Who did read the Gospel, Psalms and the Torah?
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546-48
And we followed over their footsteps with Jesus, son of mary, attesting to what he possessed of the torah, and we gave him the gospel. In it is a guidance, and a light, and a attestation to what he possessed of the torah, and a guidance and advice to the reverant. So let the people of the gospel judge with what God has revealed in it. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then it is those who are the the disobedient transgressors. And we sent down to you the ordinance with the truth, attesting to what you possess of the ordainance, and a WITNESS/PROOF/VOUCHSAFE over it. So judge between them with what God has revealed and do not follow their desires, when the truth has come to you. To each of you, we have made of you, a law and a clear way, and if God willed, he could have made you one community, however the reason is to test you with what he has given you. So be foremost in the best. To God you all return, and he will inform you of what you differed with it.
This is my own interpretation, based on my limited understanding, and may, and likely does, contain errors, but i have sincerely tried to interpret and translate the text..
Peace.
'the gospel' is what God revealed, and what was given to jesus.
'the torah' is what God revealed, and what was given to moses.
the word in caps is my understanding of 'muhaymen', and may or may not be correct, but in my understanding it certainly does not mean superceeding!again i could be wrong.. God knows best. Verify for yourselves.
Peace
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What made you think that Jesus did not obey the Torah?
It wasn't me who thinked that. that was the official verdict for Jesus on Sanhedrin court. (Jewish Sharia Court), he was guilty of violating the Torah law on base of shirk. Read the Gospel on the section where they put Jesus on trial..
While based on my understanding of the reading, Jesus was a rock star.. in short period he managed to get millions of followers on Instagram. Groupies followed him everywhere.. He perform the nation wide tour around Judea and Galileel and all venue was sold out... thousands appeared on his concert..
Alas.. he seems to spread the message of rebellion against the religious establishment, calling them liars, hypocrites and vipers... if he wasn't stopped, the entire religious establishment will be over. Ulema will be disregarded by the people.. Basically he's the enemy of Islam.. erggh.. I mean the enemy of Judaism. so they bribed one of his follower to act as a (false) witness, designed a false accusation against him, yet forward the execution to the Roman authority, by telling the Roman governor that this dude Jesus is planning for a rebellion against Roman authority because he claimed himself to be the king of Judea. The infamous INRI, Iesous Nazarenous Rex Iudearum (Jesus the Nazarenes, King Of Judea).
Why they forwarded it to the Romans?
To avoid people outrage against the religious establishment of course... because this Jesus was very popular..Yet one dude within the Sharia court sympathize with his movement, he disagree with other court members yet he didn't voiced it explicitly as he thought it's quite useless to do so. His name is Joseph Arimathea, he designed a scheme to save Jesus, he bribed the Roman centurion to not break his legs and bones and once he passed out on the cross he took him to his place for recovery.
After recovery it's not safe for Jesus to continue lurking around Judea, so most probably Mr Arimathea also helped his escape from Judea.. After the Crucifixion there are no more story about Jesus, Mary (his mom) and Mary Magdalena as if they all vanishes to thin air...
The movement was then continues by his brothers, colleague and friends.... yet most.. if not all of them were finally murdered too....
"Lifted up to heaven" might be a cover up story so the authority will not continue to look for him..
Jesus (or any other human) will die of suffocation because of the light air if he really was propelled upward to the sky.. since he didn't wear any proper suit or life support systems with him.From my perspective, the Gospel is a story about rebellion against religion, the Gospel is among the most anti religious book ever being written. Oddly as time progress it become a "religious book" by itself.
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Restriction for catching fish?
Where did you read that if i may ask?
i think its written in the early parts of chapter 2 in quran i cant recall the verse i will post it afterwards .. if i find it..
peace
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i think its written in the early parts of chapter 2 in quran i cant recall the verse i will post it afterwards .. if i find it..
peace
What i can remember is that they tried to catch the fish, but they forgot it..
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What i can remember is that they tried to catch the fish, but they forgot it..
actually i just read it again... sorry for misunderstanding ,, although in brackets some people told it was fish catching thats what i read in urdu translation but now i properly read it,,, it was about some restriction on saturday/sabath... and then God punished these people as monkey... i m giving you reference here,, you can read it by your own.. thats what happen when u read the brackets. although i cannot say whether the restriction was catching a fish or something else...
