Allah stoning devils with stars?

Man_of_Faith

Recluse,

Yeah right, the passage does not say that. I am not burning in any hell due to some superstitious belief.

Be well
Amenuel

huruf

Why are two completely different words (none of them being the usual one meaning star) translated as "stars" in this translation chosen by the poster.

Does anybody know here what he or she is talking about?

Imran is right. People should have at least the humility to acknowledge that they do not have an idea of what is being dealt with in those ayas.

But for the poster the overriding need to ridicule the Qur'an seems to trump everything.

Man_of_Faith

True, but of you have no idea about something, logic is the best substitute.

Be well
Amenuel

HP_TECH

Hey folks,
There is no reason to dance around the issue the Quran is clear, the root meaning is clear and the Arabic Lexicons are also clear

Check the following out.

Ra-Jiim-Miim = to stone, cast stones, stone to death, curse, revile, expel, put a stone (on a tomb), speak conjecturally, conjectures, guess, surmise, the act of beating or battering the ground with the feet. rajmun - conjecture, guesswork, missile. rujum - shooting stars, throw off, damned, thrown off with curse. marajim - foul speech. marjum - stoned.

rajama vb. (1)
perf. act. 1191
impf. act. 1820, 1946, 3618, 4420
n.vb. (rajm, pl. rujum) 1822, 675
pcple. pass. 26116

rajim n.m. 336, 1517, 1534, 1698, 3877, 8125

It denotes throwing/casting or pelting stones in Classical Arabic Lexicons

http//ejtaal.net/aa/img/ll/10/ll-1090.png

Let us stop pretending and let us seek the truth genuinely and together folks!

JavaLatte

@ Recluse

If someone has bad intention, I think it is not hard for him/her to find the way to attack/criticize the Qur'an.

For example, challenging the people in this forum to explain chapter 18, verse 86 & verse 90.

In my opinion, putting such verses into this forum and challenge the members to explain those and then seeing the responses/answers - this method might give hint to recognize hypocrites... so, I suppose what you did (criticizing the Qur'an) could cause certain 'advantage' (but not for you).

For your own good, I think you should respect each verse in the Qur'an (whether you already understand it or not) and give yourself enough time to apply in your life the lessons that you already understand from the Qur'an and see for yourself whether applying them change you to be a better person or not, whether you 'see' more clearly or not, etc (other good things).

I prefer to use myself as an object of experiment to test the truth of the Qur'an. So far I have felt/received the benefits. Praise be to Allah.

Peace.

Bender

Your understanding pertaining the topic is nonexistent in this forum so far because I think you are afraid of admitting you have no alternative understanding, hence why you have not answered my other post.

What is YOUR understanding Bender?

I already gave you now 3 times how I read/understand it and also why I think so, so not sure what kind of explaining/understanding you expecting from me.

My understanding may be wrong but it is for sure better than yours or Recluses. And if you or someone else comes with a better alternative with better arguments then I am not proud/afraid/whatever to throw away my understanding and go for the better one.

Bender

Why are two completely different words (none of them being the usual one meaning star) translated as "stars" in this translation chosen by the poster.

Hi Huruf

Yes indeed, and there are also many other words which are totally mistranslated, and above all the whole construction of the verses is wrong.

People should have at least the humility to acknowledge that they do not have an idea of what is being dealt with in those ayas.

Difficult verses/chapters have always been the playground for certain people.
Instead of trying to solve the "riddles" of that chapter/verses they like to inject their nonsensical understandings as truths for some weird reasons.

But for the poster the overriding need to ridicule the Qur'an seems to trump everything.

That is what they are good in, they do not bring something better and they do not want to discuss the verses but they throw in their nonsense like it is the truth and to ridicule.

HP_TECH

I already gave you now 3 times how I read/understand it and also why I think so, so not sure what kind of explaining/understanding you expecting from me.

My understanding may be wrong but it is for sure better than yours or Recluses. And if you or someone else comes with a better alternative with better arguments then I am not proud/afraid/whatever to throw away my understanding and go for the better one.

I have indicated exactly that here. How can you deny the evidence shown by the following or did you just give a blind eye to them?? ???

Root concordance it is used in similar ways in many other ayaats
Project Root List (it has ties with Wakas and this website) the root meanings provided are suggestive of "projectiles" i.e. objects or stones being thrown/cast
Free-minds Translation
Corpus.Quran.com Translation
Lane's Lexicon

How can you deny what I just posted?

spodacus

Salam, those are valid points. Should we also include the verse which talks about how Allah uses allegorical description for his servants to reflect upon? Also the verse which says that the same allegorical description can also be twisted by those with disease in their hearts?

I have indicated exactly that here. How can you deny the evidence shown by the following or did you just give a blind eye to them?? ???

Root concordance it is used in similar ways in many other ayaats
Project Root List (it has ties with Wakas and this website) the root meanings provided are suggestive of "projectiles" i.e. objects or stones being thrown/cast
Free-minds Translation
Corpus.Quran.com Translation
Lane's Lexicon

How can you deny what I just posted?

