How to defend ourselves against ignorant people/traditional Muslims?
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I think you got some things wrong.
A submitter is a Muslim.
A believer is the other word, I think it's Mumin?i think submitter is a poor defination of muslim it should be peacemaker
becoz if you fit this defination in quran it will not give confusing meanings on some other parts of scripture..4913 O people, We created you from a male and female, and We made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Surely, the most honorable among you in the sight of God is the most righteous. God is Knowledgeable, Ever-aware.
God judge by hearts regardless of nation label /race..
an he is ever aware regarding his creation
infront of him honorable is the one who is righteousbtw the topic was of marriages in interfaith , i think LAW did not put any restriction in marriage
so marrying a sunni is nothing wrong ..Life's too short for all this hatred. I hope you realise that soon.
exactly
and we should not judge somebody , God alone knows whats inside the chests..(God will judge by heart) and according to the ability of understanding
whatever label u born with..
life is about doing / making love..u make me remember one of the saying.. someone said
i dnt how people manage to get time of hating when we have much shortage of time for doing love fully ..
God bless you both
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hmm thats what i m trying to say marry with whoever you wish regardless of label race nation..
LOVE is the key (pure love)coz if we try to find a quran alone wife its like to find a grain in sand of desert.. hmm
they are not different than other sect of God alone people so they never consider themself as "pervazi" its a label given to them by sunni people..
and i think there are lot of members in this forum who like the teaching of pervazi.. (and some of them follow it too)
the recent example of pervaizi teaching is shabbir ahmed interpretationand moreover when i was declaring the God alone people it meant to be the one who follow only quran..
its a law of universe that grows from singularity to multiplication
same law apply to quran alone and rest of the nations .. like expanding universe..but when God talk about a system its peacemaking , although from time to time God is telling us what actual system is acceptable infront of him.. he knows we will not be able to make us all one nation.. (how hard we try)
examples are infront of you
If we take reality into account west has more Quran alone people than any other place https//www.reddit.com/r/Quraniyoon/comments/6fknyu/ranks_of_countries_most_faithful_to_islamic/
If you want to search for one in the desert you will have to go to Israel as given in the chart.
If sunnis are calling them pervezi why should we contribute to it? Let's call them Muslim then? I read his stuff. What I have seen is that the man said exactly what I concluded also. That doesn't mean I am a pervezi. The whole thing ends up with only one concept that people in different places, from different times have got the same message about Islam when they actually made an effort to let themselves think and understand what God is trying to tell us.
Same can be told about Dr Shabir though I take his stuffs with a grain of salt.
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If you want to search for one in the desert you will have to go to Israel as given in the chart.
If sunnis are calling them pervezi why should we contribute to it? Let's call them Muslim then? I read his stuff. What I have seen is that the man said exactly what I concluded also. That doesn't mean I am a pervezi. The whole thing ends up with only one concept that people in different places, from different times have got the same message about Islam when they actually made an effort to let themselves think and understand what God is trying to tell us.
Same can be told about Dr Shabir though I take his stuffs with a grain of salt.
actually i also listen ghulam ahmed some things he explain very perfectly
he was the first modern scholar who challange the authority of hadith
he co worked with founder of pakistan (muhammad ali jinnah)do you notice i sometimes bring the issues regarding God will and laws of cause and effect
he handle that section very intelligently and logically(although not agree with all what he said)but on the other hand he reject the miracles and existence of invisible being creation ..
thats how divide and rule play its role in any organisation what we say "parties"
when one party beleive in something and another party disbeleivng in same thing..its only opinions that divide you from singularity..
interestingly he was also against the sects (so dnt worry you are not pervaizi lol)
but as we know some of his theories are not really accepted by main stream quran alone scholars like edip,layth and javed ahmed ghamidi..about shabbir ahmed , he actually interpret quran metaphorically instead of literally sometimes the message get totally different than literal meanings when compare with other translators.. but i think that interpretation is also there due to a reason .. lot of his metaphors are masterpiece compared to daily life what everybody encounter..
the book is deep(37)
BOLD just curious to know why u specially refer israel ? its on the dangerous number 27 perfect cube lol
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actually i also listen ghulam ahmed some things he explain very perfectly
he was the first modern scholar who challange the authority of hadith
he co worked with founder of pakistan (muhammad ali jinnah)do you notice i sometimes bring the issues regarding God will and laws of cause and effect
he handle that section very intelligently and logically(although not agree with all what he said)but on the other hand he reject the miracles and existence of invisible being creation ..