And well ye knew those amongst you who transgressed in the matter of the Sabbath/saturday We said to them "Be ye apes, despised and rejected." 2 65
peace
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Why can the word of God be mixed with the word of human beings? Why are you so sure about the rest of the scriptures not being pure anymore?
i m not saying , thats what the history is telling us, becoz bible got plantey of versions. and their original languagelost , and these other scriptures are in hand to hand with historians, and when modern day scientific theories and understanding we filter from it, it contradict a lot,,
sometimes even the authoer seems to contradict with his own statements , i can provide you a link of debate between dr william campbel and zakir naik about the topic, the quran and bible in the light of science... and it was very popular, show, zakir point our more than 100 scientific mistakes from which william campbell didnot rectify only one...
on the other hand dr william campbell also point out 6 mistakes in quran... and with the grace of God zakir rectify all of them...
my personal belief is quran is original words of God for all the mankind... before it was for specific period for specific people...
qurna also challanges multiple times to bring a chapter like this if you are in doubt...
i also try to find a mistake in quran but still i m unnable to find any..
peace
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Yes, without verification we are bound to not use our sense but merily follow blindly what suits our desires. And that's what i don't want to do.
exactly my brother verification with neutral and honest mind is the key of success..
peace God bless you
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i m not saying , thats what the history is telling us, becoz bible got plantey of versions. and their original languagelost , and these other scriptures are in hand to hand with historians, and when modern day scientific theories and understanding we filter from it, it contradict a lot,,
sometimes even the authoer seems to contradict with his own statements , i can provide you a link of debate between dr william campbel and zakir naik about the topic, the quran and bible in the light of science... and it was very popular, show, zakir point our more than 100 scientific mistakes from which william campbell didnot rectify only one...
on the other hand dr william campbell also point out 6 mistakes in quran... and with the grace of God zakir rectify all of them...
my personal belief is quran is original words of God for all the mankind... before it was for specific period for specific people...
qurna also challanges multiple times to bring a chapter like this if you are in doubt...
i also try to find a mistake in quran but still i m unnable to find any..
peace
Peace,
543
But how can they made you their judge, while with them is the torah. In it is the judgement of God. Then they turn away, and those are not with the trusters. Indeed We revealed the torah. In it is a guidance and a light, with it judged the prophets - those who had submitted. To those jews, and the rabbis, and the scribes/scholars, with what they were entrusted of the ordainance of God, and they were witnessess to it. So do not be afraid of the human beings, but fear me. And do not exchange with my verses a small gain. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then those, it is they who are the rejectors.546-48
And we followed over their footsteps with Jesus, son of mary, attesting to what he possessed of the torah, and we gave him the gospel. In it is a guidance, and a light, and a attestation to what he possessed of the torah, and a guidance and advice to the reverant. So let the people of the gospel judge with what God has revealed in it. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then it is those who are the the disobedient transgressors. And we sent down to you the ordinance with the truth, attesting to what you possess of the ordainance, and a witness/keeper/proof over it. So judge between them with what God has revealed and do not follow their desires, when the truth has come to you. To each of you, we have made of you, a law and a clear way, and if God willed, he could have made you one community, however the reason is to test you with what he has given you. So be foremost in the best. To God you all return, and he will inform you of what you differed with it.This is my own interpretation, done sincerely and truthfull as possible, with my limited understanding, i encourage those who seek the truth to verify for themselves everything, and not take my word for it, to seek guidance from their Lord, and understanding of the original Quran.
from theese verses, to me it seems clear, that God is instructing the respective people to judge by what God has revealed in The Book, including the Torah and the Gospel. God would not give an instruction that is impossible to follow, hence they must be intact.
I Believe that the Torah and the Gospel are for the most part intact, God does not give confusing, or misleading instructions. I believe that the problem with the Torah, and the Gospel, lies in the interpretation thereof, and the distortions by certain people, but i believe the Words of God are intact, as we know from the as God is sufficient to protect His revelation (the original revelations of God)
some points of observation
what is the truth from God?
2948-9
And you did not recite from before it from a book, and you did not mark/enscribe it with your right hand, then surely the vain/arogant/false ones have doubted. No! it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge.
