Homosexuality LGBTQI and the deen
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Hawk, exactly, I've raised that up previously on the board...it does seem like it's something other than just your run of the mill same-sex action.
But what thoroughly baffled me was this
homosex does not hurt anybody , bravo
hetrosex also does not hurt anybody..
speaking lie does not hurt somebody
borrow a credit money from bank and didnt give it back does not hurt anybody
buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year does not hurt anybody...and lot of more things .....
What does buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year even mean?
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Agreed, thanks Bender. @All, this is only a discussion within forum rules,
for those who find this discussion abhorrent no participation is required.
My point is this The people of prophet Lot were engaged in something
that none had engaged in before, therefore there were no homosexuals
before the time of Lot? Or is the reference to "none had engaged in before"
a reference to something else? hmmpolice
Salam,
The only people that were saved from the people of Lot were the family of Lot, except his wife.
1.They were a rejecting people; so this could explain why the women of the people of Lot were not saved; we aren't told if they were homosexuals too, unless I missed it.
2.All males (or majority, a huge majority) were homosexuals.Is there a city where all males approach men instead of women? No there isn't. The only city/town was of the people of Lot.
Salam
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But what thoroughly baffled me was this What does buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year even mean?
its mean , when u purchase a mobile and falsely claim it lost and get a new one .. does not hurt anybody .. so this act is allowed .or not.. can we give ourself satisfaction that what we did is nothing wrong...?
same the people who think if an action does not hurt someone its mean we are allowed to do it.. without any fear of consequences...
like illegal sex, dishonesty and other stuff..
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the acts of nation lot as per quran are
1 approaching men
2 murder/rape
3 robbery on highwaysmurder and robbery were acts already done by lot of nations and individual
so we left with option 1 ...although if we want to go with the flow with brother hawk then a question arise again what was the act?
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Peace all,
Homosexuality does still not hurt someone else, except if you would rape them homosexually.
Exactly. Even unwanted sexual harassment/advances/inappropriate touch can be very painful for a person to go through. Feeling trapped, like there's no escape either physically or mentally, developing a long-lasting and unhealthy relationship with sex and/or other people, seeing oneself or knowing you're being seen only as a sexual object, etc. I can't imagine. I would not wish anyone to be forced into something without their consent.
My point is this The people of prophet Lot were engaged in something
that none had engaged in before, therefore there were no homosexuals
before the time of Lot? Or is the reference to "none had engaged in before"
a reference to something else? hmmIn my opinion, that line refers to all of what the people of Lot did, as a collective whole. They made unwanted sexual advances towards the men/travelers (781; I'm not sure we can go so far as to say "rape" with certainty), they were criminals (155, it sounds like they were behaving highly inappropriately in front of Lot's guests (117, they sound like they were threatening to drive Lot out if he didn't stop trying to tell them the errors of their ways (26167), and as others have mentioned, they blocked the travelers from leaving (2929), and committed "evil" in their meetings (2929). I know some translations of 2929 also include the crime of robbery, and I know other "progressive thinkers" have suggested that the people of Lot had spouses (26166).
Like many other examples in the Qur'an, they were exceeding their limits - thinking they were invincible perhaps - and could do whatever they wanted with no consequence or concern for other people.
Salam,
The only people that were saved from the people of Lot were the family of Lot, except his wife.
1.They were a rejecting people; so this could explain why the women of the people of Lot were not saved; we aren't told if they were homosexuals too, unless I missed it.As far as I know, you didn't miss anything.
2.All males (or majority, a huge majority) were homosexuals.
Is there a city where all males approach men instead of women? No there isn't. The only city/town was of the people of Lot.
Salam
I remember reading a thread on homosexuality a while back in which someone wrote about their experiences of being in San Francisco
This topic interests me. Why? Well...... for one I just moved back from San Francisco this year. I was in San Francisco for nearly a year. For a lot of the people here, gay people are like an abstract theory- something thought about but not encountered in real life. I live in Texas now and there are, of course, gay people here but they're secretive and don't talk about that aspect of their lives in public. In San Francisco, they felt no shame in discussing intimate details and no shame in flaunting their life-style in public. Before I lived there, gay people were like an abstract concept to me and I couldn't understand why God seemed to prohibit homosexuality. It wasn't until I had personal experience of dealing with the "gay community" that I became against homosexuality. I believe in treating gay people with respect and kindness but that doesn't mean I have to alter my religious views to suit them. Anyways, for you who have not seen what I've seen, I will talk a little bit about my experiences in San Francisco. Some things I describe following this are gross; you might wanna skip it.