I think I read his stuff also. I have to recheck. What did he say about invisible being creation? I don't fully reject the idea of miracles anymore. I did it in the middle, but then I have to reconsider.
thats how divide and rule play its role in any organisation what we say "parties"
when one party beleive in something and another party disbeleivng in same thing..its only opinions that divide you from singularity..
Our disagreements are never a problem. There is always someone who comes to show us the right way when we are being in the wrong. But again, the wrong of ours does not lead to killing like it does in the sects and the more you will try to have a conversation about hadiths with a sectarian the more you will find yourself shivering. They have forgotten what is right and wrong. They'll accept anything bad just if you tell them "Prophet said". These are some of the things I have been told
I will swear that hadiths are words of Prophet if after that you accept our sectarian religion.
So what if the Prophet cut off hands and legs of the people?
If the consensus of the ulema is that he married a kid then I will stick to that.3 sectarians on our subreddit deleted their usernames after we showed them that what they thought they had in the hadiths were not exactly there. You can also see the adnan guy's fraud questions in that video and under the comment section, sectarians are going "yahoo". None checked whether answers to his questions actually were truly in the hadiths the way they think Islam is. So the divide between us and them is extremely different. Apparently, even nonMuslims begin to understand the core problem of Islam when you discuss it with them. It is something absent in the conversation between us and sectarians.
I must also say that they defend the hadiths without actually reading them. They copy everything they heard from the mullahs.
interestingly he was also against the sects (so dnt worry you are not pervaizi lol)
but as we know some of his theories are not really accepted by main stream quran alone scholars like edip,layth and javed ahmed ghamidi..about shabbir ahmed , he actually interpret quran metaphorically instead of literally sometimes the message get totally different than literal meanings when compare with other translators.. but i think that interpretation is also there due to a reason .. lot of his metaphors are masterpiece compared to daily life what everybody encounter..
the book is deep(37)
Well, no one can be 100% accurate. Times are different. Much depends on the progress of the knowledge and understanding.
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i think submitter is a poor defination of muslim it should be peacemaker
becoz if you fit this defination in quran it will not give confusing meanings on some other parts of scripture..4913 O people, We created you from a male and female, and We made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Surely, the most honorable among you in the sight of God is the most righteous. God is Knowledgeable, Ever-aware.
God judge by hearts regardless of nation label /race..
an he is ever aware regarding his creation
infront of him honorable is the one who is righteousbtw the topic was of marriages in interfaith , i think LAW did not put any restriction in marriage
so marrying a sunni is nothing wrong ..exactly
and we should not judge somebody , God alone knows whats inside the chests..(God will judge by heart) and according to the ability of understanding
whatever label u born with..
life is about doing / making love..u make me remember one of the saying.. someone said
i dnt how people manage to get time of hating when we have much shortage of time for doing love fully ..
God bless you both
Here, the requirement isnt for a polytheist to just leave polytheism, but to become a believer to marry a believer. This is hint nr 1. A sectarian isnt a believer
2221 And do not marry the female polytheists until they believe; for a
believing servant is better than a polytheist, even if she is pleasing
to you. And do not give in marriage to the male polytheists until
they believe; for a believing servant is better than a polytheist,
even if he is pleasing to you. These invite to the Fire, while God is
inviting to Paradise and forgiveness by His consent. He clarifies
His revelations for the people that they may remember.Hint nr 2. Women are not to be with rejecters, and men arent to keep disbelieving women. Also, its directled to believers...