In regards to the Torah, i have the following notes
...in reference to the Masoretic Text the word mesorah has a very specific meaning the diacritic markings of the text of the Hebrew Bible and concise marginal notes in manuscripts (and later printings) of the Hebrew Bible which note textual details, usually about the precise spelling of words.
...By long tradition, a ritual Sefer Torah (Torah scroll) could contain only the Hebrew consonantal text ? nothing added, nothing taken away. The Masoretic codices however, provide extensive additional material, called masorah, to show correct pronunciation and cantillation, protect against scribal errors, and annotate possible variants. The manuscripts thus include vowel points, pronunciation marks and stress accents in the text, short annotations in the side margins, and longer more extensive notes in the upper and lower margins and collected at the end of each book....
as if a sign from our lord..
The Hebrew word masorah is taken from the Book of Ezekiel 2037 and means originally "legcuffs"
that is from wikipedia on Masoretic Text..
certainly they have shackled themselves to their own interpretation. Although the Masoretic Text is not the only source of translation of the Bible, it certainly would have a great influence on it, and we know that the original Torah was written without vowels, just like the Quran. I believe the original material is largely intact, but THE INTERPRETATION, may be, and most probably is highly distorted. In my honest understanding, the samaratain pentetauch is likely the most intact copy of the torah we have, as, in my understanding it was the last to adopt legcuffs
As for which mountain is which, Our Lord knows best.
Peace
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Peace,
543
But how can they made you their judge, while with them is the torah. In it is the judgement of God. Then they turn away, and those are not with the trusters. Indeed We revealed the torah. In it is a guidance and a light, with it judged the prophets - those who had submitted. To those jews, and the rabbis, and the scribes/scholars, with what they were entrusted of the ordainance of God, and they were witnessess to it. So do not be afraid of the human beings, but fear me. And do not exchange with my verses a small gain. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then those, it is they who are the rejectors.546-48
And we followed over their footsteps with Jesus, son of mary, attesting to what he possessed of the torah, and we gave him the gospel. In it is a guidance, and a light, and a attestation to what he possessed of the torah, and a guidance and advice to the reverant. So let the people of the gospel judge with what God has revealed in it. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then it is those who are the the disobedient transgressors. And we sent down to you the ordinance with the truth, attesting to what you possess of the ordainance, and a witness/keeper/proof over it. So judge between them with what God has revealed and do not follow their desires, when the truth has come to you. To each of you, we have made of you, a law and a clear way, and if God willed, he could have made you one community, however the reason is to test you with what he has given you. So be foremost in the best. To God you all return, and he will inform you of what you differed with it.This is my own interpretation, done sincerely and truthfull as possible, with my limited understanding, i encourage those who seek the truth to verify for themselves everything, and not take my word for it, to seek guidance from their Lord, and understanding of the original Quran.
from theese verses, to me it seems clear, that God is instructing the respective people to judge by what God has revealed in The Book, including the Torah and the Gospel. God would not give an instruction that is impossible to follow, hence they must be intact.
I Believe that the Torah and the Gospel are for the most part intact, God does not give confusing, or misleading instructions. I believe that the problem with the Torah, and the Gospel, lies in the interpretation thereof, and the distortions by certain people, but i believe the Words of God are intact, as we know from the as God is sufficient to protect His revelation (the original revelations of God)
some points of observation
what is the truth from God?
2948-9
And you did not recite from before it from a book, and you did not mark/enscribe it with your right hand, then surely the vain/arogant/false ones have doubted. No! it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge.
In regards to the Torah, i have the following notes
...in reference to the Masoretic Text the word mesorah has a very specific meaning the diacritic markings of the text of the Hebrew Bible and concise marginal notes in manuscripts (and later printings) of the Hebrew Bible which note textual details, usually about the precise spelling of words.
...By long tradition, a ritual Sefer Torah (Torah scroll) could contain only the Hebrew consonantal text ? nothing added, nothing taken away. The Masoretic codices however, provide extensive additional material, called masorah, to show correct pronunciation and cantillation, protect against scribal errors, and annotate possible variants. The manuscripts thus include vowel points, pronunciation marks and stress accents in the text, short annotations in the side margins, and longer more extensive notes in the upper and lower margins and collected at the end of each book....
as if a sign from our lord..
