The Daaba = Oil?
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Salam,
I was watching a documentary on oil and how its presence has caused the entire communication and transportation revolution, as well as the fact that oil is the result of organic creatures being buried for thousands or millions of years inside the earth.
With this information in mind, I would like to re-examine the prophecy of "The Creature" and the understanding of 2782
A "Daaba" according to the Quran is land based organic life (made of water 2445) and is considered, along with birds, as creatures that will return to God after their death (63.
2782 "And when the sentence has fallen upon them, We will extract for them organic matter from the earth, to let them communicate. Indeed, the people are unaware regarding Our signs."
We also read from 2782 that the "Daaba" will come out from "within the earth," which is not a place where any such creature lives as all land animals dwell "on the earth" and not "in the earth". As such, I read this prophecy as one concerning oil which is the remains of organic land animals, coming from within the earth, and which has enabled "communication" of the people through the various inventions and technologies that have been produced by it.
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Well, the question is that although it has been believed, I do not know why, that oil is a fossil, the fact, as it turns out, is that it is not, and that is the reason why in spite of the threats that it was finishing, it is not finished not finishing. It seems that it is being continually produced at the jonction between the crust and the mantle.
See in inernet "abiotic oil".
Salaam
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What about taking a look in the Gospel? Why else should the people of the Gospel judge with the Gospel? And why else does God call it a Guidance and a Light?
An English translation of the Quran - 547 And let the people of the Gospel judge with what God has sent down in it. And whoever does not judge with what God has sent down, then these are the wicked.
An English translation of the Quran - 546 Subsequent to them, we sent Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming the previous scripture, the Torah. We gave him the Gospel, containing guidance and light, and confirming the previous scriptures, the Torah, and augmenting its guidance and light, and to enlighten the righteous.,
Maybe it's a beast that is mentioned in the Gospel
An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 47 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.
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An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 47 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.
This could mean pretty much anything... all those beats and their likes.
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the process of earth digging from the upper crust to mantle will may bring more discoveries for future generations who knows whats hidden inside the earth.. we just start discovering the secrets of earth... lets carry on...
although oil and computer are close understandings as we know after the era of oil the things like camera voice recorders and other stuff is giving hint to the the nature what that creature will tell us,, but again who knows what is the height of discoveries.. as i see from last 15 years after the advancement and acess of computer tecnology allovver the world already bring surprises every single year for us... i m looking a world in a very strange shape in next ten years ...
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This could mean pretty much anything... all those beats and their likes.
I just mean that maybe it could mean term that is being described in the previous Scriptures.
For example, we actually read in the Torah who Israel is, it's Jacob. And we actually read in the Torah the Law that is being referred to in the Quran.
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I think it is a translation issue and Jacob is not Israel but Jacob called for Israel for the first time. Quran refers to him as Jacob and not Israel.
Before Jacob the narrative speaks of "the promised land" but at about that point in the narrative it speaks of Israel. All of that is metaphorical and code-like and the real "promised land" is not of this world and Israel is the community which lives according to what is necessary to reach the "promised land".
O Children of Israel is addressing all those who live according to the ancient decree.
Be well
Amenuel -
I think you are right MofF
Isra' is the night travel which may be understood as the travel by humans from darhness into the light, Isra'il would be the people who do that, those who have a pact to do that and it would not be restricted to any linneage, but would apply to anybody who becomes conscious of the night and hets up and starts to travel towards the light.
The prople of Israa'ill is anybody who does that.
Just as the people of Isma3ill are the people who hear and obey God, that also applies to anybody who does that, hear and obey
Salaam
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Salaam,
2782 And when the Word is fulfilled against them (the unjust), we shall produce from the earth a beast to (face) them He will speak
to them, for that mankind did not believe with assurance in Our Signs.| - And when| - (is) fulfilled| - the word| - against them,| - We will bring forth| - for them| - a creature| - from| - the earth| - speaking to them,| - that| - the people| - were,| - of Our Signs,| - not| - certain.|
dabba i (dabb, dabb) to creep, crawl
(reptile); to proceed, advance, or move ( slowly; to go on all fours; to enter ( into); to steal, creep ( s.th.), come ,.into s.o.?s heart; of a feeling, e.g doubt); to spread ( over, in, through), fill, pervade, invade ( s.th.) ; to gain ground; to gain ascendancy ( in s.o.; of a condition, an idea, a sensation); to stream in, rush in (of sensations, upon s.o.) (d. al-ayh) to gain vitality II to sharpen, point, taper ( s.th.)dabb creeping, crawling; infiltration; influx, inflow, flow (e.g., of sensations, of life, of vigor); reptile
The word "dabbatan" in this ayat denotes an entity/energy which creeps or crawls. Interestingly it also has the meanings "to stream in", "influx", "inflow" and "flow". These are all words we associate with information and communications technology today.