6010 O you who believe, if the believing females come emigrating to
you, then you shall test them. God is fully aware of their belief.
Thus, if you establish that they are believers, then you shall not
return them to the rejecters. They are no longer permissible for
one another. And return the dowries that were paid. And there
is no sin upon you to marry them, if you have paid their dowries
to them. And do not keep disbelieving wives, and ask back what
dowries you paid. And let them ask back what dowries they had
paid. Such is the judgment of God; He judges between you. God
is Knowledgeable, Wise.So from this we get that believers are for believers.
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Salam everyone )
I don't know if the question has been asked before. Do you feel like you have to defend your self from all sides? Ignorant non-Muslims think you are some kind of extremist associated with Salafi Muslims and Wahabbis, etc. and some Muslims call you "kaffir", "munafiq" whenever you don't agree with them. But that is online. I have never challenged anyone in real life. How to deal with such people if you ever want to present your views to others (both online and in real life)? It does not seem like we will outnumber them anytime soon. Only God knows. I don't want to be associated with these versions of Islam, but sometimes I get doubts that maybe I am just a hypocrite like they say. I'm new to this. The only thing I have noticed is that these Muslims usually shut up if you only quote the Quran as they cannot argue with God. My soon to be husband insha'Allah is a Sunni traditional Muslim, but he is tolerant and often agree with me as I'm taking things slow with him about my beliefs. I just fear as being the only hadith rejecter among the Muslims in town that I know of I will have to just nod my head at what they say. What are your experience and don't you feel all alone if you are the only one you know of in your area?
Although I'm no expert but just my two cents. It is usually logical to NOT make yourself a target of ridicule and maybe outright violence within your family, if you suppress your true feelings when dealing with a segment of society that might find such views to be a type of apostasy from Islam. You are in a delicate situation, better not to expose your mindset so openly without understanding the consequences they might entail while living within YOUR family grouping. As per the Sunnis even the early Muslims hid their beliefs until they became a bigger force that could deal with the aftermath. Try to avoid conflict, other than that God knows whats in your heart.
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Here, the requirement isnt for a polytheist to just leave polytheism, but to become a believer to marry a believer. This is hint nr 1. A sectarian isnt a believer
2221 And do not marry the female polytheists until they believe; for a
believing servant is better than a polytheist, even if she is pleasing
to you. And do not give in marriage to the male polytheists until
they believe; for a believing servant is better than a polytheist,
even if he is pleasing to you. These invite to the Fire, while God is
inviting to Paradise and forgiveness by His consent. He clarifies
His revelations for the people that they may remember.Hint nr 2. Women are not to be with rejecters, and men arent to keep disbelieving women. Also, its directled to believers...
So from this we get that believers are for believers.
peace brother , as i stated earlier no need of getting hints when something author already cleared in the scripture.. look at this verse now please..
55 Today, the good things have been made lawful to you, and the food of those who have been given the Book is lawful for you, and your food is lawful for them; and the independent females from those who are believers, and the independent females from those who have been given the Book before you, if you have given them their dowries, to be independent, not for illicit sex or taking lovers. And whoever rejects belief, then his work has fallen, and in the Hereafter he is of the losers.
no hints in this verse but a clear permission of 2 catagories
1 believers
2 those who have been given book before(i.e christians,jews, and all those religions who followed abraham and noah)..this rules out everything..
but again , advise must be taken ,
peacemaker for a peacemaker
criminal for a criminal
dishonest for a dishonest
porn actress for a porn actor
film actor for a film actress
scientist for a scientist
doctor for a doctor
poor for a poor
rich for a rich
western culture women for a western culture boy
eastern culture women for a eastern culture boy
cheater for a cheater...if you mix the pattern of (compatibilty) then possibly there will be less chances that you guys get along with each other for long time..
its simple and easy..