I remember me and my friends used to think that there was something vaguely Satanic about San Francisco. We felt uncomfortable. Later on, I found out Anton LaVey's Satanic Church was based in San Francisco. So Satanism definitely has influenced the city. And I would say more than 90% of the gay men I knew were extremely promiscuous. San Francisco was so gay as a straight male I was actually a minority and I felt kinda isolated (I knew there was gay people in San Francisco but I didn't know it was THAT gay!). And I knew a lot of gay people so I knew a lot of gay men. I once saw men having sex in public and I heard a man brag about having sex with five men in one night. I remember a man who looked like he was 50-something years old randomly came up to me and offered me money to perform oral sex on me. That kinda thing was actually kinda normal. I would get approached constantly by gay men. I remember sitting on a bus and noticing the guy across from me was (very blatantly) checking me out. You can imagine how uncomfortable that sort of thing made me feel.
Clearly, this is just one person's experience/opinion. I've never been to San Francisco myself. Still thought the above was worth noting. If someone wants to take the approach that homosexuality as a whole is bad, then this could be the "evidence" for a whole society - of predominantly homosexual people - being prohibited by God.
its mean , when u purchase a mobile and falsely claim it lost and get a new one .. does not hurt anybody .. so this act is allowed .or not.. can we give ourself satisfaction that what we did is nothing wrong...?
same the people who think if an action does not hurt someone its mean we are allowed to do it.. without any fear of consequences...
like illegal sex, dishonesty and other stuff..
Isn't that still hurting someone though? It's taking away people's time, people's resources/money, and people's trust if they ever found out?
the acts of nation lot as per quran are
1 approaching men
2 murder/rape
3 robbery on highwaysmurder and robbery were acts already done by lot of nations and individual
so we left with option 1 ...Why not consider that all of this combined is what made the people of Lot do something that has never been done before?
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Then you should also stop with bothering people with your believes on every subject, including this post of you, believe what you believe in private and stop being annoying.
Homosexuality is just a subject like any other which can be discussed, if some views on it bothers you then maybe it's better to stay away from such discussions.Please don't try to lecture me, it's not about if his views are bothering me or not. It's about LGBT was a taboo in the past, with time people like him have promoted these disgusting things and in today's world you get attacked if you even think about criticizing them. Sorry bro, but I don't want my son to be a fag or a tranny, If people here want that please keep it private because it's better for everyone.
A lot of the forum members here come from western countries that promote extreme liberal ideologies, then try to interpret the Quran in that fashion.
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supporting homosexuality through quran is indeed a wrong doing... (God did not order immorality)
and about personal life... its the matter between an individual and God... (we can debate on it)
we are mixing two things ...
if somebody say i am a thief. and quran also support theft then it is a problem as long about his thefft i dnt have any problem , but my problem/confusion start when he will try to justify it through the lens of quran..
theft/lie/dishonesty/immorality all things you can say...
if somebody say if i m doing one night stand , (hetrosex) i also dnt have any problem with him as i know its between him and her and their God..
but when they come and bring quran in it then i must need to ask them ... thats what is going on here
we are confused in two things...
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apart from all this , i have a logical question?
let put quran at the side for once..
if a person is transgender .. like i m also experiencing some frd requests now a days.. who are they medically , male or female...
people claim they are both , half male half female so they get operation for finding the right path whatever they want to become...
is it really possible... as we know everything is in pair either male or female.. what is this inbetween
and if there is really such a creation like this then its not a sin for them to approach anyone whatever suits them... its their need you can say that...
this is confused topic itself first we need to understand all the grounds of the subject then we can discuss further how we can deal with it...
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Greetings and Peace, all group
Please don't try to lecture me, it's not about if his views are bothering me or not. It's about LGBT was a taboo in the past, with time people like him have promoted these disgusting things and in today's world you get attacked if you even think about criticizing them. Sorry bro, but I don't want my son to be a fag or a tranny, If people here want that please keep it private because it's better for everyone.
2170 And if they are told "Follow what GOD has sent down," they say "No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing!" What if their fathers did not comprehend anything and were not guided?
A lot of the forum members here come from western countries that promote extreme liberal ideologies, then try to interpret the Quran in that fashion.
4911 O you who believe, let not any people ridicule other people, for they may be better than they. Nor shall any women ridicule other women, for they may be better than they. Nor shall you mock one another, or call each other names; miserable indeed is the name of wickedness after attaining faith. And anyone who does not repent, then these are the transgressors.
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
My comments in red.
apart from all this , i have a logical question?
let put quran at the side for once..
if a person is transgender .. like i m also experiencing some frd requests now a days.. who are they medically , male or female...
Transgender can be medically male or female, but not both. Intersex are born with tissues of both male and female. In North America, about 1 in 2000 babies are born intersex. There are also people who have sex reassignment therapy.
people claim they are both , half male half female so they get operation for finding the right path whatever they want to become...
is it really possible... as we know everything is in pair either male or female.. what is this inbetween
Biological in between is intersex.
and if there is really such a creation like this then its not a sin for them to approach anyone whatever suits them... its their need you can say that...
this is confused topic itself first we need to understand all the grounds of the subject then we can discuss further how we can deal with it...