In order for ICT (information and communications technology) to exist we need electricity. This can come from uranium, plutonium, gas, hydraulic, oil and coal. All of these are extracted from the earth's crust and used abundantly to supply electricity globally. Electricity is distributed via electrical grids using cabling which allows it to be transported. It is a vital component in all forms of ICT e.g radio, television, cellular phones, computer and network hardware and software, satellite systems and so on.All of this put together creates a process of extracting the elements (akhrajna lahum) from the earth (min al ardi) in order to supply and distribute electricity (dabbatan) for the information age we live in (tukallamuhum).
Regards,
Janet. -
Salam,
I also want to add from previous discussion,
It doesn't necessarily have to mean "mass-communication" started with computers/internet.
According to history oil was discovered by the Chinese a couple hundred years AD, but they couldn't use it for mass communication.
Mass communication began when they started using cars, boats, airplanes, telegrams, faxes to send messages etc.
Though computers are a huge advancement in this mass communication.There are some verses that can be against the previous translation.
Quran A Monotheist Translation 2013
2782 And when the punishment has been deserved by them, We will bring out for them a creature from the earth, it will speak to them that the people have been unaware regarding Our revelations.This translation makes it quite clear that 1. a creature will come, 2. remind us? or warn us?
So it's number two that we should look into. The creature will speak to us about God's revelations that we have been unaware of. It sounds pretty much that in this translation this creature is a "messenger", and a messenger warns, reminds etc.
Here comes the problem with number one. Messengers are only humans, or angels in disguise as humans.
2275 God chooses messengers from among the angels and from among
the people. God is Hearer, Seer.69 And had We sent an angel, We would have made him appear as a
man, and We would have confounded them in what they already
are confounded.Which means we can discard the older translation, that it's not "creature".
You also have the other verse about all living things being on the earth and not in.I think you're on the right track, God-willing.
Lastly, I would like to add this. In an article (very good article) you wrote, you said there are certain signs of Judgment day, or Doomsday.
One that is really interesting is the breach of the moon, in other words the landing. I don't know if you still have same translation of that verse, but if you do, here's something that really got me some shivers my spine.
2782 "And when the sentence has fallen upon them, We will extract for them organic matter from the earth, to let them communicate. Indeed, the people are unaware regarding Our signs."
The sentence! That the retribution is all in motion (this you told me)!
I don't know which sign of J-day came first, moon-landing or this daaba. If we say moon landing was the first sign, it would strengthen the translation of oil/computers being another sign. Even if moon landing was a sign after daaba, it still strenghtens this new translation, because they are both happening so close to each other!Salam
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Peace Layth?
In 2782 in your understanding explain the following three issues
And when (is) fulfilled the word against them, We will bring forth for them a creature from the earth speaking to them, that the people were, of Our Signs, not certain.
1)Who is THEM?
2)Wat is the FULFILLED WORD
3)Read the verse carefully. You claim that it is oil because it facilitates communication, but is that what the verse is saying is the purpose for bringing forth the dabbatin? Is it simply to facilitate communication?I hope thinking about these three issues will cause you to see the picture clearly
Salaam
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Salaam,
2782 And when the Word is fulfilled against them (the unjust), we shall produce from the earth a beast to (face) them He will speak
to them, for that mankind did not believe with assurance in Our Signs.| - And when| - (is) fulfilled| - the word| - against them,| - We will bring forth| - for them| - a creature| - from| - the earth| - speaking to them,| - that| - the people| - were,| - of Our Signs,| - not| - certain.|
dabba i (dabb, dabb) to creep, crawl
(reptile); to proceed, advance, or move ( slowly; to go on all fours; to enter ( into); to steal, creep ( s.th.), come ,.into s.o.?s heart; of a feeling, e.g doubt); to spread ( over, in, through), fill, pervade, invade ( s.th.) ; to gain ground; to gain ascendancy ( in s.o.; of a condition, an idea, a sensation); to stream in, rush in (of sensations, upon s.o.) (d. al-ayh) to gain vitality II to sharpen, point, taper ( s.th.)dabb creeping, crawling; infiltration; influx, inflow, flow (e.g., of sensations, of life, of vigor); reptile
The word "dabbatan" in this ayat denotes an entity/energy which creeps or crawls. Interestingly it also has the meanings "to stream in", "influx", "inflow" and "flow". These are all words we associate with information and communications technology today.