The Hebrew word masorah is taken from the Book of Ezekiel 2037 and means originally "legcuffs"
that is from wikipedia on Masoretic Text..
certainly they have shackled themselves to their own interpretation. Although the Masoretic Text is not the only source of translation of the Bible, it certainly would have a great influence on it, and we know that the original Torah was written without vowels, just like the Quran. I believe the original material is largely intact, but THE INTERPRETATION, may be, and most probably is highly distorted. In my honest understanding, the samaratain pentetauch is likely the most intact copy of the torah we have, as, in my understanding it was the last to adopt legcuffs )
As for which mountain is which, Our Lord knows best.
Peace
"So do not be afraid of the human beings, but fear me"
All praise due to God, Lord of the worlds. Good to be reminded of that!
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Peace,
543
But how can they made you their judge, while with them is the torah. In it is the judgement of God. Then they turn away, and those are not with the trusters. Indeed We revealed the torah. In it is a guidance and a light, with it judged the prophets - those who had submitted. To those jews, and the rabbis, and the scribes/scholars, with what they were entrusted of the ordainance of God, and they were witnessess to it. So do not be afraid of the human beings, but fear me. And do not exchange with my verses a small gain. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then those, it is they who are the rejectors.546-48
And we followed over their footsteps with Jesus, son of mary, attesting to what he possessed of the torah, and we gave him the gospel. In it is a guidance, and a light, and a attestation to what he possessed of the torah, and a guidance and advice to the reverant. So let the people of the gospel judge with what God has revealed in it. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then it is those who are the the disobedient transgressors. And we sent down to you the ordinance with the truth, attesting to what you possess of the ordainance, and a witness/keeper/proof over it. So judge between them with what God has revealed and do not follow their desires, when the truth has come to you. To each of you, we have made of you, a law and a clear way, and if God willed, he could have made you one community, however the reason is to test you with what he has given you. So be foremost in the best. To God you all return, and he will inform you of what you differed with it.This is my own interpretation, done sincerely and truthfull as possible, with my limited understanding, i encourage those who seek the truth to verify for themselves everything, and not take my word for it, to seek guidance from their Lord, and understanding of the original Quran.
from theese verses, to me it seems clear, that God is instructing the respective people to judge by what God has revealed in The Book, including the Torah and the Gospel. God would not give an instruction that is impossible to follow, hence they must be intact.
I Believe that the Torah and the Gospel are for the most part intact, God does not give confusing, or misleading instructions. I believe that the problem with the Torah, and the Gospel, lies in the interpretation thereof, and the distortions by certain people, but i believe the Words of God are intact, as we know from the as God is sufficient to protect His revelation (the original revelations of God)
some points of observation
what is the truth from God?
2948-9
And you did not recite from before it from a book, and you did not mark/enscribe it with your right hand, then surely the vain/arogant/false ones have doubted. No! it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge.
In regards to the Torah, i have the following notes
...in reference to the Masoretic Text the word mesorah has a very specific meaning the diacritic markings of the text of the Hebrew Bible and concise marginal notes in manuscripts (and later printings) of the Hebrew Bible which note textual details, usually about the precise spelling of words.
...By long tradition, a ritual Sefer Torah (Torah scroll) could contain only the Hebrew consonantal text ? nothing added, nothing taken away. The Masoretic codices however, provide extensive additional material, called masorah, to show correct pronunciation and cantillation, protect against scribal errors, and annotate possible variants. The manuscripts thus include vowel points, pronunciation marks and stress accents in the text, short annotations in the side margins, and longer more extensive notes in the upper and lower margins and collected at the end of each book....
as if a sign from our lord..
The Hebrew word masorah is taken from the Book of Ezekiel 2037 and means originally "legcuffs"
that is from wikipedia on Masoretic Text..
certainly they have shackled themselves to their own interpretation. Although the Masoretic Text is not the only source of translation of the Bible, it certainly would have a great influence on it, and we know that the original Torah was written without vowels, just like the Quran. I believe the original material is largely intact, but THE INTERPRETATION, may be, and most probably is highly distorted. In my honest understanding, the samaratain pentetauch is likely the most intact copy of the torah we have, as, in my understanding it was the last to adopt legcuffs )
As for which mountain is which, Our Lord knows best.
Peace
Did the Quran say that the Torah and the Gospel are not intact anymore?