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_reassignment_therapy
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
6104 "Visible proofs have come to you from your Lord; so whoever can see, does so for himself, and whoever is blinded, will be such. I am not a watcher over you."
May ALLAH see fit to Guide all seekers.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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homosex does not hurt anybody , bravo
hetrosex also does not hurt anybody..
speaking lie does not hurt somebody
borrow a credit money from bank and didnt give it back does not hurt anybody
buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year does not hurt anybody...and lot of more things .....
What is your point? The three last arguments may hurt someone.
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What is your point? The three last arguments may hurt someone.
His point is, what is immoral isn't necessarily hurtful. Hurtful in the ridiculous way we "modern" human beings all agree with. Hurtful as slapping someone in the face.
Very low standards indeed, for Godly beings.
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It is all from you people.
From the well elaborated definitions to the fabricated values of your societies. It is all you. Discuss all you want about it.
I have grown in a society where you could kiss to the cheek and hug and even share a bed with another male out of lack of space without even the sexual ideas crossing your mind. Heck, in some places people don't have beds, they share the floor with each other. Males hold hands with each other whenever they feel like out of friendship and fraternity. This was at the time the foreign media and internet had very little influence on such places. Now it changed.
This entire sexualising of everything came from you people. You have poisoned everything, and put your definitions on anything. So you "dig" into the verse of God the way you want, and come up with the definitions that suits your societies. Your societies are porn-driven societies. Slaves to feelings. It is all linked. The spreading of this "phenomena" is growing. Internet and media is contributing to it, your part of the internet and media.
Discuss all you want about it.
P.s if the "you people" bothered you, good.
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What is your point? The three last arguments may hurt someone.
no all five actually hurt someone and all five may not hurt someone aswell...
example , homosex can hurt someone if victim father get to know...
hetrosex can hurt someone emotions too specially in the case of married couples
speaking lie cannot hurt someone if i tell to my manager i m late due to the failure of my car ..instead of telling him truth that i get late due to my own laziness
get credits from bank and did not pay them back , cannot hurt if we know organisations are insurance covered..
the false claim of mobile also harmless when we know insurance company is backed up the owner...but in all this we have to see the nature of action...
so its up to you what is the purpose of those actions ..
on other words if actions are harmless does not mean its right to do it..
in all five you get satisfied that you did not harm anybody but when you ask from inside then the voice of your conscience will tell you..
God knows whats in the chests .. you can cheat/trick with system/laws but it will only save you from society not from the consequences of these actions will save you from the law of God.. -
Homosexuality can have its roots in various reasons such as that the soul has had a female sex body in the past and made a strong imprint to it
i just remeber this funny claim of you ammanuel ... trust me i still cant decide either i laugh rotfl on it or i do this brickwall
so what i find new in the concept of incranation is this souls can also change genders in that theory... hmm
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Transgender can be medically male or female, but not both. Intersex are born with tissues of both male and female
so there is also male and female in intersex... i mean intesex male and intersex female... ?
and can you tell me trangender girl, ? a little bit detail... can she get pregnat..?
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I remember reading a thread on homosexuality a while back in which someone wrote about their experiences of being in San Francisco
Clearly, this is just one person's experience/opinion. I've never been to San Francisco myself. Still thought the above was worth noting. If someone wants to take the approach that homosexuality as a whole is bad, then this could be the "evidence" for a whole society - of predominantly homosexual people - being prohibited by God.
In SF, LGBT constitute only 6.8% of total population..
Thus they're not yet "dominant" or "majority" but a very very small minority...To me 'homosexual' as the cause of 'city destruction by explosion' (meteorite or other causes) is as absurd as 'sacrificing virgin to the Gods' is the cause of "rain" to fall on the area. (Which was widely believed in Canaan during the time of Lot).
Speaking of which... there will be a BIG earthquake coming to SF (and other US western coast cities) between now to 2100..
I wonder whether they will again blame 'homosexuality' as the cause of the earthquake in SF (and other US west coast cities).The BIG earthquake will definitely NOT caused by the movement of earth's crust tectonic plate which happened to lie just few miles away from US western coast... that doesn't make sense at all... how can an earth tectonic plate caused an earthquake right?
Definitely... Homosexuality is to blame as the primary cause for the BIG earthquake... with Sodom as evidence...
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It does seem that a fragment of the human population is born innately homosexual. It means it was the decision of "God" according to your common reasoning regarding that phenomenon. These people cannot help their condition except to enter celibacy if they like to refrain from vain bodily stimulation. It has been shown these people cannot endure a normal heterosexual relationship.
Be well
Amenuel