In order for ICT (information and communications technology) to exist we need electricity. This can come from uranium, plutonium, gas, hydraulic, oil and coal. All of these are extracted from the earth's crust and used abundantly to supply electricity globally. Electricity is distributed via electrical grids using cabling which allows it to be transported. It is a vital component in all forms of ICT e.g radio, television, cellular phones, computer and network hardware and software, satellite systems and so on.All of this put together creates a process of extracting the elements (akhrajna lahum) from the earth (min al ardi) in order to supply and distribute electricity (dabbatan) for the information age we live in (tukallamuhum).
Regards,
Janet.I think its the computer and the age of information technology that led to the discovery of code 19 and the renewed interest in Quranic studies that leads to the truth and the spread of the truth.
Information technology is a tool that can be used for good or evil. And as the Quran says, with knowledge come disputes as everyone is not on the same page as not everyone is receptive to truth.
The truth is simple but becomes complex bcoz of manipulation and conjectures leading people astray.
The instructions and teachings are straightforward but bcomes complex due to ego, disbelieve, manipulation and conjectures.
Most disbelieve but compensate them with conjectures to satisfy their ego as if they believe - not fooling anybody except themselves
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Salaam,
2164, 638, 822, 855, 116, 1156, 1649, 1661, 2218, 2445, 2782, 2960, 3110, 3414, 3528, 3545, 4229, 454
These are all the ayats that refer to "dabbat".
Having gone through them it would appear that to only translate "dabbat" as a "creature" is not correct. It can also be translated as a "creation" or "created entity/being". This fits in better with understanding ayat 2782 since not one person to date, leave alone all of mankind, has actually witnessed a talking creature proving the existence of the Creator. On the other hand, technology which "talks" to mankind is something the whole world has witnessed as it progresses and it is certainly one of the marvels of the Creator. All the elements and natural forces required for this progressive evolution are not of our making but created by the Creator. That is enough proof for the ones who believe and for those who don't believe it is still a marvel.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Janet. -
I think its the computer and the age of information technology that led to the discovery of code 19 and the renewed interest in Quranic studies that leads to the truth and the spread of the truth.
Peace -- computers don't talk or do anything on their own only programmed to accelerate things and there is no code i.e. consistent pattern only searching for multiples reporting 5% which would appear if perusing most any text and discarding/hiding 95% of trials. Likewise oil is mostly from billion years of decayed plants and algae.
The creature that speaks (allegorical) is toward end of days which we humans don't know; could be today or thousand years.
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The invention of the computer is just the hardware. Things come alive when it is all connected and when mass data is available.
Enter Artificial Intelligence.This creature uses all computers everywhere as body and brain in one. Today the IoT (internet of Things) is popular. Everything is getting a chip, and everything is getting connected. Your car, your phone, your clothes even, your wrist watch, and all the stuff in your home like fridge, heating/cooling system, computers, all sorts of sensors (cam, mic, temp, humidity, sound, gas...). Security systems are connected through internet with their cameras and detectors of smoke, heat and intrusion.
The Stockmarket is already not run by people. Machines do it. Software and Machine Learning can improve itself, and we cannot back trace the changes.
Google is buying small companies that are into AI and related. Google is mapping all the roads, and people's lives (photos, faces, voices, places, preferences, relations...).
I'm not even mentioning the interest shown from the warfare industry (which should not be called or described by the word 'defence'. Just search for what type of robots that are already built.... amazing creatures really.
Technology is not the issue. Technology is dead. AI is something altogether different. AI need a network, and that is already in place, and is being proliferated exponentially as we speak. AI needs an interface, and that we've had for a long time... all those gadgets for comfort and safety/security. AI also needs mass data, or it won't work. Mass data is being collected from everywhere. Everything is recorded, and part of its use is for AI to learn and develop.
An AI intelligence is indeed a creature, made from Earth, able to speak to us...
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The invention of the computer is just the hardware. Things come alive when it is all connected and when mass data is available.