-
Peace,
543
But how can they made you their judge, while with them is the torah. In it is the judgement of God. Then they turn away, and those are not with the trusters. Indeed We revealed the torah. In it is a guidance and a light, with it judged the prophets - those who had submitted. To those jews, and the rabbis, and the scribes/scholars, with what they were entrusted of the ordainance of God, and they were witnessess to it. So do not be afraid of the human beings, but fear me. And do not exchange with my verses a small gain. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then those, it is they who are the rejectors.546-48
And we followed over their footsteps with Jesus, son of mary, attesting to what he possessed of the torah, and we gave him the gospel. In it is a guidance, and a light, and a attestation to what he possessed of the torah, and a guidance and advice to the reverant. So let the people of the gospel judge with what God has revealed in it. And whoever is not judging with what God has revealed, then it is those who are the the disobedient transgressors. And we sent down to you the ordinance with the truth, attesting to what you possess of the ordainance, and a witness/keeper/proof over it. So judge between them with what God has revealed and do not follow their desires, when the truth has come to you. To each of you, we have made of you, a law and a clear way, and if God willed, he could have made you one community, however the reason is to test you with what he has given you. So be foremost in the best. To God you all return, and he will inform you of what you differed with it.This is my own interpretation, done sincerely and truthfull as possible, with my limited understanding, i encourage those who seek the truth to verify for themselves everything, and not take my word for it, to seek guidance from their Lord, and understanding of the original Quran.
from theese verses, to me it seems clear, that God is instructing the respective people to judge by what God has revealed in The Book, including the Torah and the Gospel. God would not give an instruction that is impossible to follow, hence they must be intact.
I Believe that the Torah and the Gospel are for the most part intact, God does not give confusing, or misleading instructions. I believe that the problem with the Torah, and the Gospel, lies in the interpretation thereof, and the distortions by certain people, but i believe the Words of God are intact, as we know from the as God is sufficient to protect His revelation (the original revelations of God)
some points of observation
what is the truth from God?
2948-9
And you did not recite from before it from a book, and you did not mark/enscribe it with your right hand, then surely the vain/arogant/false ones have doubted. No! it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge.
In regards to the Torah, i have the following notes
...in reference to the Masoretic Text the word mesorah has a very specific meaning the diacritic markings of the text of the Hebrew Bible and concise marginal notes in manuscripts (and later printings) of the Hebrew Bible which note textual details, usually about the precise spelling of words.
...By long tradition, a ritual Sefer Torah (Torah scroll) could contain only the Hebrew consonantal text ? nothing added, nothing taken away. The Masoretic codices however, provide extensive additional material, called masorah, to show correct pronunciation and cantillation, protect against scribal errors, and annotate possible variants. The manuscripts thus include vowel points, pronunciation marks and stress accents in the text, short annotations in the side margins, and longer more extensive notes in the upper and lower margins and collected at the end of each book....
as if a sign from our lord..
The Hebrew word masorah is taken from the Book of Ezekiel 2037 and means originally "legcuffs"
that is from wikipedia on Masoretic Text..
certainly they have shackled themselves to their own interpretation. Although the Masoretic Text is not the only source of translation of the Bible, it certainly would have a great influence on it, and we know that the original Torah was written without vowels, just like the Quran. I believe the original material is largely intact, but THE INTERPRETATION, may be, and most probably is highly distorted. In my honest understanding, the samaratain pentetauch is likely the most intact copy of the torah we have, as, in my understanding it was the last to adopt legcuffs )
As for which mountain is which, Our Lord knows best.
Peace
Have you seen the Oldest written Torah Book?
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Did the Quran say that the Torah and the Gospel are not intact anymore?
Peace
Nowhere. to my knowledge anyway, God willing, as i progress with my torah study, i will update, however i am juggling alot of differend things, so it may be some time.
In Regards to the oldest written torah copy, as far as my research goes, if i recall correctly the oldest full manuscript is 9th century CE, check out wikipedia, they have pretty good articles of biblical texts, specificaly the masoretic text and the torah wiki pages, also biblical textual critisism, and check out the synoptic gospels as well, also as i understand, the Samaratain Pentetauch (torah) is written in a script that predates the babylonian captivity of israel, so it is possible that it survived intact since then, aside from Kraite Judaism, the Samaratains seem to be the only ones who follow the torah alone (though i may be mistaken).
however all we realy know without doubt, is that God is telling them to bring the torah, and recite it, at the time of muhammad, and says that in it is Gods judgement, and they are to judge by it, so at least we know that the torah was intact and able to be brought and recited in the time of Muhammad.