HP_TECH

Salam, those are valid points. Should we also include the verse which talks about how Allah uses allegorical description for his servants to reflect upon? Also the verse which says that the same allegorical description can also be twisted by those with disease in their hearts?

There is nothing allegorical here.. just stop denying.

You think this is the only ayaat? It is spelled out in MANY words and MANY other chapters stop rejecting folks.

I really cannot decide about those of you arguing these clear facts. I am not sure whether

you are not rightly guided because you follow Western modernism hence neoprogressive islam
there is disease within in your hearts
you are misinformation agents
"trolling shills" (for lack of a better term)
just not familiar with the Quran after all

Recluse

Recluse I would say I acknowledge that to be the TRUTH.
Although it is not stoning as in rocks, but rather it is shooting stars, comets, asteroids which are all heavenly projectiles that are pelted. They appear as luminous stars in the night sky precipitating to the earth or showering down, hence Meteor showers.

This only shows that you have chosen to replace your God-given reason with blind faith like billions of Christians and Muslims.

This is very comforting and easy to do. The problem is there are hundreds of other verses in the Qur'an that are scientifically and logically impossible.

Recluse

@ Recluse

If someone has bad intention, I think it is not hard for him/her to find the way to attack/criticize the Qur'an.

For example, challenging the people in this forum to explain chapter 18, verse 86 & verse 90.

In my opinion, putting such verses into this forum and challenge the members to explain those and then seeing the responses/answers - this method might give hint to recognize hypocrites... so, I suppose what you did (criticizing the Qur'an) could cause certain 'advantage' (but not for you).

For your own good, I think you should respect each verse in the Qur'an (whether you already understand it or not) and give yourself enough time to apply in your life the lessons that you already understand from the Qur'an and see for yourself whether applying them change you to be a better person or not, whether you 'see' more clearly or not, etc (other good things).

I prefer to use myself as an object of experiment to test the truth of the Qur'an. So far I have felt/received the benefits. Praise be to Allah.

Peace.

More empty words and accusations, I don't have any "bad intentions", but you have blind faith, which is the problem

I don't have any "disease in my heart" either like someone else claimed..

These are "verses" to frighten and prevent people from using their God-given reason, they were meant to terrorize you...

Peace

huruf

I love it when you psychoanalyse us for free, Recluse, you put so much passion and emotion into it, that we can't help feeling grateful.

Salaam

Recluse

Recluse,

Yeah right, the passage does not say that.
Be well
Amenuel

That is just your claim.

Peace

huruf

There is nothing allegorical here.. just stop denying. )

You think this is the only ayaat? It is spelled out in MANY words and MANY other chapters stop rejecting folks.

I really cannot decide about those of you arguing these clear facts. I am not sure whether

you are not rightly guided because you follow Western modernism hence neoprogressive islam
there is disease within in your hearts
you are misinformation agents
"trolling shills" (for lack of a better term)
just not familiar with the Quran after all

HP, I see that you hand condemnation right and left, but I have looked carefully through all the thread to see what you understand of those ayas and I have not seen any statement of yours with such undertanding, so can you tell what you get from those ayas.

Salaam

Recluse

I love it when you psychoanalyse us for free, Recluse, you put so much passion and emotion into it, that we can't help feeling grateful.

Salaam

I'm being psychoanalyzed myself for free as well.. as having a "disease in my heart" and having "bad intentions" )

But I know how you guys feel, I used to react exactly like you.

Peace

huruf

I'm being psychoanalyzed myself for free as well.. as having a "disease in my heart" and such...

But I know how you guys feel, I used to react exactly like you...

Peace

So you wre happy like us, that is great, we are all psychoanalised and hppy like in the old french song.

Salaam

Recluse

I'm much happier now, using my reason and conscience makes me feel happier. Instead of fearing eternal Hellfire.

huruf

So you are indeed capable of imagining an "eternal fire". You admire me. I find it impossible. I admire people who are so over capable of handling thing so much bigger than themselves...

May be they hve very good psychanalists fo get to such heights.

Salaam

imrankhawaja

Why are two completely different words (none of them being the usual one meaning star) translated as "stars" in this translation chosen by the poster.

Does anybody know here what he or she is talking about?

Imran is right. People should have at least the humility to acknowledge that they do not have an idea of what is being dealt with in those ayas.

But for the poster the overriding need to ridicule the Qur'an seems to trump everything.

huruf, peace

its all about the linking topics no doubt we are not sure about the full understanding of things which we have no control off,

and time by time God
gives us examples like mosquito bees, these small things yet the powerful side of them , asterioids are actually out of our control but these small things we cant even get our food back from bee if she take it, thats something God said in quran,

if humans really think they are able to point out mistakes and illogical things , infact they forget that the interpretation are from human beings , and human beings always learn by expperiments, and can do mistakes as well, its unjust to impose mistakes of humans to God.

examples of quran things are for human mind in a sense of simili/methapohrically , thats how humans beings understand things, but human being always very investigating , and from there the issues and misunderstanding starts, example is here nobody really knows what is the mechansim of asterioids/comets how they formed where they formed how they work? but what people like to critise on things which they have no power or knowledge offf, thats what happening here,