In this world, I believe that the soul's experiences occur by way of?
• the sensory faculties which serve as the soul's material feed, and
• the brain's neural activity, including both hormonal and psychological factors, which both serve as the soul's immaterial feed.
I hasten to add that all the above is purely speculative, based only on my rationalising of how I perceive and experience corporeal personal identity and the soul.
The spiritual approach is based on scriptural evidence, and in my view, we are advantaged over secular scientists in having additional knowledge that they are not willing to accept, or of which they are unaware. We know from the Quran that each soul is destined to one of three places damnation, purgatory, or bliss. The decision's we make in this world directly affect our destiny. And to this effect, I believe that decision-making takes place at the point of the soul, and I believe it to be of a binary nature. Decision-making, in my opinion, is aided ultimately by the framework of the brain's neural activity along with the influence of the entire sum of experiences fed to us by our sensual faculties. Then, when the Hour comes to pass, the personal identities that we developed in this world will be divorced from our souls but we will not be unaware of them based on the many Quranic narrations that the soul on the Day of Judgment will be either regretful for what it did, or will be content with what it did in its worldly existence. In this respect, your professor's analogy of seeing a photograph of your younger self is quite apt.
Taken together, the corporeal and spiritual both imprint a transient personal identity onto a lasting and metamorphosing soul that begins its worldly existence free of any worldly experiences, be they material or immaterial.
Good speech. I would like to see myself as a soul that is aware of my past but yet at the same time purified and free. I don't think I want to "live" for eternity in the afterlife. I can't comprehend that. But time is subjective, I suppose.
In another forum recently members have created a "wish list" for the hereafter, of all the things they want to do... Even things that don't exist, or are forbidden by God in this world. I can't imagine even wanting anything they described, with all due respect to their wishes. / I can't imagine such a "worldly" existence in the hereafter.
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Peace,
I think the Qur'an does not inform that we will face reincarnation, but it informs us that we will face resurrection (we will return, and we will through resurrection in our return to meet Allah and be judged for our actions). Not reincarnation, but resurrection - and they're not the same thing.
I have opinion that putting human to undergo reincarnation is something unfair/unjust. Personally, I do not want to repeat this kind of life again and again. Insha'Allah, one time experiencing life like this (in this world/realm) is enough for me - and I want no more.
Good question, sister.
I it ressurrection. Iwonder. The Qur'a says God willmake of us a new creation.
Salaam
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The Qur'a says God willmake of us a new creation.
Yes. Qur'an 1798
I believe that the Creator is definitely capable of doing it and it makes sense to me.
The messengers brought this news, that's why they were ridiculed and rejected, because many of among their people did not believe it - maybe because to them this news sounds strange (hard to believe).
However, (I think) it is a good news for those who accept the news/message.
Salaam.
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Peace JavaLatte, huruf,
As per my understanding, this is our first and last life on earth.
32/12 And could you but see when the guilty shall hang down their
heads before their Lord Our Lord! we have seen and we have heard, therefore
send us back, we will do good; surely (now) we are certain.and
2399-100 When death comes to one of them, he says, "My Lord, send me back.
I will then work righteousness in everything I left." Not true. This is a false claim
that he makes. A "Barzakh" (barrier) will separate his soul from this world until resurrection"may we all have a blessed Ramadan
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Salaam,
= Ba-Ayn-Tha =
Removal of that which restrains one from free action
Anything that is sent
Rousing, exciting, putting in motion or motion
Incited, urged, instigated or awoke
Raising/rousing (e.g. of the dead to life)
Sleepless or wakeful
Hastening, quick, swift in going, impelled or propelled.I can't see the difference between resurrection and reincarnation.
2399/ 23100 is a conversation between people who have died and the Creator. They are asking to be returned to their lives in order to set to rights what they have left incomplete. Unfortunately for them it is too late and they cannot return to their old lives/bodies.
Regards,
Janet -
Salaam JavaLatte,
I understand there's a difference between reincarnation and resurrection. One process requires a host i.e a human body for the energy to be housed in and the other is an unknown process. We do not know what form the energy is in when it is gathered and reporting to the Creator. Perhaps its reckoning is that it is again chained to a 3d body in order to pay off its debt. Having said that, the word used many times in the Quran to describe this process is 'ba-ayn-tha' and the meanings of this word show that it means to come back to life/ to be in motion. This is applicable to both processes.
Regards,
Janet. -
Salaam Janet,
I understand there's a difference between reincarnation and resurrection.
I don't know which one is correct, that above (red) or this below (blue).
I can't see the difference between resurrection and reincarnation.
One process requires a host i.e a human body for the energy to be housed in and the other is an unknown process. We do not know what form the energy is in when it is gathered and reporting to the Creator. Perhaps its reckoning is that it is again chained to a 3d body in order to pay off its debt.
I suppose we have different point of view to recognize the difference, and it seem that we have far different view on other thing as well (more than the issue of reincarnation).