I believe that God is sufficient to preserve his scriptures though, and besides, we have the quran, and the gospel, and the psalms, if you read them all, and judge by the light of the quran, God willing you will see the truth..
Peace
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Peace
Nowhere. to my knowledge anyway, God willing, as i progress with my torah study, i will update, however i am juggling alot of differend things, so it may be some time.
In Regards to the oldest written torah copy, as far as my research goes, if i recall correctly the oldest full manuscript is 9th century CE, check out wikipedia, they have pretty good articles of biblical texts, specificaly the masoretic text and the torah wiki pages, also biblical textual critisism, and check out the synoptic gospels as well, also as i understand, the Samaratain Pentetauch (torah) is written in a script that predates the babylonian captivity of israel, so it is possible that it survived intact since then, aside from Kraite Judaism, the Samaratains seem to be the only ones who follow the torah alone (though i may be mistaken).
however all we realy know without doubt, is that God is telling them to bring the torah, and recite it, at the time of muhammad, and says that in it is Gods judgement, and they are to judge by it, so at least we know that the torah was intact and able to be brought and recited in the time of Muhammad.
I believe that God is sufficient to preserve his scriptures though, and besides, we have the quran, and the gospel, and the psalms, if you read them all, and judge by the light of the quran, God willing you will see the truth..
Peace
So why do we think or thought that the Word of God can be destroyed and manipulated.
That's just a wrong belief.
Yesterday i came across some salafis that i know from when i was following salafism blindly. I told them about that i want to follow the Torah, Psalms, Gospel and Quran and that i was reading the Book of Isaiah.
First thing they said, "but the Torah is not the word of God anymore"..
In the end i said that God is Guiding and that the Guidance is God's Guidance, and that every human being is in need of He's Guidance.
And then by He's will i invited them to read the Torah, Psalms and the Gospel !
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Peace
Nowhere. to my knowledge anyway, God willing, as i progress with my torah study, i will update, however i am juggling alot of differend things, so it may be some time.
In Regards to the oldest written torah copy, as far as my research goes, if i recall correctly the oldest full manuscript is 9th century CE, check out wikipedia, they have pretty good articles of biblical texts, specificaly the masoretic text and the torah wiki pages, also biblical textual critisism, and check out the synoptic gospels as well, also as i understand, the Samaratain Pentetauch (torah) is written in a script that predates the babylonian captivity of israel, so it is possible that it survived intact since then, aside from Kraite Judaism, the Samaratains seem to be the only ones who follow the torah alone (though i may be mistaken).
however all we realy know without doubt, is that God is telling them to bring the torah, and recite it, at the time of muhammad, and says that in it is Gods judgement, and they are to judge by it, so at least we know that the torah was intact and able to be brought and recited in the time of Muhammad.
I believe that God is sufficient to preserve his scriptures though, and besides, we have the quran, and the gospel, and the psalms, if you read them all, and judge by the light of the quran, God willing you will see the truth..
Peace
Yeah, God told us that the Torah contains Guidance and Light.
And the Quran also told Mohammed to let the people of the Gospel judge with the Gospel and what God had Revealed therein. So another huge clue that the Gospel was there at the time of Mohammed.
Some people love to say that the Gospel we have now is not the Gospel anymore, and that there was no Gospel anymore after 60 +/- AD. While there was a Gospel 1400 +/- AD that is confirmed by the Quran..
547 if i can recall from memory.
May our Lord guide us.
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And i heard that the names of Matt,Mar,Luke,John were not introduced until later.
The Gospel had not such names they say? Just like the chapterheadings of the Quran? They were not there?
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355 For God said "O Jesus, I will terminate your life, and raise you to Me, and cleanse you of those who have rejected, and make those who have followed you above those who have rejected until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, all of you,so I will judge between you in what it was that you disputed."
*Until the Day of resurrection!
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355 For God said "O Jesus, I will terminate your life, and raise you to Me, and cleanse you of those who have rejected, and make those who have followed you above those who have rejected until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, all of you,so I will judge between you in what it was that you disputed."
*Until the Day of resurrection!