Enter Artificial Intelligence.This creature uses all computers everywhere as body and brain in one. Today the IoT (internet of Things) is popular. Everything is getting a chip, and everything is getting connected. Your car, your phone, your clothes even, your wrist watch, and all the stuff in your home like fridge, heating/cooling system, computers, all sorts of sensors (cam, mic, temp, humidity, sound, gas...). Security systems are connected through internet with their cameras and detectors of smoke, heat and intrusion.
The Stockmarket is already not run by people. Machines do it. Software and Machine Learning can improve itself, and we cannot back trace the changes.
Google is buying small companies that are into AI and related. Google is mapping all the roads, and people's lives (photos, faces, voices, places, preferences, relations...).
I'm not even mentioning the interest shown from the warfare industry (which should not be called or described by the word 'defence'. Just search for what type of robots that are already built.... amazing creatures really.
Technology is not the issue. Technology is dead. AI is something altogether different. AI need a network, and that is already in place, and is being proliferated exponentially as we speak. AI needs an interface, and that we've had for a long time... all those gadgets for comfort and safety/security. AI also needs mass data, or it won't work. Mass data is being collected from everywhere. Everything is recorded, and part of its use is for AI to learn and develop.
An AI intelligence is indeed a creature, made from Earth, able to speak to us...
&Salam,
this is an interesting point of view.
Looking back at the older posts, it's hard to connect things.
2275 says God chooses messengers from among the angels and and the people.
2275 God chooses messengers from among the angels and from among
the people. God is Hearer, Seer.So from this we get that only humans and angels can be messengers.
Next, the angels are disguised as humans, so we can't see their true form;
69 And had We sent an angel, We would have made him appear as a
man, and We would have confounded them in what they already
are confounded.It all comes down to 2 things
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In older and newer translations it says "when the punishment has been deserved" and "when the sentence has fallen upon them", respectively. Both are regarding the signs of the end, and some of us believe it has been set in motion and others not. The strongest proof it has been set in motion is the moon-landing (can't find verses for now). So this means we are within the timeline of "daaba".
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How 2782 is translated. This is very important because in the older translation it gives the impression that the daaba is a messenger, while the newer translation implies that it will only communicate with us, but it doesn't say what it will communicate with us. Also that the daaba is a sign itself from God.
Let's look at the different translation and what it could mean
OLDER translation
2782 And when the punishment has been deserved by them, We will bring out for them a creature from the earth, it will speak to them that the people have been unaware regarding Our revelations.In this translation, the creature is a messenger. As we know from earlier verses 2275 and 69, messengers are humans or angels in disguise as humans. With this understanding, we have many possibilites; 1. Maybe "daaba" is mistranslated and should be translated so it can be human, such as a title instead of noun. 2. This is a heavily modified human in some secret lab, like Area 51 which is beneath earth ( a human beast? ).
NEWER translation
2782 And when the sentence has fallen upon them, We will bring out
for them a creature from the earth, that will communicate with
them. Indeed, the people are unaware regarding Our signs.In this translation, the creature is more of a sign from God rather than a messenger. We are only told it will communicate with us, and it comes from the earth. This is very wide; a creature that lives inside earth and maybe it's not within reach, such as beneath the ocean, or it lives in holes within the crust...so many theories.
What are possible translations of "daaba"?
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In this translation, the creature is more of a sign from God rather than a messenger. We are only told it will communicate with us, and it comes from the earth.
In case the AI is the daaba, and in case it starts messing with us, then it simply serves to show us that we are not so smart as we wish to think. We cannot handle our God given power of creation without making it all go south, to our own severe detriment. It would show us that we have been living an illusion. That's it. Simple.
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In case the AI is the daaba, and in case it starts messing with us, then it simply serves to show us that we are not so smart as we wish to think. We cannot handle our God given power of creation without making it all go south, to our own severe detriment. It would show us that we have been living an illusion. That's it. Simple.
It could be, but there's a problem with this. AIs have been created on the surface of earth and not in the earth. It's quite a strong argument though.
In both translations, the daaba will be brought out from the earth. -
It could be, but there's a problem with this. AIs have been created on the surface of earth and not in the earth. It's quite a strong argument though.
In both translations, the daaba will be brought out from the earth.The stuff we build all come from Earth... the metals, minerals and plastics all have origins extracted from within Earth. Only what we eat are from the surface, apart from wood of course. )