If people want to be reincarnated, that's their wish (which I very doubt it could happen). Anyway, it is clear to me that reincarnation theory is not supported by the Qur'an, and moreover, I see "reincarnation thingy" as something fake, unwise and smells fishy. I also think that it is unnecessary process and unfair. About people who claimed to remember (have memory about) their 'past life' - I don't have strong reason to trust them. To me, it is similar like hearing/reading about people who claimed witnessing aliens and UFOs - "good acting" indeed.
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Nt necessarily back, most of the times it is used and there is not back.it is just sent or produced.
But we are tolde that when we liv again it will be a nuew creation.
Salaam
Salaam Huruf,
you're correct...the meaning is not bring 'back' to life, it's bring to life. My point is that both reincarnation and resurrection use a process of giving life. Exactly like a new born baby which is a 'new creation'.Regards,
Janet. -
= Ba-Ayn-Tha =
Removal of that which restrains one from free action
Anything that is sent
Rousing, exciting, putting in motion or motion
Incited, urged, instigated or awoke
Raising/rousing (e.g. of the dead to life)
Sleepless or wakeful
Hastening, quick, swift in going, impelled or propelled.I can't see the difference between resurrection and reincarnation.
Salaam JavaLatte,
The quote above is what I had written to show that based on the meaning of the root word 'ba-ayn-tha' I could not see a difference between reincarnation and resurrection since both processes require the act of life giving. The conceptual difference between the two processes is clear in one way to me since reincarnation requires a body and resurrection doesn't necessarily. That's the extent of the little I know.
Salaam Janet,
I don't know which one is correct, that above (red) or this below (blue).
I suppose we have different point of view to recognize the difference, and it seem that we have far different view on other thing as well (more than the issue of reincarnation).
If people want to be reincarnated, that's their wish (which I very doubt it could happen). Anyway, it is clear to me that reincarnation theory is not supported by the Qur'an, and moreover, I see "reincarnation thingy" as something fake, unwise and smells fishy. I also think that it is unnecessary process and unfair. About people who claimed to remember (have memory about) their 'past life' - I don't have strong reason to trust them. To me, it is similar like hearing/reading about people who claimed witnessing aliens and UFOs - "good acting" indeed.
I believe that Buddhism, Hinduism and other religions subscribe to this theory and I prefer to keep an open mind. There is nothing unfair about 'karma' since it's meant to balance out one's wrong doing...which basically means to avoid wrong doing since there'll be pay back. In fact, that's the perfect justice system...payback on earth according to the wrong doing committed on earth. It's alright to not agree on this. Where would the variety in life be if we all thought the same way?
Regards,
Janet. -
I believe that Buddhism, Hinduism and other religions subscribe to this theory
I don't follow their religions.
In my view, Buddhism and Hinduism are not the right path, they're "vague" paths. If I follow as such, as if I follow something unclear and have no strong foothold. But I'm not someone who has authority to say "You're wrong to follow Buddhism". I think every human has right to follow/choose any belief - as well as bearing the consequences.
As for me, I want to follow the true path. I accept the Qur'an as guidance book because my Rabb guided/guides me to accept it. If my Creator shows me that the Qur'an is wrong, I do not want to hesitate to reject it immediately.
and I prefer to keep an open mind.
I prefer to keep open mind to accept the truth and I choose to close my door from accepting falsehood.
What my Rabb teaches me is that the path of truth is basically one, and that this path is "straight" (righteous).
There is nothing unfair about 'karma' since it's meant to balance out one's wrong doing...
Can you point out where in any of my previous posts in this thread where I mentioned the word "karma"? I believe you can't.
The truth is I did not say that 'karma' is unfair.
I never claimed anywhere in this thread (even in this forum) that karma is unfair. Never I claimed such thing.
Karma is other different thing than reincarnation, I say. I don't want to mix those two without enough consideration.
It's alright to not agree on this.
I prefer to say... it is acceptable to agree or disagree on this forum. I am not here to convince other to follow/agree with me.
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Anyway, it is clear to me that reincarnation theory is not supported by the Qur'an, and moreover, I see "reincarnation thingy" as something fake, unwise and smells fishy. I also think that it is unnecessary process and unfair.
Salaam JavaLatte,
You're correct, you didn't use the word karma, I did. Most probably because the whole idea of reincarnation is pointless without the concept of karma. I'm merely pointing out that reincarnation is not unfair as you've stated, since it's a system based on the philosophy of 'as you sow so shall you reap'.
Karma (Sanskrit ; IPA ( listen); Pali kamma) means action, work or deed; it also refers to the spiritual principle of cause and effect where intent and actions of an individual (cause) influence the future of that individual (effect). Good intent and good deed contribute to good karma and future happiness, while bad intent and bad deed contribute to bad karma and future suffering. Karma is closely associated with the idea of rebirth in many schools of Asian religions. In these schools, karma in the present affects one's future in the current life, as well as the nature and quality of future lives - one's sasra.
Regards,
Janet. -
Karma was taught by prophet Isaiah. "Each person faces the effects of their deeds to the equal magnitude".
Be well
Amenuel