Peace,
This is a great verse, so many people reject jesus. God made him a sign for all of mankind, and to mark the end times (if i recall correctly), and God certainly made him a catalyst for the whole world. because of this, Missionaries have travelled all over the earth, and bibles are everywhere. sure they might be advocating idol worship, and distorting it. but the truth and guidance and light is still in it, anyone who is sincere, and God wills to guide, will see the truth in it, and the falsehood in it.
A few points to note..
Indeed Matthew, Mark Luke John etc etc are just traditions, similar to the names of the surahs, or there revalation order/place, there is no real way to confirm.
If i recall correctly, prehaps one of the authors mentions himself? as far as i know, none of them were actualy disciples, Also there are variations, one gospel more or less says 'this is a passed on account' from those who witnessed it. and similar things in another. i cant recall exactly. but research it for yourself.
I am not saying that every word in the gospels are true! however, i sincerely believe that the three synoptic gospels must have come from the same source. it seems likely to me that they were oral accounts of the gospel that was given to jesus, we do not know for sure though.
what i am most certainly saying, is that i believe, that the gospel accounts, the words of jesus in them, contain parts of THE gospel (singular) meaning good news, which was given to jesus.
It is the same with the torah, but different again. It is not 100%, there are variations in different copies etc, but again, God is sufficient to preserve from distortion, and he tells those repective people to judge by them.
The biggest key realy, is the interpretation of, and the reading itself. the reading was revealed by God, it was probably written down without vowel sounds, hence there is room for ambiguity, and distorting, hence the referance (if i recall correctly) in the Quran to the jews 'twisting their tounges to distort the deen'..
all the scriptures are faliable because they are written down/translated/etc by faliable human beings. Gods guidance is what we need to see the truth, those i believe that he preserved sufficiently the guidance and light in theese revelations, as he seems to (in my understanding) be saying in the Quran.
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And you did not recite from before it from a book, and you did not mark/enscribe it with your right hand, then surely the vain/arogant/false ones have doubted. No! it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge. And none are in denial with our signs except the lost ones.
my own interpretation, faliable, and imperfect, but i have sincerely done my best.
"it is clear signs in the minds/hearts of those who have been given knowledge"
also i think your dates are wrong, muhammad was, if i recall correctly in the 600s
one final point to note..
While i admire your curiousity, and that you seem to be very keen to learn, you are asking me to many questions.
seek assistance from your Lord not human beings.
do not follow me! for both of our sakes.
I am only a human being, so was every messenger of God, they followed God alone, and i try my best to, and so should you.
The prophets/messengers did not follow a human translated or interpreted book, they followed the revelations/guidance from their lord
Peace
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Jafar,
From my perspective, the Gospel is a story about rebellion against religion, the Gospel is among the most anti religious book ever being written. Oddly as time progress it become a "religious book" by itself.
Particularly when Mr. Jesus said "I am in the Father and the Father in me" implying God is who God is, i.e. not a separate phenomenon. Rabb encompasses all those souls who are in the unity. The rest are dead by definition, even Jesus uses the term dead in reference to someone who is not alive in the spirit. Jesus furthermore says that these people are kings (angels = melakat - for the word stems from Miim-Lam-Kaf which is a root meaning "control" and they are kings over the others. This is what these ascended beings called angels are. Jesus is an angel too now, it was what he said himself, he would be a king, but not of this world. He led the way for others to accomplish the same and it was a great mercy of Rabb (everyone of angels combined) to give such a manifest solution to reach salvation from this world.
Some people have managed without help while others have been guided. The truth is not hidden nor manifest, and one needs to contemplate and think a little. Even without Jesus is it possible to contemplate sufficiently and reach to an explanation to this world and what it is.
Each human soul is like a seed of Rabb and it needs to develop into a full-fledged "share" of Rabb. This way the consciousness of Rabb will expand.
There is absolutely no one to worship and there never has been. The only "worship" is to be as "the Father".
And our world cycle is not the only one ever been in existence but there is also one with individuals (shares of Rabb) such as Gabriel and Michael, called controllers/kings by the scriptures. These were successful prospects of the past and they shaped the current test as "angels". It is in 230 and surrounding passages that the amateur interpreters of Quran made to say something else.
Basically we are all contained in Rabb, knowingly or unknowingly, with weak consciousness or strong consciousness.
Be well
Amenuel